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AnneMarie Draconia

Club Staff Union ???

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Sy Beck wrote:

Can anybody here devise me a new set of rules for Monopoly.  The game as it is, seems unduly oppressive and I will no longer put up with being squashed under the capitalist, jackbooted heel of my partner's tiny silver boot!

Would you mind so much if it was a black patent leather stiletto, wrapped around a nicely pedicured foot at the end of a fish-netted leg?

(Never mind that the next step in that visual is a lampshade).

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Madelaine McMasters wrote:


Sy Beck wrote:

Can anybody here devise me a new set of rules for Monopoly.  The game as it is, seems unduly oppressive and I will no longer put up with being squashed under the capitalist, jackbooted heel of my partner's tiny silver boot!

Would you mind so much if it was a black patent leather stiletto, wrapped around a nicely pedicured foot at the end of a fish-netted leg?

(Never mind that the next step in that visual is a lampshade).

GET OUT OF MY HEAD McMASTERS!

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  • Yes
  • No
  • None
  • No

I'd just like to make it clear that I'm old enough to remember how the unions destroyed this country's industry in the 1970s and 80s.  Any business I run in SL will always be non-union.  It's illegal to discriminate on the grounds of union membership (or not) in RL, at the moment but thankfully even the EU hasn't closed all the loopholes so there's always some way to stop the Soviet rot, as long as you get it quickly enough.

NOTHING kills a company quicker than being uncompetitive and NOTHING makes a company as uncompetitive as a union.  Then all the union staff are unemployed because their companies have closed-down.

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lets go back to basics, forget about "the union" and clubs and lets look at the source of the problem and why this solution was thought.

we need a form of organization to protect the weak from abuse.

many people get abused in second life, specially from ones who have more resources than them, im not talking about physical abuse, thats impossible here, but there are other types of abuse, psychological and emotional, that can add a great level of stress on the victim, and potentially damaging the user severly. i have seen that happen here in the forums.

to do something about it, groups like Justice League Unlimited has been created, and many others, because in this world with practically no law, there is practically no defense for the weak, the solution of the Union is one of many, because theres a clear need for that, and we dont have a very effective one currently.

if anyone can come out with an idea to solve this, if it can solve a small part of it, its a good thing to add to the world.

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Canoro, I am surprised at your comment. I do agree that the weak (or inexperienced) need protection from those who would take advantage. I cannot agree that we need to form an organization. I think that can only lead to one organization fighting another. The only way anyone can help is to do what many (you, for instance) already do: offer encouragement to those who need it.

We can't make weak people strong. We can, and should, condemn those who take advantage and do what we can to minimize their influence. I do not think forming organizations to combat loutishness can work in a virtual world. There is too little accountability.

I reallly hated disagreeing with you. You are one of the most well-spoken people on these forums. Even when you are being subjected to attack you remain calm and state your case; a talent I lack.

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when i see people, specially newcomers that are abused, and linden lab cant do anything about it, they dont get in residents disputes, and some cases where a landlord ban someone from a sim after the residents pay the rent, i wish there was something to protect them, some groups of people see that and do something about it, some dont use the best methods but they try to be part of the solution, and that can be appreciated. a union is meant to defend, thats its main purpose, so if a union is going to stop some abuse in second life, i support it.

also that, offer encouragement to those who need it, condemn those who take advantage and do what we can to minimize their influence.

some times people disagree, and thats ok, we come from different backgrounds, we are different, it would be unreal that we match every perspective.

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Canoro Philipp wrote:

lets go back to basics, forget about "the union" and clubs and lets look at the source of the problem and why this solution was thought.

we need a form of organization to protect the weak from abuse.

many people get abused in second life, specially from ones who have more resources than them, im not talking about physical abuse, thats impossible here, but there are other types of abuse, psychological and emotional, that can add a great level of stress on the victim, and potentially damaging the user severly. i have seen that happen here in the forums.

to do something about it, groups like Justice League Unlimited has been created
, and many others, because in this world with practically no law, there is practically no defense for the weak, the solution of the Union is one of many, because theres a clear need for that, and we dont have a very effective one currently.

if anyone can come out with an idea to solve this, if it can solve a small part of it, its a good thing to add to the world.

1 user laughed and laughed and laughed until she cried..... ok, that user was me =D

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I think what you are asking for is more akin to a police body than a union and that can only be provided by LL or some other entity at their [LL] behest and permission.

I have to agree with Void about you citing JLU.

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groups like JLU  and SL police and the rest of them don't solve anything..they end up creating more problems and more griefers and in turn are griefers themselves..

education is the best way to teach someone and for someone to learn how not to be a victim..groups willing to do that are a help..

not these AR groups that go around collecting all kinds of information on everyone and stacking it up on some database..

 

 

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it's because LL is charging them way too much for tier. Direct your complaints against the real culprit: LL;

______________________________________________________________________________________

Och a jab at the big business, and the free market econmy.. At the last look at the TOS. It nowhere states gameful employment, and a right to work.  Perhaps one needs to step in the RL.. I am not certian what a strike would do, when there are so many choices.. But if makes you happy..

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  Thankfully there are right to work states where you can't be forced to join a union in order to get a job.    SL is a US corporation, should they then set up Right to Work sims where the unions hold no sway

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thank you .. that was rattling around in my little brain...

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Canoro Philipp wrote:

lets go back to basics, forget about "the union" and clubs and lets look at the source of the problem and why this solution was thought.

we need a form of organization to protect the weak from abuse.

many people get abused in second life, specially from ones who have more resources than them, im not talking about physical abuse, thats impossible here, but there are other types of abuse, psychological and emotional, that can add a great level of stress on the victim, and potentially damaging the user severly. i have seen that happen here in the forums.

to do something about it, groups like Justice League Unlimited has been created, and many others, because in this world with practically no law, there is practically no defense for the weak, the solution of the Union is one of many, because theres a clear need for that, and we dont have a very effective one currently.

if anyone can come out with an idea to solve this, if it can solve a small part of it, its a good thing to add to the world.

Good posts Canoro!

Tell me more about this "Justice Leage Unlimited," please. I've never heard of it but sounds like I might be interested.

Thanks!

Jeanne

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JeanneAnne wrote:


Canoro Philipp wrote:

lets go back to basics, forget about "the union" and clubs and lets look at the source of the problem and why this solution was thought.

we need a form of organization to protect the weak from abuse.

many people get abused in second life, specially from ones who have more resources than them, im not talking about physical abuse, thats impossible here, but there are other types of abuse, psychological and emotional, that can add a great level of stress on the victim, and potentially damaging the user severly. i have seen that happen here in the forums.

to do something about it, groups like Justice League Unlimited has been created, and many others, because in this world with practically no law, there is practically no defense for the weak, the solution of the Union is one of many, because theres a clear need for that, and we dont have a very effective one currently.

if anyone can come out with an idea to solve this, if it can solve a small part of it, its a good thing to add to the world.

Good posts Canoro!

Tell me more about this "Justice Leage Unlimited," please. I've never heard of it but sounds like I might be interested.

Thanks!

Jeanne

oh you want information about them? LOL

ok i'm gonna send you some links in IM because i'd probably get banned from the forums for posting them here...

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Ceka Cianci wrote:

ok the links are in your forum IM's..that should be enough to get you started  hehehe

Wow!! Ceka... Thanks!

Thanks not just for turning me on2 bronxelf's Summary Thread of the JLU affair, but for alerting me to the existence of SLUniverse forum.

I've only read bronxelf's Summary but it sounds like the JLU are DC comics superhero roleplayers, more than anything. If they actually are running software that detects peoples' IP addresses in SL, that's just wrong. It wasn't clear to me that they're actually doing that, tho. If they are, then LL ought to put a stop to it.

Maybe the JLU's intentions are good (and maybe not!) but I don't think we need a bunchuv self-appointed vigilantes running around SL collecting info on people they consider to be griefers (or "goons" as Boellstorff calls them). When I advocated a Union for SL club workers I had no intention of it operating as such. Obviously, these issues are complex and there is an entire history to SL that I don't understand (and reading Boellstorff's book only gives me the vaguest notion of). Guess I'd better do more reading & give the whole thing more thought!

Thanks again!

Jeanne

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oh i understand you were not meaning  using something like that..

i just seen groups like those mentioned and had to pull the whole romance out of it to show they are just users like the rest of us..

i don't know what their program does nowdays..

i just know we are all users on the same level..no matter how head strong we get..and when we do get to a point where we think the rest of the grid is below us..we need to be put in check..

groups on power trips thinking they can push or manipulate any other users or scare the crap out of them..they need a good kick in the butt..

 

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Ceka Cianci wrote:

oh i understand you were not meaning  using something like that..

i just seen groups like those mentioned and had to pull the whole romance out of it to show they are just users like the rest of us..

i don't know what their program does nowdays..

i just know we are all users on the same level..no matter how head strong we get..and when we do get to a point where we think the rest of the grid is below us..we need to be put in check..

groups on power trips thinking they can push or manipulate any other users or scare the crap out of them..they need a good kick in the butt..

 

My goodness!! It just goes on & on... Apparently, not only were they collecting IP addresses of SL users, but also info on alts, RL medical information & info about family members!!! But were doing so in a way that *technically* didn't violate LL's ToS! Then they were storing this data on the bwiki that's only password protected and easily cracked. And... there were at least certain Lindens who supported them doing this!!!

LoL This is really rich. Someone should write a novel about all this, and then make the movie. Who knew there are people so caught up in SL that they would go to all this trouble? Mind blowing!!!

Know what I think, Cera? The JLU needs more than a good kick in the butt. They need to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law!

Jeanne

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JLU and Unions are forms of organization that their purpose is to protect the weak against abuse. i agree that some of those organization dont use the best methods, but at least they are doing something.

the more people get together for that noble purpose, the better.

im up for anything that fill that hole in second life.

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Jeanneanne be very careful of what you type because of the forums rules ..we can't really go into detail on these forums like we can in others..

 

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You sound familiar with these groups.  What can they really do to enforce any agreements in SL?  Specifically?

How can collecting dubious information on avatar names (for what purpose) accomplish anything?

If someone is 'doing something' that is better than doing nothing?  In all cases? 

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Canoro Philipp wrote:

JLU and Unions are forms of organization that their purpose is to protect the weak against abuse. i agree that some of those organization dont use the best methods, but at least they are doing something.

the more people get together for that noble purpose, the better.

im up for anything that fill that hole in second life.

that may have been the initial start up idea..but it's long past that now..

thats why these things are never a good idea..because they are ran by humans..just like any black list..they become corrupt..give these kind of groups an inch and they grab a mile and think they can go around telling everyone how it is on their grid..

 

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Venus Petrov wrote:

You sound familiar with these groups.  What can they really do to enforce any agreements in SL?  Specifically?

How can collecting dubious information on avatar names (for what purpose) accomplish anything?

If someone is 'doing something' that is better than doing nothing?  In all cases? 

some groups like these have been found to hunt down information on someone and then gather it all in one spot..

throw up an RL pic in one place and then mention your RL name in another and then some information that you think is useless about your RL self in another..and before you know it  someone is calling your boss at work or you at home..

it's not just a grid thing..some of these groups take it to your RL hard and out to wreck your life..

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Ceka Cianci wrote:

Jeanneanne be very careful of what you type because of the forums rules ..we can't really go into detail on these forums like we can in others..

 

Ok Ceka, thanks for the heads-up.

I'm now to the point where Scotland Yard & the CIA are behind it all! Which makes me think that there are paranoid schizophrenics loose in SL, wearing spandex!!! :smileyvery-happy:

Seriously, tho... some of this is very disturbing.

Jeanne

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i agree, the idea of forming those organizations can be with good intentions, but they can get corrupted, sadly, thats a truth.

but luckily, not all organizations that their purpose is to benefit society are corrupted.

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