ShelbyBeu

Very much. Slink Physique was great for that type, I thought. It was out a long time, didn't update as aggressively as some, I don't think promoted itself well, and didn't stay popular enough to remain supported. Okay, I get it. I'll also admit bent knees in Slink Physique can be a little messy, though for all I like I'll accept that flaw. But we need something like it. Maitreya is at least thin unless you intentionally make it otherwise, but I'm a fan of neither the shoulders nor the elbows. That leaves Legacy as the only non-Maitreya well-supported one that will at least let you be thin, which I keep thinking I have to get to be able to wear newly made clothes, but I don't think it has the ability to look good somewhat toned like Slink P does, and isn't even as supportive of thinness to the extent Slink P and Maitreya are. So I'd hope with all the very curvy bodies getting a lot of support, that one or two could emerge the "winner" of the curvy look and we could get something slimmer to replace one or two or the others, hopefully supporting a bit of a toned look, the next generation of Slink Physique, essentially. Or at least a Maitreya with better arms.

Slink needs better publicists or whatever you'd call someone who'd try to convince vendors to support their bodies, because Physique is very good. Physique Redux lacks Alpha cut on the HUD, which after rereading the thread I see is an issue for many, and the Alpha BoM layers Slink provides aren't much good at all (maybe part of Slink's decline?); but if you'd rather forego BoM for Alpha cuts instead you don't have to use Redux and can still have the Alpha cut hud, though what works for me is something that's called something like Alpha 911 and one can pick Alphas on it like an Alpha cut hud, and it has a wide variety of Alpha cuts one can add to a BoM body: it works great for Slink Physique, and I imagine would work with any. Every time, the 911 hud has the alpha cuts I need without covering up areas I need to leave visible. You "wear" them and then you can save the alpha layers as part of the outfit if you use the Outfits system from Firestorm, and then they'll be there every time you put it on. You don't keep the Alpha layer open and use script memory once you've added the Alpha cuts. Once you set it up you detach the 911 hud. That solved it well for me. Before that I was using the old alpha cuts hud system, and that had some issues with matching colors with hands and feet.

What's funny is that you don't need a specifically curvy body type to have a curvy body. My avatar with Slink Physique is very big in the breasts, kind of an accident that people who like my sl body like so much I'll always continue with, and if I chose to make her hips and butt bigger she could be quite curvy with Slink Physique. I choose for her only big curve to be her big breast, but it wouldn't have to be. I know a lot of Slink users like it even curvier I guess, which is why Hourglass outsells Physique, and thus why everyone still makes Slink Hourglass clothes and not Physique. I'm putting it off some, but eventually I'll try the two Legacy ones, I guess: Legacy and the Legacy Perky variation, One of my closer sl friends went through a lot of bodies and really, really likes Legacy. I hope I do, as it seems to be my only choice, one of their two variants, if I don't want to go Maitreya. I really wish I didn't have to give up Slink Physique though, but the clothing makers are forcing my hand unless I wanted to go without any new releases. I know I'll keep using the Slink body with the clothes I have with it now. The majority of my clothes were made before Legacy was even a "thing" so don't even have Legacy versions, and I won't stop wearing those clothes. I'll need a Legacy body for newer models, though. I just hope I like it. I think there's some sort of difference between how the arms hang in Slink Physique compared to Maitreya that I really don't like MaItreya's look very much,. I hope Legacy's look works for me, in terms of my liking it, since I know Maitreya's doesn't.

I'm in a similar position to the OP, outside of that my reasons for loving my Slink Physique Redux body aren't about its low resource use. I just really like the look. If designers hadn't stopped supporting it nothing could get me to change. The last I'd known, Blueberry was still supporting it, though Addams, where even more of my clothes had come from, had stopped, as had most of the other places I liked to shop, and I went a few months without clothes shopping. Then I got a shock as Blueberry had their 10th anniversary sale, the last I'd known they were supporting it, and I was sadly shocked to see that they no longer did. My avatar actually has very big breasts (which from other posts is a problem people find with other bodies, based on other posts in this thread), going back to when I first started with it, where I wanted moderately big breasts so I set breast size to about 72 and figured on a 0-100 scale that's still fairly moderate though they looked big, but when I did it I was thinking I wanted above average and so anything below 70 would be more in the average range, rather than somewhat above. I trusted the numbers over my eyes. I came to realize that they're very big, but my avatar attracts positive attention by many who like it, definitely including the breast size in the positives, and to those who know me in game I wouldn't be "me" without them; so a body that the breasts tend to be big is okay. There's something about Slink Physique's bone structure that when I was first trying mesh bodies, looked good to me. I plan to keep using the clothes I have and wearing the Slink Physique body with them. I like clothes shopping, but would hate to start from scratch. However, I'd also hate to be stuck without being able to get any newer releases- so I need another body to wear them on, That means, though, that if I don't want to look ultra-radically different depending on which body I'm best not just trying the demos and eyeballing what looks good to me, which is what got me started on Slink Physique, because it also matters that it won't look too different from Slink Physique, if I'm going to be switching back and forth depending on how new the clothes I'm wearing are. So, again not trusting my eyeballs alone, I'm asking of the well supported bodies (and not Maitreya; I don't care for its look, really didn't back when I chose Slink, something intangible about it) which should I try demos of, that are similar for a "fit" look, outside of the breasts moderate in curves, in that my body is quite slim overall outside of the breasts, I want a kind of fit, athletic look overall. The reason I'm asking rather than just demoing is that I'm guessing there are some more familiar with the newer set of bodies than I am, and would know what would be more similar to an updated, supported Slink Physique relative to others, narrowing the list of bodies I ought to check out.

In my OP I mentioned, kind of in a small aside, gachas in a way that was meant to show I recognized they were an exception. Many people enjoy them, and they don't really work with Copy, so there's a good reason for them to be No Copy. I even pretty clearly conceded that I saw a decent reason for things like furniture and radios to be No Copy, though I'll go for a Copy version if I can-- but I understand the logic in making those No Copy. It's clothes/skins/animations, things that even if Copy can't be used multiple times as long as No Trans, and that also aren't Gachas, that were the topic of my OP-- really clothes set it off, but I see some of those on the others as well.

Then make the animation non-transferable, which I prefer a whole lot more. I can't tell people what they can or cannot buy. I can try to persuade people not to buy No Copy, both so they don't lose their item with no way to get it back and to, in my opinion, improve what is offered. I understand your point. I was more interested when I wrote the rant in getting potential customers to listen. If enough won't buy No Copy, nearly everything would at the least have a Copy version, especially items only worthwhile on oneself. I was also angry at seeing No Copy clothes, because I don't see a good reason for them, so I was less than purely rational in what I wrote. I then think I wrote calmer posts after that, and I also don't think I was the only one who in this thread wrote an overheated post. At bottom, I want to improve the market, and while my methods may not have been the most effective, and some might believe (though I really don't get the point of view) that if I got what I wanted it would not improve the market; but the anger directed by some was, I think, uncalled for-- even toward my initial rant. But if a creator goes No Copy just because they didn't like the tone of my rant, that person is behaving the worst of anyone. If someone complains about a practice, they may not convince you so you may ignore the complaint; but you don't decide to mess up your business if you make Copy items by stopping the practice because you don't like that someone ranted against No Copy-- after all, I'm encouraging people to buy from that creator, whose items are Copy-- or if you do, you really deserve unkind feedback, worse than any even in my first rant.

In order: Correct. What set me off was having to pass up some otherwise good clothing due to perms I consider ridiculous in clothing. Agreed that if you don't check the perms that isn't the creator's fault, but a lot of people don't even realize perms are important so lose items because they bought no copy. I want then for them to realize the perms are more at fault than they are for "mishandling" the item, so maybe instead of thinking they'd better be more careful with the item itself they just will buy Copy in the future. One of my goals was to increase the number who shared my ideas, whether or not that was the actual effect. I'd like to win over those who can change it, who foremost are the buyers. If enough stopped buying No Copy, at least for must-be-in-inventory items, sellers will stop setting those perms. I also want to win over the creators as well, let them know they do lose some sales to being No Copy.

And is it wrong for me to try to improve the market by pointing out that a I strongly believe a business practice is bad and should not be supported, and also to point out that any No Copy item can very easily be lost, and you have to hope the creator has the good will to replace it, and that even if they do there's a good chance there will be significant inconvenience finding them, since they do have real lives and you likely do as well, and you may not even always be sure they're still part of SL? I still wouldn't say it's that awful of a business practice if it's something that can, if copied, be used in many places, so I limited to items on the person. Due to the loss risk I'd rather avoid No Copy entirely, but there's more reason for it in things like furniture. I think people should avoid things like No Copy furniture due to the risk of loss, but only that. I think people should avoid No Copy clothing and the like not only due to the risk of loss but also to possibly try to make the SL market better. The more sales that can be lost by denying Copy permissions, especially on items that only one person can use at once, the better I think the market will be. I think on items like that the creator often hasn't even thought it through, maybe doesn't know anyone is out there who avoids items due to those permissions, and maybe don't realize extra copies of things that must be in the user's inventory don't hurt them, not having thought it through. Maybe some buyers have lost items due to No Copy and think it's their own fault, where even if they screwed up to lose it, a lot of the fault is the creator's setting No Copy. If anyone in those situations changes their minds in what I consider a positive way, I'm glad I posted. If instead, as someone posted, it causes an opposite reaction and someone is so scummy as to think just to spite me they'll start going No Copy, I hope they lose a lot of business for it, but maybe then I should have just stayed away from No Copy myself and told people in game, but not posted.

I'd rather be able to modify everything, and I'm not happy that some creators to ban it, but most furniture can be modified and most non-mod clothes have huds or a number of color choices. So that isn't what I decided to post about. Can anyone give me any reasonable reason though why someone would make clothes, animations, or skins no copy instead of no transfer? I'm not even talking so much about household items, which at least the case can be made that they're stopping an estate owner from giving use of them to all who rent or something. Not that I like it then, but at least I see the other side. But those that only work if they're in my inventory, no excuse, period. The only excuse I can imagine is that they think I want to resell them and would rather have transfer. Uh...no. If it's a gift I'll buy it as a gift. If I plan to wear it myself, I can't imagine a time I'll want to resell it. And if I did want to, it's only worth anything if I undersell what they charge, so they should prefer to give me copy instead. So no reasonable reason.

BUT, when people create with No Copy that limits the selection for those who want copy, and with clothes/skins/animations there's no excuse for it. I don't even like it with other items, but those that could be used other placed at least I understand why. So I'm doing all I can, trying to convince people not to buy items like that, which will lead creators to feel they must give Copy perms.

I dislike No Copy anything, and generally won't buy No Copy given a decent Copy alternative. It's very, very easy to lose them and you have to rely on the good will of the seller to replace them. The seller also has a real life and may not be on when you want it replaced, so even if that person had good will, it may be hard to find the seller. But with most items at least I understand why they might be No Copy. Nearly all (maybe absolutely all) SL radios are No Copy, and I decided I'd buy one rather than keep trying to get the music stream on my little parcel that I wanted, despite having to buy No Copy. As the maker explained to me, there's a reason for it, which is that estate owners could buy one Copyable radio and put it in dozens of apartments or something. I still will buy Copy if I can, and I think everyone should. But with items like that, at least there is some logic. I was in a clothing store today, with decent clothing. I might have purchased something, except it was all No Copy, and they were not gachas. There is zero excuse for that, and I wouldn't buy No Copy clothing if it were 99% of SL clothing. I'd buy from the 1% then that was Copy. The only argument for No Copy, besides gachas which some have fun with, is that multiple copies might be in use at a time if it's something an estate owner could put in multiple estates. But as long as it's No Transfer, I can't do that with clothing I buy anyway. I could have 50 copies but could only wear one, or wear all 50 and look stupid. No Transfer is enough to make sure I don't give away or sell 50 copies. That goes also for skins, animations, and many other things that must be on the person to be useful. All you do when you make something like that No Copy is to introduce the risk of losing it, which easily can happen and if you replace it inconvenience yourself to do that, and if you don't then have an upset customer who bought the product but can't use it. Most makers of things that must be on the person realize this and make their items Copy, thankfully. But if you don't, you will lose sales, you should lose sales, and in fact for clothing and the like you should get zero sales because there's no reason for No Copy at all. I also dislike No Mod unless there's a hud with many textures available, but that's a different issue. I'm a lot less likely to buy something I can only get in one color that can't be changed, but it's not as extreme as with No Copy absolutely meaning No Sale with on-person items. I also with most things like furniture and decor can find Copy items, most of which can be modified as well, and will prefer them also, and I encourage others to buy Copy/Mod there if they can, but again it's not as extremely simple. I realize there are two sides there. But there is no reason for any on-person items, that one must have on herself to work, to be No Copy, and all I can do is post to let sellers know they lose sales if they do that and to help buyers see that buying those items encourages a ridiculous restriction and, like all No Copy, takes a significant risk of loss of what you bought.