Race--does it matter?

[Harper Beresford]

Hey, everyone! I was honored to be asked to participate in the Fashion Expert event today, and I am here to listen and ask questions myself.

I am a blogger for A Passion for Virtual Fashion. For over 2 years, I have been blogging almost daily to talk about avatars, fashion, and life.

One of the things that interests me personally is the issue of race in SL. We live in an international community, so we should be presumably be prepared to embrace the people of the world, and we do but representation here in SL is sorely behind.

I have two questions:

1. Do you represent as a race you're not in RL? (And does it matter?) and

2. Can you find good skins, shapes, etc, in SL to achieve this.

I will throw my hat in the ring with a blog I did about Mollena Williams, real woman--Afrocan-American--and an internet netizen who stumbled across my blog previously. I was thrilled to find a skin that was not a white skin darkened and a shape that worked.

[CronoCloud Creeggan]

That's a very nice skin in that photo.

I don't represent a race different than I am...for one I wouldn't feel comfortable doing so and back before I found my one true skin maker there weren't that many good non-caucasian skins anyway.

 

 

[Strawberry Singh]

Wow I love that picture!

 

I know a lot of people tend to think dark skins and dark hair when they think of me (which I'm trying to change now because I don't want to be boxed into a specific kind of look) but I do enjoy trying on different skins that give me completely different looks. I don't change my shape though, kind of attached to it. 

As for your questions:

1. I don't think I represent any kind of race as I change myself around a lot, and I don't think it matters. 

2. I think skins are getting better and better with more details and more variety. A few years ago it would be very difficult to find a decent dark skin on the grid, now I have an inventory full of them.  Some of my most favorite dark skins are from: Dutch Touch, PXL, Glam Affair and The Body Co. 

 

 

 

 

[Whimsy Winx]

I agree, I don't feel comfortable representing a different ethnicity.  I find this is a big problem when I have skins to blog, or find really great skin outside of my rl race.  How should I showcase them?  I would hate to misrepresent an image to such an extent that someone finds offense or feels I wasn't respectful. There are some really beautiful dark skins inworld. Alas my favorite were from Tete a Pied/5th & Oxford which is no longer open.  Where to find skins for other races is a frequently asked question in Fashion Emergency, the skin you cited is hands down a big time favorite, as well as stores like Skin Within, Glance, and Uzuri.

[Marianne Little]

I have distanced myself from socializing in SL, because my RL would suffer from it is I had a more active social life in SL. I need to quit SL on a second, if I have to, and can't have jobs or dates in SL. SL has become more and more a tool to create looks in.

If I find out I shall change race (or gender) I go totally up in it, and want skin, hair, clothing and accessories that fit the type I want to be. I am European looking most of the time, but sometimes I change totally.

 

[Thereaver Barrymore]

I don´t represent a race but I guess I shouldn´t feel unconfortable if I had to. Once I made a fashion editorial for InnerWorld Magazine with black avatars, it really liked the result. Nowadays the skins are really amazing, there is a lot of options. I love everything =)

http://www.inner-world.org/ed_09_en.html ( page 106 ) - It´s not a ethic post, it´s about bikinis. But I liked the avs ^^

 

[Harper Beresford]

That's gorgeous, Thereaver!

I would say that one of the problems I have with the SL avatar sometimes is the nose..I just can't get it to be right for an African-American or East Asian look that I want. Not everyone has a pencil thin nose.

[Marianne Little]

It should be more sliders for the nose. But I assume LL will not update our avatars, it's been the same ol' since 2003, or is the Ruth shape even older than that?

[Cajsa Lilliehook]

I am not comfortable presenting myself as a different ethnicity other than in a skin review, and even then just to show the tone. I am not going to go out and about as a different ethnicity than my own, but then I also avoid wearing religious and cultural symbology that are not my own as well. I will wear ethnic clothing, but only in my own skin, so to speak. I am white and am aware that we have cultural and social privileges that allow us to dabble in cultural appropriation in ways that people of other races cannot. 

That said, I think that if someone else wishes to adopt an ethnicity other than their own, if they do so with respect, that shoudl be ok. I mean, if you can be a fairy, an elf, a vampire or an animal, it does seem silly to say you cannot be a different skin tone in your own species. But I do think it should be done with care and that if you present yourself as someone from a different ethnic background than you have an obligation not to act out the stereotypes associated with that background. Presenting oneself as an ethnic stereotype is just wrong. 

[Ceera Murakami]

I'm usually an entirely different species, let alone race! As a furry, my fur's usually red and white, but ranges anywhere from snow white to coal black, depending on the exact avatar I choose to wear at the time.

When I am Human, I tend to appear as Caucasian (which I am), or Asian (which I am not at all) or a somewhat ambiguous mix of Western European/French/Asian. In spite of living among those of black or hispanic races most of my real life (I have tended to prefer mixed ethnicity neighborhoods), I have never really wanted to portray my avatar as one of those Human races.

[MuffinUnsane1488303563]

I enjoy being everything from a bug to a snail. I don't think race does matter in SL outside roleplay. I don't find much fun in making my avatar to resemble myself so I just pick what's fun! Though, it is hard to find good looking dark skins that aren't oodles of L. Recently found some that are rather great though!

 

[Melanie774 Kidd]

While I generally prefer to wear skins that reflect my RL coloring/ethnicity, I also really enjoy wearing skins of all colors.

If people choose to create an appearance for their avi that is not reflective of their RL gender or ethnicity, I don't necessarily think it's a negative thing. (It becomes a negative thing only when they make it so.) For me, personally, it's simply about appreciating beauty in all it's forms. I'm an Asian woman in RL, but that doesn't stop me from indulging in blue or green eyes every now and then, nor does it prevent me from wearing a gorgeous black skin with amazing sculpted dreadlocks.

I view it the same way I view putting on a blue skin with fairy wings, or faun legs, or a mermaid's tail, or a princess gown and tiara, or usagi ears and tail, or even creating a male appearance... SL is a place where you can play Let's Pretend and Dress Up, so why not go all out and explore wearing different skins and such!

[Melita Magic]

---

Harper Beresford wrote:

I have two questions:

1. Do you represent as a race you're not in RL? (And does it matter?) and

2. Can you find good skins, shapes, etc, in SL to achieve this.

---

I think this resident expert/ Q & A sounds like a good thing. Congrats on being asked to be part of that.

1. I have an Asian alt, haven't used the av in ages tho

2. No 

 

 

[Leela Qissinger]

Being among an indian community in SL I encounter many people who pursue their culture also in SL and with this even ceremonies like weddings.

 I don't distinguish myself in race but more my own feeling. 

[Ohna]

1. Do you represent as a race you're not in RL? (And does it matter?) 

No, and no, it doesn't really matter. For me, I feel most comfortable being what I am in RL and taking it to SL. I'm Black in RL so I always want to take that to where I go, to the best I can.

2. Can you find good skins, shapes, etc, in SL to achieve this.

Honestly, I haven't had luck with any shapes. Most shapes, as I think one said, have more narrow noses (which is fine) but I know for myself that I don't have a narrow nose and I am fine with that. In the end, I had to make my own shape, based on a picture of me. For skins, it is good now. There's a decent selection of dark skins from The Body Co, Adam and Eve, Dutch Touch, Uzuri (they are nice, but hate them on me) , and MOJO. Also Chain and Vine, L.Fauna, Tuli, and Fresh Fx have nice tones too. However, marketplace has some gems as well.

 

[Harper Beresford]

Ohna, I think one of hte limitations is the actual perameters of the nose on the SL avatar. I have tried nad tried to make a wider flatter nose--one that represents some people's noses (white or black or Asian or whatever--some people have flatter wider noses) and have found it's harder than heck. It doesn't help when the skins are fitted on super skinny noses either. So you saw my result above for Mollena. Not *entirely* happy but good enough

Check out Angel Rock skins too. I really like her African-American skins.

[Ohna]

I think you're right! I had to play with it, I think the skin depends a lot too. It looks funnier when I wear certain skin. I read that post and went to check out the skins. You did well in my opinion. There's another issue that I have, but that is probably better suited for another thread.

[Harper Beresford]

Well start a thread or cough it up!

[Sonatrix Dench]

I represent a race other than I am in real life. I'm white in real life, but for well over a year now I've been black in SL. And it started out because I found a skin that I really fell in love with. I went back and forth with myself (and a few other people) about wether or not it would be weird to be black in SL but not in RL. In the end I decided that I thought it was pretty and I was going to do it, and I've never gone back. I do get asked quite often why I'm black in SL but not in RL (cause I don't hide it), and I just tell people that it's because I think it's beautiful and it's SL so why not be something different than I am in RL?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/sonaspics/6179663188/in/photostream

(It's a horrible picture cause my computer just isn't cooperating right now, but you get the idea.)

[Harper Beresford]

That IS a beautiful skin. Do you ever feel people are upset tha you represent differently or do the suggest that you misrepresent people of color by looking that way? Race can be such a dicey issue in RL but seems less so in SL. Do you think so?

[Sonatrix Dench]

Thanks! Ohna made the skin. I love it. I switch between this one and Curio's Jasmine in Teak, which is a lot lighter but still lovely. I don't really think that people get upset, cause I don't try to act or dress any certain way just because I look different. I'm still me, still the same style and everything. But I know a lot of people don't get it, and think it's weird for sure. My boyfriend and I live on a war sim and there's a lot of younger gamer type guys around and I have no doubt that they are like, "Dude, why is your girlfriend black?" And sometimes when someone who I've been talking to for a while see's my avatar for the first time I'll get the obligatory, "Oh.... your avatar is black." But whatever. At least I'm not wearing a black skin and off trying to do some gangster RP which was oh so popular a few years back. That would be offensive, and a horrible misrepresentation.

[Eve Kazan]

In RL i'm white and i love wearing Black skin, but it was not easy to do... it's a personal feeling, because i think that the attitude of people around me is different if i wear a black skin.

I dont know how to say ... it's like a "light" racism ... when i wear black skin i hear some friends said "you have burnt under the sun" ... they censured themself as if to say the color was a racist act LOL.

But i think it's more like a discomfort, some people can't imagine, can't go beyond the reality in SL ...

 

[N1kk1 Camino]

Yes, race matters and on some many different levels beyond just skins in second life. When I first joined second life a year or so ago I was totally optimistic as to what this "new world" would be like. I was open to the experience of knowing it and embracing others who already exist in this ...bubble. Well, long behold the big R word came into play very shortly after joining (days after). Racism is one of the few things that I find odd about secondlife but I do understand it's presence in virtual reality. If someone is a racist in rl then why wouldn't they be in sl ? That's a retorical question I had to ask myself in order to not be bothered by the closed mindedness of people.

I have nothing against anyone who is racist, afterall it is your life be it rl or sl so you can do whatever you please. I do have something against those who are only a certain way online in general. You know the closet cases...those who only behave a certain way behind a computer screen. Sure we secondlifers can all fit that profile because it is virtual reality but when a person is an extreme in their characteristics (not so much their character/avatar looks) then that to me becomes an issue. For example ... don't get on me for being a person of color or how my avatar is shaped based on the physical attributes that are GENETICALLY INCLINED to people of color (afro etc.) all while calling me a "**bleep**" yet your avatar is shaped just like mine and you're european/caucasian!

I was asked on several occasions to change my shape and even the complexion of my skin to fit a mold. It was nicely put to me that in sl especially if I wanted to be a dancer that my look wasn't appealing because it wasn't thin with long legs etc. Which kind of boggled my mine. Like i was being rediculed for my avatar on one hand and on the other hand my avatar was being imitated by those who made such a fuss about it. I was briefly dancing at a club (no name) and the size of my ass and my shape was a big issue among mostly the "female" dancers there but as I would get attention and tips from the male customers. Then I start to notice that those same "female" dancers were changing their shapes and making their booties bigger and going for a more curvaceous voluptuous look as mine all while still trying to degrade me for being the "black" woman. So many times I see people who are european/caucasian with dark tanned and oiled up avatars being complete assholes about RACE towards people of color when they are literally a few RGBs away from that person's skin (avatar).

I even went through a phase where I would constantly have my facelights and body lights whatever they're called attached to my avatar nonstop...why? Because it gave it a certain glow, a brightness to a skin of color like mine. I now only wear them to highlight certain outfits. I say all of this only to point out that there are issues of race in second life. I'm sure there are lots of people of color posing as other races in sl only to fit into a mold that really shouldn't exist because it's virtual reality. It's SECOND life and that to me means that the things such as ignorance, shyness , racism or anything that may be stopping you from being yourself in real life should be left at the "login" button before entering.

 

The real question shouldn't be does it matter because that's an easy yes....the real question for me would be WHY DOES RACE MATTER IN SECOND LIFE?

 

 

 

[Drake1 Nightfire]

To start with...

Secondly.. you mean a race aside from human? Cuz last time i checked we were all humans in RL. In SL i am rarely a human so i guess if you only allow humans in your sim, race would matter. Personally in the 6 years i have been in SL i have yet to come across a "racist." My good luck i guess.

Thanks for the Necropost.

[Harper Beresford]

N1kk1, I am so glad you responded to this thread after all this time. I guess my question, "Does it matter" leads to "If it does, then why does it?" I didn't want to assume it does to all. I think it does more than we realize.

I also find disturbing the way that the other women in your club criticized your shape. I have to wonder what notion of female body they have in their heads and then if that is a notion connected to race or gender or both. I personally have a nice full booty on Harper--I think that is sexy and womanly, but that's me. But do they think a big ass means a woman of color? Or fat? Do they think that all men only want big boobs (they don't) or skinniness (they don't)?

So I am glad you posted to this discussion. It really added to the conversation