RobertThorp

I saw a woman (well, a female avatar) the other day that had that problem. At times one or both boobs would stick out of her dress. I wish the women who are around me in RL would wear RL mesh so their boobs would stick out.:matte-motes-oh-rly:

vickiadams wrote: They should define "private parts" Wouldn't the term "private parts" be sufficient. Is there any ambiguity there? Eileen Fellstein wrote I know you werent asking me, but in my experience, yes there is, though it's pretty clear to nearly everyone and most of the people that would challenge it would be doing so just for the sake of splitting hairs. That, unfortunately happens a lot more often than people would imagine. The big deal with this one is nipples. Are those private parts? Anyone with an ounce of sense knows, women need to have them covered in such a place. Guys could go shirtless in an informal setting/event. Still, people will pick it apart and argue. Some might even try to say silly stuff like they thought 'private' was talking about the items in their purse or their holstered weapon. Yes, lol. People do try to pull crap like that. Eileen is right. In RL criminal law there are problems with laws in some U.S. states that make public exposure of private parts illegal, but don't address the question of adult female nipples. Some people think they are "private", and some people think they are not. In some states female nipples (and areolas) are specifically defined as "private parts"; in other states they are not so defined. The term "private parts" is, in some states, defined as body parts used in excretion and reproduction. There are exceptions for breast feeding. This definition leads to the assumption that nipples are private parts (why have the breast feeding exception if nipple are not private parts). Reasonable people will disagree about whether female nipples should be classed as "private parts". But, one way or the other, it should be defined. In the SL terms of service there should also be an explicit exemption of nudity in a dressing room, private home, or other place where it would not be possible for someone to see you without positioning their camera. Bob

"I think that the TOS and guidelines should be less vague and ambiguous and more explicit." I agree. Vagueness and ambiguity are a serious problem with contracts (including terms of service) and laws. In criminal laws relating to sex crimes they often are the result of legislators who are too prudish to write more explicit language into laws. As a result, accused criminals get off when the laws are to vague to enforce, or to convince juries. I have not been in criminal defense work for about a decade. But I do write contracts and terms of service (but not for SL or similar things). Marybeth writes laws, and I know that laws she writes have no such ambiguity. Bob

Where is SL if not on the web???**Only uploaded images may be used in postings**://secondlife.i.lithium.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif" border="0" alt=":smileyvery-happy:" title="Smiley Very Happy" /> SL is not on the web. It does use the internet, but the web is only a part of the internet. The web (or, officially, the World Wide Web) is an application that runs on the interet and uses browsers, such as Internet Explorer, Chrome, etc. and the HTML language (and other things) to communicate. No one owns the web; many computers owned by competing companies supply services to the web. SL is another different application that allows an program on your computer, commonly called the viewer" (the Linden supplied viewer, Firefox, etc.) to communicate with Linden Lab's computers. In the past both LL and others have had applications that ran on the web that would allow use of SL on a web browser. However, due to technical limitations these have been limited. The advantage is that you can access SL through any computer connected to the internet. For example, the PC on my desk does not have a SL viewer; the firm will not allow installation of additional software without going through the firm's IT group. I have SL installed on my home computer. With SL on the web, even with limited features, I could get access from my office computer or from the local public library. It would be a good idea if it can be done without too many limitations.

Marybeth, Since you write laws and regulations for a living, I bet you, like me, have a problem with the words "feel comfortable". Perverts I have known (at one time part of my job), feel comfortable doing things like showing off their privates in front of kids and grandmothers. That is why they are perverts. Bob

My very first case after law school was defending a guy who had admitted to several acts involving a remote camera in a women's shower area, a peephole into a women's room, and other such things.. And I had to sit next to that pervert. That is only what he admitted to. He was accused, and found not guilty, of other acts that I won't write about here. After he won on those counts, he shook my hand. First thing I did was wash that hand. So, it does happen in RL

"I usually wear in RL and make in SL sexier nighties" I would like to see some pictures of your sexier ones. Bob

"Now a question: I understand that at 13 my son can get onto certain kid areas of SL through a "sponsoring organization". Is this safe for kids? How do I find such an organization? All this is assuming that he is interested in trying it out." See Sec. 2.2(i), Age Requirement for Use of Areas of the Service, Users 13 to 15 https://secondlife.com/corporate/tos.php#tos2 I don't know about it.. You might want to check with your son's school or any other groups (scouts, church, etc.) or ask Linden Labs. It is probably up to a school or some other group to verify the age and RL status of the person, and to carefully monitor the "location". Years ago, pre-internet in the days of dial up bulletin boards, there was a discussion board specifically for children. To get access, a child and parents had to apply. The user name (did not include last name) and initial password was sent to the school, who would verify the child as a student and give the information to the teacher to pass to the student. The site was heavily monitored by adults. Prodigy (pre internet bulletin board) had sections for children of different ages, all posts were moderated, that is, reviewed, by an adult before posting. As I pointed out on another discussion on this board, there is an internet based discussion board for lawyers. To become a member an applicant is verified by the local bar association and then a user name (full real name + a number) and the initial password is sent to the law firm of the proposed member. So, unless hackers have figured out a way in, it can be done. The key thing is off line verification of members and intense adult monitoring Bob

Not only do I work for the same firm as Marybeth but I am a member of the closed law forum that she is a member of. To join that forum you go through your local bar association, they mail your assigned user name (your real name + a number, if there are others with that name) to your law firm. So we know who we are talking to. I know of some other forums that are similar (i.e. there is some off line vetting to make sure you are who you say you are and meet the membership requirements-- profession, residence, school, political affiliation, etc. -- for the group.) A cartoon (I can't remember which) once said that "on the internet nobody knows that you are a dog. On most fora (such as this) we have no way of knowing who the other person really is. I assume that everyone here has an interest in Second Life, and have no reason to deceive others about their gender, profession, etc. But that is only an assumption. On SL, in world, role playing is apparently encouraged, and I can see how it would be fun. I do not get involved, but I have no objection to interacting with those who do. I once had an avatar who looked like an ancient Egyptian woman talk with me about a computer problem. I do not know if she was really a woman; I assume she was not really an ancient Egyptian; I assume the person really did have a computer problem. I have no reason to care about the gender or nationality of that person. Bob

Marybeth: "I work with Bob and bet he still would be embarrassed. I will have him do some shopping for me! **Only uploaded images may be used in postings**://secondlife.i.lithium.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif" border="0" alt=":smileyhappy:" title="Smiley Happy" />" NO WAY!!!

Yep. When I was young my mom often took me shopping with her, and we walked through the lingerie section. When I was a young teenager it was pretty embarrassing when my mother stopped to buy a bra with me waiting. Not to mention the experience, when she had a broken arm, of having to go into the feminine hygiene aisle at the supermarket and picking something from the shelf and putting it into the cart, then going through the checkout where a girl in my class bagged. But there is nothing adult or sexual in any of that. It is a part of life. Very much G rated. Bob

Perrie Juran stopped his giggling long enough to ask: What does being a Male have to do with not wearing lingerie? --------------------------------------------------- Nothing, really. Mostly, we just call it "underwear". But I find the selection of 38AAA bras to be rather limited. Bob

My avi does not wear underwear. I wear underwear in Real Live for comfort, but that is not a factor in SL. (As a male I don't wear lingerie, of course). I have seen female avis wearing skirts without panties or glitch pants. It is very easy to position my camera to see under the skirt of a woman sitting or standing. I wouldn't mind seeing the same in RL, but I don't think I will :matte-motes-big-grin: But I know that women wear sexy bras that no one will see, so I can understand women wearing bras on their avis even though they can't be seen and they serve no function.

Is that really a picture of you, Marybeth (the real person, not the avitar)? Something I have been wanting to see! Not that I have seen too many bras, but until you pointed it out, I had never realized that the lace was different from what I am used to seeing on other things. I could probably draw lace, if I had the desire to do that.

Yes, Marybeth, your avatar does look just like you. At least the parts I can see and the suits you wear at work. You or someone must have designed your avatar face to look like you, or you were lucky to find the right skin. Same with hair. As for me, my avatar kinda looks like me, but I haven't gone to any great length to make it look like me. Bob (member of the same firm as Marybeth)

Mea Clupa. I am now on my own computer in my own office. I forgot to sign off on Mary's computer when I used it early this morning, and she assumed it was signed on as her. I also think that I left an empty coffee cup on her desk.

Bob, NO But I think we are going to be at the same pool party next month, you can see me in my lastest bikini. I just made a similar one in SL, you can see my avi wearing that also. Mary

Mary, >I have been on certain beaches in Germany and France and dressed appropriately (topless or naked).< Can I go with you on your next trip to a German or French beach? Bob

Why are you worried about someone seeing your avatar in a dressing room? I don't understand why people are so uptight about their bodies. I would just as well change in the store. If they tell me to use a dressing room, I would have no problem with others seeing in. Bob