Extrude Ragu
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Posts posted by Extrude Ragu
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5 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:
They buy a "pretty red spiked dog collar", odds are the MP page will state that it's an RLV collar, and list some of the "cool RLV functions" like leashing and posing etc, because that allows the merchant to charge twice as much for it.
The relay in the collar will be either off by default, or ask, and there will be NO sudden surprises with being ambushed by furniture, or RLV control zones without consent. NONE,
The collar will be set to private by default, so Joe Random can't just click your collar and take control of you, EVER.
This is entirely reliant on store owners being dilligent and having accountability. Neither of which hold true on the Second Life marketplace and you know it.
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And what happens when that dog collar user finds themselves being dogged in the moderate sim? Well what's the repercussions? The store owner will claim they put RLV in the description somewhere. LL will say adult content is allowed in moderate regions so long as you're not in public what's the problem. The new user gets blamed for simply not knowing.
If a general rated experience does something adult, guess what, you can report it, and LL can suspend the account of the person who made the experience. There's accountability.
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Every experience in Second Life has a Scope, a Description, and an Age Rating
If a new user joins Betty's BDSM Jungle Experience, rated Adult and scoped to Betty's Jungle. I can hardly complain when I join it and find my avatar being 'monkeyed about with'. I knew what I was getting into.
If I as a new user, download Alchemy, then buy a pretty red spiked dog collar - Does not mean I expect to suddenly find myself being 'dogged!' - In fact, I might have my preferences set to only show general/moderate content, made a general/moderate marketplace search, and attended a general/moderate sim and find this happen.
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I think the whole argument that on some viewers users had to check a box to enable RLV means they know what RLV is and what it can do is disingenuous at best.
It's not uncommon for different items in Second Life to nag users to turn on RLV to use them, and the education supplied surrounding what RLV can do when they are nagged is often shakey at best if existent at all.
Collars sold on the MP are very often sold preloaded with RLV Relay functionality like OpenCollar and not advertised as such, and there is no accountability for store owners who do this.
I'm not claiming Experiences are better than RLV, but to claim RLV has no weaknesses that Experiences aren't better at I think is simply being dishonest for the sake of hating on experiences.
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36 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:
Claiming that simply buying a choker from a fashion store means you might get ambushed by "Stealth Self Griefing RLV" is just a blatant LIE.
Your post assumes that everyone who has RLV enabled knows how it works.
They don't.
Many users don't know what RLV is, or what a relay is, or that RLV is even enabled. Some viewers enable RLV by default - For example, the Alchemy viewer has RLV enabled by default. It's very easy for a new user to self-grief with RLV.
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On the topic of the spooky permissions dialog.
It's possible to get around the user spooking experience permissions window by linking the user the experience profile SLURL instead of llRequestExperiencePermissions
Brings up this dialog, which is much less spooky and full of technobabble than
Which has more warnings on it than when I make a credit card transaction using my bank.
You just have to never llRequestExperiencePermissions until llAgentIsInExperience is true.
I do think that attachment scope experiences would be useful so long as the user can leave and join them the same way as regular experiences. Many people don't need the full featureset of RLV and prefer the simplicity of the default viewer. Experiences could act as an RLV alternative in that sense, and offer more control to the user as the user can pick and choose which creators products have the permissions, something that is not (easily) possible with RLV and users often accidentally grief themselves because they buy a choker or some other item and not realize it's RLV enabled etc.
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The beauty of Second Life is that we can all choose what we do on the platform. If Billi doesn't like experiences, she doesn't have to join them. Meanwhile creators enjoy the freedom to choose who they want to appeal to in their land. I don't mean that in a negative way, I really do think that's a good thing. We don't need to convince each other to like these things. If we like them, we like them, if we don't, we don't. Second Life lets us all enjoy SL our own way.
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Also, just trying Roblox for an hour I managed to find a simple user retention trick that could easily benefit SecondLife in their UI design (offering to go somewhere else in the quit confirmation dialog instead of just quit/cancel) - Something that has nothing at all to do with attracting young people but simply noticing some good UI design that helps newbies in another game. What helpful ideas have you had to add to this thread? none.
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22 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:
Actually that is the point. It attracts the kind of players who don't generate enough income to support the platform.
"We must copy CrapBlox because its popular with useless people we don't want here so we can LOSE a billion USD a year too!"
The average age of residents in Second Life keeps going up and up and up, and they are not going to get replaced at the rate we'll be losing them. Do you honestly think the technology of today will please the people of tomorrow? I think you are kidding yourself if you do.
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Yeah alright, well you do you Zalificent. Did you make your make everyone a genius serum yet?
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I don't think anyone is saying Second Life should try to emulate Roblox. We're a platform that targets adults after all.
In 4 or 5 years however Gen A will be old enough to play Second Life and the question is - What should we do to be good enough, by then for them to make the switch? We can look at the platforms they are using now and learn from them. Even if Roblox is a financial disaster, it's still clearly a very popular game that doesn't seem to suffer nearly the same retention problem Second Life does.
Understanding what draws so many players to it and how it manages to keep them could help Second Life in the future when it wants to attract a Gen A that has reached adulthood. After all, in 4 or 5 years, not all of the players who are currently playing Second Life will still be around. Equally of course, understanding why it loses so much money is equally important, so we don't fall into the same pitfalls.
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Then I tried to fix it by choosing another home...
... I ended up with two.
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The linden home controllers can be funny.
I once tried rotating a home...
It rotated itself off the parcel...
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Somehow I suspect if they did they'd never admit to it
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7 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:
Others just simply can't be bothered to breast another steep learning curve
Presumably you're talking about creators here, as customers do not need to learn anything. They rez their PBR house and it's already set up for them, it just works. If they use an old EEP, the sky doesn't fall, and the PBR house still looks better than their neighbors legacy one (assuming its an actually good creation).
So then what exactly does a creator have to learn? How to make a PBR material? Well if they're using Blender, they were already making PBR materials and had to convert them to work with the legacy renderer. For most creators creating in PBR removes Second Life specific steps of the content creation process. It makes it easier. Speaking as a creator who uses PBR, authoring materials for Second Life has become faster.
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I sat down and started going through all the system environments and applying them to myself one by one. None of them look 'wrong' with my own PBR content. Sure they can probably look 'better' if I edit the old environment and give it HDRI scale etc. But are they broken without it? no.
I think some of the complaints are a bit overblown to be honest, having put what is being complained about into practice. It feels like people are complaining about theory instead of what happens in practice.
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Oh, another observation that I had in roblox, that I think would work well in SecondLife.
One thing I struggled with as a newbie I had no idea how to leave the world I was in and eventually went to close the roblox window when I couldn't find how to leave.
Like Second Life, Roblox has a do you want to quit confirmation window. However, what they did different, was that they also added an option to that dialog to go to another world.
I think we could learn from that. How many newbies at the welcome hub quit SecondLife because they don't know how to go somewhere else? What if we added an option to the quit confirmation dialog to go somewhere else? It could open the destinations floater or something. It could help retain newbies a bit longer until they learn how to find destinations properly.
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In terms of 'making the transition' smoother for young people who are growing up and looking for a more mature platform.
We do already have something similar to Roblox's worlds - Experiences.
Experience profiles in SL already have a picture field, a location field, name & description field. A quick marketing trick would be to simply make an experience guide page from that data, similar to the destination guide.
Sure, I don't think they could ever be the main event like roblox, but that's not the point, the point is to provide enough familiarity to make the platform transition smoother. Like a 'hey! we have something kinda like that too!'
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I don't think Second Life should try to be Roblox. But I think it's worth observing what makes other platforms popular regardless.
I haven't given a great deal of thought yet as to what to draw from my observations. Been too busy with RL work. I might have some thoughts later.
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15 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:
I'm always amused when Positivity Cultists suggest destroying SL by shamelessly imitating CrapBlox.
*sigh*
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A Train Simulator
When I was young the equivalent of this would have been Microsoft Train Simulator.
A train drives past me. It's being driven by another player. I drove around in this world. It's also vast.
The key takeaway here for me as a creator is that Roblox players aren't just used to building little hangouts together. They build entire games together and hang out and play in them.
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So, I sat down and made an account on Roblox, to actually see what Gen A are growing up with, trying to understand their 'creature comforts' etc. I've never played Roblox before until today so all of this is new to me.
Disclaimer: I'm not claiming Second Life should behave like any of this. This post is purely observation. Don't shoot me, I'm just the messenger, mmkay?
The homescreen
The first thing I notice about Roblox is that you don't just log in and appear in a world like Second Life. You have to choose a world.
I notice that every world appears to be more like an 'activity' or an 'experience'. There are first person shooter worlds, minigame worlds, roleplay worlds etc.
I found it very easy to click something and immediately find myself engaging in an activity of some kind.
I joined a world called 'Realistic Car Driving'
It was not long before I found myself racing around, doing jumps and doing donuts in a parking lot.
From the experience I found that Roblox is a pretty strong game engine. The driving was snappy, like an actual driving simulator, it was clear the simulation was happening client side because there wasn't that classic SL input delay.
Another world takes me into a very realistic and highly detailed first person shooter experience
I notice that Roblox has no hangups about completely changing my avatar depending on the world I'm in, and the worlds have different UI. Essentially like playing totally different games. Two different driving worlds had two different UI's.
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I mean by the time those who are 14 now are mature enough to be playing SL, their interests will change and evolve and I suspect in many ways SL will have its own natural appeal over these platforms targeted at a younger audience.
With that said, maybe it would pay its dues for some residents and the SL Marketing team to create roblox accounts and play for a day. Figure out what features from Roblox are really good/popular and should make their way into SL.
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Should be live now
Was the feb 14 server release
https://releasenotes.secondlife.com/simulator/2024-02-06.7806095376.html
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Would you use an "attachment-scope Experience"?
in General Discussion Forum
Posted
Fact of the matter is all I have to do to make a relay is make a script that listens for some messages, does some processing and and send those messages to the viewer.
There's nothing stopping me selling you an attachment that puts a big black overlay over your screen when you attach it via RLV and then locking the box to your screen in such a way you can't detach it. It's so easy to grief a user with RLV it is comical.