How to make a 132 prim vehicle meet 32 prim physic requirement.

[Lennon Neox]

Hello. Vehicle developer noob trying to understand how to make an 132 prim object be under or equal to 32 prims. I have looked at the mesh option but I currently use the Firestorm viewer to access Second Life, so I do not think that it supports this mesh function that seems to be the rage.

 

Is there a way to fool the lsl script server to believe I just have a 32 prim object and not any amount over that?

[Ariel Vuissent]

I'm not a builder, so I'm not sure how to make the vehicle meet that requirement, but thought I would chime in that, should you be interested in doing so, you CAN try mesh, as Firestorm does support it.

[Chosen Few]

No, there's no way to fool the system.  If your model is 132 prims, then it can't be made physical, period.  If you're going to use prims, then either make a simpler model, or use a different method of locomotion than physics.

That's just how it is with prims.  They're are accounted under a "one size fits all" paradigm.  Whether it's a torus or a cube or a sphere or what have you, every prim has a weight of exactly 1 in terms of both land impact and physics.

Imported mesh models, on the other hand, are accounted under an entirely different, and far more sensible system, in accordance with the actual resources they use.   Unlike with prims, the visual shape of a mesh model is a totally separate entity from its physical shape.  Therefore, as long as the model's physical shape is simplistic enough to stay under 32, the model can be made physical, no matter how complex the visual shape might be.

 

A few things to know:

1. Firestorm does support mesh, so if that's your viewer of choice, you're fine, as far as that goes.  To be allowed to upload mesh models to SL, you just need to have payment information on file with LL, so they know who you are, and you have to complete a quick IP rights quiz/tutorial, so they know that you understand you shouldn't do things like rip models out of games and upload them to SL. 

Of course, you'll also need to know how to make mesh models in the first place.  That means get yourself a good 3D modeling program if you don't already have one, and learn how to use it to do polygonal modeling if you don't already know it. 

 

2.  Mesh modeling is the standard way that all content for all video games and virtual worlds is made.  It's been THE standard, for decades, and likely always will be.  People whose only experience with 3D content is SL tend to be under the impression that its some newfangled thing LL invented.  I take it from your "seems to be all the rage" comment that you maybe thought that, too.  Do yourself a favor, and recognize it for what it really is.  Learning how to make mesh models will not only help you with SL, but will give you a marketable skill that can be transferred to literally every other realtime 3D platform there is.

 

3.  If you're brand new to mesh modeling, and you do want to learn it, then the best advice I can give you is to forget all about SL content for the next few weeks, and focus on learning 3D modeling itself.  Don't ever approach it with "I want to make ______" in mind, whatever the blank happens to be. Treat it like learning a musical instrument or a language.  You learn the basics of the subject itself first, and then you practice, practice, practice, to get good enough to do the specifics.

Once you've got a handle on the basics of modeling, you'll be apply that knowledge to whatever it is you want to make, be it content for SL or anything else. But if you try to go the other way around, to narrow the focus just to SL right from the start, you'll be in for a world of frustration. 

Trust me on this.  No matter how smart or capable you may be simply doesn't matter.  No one can successfully put the cart before the horse.  Learn this stuff in the right order, one step at at time, and it's EASY!  Try take it out of order, and you'll be tearing your hair out in frustration, banging your head on your keyboard in despair, and throwing your monitor over the nearest cliff in defeat, within a matter of hours.  There's only one way to approach it that works.

 

4.  There's no such thing as "the LSL script server".  LSL is a scripting language, which we humans utilize in order to issue instructions to objects, to tell them how to behave within the simulation.

 

5.  LSL has nothing to do with physics.  The physics in SL, is driven by a dedicated software package called Havok.  It's used in all kinds of games and virtual worlds.

[Lennon Neox]

Thank you for the info. I have not really had found any hard evidence on what a mesh model is, but I assume from what your saying is that you have to create one using a different 3-D modeling program. I guess I will just have to build a simpler vehicle and check out how to make a mesh model.

Linden Labs really got to get it together, were almost in 2012 for goodness sake. They are just updating services without making references for people who don't fully understand the mechanics with the feature. Sorry, I am talking like it's new, even though it's not, because I have not come across a reason to understand it until now.

Great.... back to the drawing board. I can not wait until they decide to come out with a feature that will have more emphasis on people trying to make a little business .

[Innula Zenovka]

If you use a recent version of Firestorm, you should certainly be able to set child prims to PRIM_PHYSICS_SHAPE_NONE

Select the object in Edit mode, and examine the "Features" tab.   It should be available on a drop down there.  If it's not, then consider updating Firestorm or even using the official viewer at least for this exercise.    If it is there, you need to deselect anything that needs to remain physical (the root prim, certainly, plus wheels, bumpers/fenders and anything else that might need to be solid.    Then select Physics Shape None for the remaining selected items.

Be warned, though, that this means your vehicle's "land impact" will now be calculated according to the mesh accounting system, which I don't pretend to understand.   All I know is that complex shapes -- tortured prims, cut toruses and the like -- come very expensive, so you might find your 132 prim vehicle suddenly has a "land impact" of considerably more than 132. So try this in a sandbox first.

You can, if necessary, set PRIM_PHYSICS_SHAPE_TYPE by script.  Using Edit Linked Parts, simply drop this into each prim you want thus to set.

 

default{	state_entry()	{		llSetLinkPrimitiveParamsFast(LINK_THIS,[ PRIM_PHYSICS_SHAPE_TYPE,PRIM_PHYSICS_SHAPE_NONE]);		llRemoveInventory(llGetScriptName());	}}

 But doing that for 100+ prims seems a very laborious way of doing something that can so easily be done with an up-to-date viewer.

 You don't need to make the item out of mesh for this to work.  You just need to set the prim physics shape to the appropriate mesh physics type.

[Chosen Few]

---

Lennon Neox wrote:

I have not really had found any hard evidence on what a mesh model is, but I assume from what your saying is that you have to create one using a different 3-D modeling program.

---

Yes, exactly.

The best way to think of it is to equate the SL viewer to a browser.  If you want to make very simple content for the Web, like the posts we're writing in this forum right now, then your browser is all you need.  However, if you want to make anything more complicated than that, you'll need dedicated software for the task, like Dreamweaver, Flash, etc.  By the same token, if you want to make very simple content for SL, like primitive geometric solids (prims), you can do that directy in the viewer.  But if you want to make anything more than that, like textures, sounds, animations, and yes, mesh models, you need to do that in programs that are dedicated for those purposes.  Even the quirky, entirely SL-specific, sculpted primitives (sculpties) require third party 3D modeling software.

 

---

Lennon Neox wrote:

 

Linden Labs really got to get it together, were almost in 2012 for goodness sake. They are just updating services without making references for people who don't fully understand the mechanics with the feature. Sorry, I am talking like it's new, even though it's not, because I have not come across a reason to understand it until now.

---

It's more than understandable that you never before might have had cause to think about what a mesh model is, or even to have been aware that they existed in the first place. However, in total fairness, should LL really be held responsible for that?  Should it really fall on them to have to state that that which is standard is standard?

LL has never explained what a texture is, nor how to make one.  Yet, everybody makes and/or uses textures every day, and I'm pretty sure nobody thinks they were invented specifically for SL.  The same is true of sounds, and animations.  Why should mesh models be any different?

For what it's worth, they did go to lengths to explain how sculpties work, when sculpties were first introdiced, since those are totally unique to SL.  Adding sculpties without explaining them wouldn't have been productive. 

But for something as absolutely standard as mesh, there's little to no reason for LL to expend resources into trying to explain anything about it at all, beyond just what very few SL-specific considerations for its implementation are in play (and they do explain those quite thoroughly, contrary to what certain resident doomsayers would have you believe).  LL isn't in the business of giving modeling lessons, nor should they be.

I don't expect LL to instruct me on on mesh modeling any more than I'd expect my Web host to teach me how to make websites, or a toll booth attentdant to teach me how to drive.

[Chosen Few]

Ah, I didn't realize prims could be set to utilize the new accounting method.  Thanks for the correction.

Prim builds have such an ungodly amount of hidden faces and extra vertices, though, I have to assume the land impact would go through the roof for anything made out of 132 prims.   So, this might not prove all that useful a solution to the OP's problem.  Simplifying the build, or replacing it with a mesh model, are still going to be the most effective solutions.

[Lennon Neox]

Thank you all for the advice. Especially you Innula. I will differently experiment with the script as well as investigate these mesh techniques. As far as upgrading my viewer, the real problem for me is saving money and giving my either my laptop or buy an desktop with better graphic processing qualities (more than likely I am going to build it myself .) . It will take some time but I guess I am going to have to be more patient.

[Innula Zenovka]

As Chosen rightly points out, there's a danger that the "Land Impact" of the vehicle will go through the roof using the mesh accounting techniques, so I'm not sure how practical a solution it will be.  No harm in testing in a quiet sandbox, to see what effect it has, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if the vehicle suddently turned out to need several hundred spare prims on a sim before you can rez it -- like I said, I don't pretend to understand the ins and outs of the mesh accounting system, but I do know it can throw nasty surprises at you.

 

[Rufus Darkfold]

You might even want to set the wheels to NONE (since they are likely to be rather costly, around 14 each for tori, under the new accounting) and have an invisible box hold the vehicle off the ground.

The new accounting also offers another option for moving your vehicle,  llSetKeyframedMotion.   This is for non-physical vehicles,  but provides the same smooth motion as you get with physical, and is far easier to code and seems less laggy.  This would be particlarly appicable to vehicles like boats and aircraft that do NOT follow  terrain.

BTW,  the land impact of my latest (non-physical) vehcile went from 18 under the old accounting to 243 when I changed one prim, and back down to 18 as I changed all the toruses, tubes, and rings in the build to NONE.    Without a script in it,  land impact drops to 11.  (Looks like small, passive builds may do much better under the new accounting than the old).