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Tamara Artis

Is it possible to do it without the balls?

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Heya:)

I hate balls! And i hate when I need to click on something to get them then sit on them. 

So, can I buy something, to do the s.. thing without balls?

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The only way I can think of is the way some "Hug and Kiss" scripts work, where the hud allows you to offer a hug or a kiss, and if the second person accepts, then both characters do an animation. But that would work very poorly for adult activity animations, because there is no way to adjust for variations in avatar size, or to ensure alignment between the two avatars.

Pose balls are needed to lock the relative positions of the avatars to each other and allow adjustability, with regarde to animation playback.

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I rarely use pose balls anymore.  You really don't need them but it does take more time to set up the positions when you don't and then, when you do, they may not be easy to align for each user.  You can also create a sit script that reads the size of your avi and adjust the positions accordingly.

I did buy a Hot Tub a while back that had an ingenious script where you clicked on the towels (his and hers) to start the animations.  The poses are adjusted with a chat command and overall, it's a very well done piece. 

It was made by Denny Chrome and his store is DC Design.  You may want to go check it out or some of his other stuff. 

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Crossleg.pngI've always been frustrated by poseballs as well which is one of the reasons I learned everything I could about animations.  For most of the projects I help with and everything that I make for my personal shop I simply use HUDs or scripts like Ceera was hinting at.

For furniture and such there are fantastic scripts that let someone just sit on the couch or whatever and then menus let them pick positions.  For AO's and ground sits I just make the anims and let people pick from a HUD menu, no poseballs necessary.  The trick with that is that you have to be careful making the animation because there's no poseball to adjust the position... tall people may float above the ground, while short people may sink into it.  Poseballs help sort that drama out.

Ceera was also right that if you're trying to bring two (or more... but shame on you) people together then poseballs are the easiest to position them with, although the scripts I use for furniture can do the same thing with a few more clicks.

To really be helpful we'd need to know what you're interested in.  Sitting?  Picture posing?  Kissing?  etc etc.  Simply filling your AO with what you're interested in and using the 'sit anywhere' may be all you need, can't really guess. 

You can just poke me with a PM to get down into the details if you're trying something in particular... if you just want to whine about silly looking poseballs then I'm right there with you and I'll be glad to whimper and wail together.

Enjoy your learning in the forums ;)

Lanas

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Well, it is but you'll be firing 'blanks'.

Sorry sorry. It is possible.

I suggest something I have. Its free and works great for simple poses. Learjeff's Easy Sit Target Positioner is what it is I beleive. There are also other free ones that work just as well. You can even put multiple poses but that may be a bit tougher.

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You can use nPose, a free OS system, which doesn't involve poseballs.   Or Perfect Sitter.   The only drawback is that you need to sit in the right order, because the scripts have no other way of knowing who plays which animation in a pair other than the order in which you sit.

Anyone who wants a copy of nPose is welcome to IM me or Pudenta Magic in world for one.

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Yes it is possible to have couples animations with no pose balls.  I own a such a rug, made by EarthDwellings, and I've seen other furniture.  I have no idea how the rug works without balls, but it works well, and I like it a lot better than pose balls.

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Thank you all for your replies!

I'll reply to myself lol, and try to explain the situation.

Last night I was wandering round the grid with a guy and we ended up at some boat. It was nothing special except the perfect place to have a quick adult activity. Since this is an adult forum, but I need to write as it is not, lets hope you all know what I mean:)

My AOs can walk, sit, ground sit, dance, swim etc, don't need that kind of a posing, I just wanted to have some hud and be able to do an old fashion adult activity. Without rezzing some piece of a furniture!

And yes, he had a bracelet but when I clicked the balls rezzed in the air and it was baaad!

I'll look through all the infos you gave me and see if I can do something, thanks!;)

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Thank you all for your replies!

I'll reply to myself lol, and try to explain the situation.

Last night I was wandering round the grid with a guy and we ended up at some boat. It was nothing special except the perfect place to have a quick adult activity. Since this is an adult forum, but I need to write as it is not, lets hope you all know what I mean:)

My AOs can walk, sit, ground sit, dance, swim etc, don't need that kind of a posing, I just wanted to have some hud and be able to do an old fashion adult activity. Without rezzing some piece of a furniture!

And yes, he had a bracelet but when I clicked the balls rezzed in the air and it was baaad!

I'll look through all the infos you gave me and see if I can do something, thanks!;)

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Griffin Ceawlin wrote:

I like my balls and can't imagine what life would be like without them. I do
not
, however, like sitting on them.

:matte-motes-big-grin: omg!:matte-motes-oh-rly: I really really like you Griffin!

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Griffin Ceawlin wrote:

I like my balls and can't imagine what life would be like without them. I do
not
, however, like sitting on them.

:matte-motes-big-grin: omg!:matte-motes-oh-rly: I really really like you Griffin!

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Ah, that is a bit of a problem, I'm afraid.   I thought you were talking about wanting to use furniture that didn't have poseballs, with Npose and Perfect Sitter and similar are very good for.   But if you want to animate two people without either of them sitting on something it's very tricky to align them properly.

I don't want to get too technical about it here -- ask in Scripting Tips if you want the detailed explanation, and I'll do my best there -- but animating two people who're standing (like with a hug/kiss anim) from an attachment one of them is wearing is done very differently from animating two people who're sitting on prims.  

Aligning them is far trickier for several technical reasons, to do with lsl and how it calculates rotations, and if you want to put them in a pose where one of them is laying on top of the other it's an absolute nightmare because you then run into problems with what the physics engine wants to do.    And you've got the over-riding problem that -- unlike when you're sitting on something that contains the script -- your attachment is being moved around with you, which messes up the calculations something horrible.

My business partner is a very good animator, and I'm a pretty experienced scripter,  and we've struggled with this, on and off, for ages.   There's so many things we'd like to with synchronised animations for couples played from a hud -- not just sex anims -- that we just can't because it's too tricky for the people using them to line themselves up properly for most of the couples poses.   Yes, there are some sex positions you can get to work without too much hassle, but it's a very limited repertoire (unless you particularly like doing stuff with both of you standing up, or one of you kneeling in front of the other).

Having said all that, the new beta viewer (and Dolphin and Cool VL, I think) includes two new attachment points, and -- while I've not done much with it yet -- I'm quietly optimistic that one of them, the new Root attachment point (which doesn't move when the avatar is animated) is potentially going to simplify life a lot, though I'm not sure if it will actually fix the problem.

So it might be possible some what down the line, once scripters and animators have had a chance to experiment with ATTACH_ROOT (and enough people are using it viewers that support it) but I think you're stuck with sitting on things -- be it poseballs or furniture --  for a while yet.

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Ah, that is a bit of a problem, I'm afraid.   I thought you were talking about wanting to use furniture that didn't have poseballs, with Npose and Perfect Sitter and similar are very good for.   But if you want to animate two people without either of them sitting on something it's very tricky to align them properly.

I don't want to get too technical about it here -- ask in Scripting Tips if you want the detailed explanation, and I'll do my best there -- but animating two people who're standing (like with a hug/kiss anim) from an attachment one of them is wearing is done very differently from animating two people who're sitting on prims.  

Aligning them is far trickier for several technical reasons, to do with lsl and how it calculates rotations, and if you want to put them in a pose where one of them is laying on top of the other it's an absolute nightmare because you then run into problems with what the physics engine wants to do.    And you've got the over-riding problem that -- unlike when you're sitting on something that contains the script -- your attachment is being moved around with you, which messes up the calculations something horrible.

My business partner is a very good animator, and I'm a pretty experienced scripter,  and we've struggled with this, on and off, for ages.   There's so many things we'd like to with synchronised animations for couples played from a hud -- not just sex anims -- that we just can't because it's too tricky for the people using them to line themselves up properly for most of the couples poses.   Yes, there are some sex positions you can get to work without too much hassle, but it's a very limited repertoire (unless you particularly like doing stuff with both of you standing up, or one of you kneeling in front of the other).

Having said all that, the new beta viewer (and Dolphin and Cool VL, I think) includes two new attachment points, and -- while I've not done much with it yet -- I'm quietly optimistic that one of them, the new Root attachment point (which doesn't move when the avatar is animated) is potentially going to simplify life a lot, though I'm not sure if it will actually fix the problem.

So it might be possible some what down the line, once scripters and animators have had a chance to experiment with ATTACH_ROOT (and enough people are using it viewers that support it) but I think you're stuck with sitting on things -- be it poseballs or furniture --  for a while yet.

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Probably we should take this to the scripting forum, but offhand, I'm not seeing how ATTACH_ROOT is going to help much. There are really two underlying problems here: first is that it's impossible for one avatar to sit on another avatar's attachment, and second that (AFAIK) there's still no mechanism for scripts to rotate an avatar unless the avatar is sitting on the scripted object.

(I haven't yet played extensively with llSetKeyramedMotion(), so it's possible that will work in attachments in a way that can somehow trick the avatar to rotate -- but I doubt it.)

Unless there's some way around one of those limitations, I don't see how we'll be able to do much better at lining up couple animations.

[ETA: Just wanted to agree with the nPose recommendation.  The other recommendation, however, not so much, unless it's getting a major makeover to reduce resource consumption; every estate sim I've managed has had at least one product using that system near the top of Top Scripts.]

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Probably we should take this to the scripting forum, but offhand, I'm not seeing how ATTACH_ROOT is going to help much. There are really two underlying problems here: first is that it's impossible for one avatar to sit on another avatar's attachment, and second that (AFAIK) there's still no mechanism for scripts to rotate an avatar unless the avatar is sitting on the scripted object.

(I haven't yet played extensively with llSetKeyramedMotion(), so it's possible that will work in attachments in a way that can somehow trick the avatar to rotate -- but I doubt it.)

Unless there's some way around one of those limitations, I don't see how we'll be able to do much better at lining up couple animations.

[ETA: Just wanted to agree with the nPose recommendation.  The other recommendation, however, not so much, unless it's getting a major makeover to reduce resource consumption; every estate sim I've managed has had at least one product using that system near the top of Top Scripts.]

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Thank you, all of oyu, for trying to explain me, and ty Inulla for that note you sent me inworld!:)

I got it now, sadly lol

But I have another question, how it would look if you just make some object, that looks like a rug for example, and that object becomes invisible when avatars use it, that way it would look like they're on the ground lol

Its a pitty to find out we can't do "it" in some hidden public places, specially if we can't rezz stuff there;)

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Thank you, all of oyu, for trying to explain me, and ty Inulla for that note you sent me inworld!:)

I got it now, sadly lol

But I have another question, how it would look if you just make some object, that looks like a rug for example, and that object becomes invisible when avatars use it, that way it would look like they're on the ground lol

Its a pitty to find out we can't do "it" in some hidden public places, specially if we can't rezz stuff there;)

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I agree maybe we should take this to scripting tips, but, briefly, I hope that ATTACH_ROOT is going to let me start my animations while the two avatars are standing some distance apart, so I can have one of them appearing to be laying on top of the other without their bounding boxes getting in each other's way.    You know more about this than do I, Qie, but that's one of the big problems I've always had with trying to make couples animations work for avatars who aren't sitting on anything -- the one underneath tends to slide sideways.

As to rotating avatars, I've had reasonable success with RLV and @setrot when I start llMove2Targetting towards the person I want to hug, kiss or otherwise molest.   It's not ideal, and certainly not as good as rotating a seated avatar, but I'm certainly encouraged enough to dust off some previous experiements to see what I can do with it when called from ATTACH_ROOT.

Obviously that only works if the person wearing the attachment is using RLV, but most of my friends and customers do, so there's some point in my experimenting.

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I agree maybe we should take this to scripting tips, but, briefly, I hope that ATTACH_ROOT is going to let me start my animations while the two avatars are standing some distance apart, so I can have one of them appearing to be laying on top of the other without their bounding boxes getting in each other's way.    You know more about this than do I, Qie, but that's one of the big problems I've always had with trying to make couples animations work for avatars who aren't sitting on anything -- the one underneath tends to slide sideways.

As to rotating avatars, I've had reasonable success with RLV and @setrot when I start llMove2Targetting towards the person I want to hug, kiss or otherwise molest.   It's not ideal, and certainly not as good as rotating a seated avatar, but I'm certainly encouraged enough to dust off some previous experiements to see what I can do with it when called from ATTACH_ROOT.

Obviously that only works if the person wearing the attachment is using RLV, but most of my friends and customers do, so there's some point in my experimenting.

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Tamara Artis wrote:

But I have another question, how it would look if you just make some object, that looks like a rug for example, and that object becomes invisible when avatars use it, that way it would look like they're on the ground lol

That's really easy to do.. same as poseballs.   A rug  with nPose in could easily be made to vanish when someone sits on it and become visible again when you stand up.

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Tamara Artis wrote:

But I have another question, how it would look if you just make some object, that looks like a rug for example, and that object becomes invisible when avatars use it, that way it would look like they're on the ground lol

That's really easy to do.. same as poseballs.   A rug  with nPose in could easily be made to vanish when someone sits on it and become visible again when you stand up.

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ATTACH_ROOT is really only going to affect where an attachment appears relative to the avatar. It will not really change where LSL sees attachments, that is the position it already reports for the old points. At least there will now be a case where the reported position is correct. The new attach point could maybe let you show guide boxes that help the avatars walk to the right place, but it offers nothing to help physics limitations because attachment appearance is all client side.

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