Miranda Umino

Ok , resolved and not solved , but i don t misuse the numbers . By the way , it s true than "resolved" for firestorm can be "wait a fix from linden" http://jira.phoenixviewer.com/browse/PHOE-3790 In the JIRA of Linden it says "resolved" , and in the JIra of Firestorm it says resolved too . So they have the same interpretation . But for Linden they resolve as fast as they are new issues created . And for Firestorm they don t resolve as fast as they are new issues created . So , we can tell that the quality is going to increase for Linden and decrease for firestorm . You can t compare the backlog of issues because the both jiras have not created at the same time , because they have not the same number of reporters , and because it has no meaning for Quality Assureance . For Quality assureance , the most important is not to know the total number of bug , but to know if they will decrase or they will increase Jira is a system who works on several other enterprises ( other than linden ), it s a standard , and if the cconcepters of jira have chosen to not display the number of backlogs , it s because tit doesn t mean anything . Only the progression is important

"Yes, it can. I never said it could not be. The point you are missing is that more people do respond to the LL JIRAs because LL is the owner of SL, not the Phoenix/Firestorm team." What ?? So if i am developper in the team of phoenix and i create a bug in phoenix , it s the fault of Linden ? Weird conception of equity and justice. Another point you are missing is that quite often the issue gets resolved in the support group so the person doesn't bother going back the to the JIRA to say "Hey it's fixed. You can close this now." And no the team members have no way of knowing if a JIRA has been filed or not unless the person has told them there is one (and provided a link to said JIRA) or unless the team member spends time searching for the JIRA to close it. Time which is better spent helping people. Second Life support and second life jira have the same problems . So your argue fail . I don t know why you are talking me about the billing support and the premium .. The billing support doesn t receive the bugs of viewers , but receive the bugs of accounts , lands and transactions https://support.secondlife.com/create-case/ Where are the unit tests , and the functionnal tests in Firestorm ? Do they exist ? (except these given by Linden ) I didn t see them ...

But selene.... what you have said to defend Firestorm Jiras can be applied too to defend Second Life Viewer Jiras... Some writers in this thread and other threads ( and many writers , i should tell ) flame against the bugs of second life , and "forget" volontary the bugs of firestorm

" they should concentrate on bug fixes" Second life viewer : https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR Last 30 days : 154 issues opened 179 solved ; so they fix the issues Firestorm viewer : http://jira.phoenixviewer.com/browse/FIRE Last 30 days : 305 issues opened , 202 solved .. Do they fix the issues ? If you continue to think that Linden doesn t fix the issues , what about Firestorm ?

Wrong . 1stly , you have not more script loads . Because the scripts are dispatched in several sims . If you need to check if an avatar is online in the same sim , the llgeteagenzize(avatar) avoids these communications and is less laggy than a call to dataserver 2ndly no , you have less communication lag : there are not a lot of machines who can answer a dataserver . It creates bottlenecks and so critical lag . There are plent of machines who can answer an http . So there won t be a bottleneck as easily as with dataserver events

I am sorry . For now it s only what i can offer to you . Nevertheless , there were a sum in the same page . Unfortunately it won t be exhaustive . Check it if it can help you . To my side , i am going to check if there is better . Sometimes , the transcripts are not published the next day but later

" With tasks I mean communication. " Ok , let s talk about communication . What about the voice bugged with 1.23 ? What about media on prims ? May i share some videos , some music , some documents to someone else with viewer 1.23 when i don t own a parcel ? And may we translate easily chat text with viewer 1.23 , except in using a laggy hud ? Do you think that communication inside internet is only between people with same native language ? "Heck, I even gave it a try, with LL viewer and Firestorm (which is a V3)." It was a wrong test and try. Firestorm has a V2 look and feel not a V3 look and feel , even with the last update with v3 choice . They have started to integrate some V3 code only since this month . But it displays a V2 look and feel interface. For instance , to prove Firestorm is a V2 look and feel , you have again and always a panel in your right. With FS, you can t arrange your buttons like you wish at the sides ( only at the bottom) . With V3 , you can. Whit FS , if you want to remove all buttons , it wont remove the bottom bar . With V3 , you can earn some free place in removing everything With FS, you can t switch the butoons between icones and labels . WIth V3, you can do it . If you don t want to take too long time to learn the meaning of icones , you who tell later on the thread you want a simple viewer , the V3 look and feel done for you Other TPV viewers as Exodus , Niran have the V3 look and feel , but not Firestorm. They have integrated it well sooner and have more experience with it. The V3 is dated from end august 2011 . " FPS got worse, and despite their best efforts they still carry all the negative parts of V2/V3. " It s wrong to think than you will have better FPS with elder viewers. When for instance you check this blog who has compared many viewers , and trying to have the same situation, you can see that the viewers based v1.23 ( phoenix for instance ) are really slower than the newer viewers https://modemworld.wordpress.com/2012/01/03/comparative-viewer-frame-rates/ At the ground , the same computer with the same settings could display 48 FPS with V3 while the phoenix viewer could display 26 FPS "I missed lots of important group notices and IMs since they only show in a small box thing on the lower (or was it upper?) right hand side of the screen instead of in the chat flow on my screen, where they belong." I am sorry for you , but you tell you have not the time to configure your viewer . So , explain me how you can loose IMs when you hear a little sound easily recognizable "I just don't have the time to look around for messages and notes, I don't have the time to fix a viewer makers GUI by modding it to my taste." But with V1 viewer you spend some time alone , because one functionnality after one is broken . And you will spend many time in the forums to know how to get around your problem . "Where's my radar" The radar 1.23 ? There were no radar in 1.23 . You make the confusion with other viewers "where are the notecards I was supposed the be getting" Notecards work exactly the same . They are items from servers "why is the friendslist not in communication box where it belongs? " And why it should ? Firstly it s illogic to have its friendlist in an another tab as in viewer 1.23 Secondly, it s a waste of time : with 1.23 you must switch in your friendlist ( one click ) click on IM ( second double-click ) . So 2 clicks per IM. With V3 , you can have your friendlist in a window , open your communication window and having the two windows not overlapped . After , you need only to do one double click on the friendlist window to open an IM session . It s faster and it s more simple . "Why am I being sent into the internet just for watching some profile?" Is it a pain ? The final user is interested by the content, the functionnality , not by the technology "What is a effing folllower? Why should I follow anyone? Or why should they follow me?" And so ? what is the problem ? The interest to follow someone , is to be able to read his feed who he publishes. The interest to be followed , is to publish some comments , some links , some pictures ( YOU DON T PAY THE UPLOAD OF PICTURES ), your location in your feed to the people who follow you . When you do a screenshot on V3 , you may upload it directly without fee to your profile http://modemworld.wordpress.com/2011/09/08/web-profiles-gain-a-follow-button/ When you do a snapshot with viewer 1.23 and you want to share to your friends , you are obliged to save it to your inventory and pay 10l$ ( or save to your hard disk and uploadt it and pay 10 l$) Personnaly i see 10 l$ saved of my pocket . Not a lot of , but after several months of sl , it counts , and i see a big interest in this "Will we soon have to click some "Like" boxes?" Where is the problem ? "Good FPS, meshes, outfits and less crashes are no functions, they are the core basics in a viewer." Excuse me , but as user , i dont care if i should name this "function" or "core" . I care about the final result . That 's all . The meshes don t exist with viewer 1.23 The outfits don t exist with viewer 1.23 The physics don t exist with viewer 1.23 The tatoos don t exist with viewer 1.23 the alpha mask don t exist with viewer 1.23 5 types of thing in my inventory that i can t see with viewer 1.23 "Tools are functions. And Phoenix/FS traditionally have much more of those than LL." But phoenix is not viewer 1.23 Are you ready to delete all the tools of phoenix to come back in the viewer 1.23 ? "Also most of the stuff you get with modern LL viewers was first introduced by some or the other TPV." But viewer 1.23 is not TPV "When you come from a long history of using Emerald and other TPV it feels just bad to switch back to LL. Is like visiting a ghetto." Big words ... Have you lived in a ghetto ? This sentence is nearly an offense . "And yes, contrary to my car I don't have to pay for any viewer. I'm rather fond of Mercedes Benz btw. My own one is from 1982 and still drives like a dream. But I guess you wouldn't like it since it's outdated and I can do so much more stuff with the newer models. But that's not the point since all viewers are free, " I have never said i wouldn t like your car . I have said you can compare a car ( 10000 $ ) and a viewer (free ) And to change a viewer has no cost , to change a car has a cost . To keep an old car can be understood because it has a cost "but unfortunately the viewer as made by LL isn't as nice as the various TPVs." Viewer 1.23 is nicer than TPV ? "As some ppl already mentioned in other places: LL should maybe just stop making viewers and instead hire the Phoenix guys or Kirsten or Niran or Lance or any of the other TPV developers." Why should they ? If they hire them , they will be obliged to close the sources to protect their employees. I don t want the sources closed . If the viewer has been open source , it s because linden does money for their servers not for their viewers . And so , A word with phoenix , because i have the feeling you do the confusion between viewer 1.23 , and viewer based on the niwever 1.23 . Read the title of topic , it s well the viewer 1.23 , not phoenix. You use Phoenix . But maybe you know that Phoenix is based in fact on Emerald . What have been the improvements "tools"( in the same meaning you have used in your post ) these 2 last years in Phoenix ? None . Absolutely none . Of course , they have updated phoenix to be able to follow the "core" things as you have said in your own word . They have updated phoenix to have physics, meshes etc .. But all your tools you like ( maybe the radar you were talking sooner ?) thay come from Emerald or even before emerald , before greenlife . But let s do a comparison witan another TPV viewer What have been the improvements in one year of Kisten ( the viewer doesn t exist anymore for pesrsonal reasons )? A lot of . He was alone . But he didn t need to update the viewer , he has just needed to pull a branch from the official vieweer and to apply his own changes . He had more time to be creative. The phoenix team were several . But the phoenix team was too busy to try to update phoenix , that they couldn t offer to you , as user , new tools. They have never been able to be creative and to offer you new tools because they were too busy to update some 1.23 code An another comparaison : Exodus viewer who is TPV starts to be creative , after only some moths in pulling a branch of develeoppement from the sources of V3 ..Niran too has been more creative in only some months in pulling from V3 The phoenix team has not yet integrated all the V3 code ... It has been a waste of time for this team , and for you Two years wasted by many clever developpers who could do something more interesting than update their viewer to stay compatible . What is the final result ? a 1600 version who is awfully laggy , who has many issues with meshes and who is at the border line to die Now , imagine , if the history was different : imagine one instant , that with the same potential of clever developpers , they have decided to not not maintain a viewer based on emerald . But imagine if thay had decided to pull a branch from the official viewer and they had decided to build some new tools who doesn t exist in the official viewer . Surely you would be glad to have plent of new tools , even on a V2 look and feel ( and V3 look and feel is hugely better than V2 )

I don t see any problems . But your process won t work of course . An another proces could be for instance : every employee is owner of a prim with a simple script with a http listener the company has the list of urls of the prims of each employee The company contacts each url . The url checks the status of its owner and gives the result to the company Of course we need to change the scripts , and so ? Not an huge problem . We , scripters , have met more difficult scripts to update in the past .. It s very quick to do , trust me ..

"Now tell me why I should make a better viewer?" I don t understand you . Sooner , you were complaining because you have thought than SL3 was worst than 1.23 . But bow , you complain because SL3 is a better viewer . It s illogic "... "instance with the car . It s a bad instance : a car is not free . Many people can t buy one often because cars are expensive. The viewers are free . And don t tell about the fees and the shops because they have no link with the viewers I am sorry , but when we read the archives , there were many crahes in 2007 , and a lot of ancient people tell there were more crashes than actually . Give some statistics if you have some I have never told you have no rights to complain . But telling "SL Sucks" , it s not a complain , it s an insult . There are no objective ideas behind it And telling "They give you less functionality" , it s a lie , because objectively , there are more functionnalities ( meshes , outfits, tatooos etc )

You write : "Every task needs much more clicks now" It s wrong : To change one outfit with SL3 : one button to open the list of outfits , one click to to select the outfit = 2 clicks with phoenix : one button to open the inventory , one click to open the folder outfit , one click to select the outfit = 3 clicks and it can be worst because your inventory is not sorted With phoenix you ahve only 9 buttons at the bottom . With SL3 , you may have up to 30 buttons ( for instance with the starlight skin ) on the sides and or the bottom It s an huge difference with SL2 where you should open the side-panel before to do any action . Because , you may have more buttons at your convenaninace with SL3 than phoenix , you can access to your action faster with less clicks Better , you could change the number or the type of buttons with phoenix . With SL3 yoou can select which button is interesting you , and not display the others " The immersion effect is doggone " It s wrong , you can hide every controls with SL3 ( control+ shift + u) . But at the difference with the mouselook mode , you see your own avatar The immersion is more complete than in phoenix because you have not the gui displayed . With phoenix you will have always the bottom bar and it will limit your immersion

I am sorry but i don t understand one word what you tell . It s illogic , panoid and crazy .. A kind of theory of conspiracy or something like this .. one instance betwen serveral : you tell that voice is uloggable after i have given you the mp3 of the voice ... Seriously , i think it s yourself who has a social problem . Breath deeply , relax down , make a rest , take some hollidays .. Surely you will think better later

And the actual viewer works .. and the elder viewer than your viewer work too .. Nevertheless , i remember than copybot could copybot only 1.23 based viewers and couldn t do it with 2.0 viewers

Presonnaly i remember of an old viewer 1.23 with an 5FPS average .. Excuse me , but i think it was seriously laggy . Secondly because the graphics drivers , the hardware conformity , the opengl specifications have changed . And the old viewer hasn t be updated . And why to pick up the 1.23 viewer ? If i follow your logic , why not to pick up the First Look viewer from 2007 ? ?http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Features/First-Look-Update-59315-now-available/ba-p/564236

No thanks , i don t want download virus

and me , i want my dos 5.0 and windows 2.0 back

It s not needful . If someone wants to allow the others to see his status , he can use/create a 2 lines script checking his status and writing it in a channel . As he is the owener/creator of teh script , this function will work , and the status could be readen by those who read the channel Better , this cript can check the status of his owner and be visible by specific persons ( for instance the closer friends of the owner ) ( 3 lines of script maybe ? ) In fact , you can always broadcast your status , but you can couldn t broadcast the status of others

Oz Linden has given an instance , and in my opinion , it s a perfect example . The last years , with the emerald viewer you could have second attachements . Nevertheless , the other viewers couldn t show the avatar as the avatar was shown on emerald viewers . So, try to explain "it s an exepected feature" to newcomers who see people with emerald viewers with their hair in their ass or floating 10 m behind them .... I don t think RLV violates this policy . To keep it simple , if i am using a viewer without RLV , and i see other people playing with RLV , i see them moving and acting in the same way. So , WindRider Taiyang writing "You can't play my game unless I can have all the toys first!" is a totally wrong . You may hear oz linden and having a sum of the transcript http://yournymph.blogspot.com/2012/02/policy-on-third-party-viewers-changed.html?zx=d783502bffdb50c3

On aditi servers , you could decrease performance quickly . But it s because aditi servers are testing machines , and often with huge debbugging traces on the server side who doesn t exist on agni servers . Their hardware is different too .

In fact , the operator is not wrong . And to use "== -1" or "~" is nearly the same . But to use an user-defined function for one line is costly . It seems , that randomly , the return of the user function is either in the same frame of the sim either the next frame of the sim . So , the time spent is either < 1 ms either 22 ms . Never between . This is a program to test it integer IsInList(list data, string name){ if(llListFindList(data,[name]) != -1) return TRUE; else return FALSE;}integer IsInList2(list data, string name){ if( ~llListFindList(data,[name])) return TRUE; else return FALSE;}integer IsInList3(list data, string name){ return (llListFindList(data,[name]) != -1);}integer IsInList4(list data, string name){ return ~llListFindList(data,[name]);}integer getTime(string stamp) // count milliseconds since the day began{ return (integer) llGetSubString(stamp, 11, 12) * 3600000 + // hh (integer) llGetSubString(stamp, 14, 15) * 60000 + // mm llRound((float)llGetSubString(stamp, 17, -2) * 1000000.0)/1000; // ss.ff..f} default{ state_entry() { } touch_start(integer total_number) { integer i = 1000000000; integer j; list l; while ( i <= 1000000100 ) { l += [ (string)i + "A" ]; i++; } integer NBITERS = 1000; string t0 = llGetTimestamp(); for ( j = 1; j <= NBITERS; j++ ) IsInList(l,"1000000050A"); string t1 = llGetTimestamp(); for ( j = 1; j <= NBITERS; j++ ) IsInList2(l,"1000000050A"); string t2 = llGetTimestamp(); for ( j = 1; j <= NBITERS; j++ ) IsInList3(l,"1000000050A"); string t3 = llGetTimestamp(); for ( j = 1; j <= NBITERS; j++ ) IsInList4(l,"1000000050A"); string t4 = llGetTimestamp(); for ( j = 1; j <= NBITERS; j++ ) ~llListFindList(l,["1000000050A"]); string t5 = llGetTimestamp(); for ( j = 1; j <= NBITERS; j++ ) llListFindList(l,["1000000050A"]) != -1; string t6 = llGetTimestamp(); llOwnerSay(llList2CSV([ getTime(t1)-getTime(t0), getTime(t2)-getTime(t1), getTime(t3)-getTime(t2), getTime(t4)-getTime(t3), getTime(t5)-getTime(t4), getTime(t6)-getTime(t5)])); } } The results give for instance [01:16] Object: 12593, 12552, 12586, 12678, 8940, 8915 [01:18] Object: 12003, 12327, 12449, 12675, 8942, 8932 [01:19] Object: 13145, 13320, 13309, 13184, 8966, 8926 Inline versions are faster than user-functions . But "=-1" or "~" are equally fast . With NBITERS = 1 it gives for instance [01:27] Object: 1, 0, 21, 0, 23, 22 [01:27] Object: 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0 [01:27] Object: 0, 0, 0, 22, 0, 0 [01:27] Object: 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0 [01:27] Object: 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0 [01:27] Object: 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0 [01:27] Object: 22, 0, 0, 0, 0, 22 [01:28] Object: 0, 0, 0, 22, 22, 0 [01:28] Object: 0, 0, 0, 21, 0, 1 [01:28] Object: 1, 0, 0, 22, 0, 22 [01:28] Object: 0, 0, 0, 22, 0, 0 [01:28] Object: 0, 0, 0, 0, 22, 0 [01:28] Object: 0, 0, 22, 0, 23, 22 [01:28] Object: 0, 1, 0, 0, 0, 0 I don t know why people talk about loop . There are no loops.

Some users with ATI graphic cards meet your experience . The main solution is to upgrade your drivers For instance : version of drivers who display the items in purple/pink :8.14 8.632.1.2-090817a-087324C-ATI version of drivers who display fine :8.17 8.93-111205a-132079C-ATI If you use the Catalyst Software Suit to update your graphic card driver , the revision 12.1 dated from end january 2012 should fix your problem

Some users with ATI graphic cards meet your experience . The main solution is to upgrade your drivers For instance : version of drivers who display the items in purple/pink :8.14 8.632.1.2-090817a-087324C-ATI version of drivers who display fine :8.17 8.93-111205a-132079C-ATI If you use the Catalyst Softawre Suit to update your graphic card driver , the revision 12.1 dated from end january 2012 should fix your problem

firstly come back to a default avatar : Press control+alt+q to display the developper menu . Maybe the shortcut is different on Mac . ( maybe control+option+q ?? ). select in this menu Avatars/Tests/Test Female normally after this you should look like a default avatar and not a cloud change your outfit after this. Secondly, to avoid future problems, Pres control+alt+q to display the developper menu . If you have Textures HTTP checked , uncheck it . Thirdly , avoid to wear some attachment with too many scripts . When you rez or TP , and you wear too much , it can happen . fourthly : if it doesn t work , verify in displaying the advanced menu ( probably control+option+d shortcut on mac ) , you display everything in the rendering types submenu Watch this to know how it looks http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Advanced_menu

If you create temp lists or temp strings , try to not stay for ever or too long in the same event . Because the garbage collector couldn t free your memory .

Even inside blender , when you must generate by python face per face , it s slow . And LSL functions can t spend a long time because a script shouldn t monopolize the CPU of the sim . Nevertheless they can delegate the work to the viewer sometimes as it s done already for the particles And too , some functions work by groups of vertexs or by group of datas . Maybe in the future we could assign or change these proprieties to have some dynamic changes in-world. Am i dreaming ?

Personnaly i don t meet any problems with llcastray . Maybe your iMaxRayHits is too high , maybe your iScanRange is too high . Or maybe you spam llcatray without delay between two calls. Personnaly , when i couple llcastray with my camera , i save the old camera , and call llcastray only when the camera has changed . It avoids spam , but i don t know if it will satisfy your needs