So they banned Gacha but...

[PermaRuthed]

That's all I have.

[diamond Marchant]

Since this thread has Gatcha in the title....

Linden Labs did not make Gatcha a violation of the "Gaming Policy" because they defined it as gambling.... they did it because they perceived a change in the "regulatory climate". The whole sad business is described here. It was a "cover-your-ass" move.

A common defitniton of gambling is "the act of wagering or betting money or something of value on an event with an uncertain outcome with the intent to win more money or things of value than was wagered." For me, gatcha does not satisfy this definition because the outcome is certain, that is, you get exactly one of the listed prizes and you cannot lose your money. (Also, you could resell unwanted items, recovering any "loss"). For me, "Game of Homes" seems MORE gambley, because your knowledge about what you will receive is even LESS.

I view both the original gatcha and Game of Homes as "marketing schemes", not really gambling.

[Istelathis]

16 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

So, the linden is or would be used to exchange for a sort of intermediary "token" that is for mobile?

Can you explain further to some of us dummies or naïve people who don't know about Avakin Life or other mobile games with tokens.

Someone a lot more knowledgeable than I would have to explain why LL would opt for tokens rather than $L.  Avakin life is very similar to SL, the tokens can be earned by logging into the app, spinning their wheel, watching ads and so on.  They also have a store you can purchase outfits, furniture, homes, and so on.  One difference that AL offers is that the homes you purchase do not require a monthly payment which means less revenue for them is generated from real estate, if SL wishes to compete with AL they will likely provide similar services and to provide those services they will likely have to set up their own shops, their own way to finance these residences, and so on.  

Edited May 9, 2023 by Istelathis

[Love Zhaoying]

6 minutes ago, diamond Marchant said:

Since this thread has Gatcha in the title....

Linden Labs did not make Gatcha a violation of the "Gaming Policy" because they defined it as gambling.... they did it because they perceived a change in the "regulatory climate". The whole sad business is described here. It was a "cover-your-ass" move.

Interesting! I just assumed gachas were killed because they were abused (not really a "single copy") and it was generally a seedy business.

Agree it doesn't have anything to do with the new Casinos, I almost missed this thread.

[EliseAnne85]

8 minutes ago, Istelathis said:

Someone a lot more knowledgeable than I would have to explain why LL would opt for tokens rather than $L.

I think people would still have to buy Lindens and then exchange them for tokens.  Why else the HUD and the Casino to buy tokens?  Thus, the Linden would or could become something like a "stablecoin".  LL can't just do away with lindens or can they?  I don't think so.  They'd have to give us something in exchange for lindens.  

Thanks though.  It does sound like a test of 'something' and Love and yourself may be right.  Perhaps someone has more knowledge of all this.  

I'm in the 'wat' stage too.

Edited May 9, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Sid Nagy]

I checked the date twice, but it really can't be an April's fool joke.

Just in case this thread will not hold long, I opened a similar one on VV1.

Edited May 9, 2023 by Sid Nagy

[diamond Marchant]

Looky! Looky! I got a Blackjack! YaY!

Notice how prominent the "Buy Chips" dialog is. Whoever built this was not messing around. When playing black jack you are on a timer... you get auto-standed if you wait too long to decide on a hit and you get booted from your chair if you don't bet fast enough.

Edited May 9, 2023 by diamond Marchant

[Sid Nagy]

Maybe the Lab is showcasing something for the gambling industry to buy from them??
Or try to get them into SL to use their gambling licences?
That could put Tilia on a new for the Lab interesting map.  🛎️

Edited May 9, 2023 by Sid Nagy

[Love Zhaoying]

2 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

I checked the date twice, but it really can't be an April's fool joke.

It needs realism. Sticky floors, bad buffets, scary old people at the nickle slots, free well drinks, heavy smoke from cigarettes, constant noises and flashing lights, no windows to tell what time it is..

[Rowan Amore]

Time for a field trip!

 

[Love Zhaoying]

Just now, Rowan Amore said:

Time for a field trip!

 

Let us know the dress code!

[Rowan Amore]

1 minute ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Let us know the dress code!

I'd say it will only appeal to new residents that might think they're going to actually win some Ls.  So, with that in mind...library avatars!

[Lucia Nightfire]

2 hours ago, Innula Zenovka said:

Perhaps the reason for making the experience grid-wide is simply so that visitors aren't, when they first arrive, confronted with  a big scary menu asking them to grant experience permissions.

Grid scope does not dictate auto-grant.

Auto-grant is another parameter for experiences.

I own a grid scope experience that does not have auto-grant.

You can have auto-grant with land scope experiences as well. See Firestorm's experience.

Auto-grant is a Linden-only accessible/changeable parameter.

The bad thing about auto-grant is that it is also anti-forget/block.

In regards to the HUD failure to detach, it seemed to have been a one-off.

It just happened to occur on the first detach.

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Lucia Nightfire said:

Grid scope does not dictate auto-grant.

Auto-grant is another parameter for experiences.

I own a grid scope experience that does not have auto-grant.

You can have auto-grant with land scope experiences as well. See Firestorm's experience.

Auto-grant is a Linden-only accessible/changeable parameter.

The bad thing about auto-grant is that it is also anti-forget/block.

In regards to the HUD failure to detach, it seemed to have been a one-off.

It just happened to occur on the first detach.

Does the Casino Experience make you jump and up and down, going "Yahoo!" when you win, and buy more Tokens when you lose?

That would be cool! And nefarious!

 

[Lucia Nightfire]

1 hour ago, diamond Marchant said:

Looky! Looky! I got a Blackjack! YaY!

Notice how prominent the "Buy Chips" dialog is. Whoever built this was not messing around. When playing black jack you are on a timer... you get auto-standed if you wait too long to decide on a hit and you get booted from your chair if you don't bet fast enough.

That table was built by a Mole and scripted by a Linden in August 2022.

The link the script is in is unique mesh meant to be used as a Blackjack table, not a prim borrowed from something unrelated.

I wonder how long LL had been planning on this?

Also, how long before they set up a kiosk/teleporter at Gaming Island? 😆

Edited May 9, 2023 by Lucia Nightfire

[Rowan Amore]

If you think about it, this isn't the same as gachas.  With gachas, the problem (the gamble) was NOT knowing the outcome (what you would receive).  With this, you know exactly what you will receive which is nothing.

Although, I think this is one of the shadiest things I've ever seen LL do, it's not technically gambling but RP.  Costly RP promoted by LL but still just RP.

I'll have to look around the region but it seems a HUGE sign that says, "Tokens can not be exchanged for ANYTHING and are purely a RP item" should be posted prominently or added to the HUD thingy.

[Gwin LeShelle]

3 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

 

Although, I think this is one of the shadiest things I've ever seen LL do, it's not technically gambling but RP.  Costly RP promoted by LL but still just RP.

 

This. I must admit I firstly felt sadness when I saw I that, I was deeply disappointed.

This is exactly what I was thinking seeing their Twitter post. If it was only for RP reasons...why not 10L for tokens well or free ones. 

And it's not only promoted by them, it's made by them, see the SocialCasino Linden that receives the payments. I am just meh now at this point tbh.

[Lucia Nightfire]

1 hour ago, Rowan Amore said:

I'll have to look around the region but it seems a HUGE sign that says, "Tokens can not be exchanged for ANYTHING and are purely a RP item" should be posted prominently or added to the HUD thingy.

The HUD does state this, but only with the first attach.

Once you close that message floater, you will never see that disclaimer again.

[Sid Nagy]

I wonder if the Lab will launch Helios as a new branch of the company soon, just like they did with Tilia.

IMHO it is relatively easy for them to transform it into a stand alone real gamble game/platform and then pay out what you win (if you win of course).
The only thing they need to do is interest and add a company with an Internet gamble license.

Edited May 9, 2023 by Sid Nagy

[Gwin LeShelle]

Some in the other thread and this one said it's not gambling because nothing to win. I earlier mentioned the father of my friend...he still plays no Apps where it is about winning, I talked to him about this case here now.

And he was very clear to me that the triggering thing is not the win of money, it's nice side effect. But he said the thing that's best for gamblers is the "could be" feeling and the machine shows you WIN they just don't give out money. It's the no difference for an addict he said. And he's not even playing Candy Crush or such things, because you can compete with friends on there.

[diamond Marchant]

5 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

I wonder if the Lab will launch Helios as a new branch of the company soon, just like they did with Tilia

https://www.gohelios.com/index.php (a division of New Sunshine LLC)

Not likely that Linden Lab can use the Helios trademark

Edited May 9, 2023 by diamond Marchant

[Love Zhaoying]

18 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

If you think about it, this isn't the same as gachas.  With gachas, the problem (the gamble) was NOT knowing the outcome (what you would receive).  With this, you know exactly what you will receive which is nothing.

Although, I think this is one of the shadiest things I've ever seen LL do, it's not technically gambling but RP.  Costly RP promoted by LL but still just RP.

I'll have to look around the region but it seems a HUGE sign that says, "Tokens can not be exchanged for ANYTHING and are purely a RP item" should be posted prominently or added to the HUD thingy.

At least, tell the users every time they buy more Tokens!

How long until we see Forum posts with people complaining about being "ripped off" and/or asking how they exchange their Tokens? Bets, anyone?

[diamond Marchant]

13 minutes ago, Gwin LeShelle said:

the thing that's best for gamblers is the "could be" feeling and the machine shows you WIN they just don't give out money. It's the no difference for an addict he said.

Sabine Hossenfelder confirms this in a recent youtube. The dopamine spike happens in anticipation of a reward.

 

[Rowan Amore]

10 minutes ago, Gwin LeShelle said:

Some in the other thread and this one said it's not gambling because nothing to win. I earlier mentioned the father of my friend...he still plays no Apps where it is about winning, I talked to him about this case here now.

And he was very clear to me that the triggering thing is not the win of money, it's nice side effect. But he said the thing that's best for gamblers is the "could be" feeling and the machine shows you WIN they just don't give out money. It's the no difference for an addict he said. And he's not even playing Candy Crush or such things, because you can compete with friends on there.

It's not technically gambling but I agree that it can feed someone's gambling addiction because you DO win something, tokens.  The tokens, however, only have a one way value.  The value to LL when selling them.  

[EliseAnne85]

23 minutes ago, diamond Marchant said:

Sabine Hossenfelder confirms this in a recent youtube. The dopamine spike happens in anticipation of a reward.

 

Yeah, the release of the Dopamine is present in all addictions and not just chemical or alcohol addictions.  Dopamine is released when we go shopping as well.  Constant shopping is an addiction.  Gacha was considered an addiction.  Sex can be an addiction.

An addiction to alcohol is the same with the Dopamine.  However, I am the only one who can not let that drink go into my body.  There is no one else who can hold back the glass of alcohol.  It gets easier over the years, way easier to be alcohol-free as the years and decades pass.  I hardly ever think of alcohol at all.  This and it's potential for addiction is what reminded me.  

I still am in the 'wat' camp here with all this though.  LL is out on a limb with this one.

Edited May 9, 2023 by EliseAnne85