Right Click "Wear Items"

[Charalyne Blackwood]

Being positioned directly above "Remove From Current Outfit" leads to instances of wearing everything within the folder. Why isn't there some kind of warning "WARNING! YOU ARE ABOUT TO WEAR THE ENTIRE CONTENTS OF THIS FOLDER! PROCEED?" So we don't make this error? Removing 400 pairs of jeans is a time consuming nightmare and the process invited accidentally hitting "Wear Items" too easy to do again.

 

"So don't do it" is  really ignorant and idiotic. We aren't perfect. We oops. Anyone that says they don't is lying.

[Coffee Pancake]

Having just tutored someone though setting up an avatar with no prior knowledge of SL, one of my big take aways in that the "wear" functionality needs to go away. It caused so much confusion.

 

[Henri Beauchamp]

7 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Having just tutored someone though setting up an avatar with no prior knowledge of SL, one of my big take aways in that the ”wear” functionality needs to go away. It caused so much confusion.

Rename it ”Replace”, perhaps ?

Or ”Wear & replace” ?

Edited February 19, 2023 by Henri Beauchamp

[Rowan Amore]

8 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Having just tutored someone though setting up an avatar with no prior knowledge of SL, one of my big take aways in that the "wear" functionality needs to go away. It caused so much confusion.

 

I agree.  Haven't used Wear in years.

[Coffee Pancake]

4 hours ago, Henri Beauchamp said:

Rename it ”Replace”, perhaps ?

Or ”Wear & replace” ?

Even then its meaningless. 

What will be replaced ?

[Henri Beauchamp]

1 minute ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Even then its meaningless. 

What will be replaced ?

What is already worn at the same spot, of course... Maybe ”Wear/replace” then...

[Solar Legion]

Not the first time this has come up. The response is still the same: All that might be good to have happen is for it to be renamed to Wear & Replace or Wear/Replace and perhaps an explanation as either part of the onboarding tutorial or as a tooltip.

That's it. That's all.

That is - as far as I am concerned - the proper course of action.

[Coffee Pancake]

8 minutes ago, Henri Beauchamp said:

What is already worn at the same spot, of course... Maybe ”Wear/replace” then...

How does a newbie even know about spots or attachment points ... at best they might assume that wearing this hat might replace the hat they already have on .. but with rigged mesh, that's a nonsense.

Wear seriously screwed us over multiple times and made getting that initial avatar set up far more of a nightmare. We were fighting the viewer as much as the tremendous learning curve that comes with modern mesh bodies and heads.

 

[Coffee Pancake]

2 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

Not the first time this has come up. The response is still the same: All that might be good to have happen is for it to be renamed to Wear & Replace or Wear/Replace and perhaps an explanation as either part of the onboarding tutorial or as a tooltip.

That's it. That's all.

That is - as far as I am concerned - the proper course of action.

#nochanges

SL should be hard.

Getting dressed is a purity test.

BOW DOWN NEWBIE !!

 

[Rowan Amore]

14 minutes ago, Henri Beauchamp said:

What is already worn at the same spot, of course... Maybe ”Wear/replace” then...

Way too many things are attached to the same place to just use replace or even wear.  Add or Remove is all we really need.  They're pretty much self-explanatory.  New people are unaware that Wear might knock something else off.  Especially now with BOM.  I've seen so many people Wear a layer and then ask why their hairbase, lipstick, tattoo keeps disappearing.

[LittleMe Jewell]

9 minutes ago, Henri Beauchamp said:

What is already worn at the same spot, of course... Maybe ”Wear/replace” then...

This makes sense for any individual item. 

However, I think OP's main issue is with accidentally click 'Wear' on a folder.  If it is just a folder of a bunch of Jeans, then the viewer ends up cycling through all of the Jeans, one at a time, with each one replacing the previous (assuming they all attach to the same location) --- and that could possibly be covered by a "Wear/Replace". 

But things get more complicated if the folder contains lots of sub-folders with lots of items within each.  The menu item in that case is "Wear Items" and there isn't really a short phrase that could be used on the right-click menu to cover that. 

IMO, if the "Wear Items" stays, then a warning message really could help lots.

[LittleMe Jewell]

1 minute ago, Rowan Amore said:

Way too many things are attached to the same place to just use replace or even wear.  Add or Remove is all we really need.  They're pretty much self-explanatory.  New people are unaware that Wear might knock something else off.  Especially now with BOM.  I've seen so many people Wear a layer and then ask why their hairbase, lipstick, tattoo keeps disappearing.

I actually use "Replace Current Outfit" all the time, when changing into something from my Outfits folder.   However, I only ever use it from the Outfits folder and never from any other location.

[Solar Legion]

Just now, Coffee Pancake said:

#nochanges

SL should be hard.

Getting dressed is a purity test.

BOW DOWN NEWBIE !!

 

Not what was said or implied whatsoever - enough of this BS.

A change has been suggested, one that actually makes sense (as opposed to "Oh iz too hard for meh!! This must go!!") - Rename the function and provide some form of documentation/tooltip as to its function and/or a bit in the tutorial covering it.

Not hard to grasp and is indeed a change. A change that makes actual sense.

[Solar Legion]

4 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Way too many things are attached to the same place to just use replace or even wear.  Add or Remove is all we really need.  They're pretty much self-explanatory.  New people are unaware that Wear might knock something else off.  Especially now with BOM.  I've seen so many people Wear a layer and then ask why their hairbase, lipstick, tattoo keeps disappearing.

That is on the item Creator, especially in the present age (Rigged Mesh and such). There really is no excuse for near everything to be set to the same attachment point, even with the way rigged mesh functions.

As far as layers go: That is a failing on LL's part for not covering that in the tutorials or in an easy to see bit of documentation/a tooltip.

[Coffee Pancake]

1 minute ago, Solar Legion said:

Not what was said or implied whatsoever - enough of this BS.

A change has been suggested, one that actually makes sense (as opposed to "Oh iz too hard for meh!! This must go!!") - Rename the function and provide some form of documentation/tooltip as to its function and/or a bit in the tutorial covering it.

Not hard to grasp and is indeed a change. A change that makes actual sense.

RTFM or a meaningless tooltip is not a solution.

Both depend on the assumption that the new user is invested enough to read a manual, or understands enough about how SL works to not only wait for a tooltip to appear, but to be able to translate what it says into a meaningful information.

Actuallity ... 

Me : Oh now put on the hair demo we got.

Newbie picks wear. 

Newbie is now a system body, system head, wearing nothing but hair.

Newbie : Oh sh.. I picked wear. That was wrong wasn't it.

 

Later on .. 

 

Newbie : Oh &^#%$@# I did it again .. 

Just now, Solar Legion said:

That is on the item Creator, especially in the present age (Rigged Mesh and such). There really is no excuse for near everything to be set to the same attachment point, even with the way rigged mesh functions.

As far as layers go: That is a failing on LL's part for not covering that in the tutorials or in an easy to see bit of documentation/a tooltip.

The defacto standard is that any attachment can go on any attachment point it likes with no rhyme or reason to it.

"All creators in SL need to start doing this correctly" is a laughable suggestion.

Blaming LL solves nothing.

This is all just pedantic pontificating.

#nochanges

[KathrynLisbeth]

Replace / Wear -- It seems a minor detail, but the word order emphasizes the Replace component of function, include Wear to contrast with Add.

But the Part that Makes it a Screwed up mess is two-fold though, and indirectly related to it's use.

1)   Rigged shoes or Rigged Hair.   From nice looking shop inworld.   On it's own Region, even!   Alas, too much effort for that 'creator' to assign the item to a 'more relevant attachment point than right hand.     So Sad.   All the Sad.     (( I was Typing and Y'all mentioned that ))

2)  Lack of Granulation in Layers.    Inability for final end users to assign them a Subtype.  Analogous to selecting an attachment point, but for layers.  Something akin to a forcing a relative sort order.  Like How System shirts always landed between system undershirt and system jacket.

Then things can be a little more apparent as an add/remove &/or replace a 'Module' Function.  The module being the relevant objects and layers, like the right hairbase for the right hair without removing the face skin and makeup.   Improve the Speed and simplicity of changing a Subset of the Components of one total saved appearance.     

Is the simplified version of how some of the fancy inventory setup things with all that #RLV folder stuff work, but not need all the 'extra built in RLV dependant workarounds' 

Edited February 19, 2023 by KathrynLisbeth
Doh!

[Solar Legion]

That's nice.

If LL ever listens to such broad changes they will end up breaking things far worse than they have prior. If you do not believe such then you have not been paying attention at all.

As for taking the time to actually go through a proper tutorial or to read a tooltip or similar: Translations are a thing as far as language barriers go. beyond that, if you're in too much of a hurry or too lazy to bother paying attention to even a tooltip ... That is on you, beginning and end.

More "basic" functions (Such as the Wear function) should be covered by the Tutorial and have at least a tooltip explaining them. More advanced functions (actually under the hidden away Advanced menu or ones that the average user won't be touching on most days (Terraforming functions as a 'minor' example)) ought to have better documentation that a user can go to.

If you honestly believe that the above is "No Changes" then ...

You may continue to be wrong without being questioned further anywhere from this point forward. You may continue in the childish belief that sensible, smaller changes are "No Change" uncontested from this point forward as well.

It is obvious that you do not care nor will you listen to anything whatsoever that does not contain larger scale or broader changes on anything whatsoever.

ETA: As far as the latter half of that 'response' of yours goes ... That is also, nice. You entirely missed the point and wish to pretend that being sensible is not a solution while pretending that the issues lie somewhere other than their sources. Being able to be attached anywhere does not excuse the practice of putting every single rigged item on the exact same attachment point. That needs to stop. There being not even a basic explanation of how layers work is indeed a failing on LL's part and needs to be rectified.

"No Changes" my right buttock ...

Edited February 19, 2023 by Solar Legion

[Rowan Amore]

43 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I actually use "Replace Current Outfit" all the time, when changing into something from my Outfits folder.   However, I only ever use it from the Outfits folder and never from any other location.

Me too.  That's the only time I use Replace.

[Rowan Amore]

39 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

That is on the item Creator, especially in the present age (Rigged Mesh and such). There really is no excuse for near everything to be set to the same attachment point, even with the way rigged mesh functions.

As far as layers go: That is a failing on LL's part for not covering that in the tutorials or in an easy to see bit of documentation/a tooltip.

Oh, I agree but it does seem as though the easiest solution to BOTH failings is to simply remove the WEAR option.  Just my opinion.

[Solar Legion]

5 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Oh, I agree but it does seem as though the easiest solution to BOTH failings is to simply remove the WEAR option.  Just my opinion.

"Easiest" and "sensible" are not often the same thing. Removal of a function is also not always a solution - just a way to ignore related issues.

[Rowan Amore]

Redundant functions are...redundant.  Regardless.of.what creators or LL.should do, Wear.as.a.function causes issues.  Add, in general, does not.  

[Ardy Lay]

There is no "wear" in the context menu of this folder.  Directly above "Remove from Current Outfit" is "Add to Current Outfit", which is quite self-explanatory.  Accidentally selecting that can be frustrating depending on the content of the folder.  Getting "That's a lot of pants!  Are you sure you want to add all of them to your current outfit?" might be a useful query.  Check with your tailor and butler for additional detail.

[Solar Legion]

8 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Redundant functions are...redundant.  Regardless.of.what creators or LL.should do, Wear.as.a.function causes issues.  Add, in general, does not.  

The function replaces the existing item on the attach point/layer it is set to whereas Add simply tosses it on as an additional item. Remove takes off a particular item.

Wear (which should be Wear and Replace) cannot do that latter - you are not right-clicking on the item you wish to Remove.

The function is different - not redundant.

If content creators actually bothered to have rigged mesh items attach to actually sensible points as opposed to tossing them all onto the 'default' point (Right Hand) then it would go a bit of a ways for some items in having Wear/Replace be more sensible and properly useful from the word 'Go'. As an example and a more personal one: I have several Anthropomorphic forms and a "Human" form. The Anthropomorphic forms sometimes require me to swap out what feet/footpaws I am using whereas the Human ones often end up with different shoes. "Wear/Replace" would be ideal for this sort of situation, especially if I am putting together a brand new form (which I often do piece by piece). There is no reason for me to individually go through and hit "Remove" on every single item I wish to replace.

[Aishagain]

Wow! So much hot air created over what is a seemingly reasonable request!

Back in the day we had "Torley's Tips" Torley Lindens little videos explaining how SL worked, including how to wear things.  They should be mandatory for all new residents, and then perhaps the above caveats can be seen as reasonable.

Of course I don't think Torley's little lectures exist in the "modern" era of SL.  Perhaps they should.

@Torley Linden?

OK then  @Strawberry Linden  Hmm so I cannot tag her.  Great, I can still tag Torley who is gawn, yet unable to tag the Linden who was formerly known as Strawberry Singh.

Edit: 2 hours later it does work, well...how about that!

Edited February 20, 2023 by Aishagain
change of approach

[Ardy Lay]

17 minutes ago, Aishagain said:

Wow! So much hot air created over what is a seemingly reasonable request!

This is what community.secondlife.com has become.