Marketplace issues (Feb 14 around 2pm SL time)

[SerArthur56]

9 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

First picture is VCO ~ Jihyo 002 . Resizer [ Mint ].  The second picture, I just typed in VCO Jihyo...no quotations.

 

thanks rowan....but if u search with no quote in low to high appear different results...i hope they will fix this as well

[Wulfie Reanimator]

2 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

First picture is VCO ~ Jihyo 002 . Resizer [ Mint ].  The second picture, I just typed in VCO Jihyo...no quotations.

 

Over 10k results for a pretty specific search doesn't seem right. Putting AND between each word gives 208 results (all of which belong to that store), which is what most people expect.

Ah, just noticed that the fixes they've made aren't live yet.

Edited March 9, 2023 by Wulfie Reanimator

[Lunachelsea]

8 hours ago, Pit Banx said:

Yes, it is incomprehensible why LL takes so much time and does not even give out information about what is being done now.

As a creator i thought i'm on the right track and nothing can happen *lol* then LL takes a big hammer and smashes MP *lol* most creators are very dependent on MP, my losses are at 90% right now . if something doesn't change soon, i'll probably look for a smaller piece of land for my shop. I am anxious about the future for the first time.

Yes. I feel you, My losses are astronomical, in the 6 figures . Its Jus Mind baffling

[Aishagain]

3 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

The blog entry does a great job of explanifying things.

*Sigh*.  The Blog entry does a great job of showing that whoever is working on these search/Marketplace changes has paid not the slightest attention to the screams of SL creators, whether it is by JIRA, ticket or in this forum.

[Love Zhaoying]

44 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Ah, just noticed that the fixes they've made aren't live yet.

Yes, there are complaints in several threads basically, "it is still broken"! 

[Wulfie Reanimator]

12 minutes ago, Aishagain said:

*Sigh*.  The Blog entry does a great job of showing that whoever is working on these search/Marketplace changes has paid not the slightest attention to the screams of SL creators, whether it is by JIRA, ticket or in this forum.

What have they missed?

[Lunachelsea]

This is absolute complete madness. Its jus so inconceivable to me.Being a larger store,My Losses are astronimical.In The 6 Digits. and we are only 8 days in. 

Average number of Mp transactions daily are between 200 - 300. Thats Daily, I have not even done 40 For a whole week.

Its definitely creating a snowball effect, I laid off 4 employees yesterday and if it keeps up at the end of the month, My region will have to go as well. Its just NOT Ok.If my Losses are this big, i can only imagine the losses LL is taking atm, and again will send the SL economy into a spin. 

[CherryChantal]

18 hours ago, Daisy Hendrassen said:

Another way most test there major changes is to first backup the existing code install the new run it and if it does not work and can’t be debugged in a reasonable time (hours not weeks) roll back to the existing code at least you knew it ran and then go back and fix your issues.

So true ... but sadly Linden Labs seems not care about us merchants ... 😞

I feel treated like this poor persian guy in that movie clip argued that all this is just madness and finally being pushed down the well with the final words of Leonidas "THIS IS LINDEN".   LOL  

[Aishagain]

41 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

What have they missed?

Seriously?  If I knew THAT I'd've hired myself out to Linden Lab for a five figure sum!  It's their system, they broke it, now it is up to them to fix it and not mess around!

Edited March 9, 2023 by Aishagain

[Wulfie Reanimator]

2 minutes ago, Aishagain said:

Seriously?  If I knew THAT I'd've hired myself out to Linden Lab for a five figure sum!  It's their system, they broke it, now it is up to them to fix it and not mess around!

You said their blog post showed they aren't listening to complaints, but the blog post mentions upcoming fixes to the three main things people are complaining about. I'm just wondering if there's something you know that isn't getting a fix.

[Flea Yatsenko]

2 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

Over 10k results for a pretty specific search doesn't seem right. Putting AND between each word gives 208 results (all of which belong to that store), which is what most people expect.

Ah, just noticed that the fixes they've made aren't live yet.

They probably aren't using the limit for elasticsearch which cuts off results that are below a certain matching score. Basically, ES searches all documents based on queries and gives each item in the results that matched a score. If you are good with ES, you figure out what scores start to be completely useless and tell ES to ignore them when it gives out results. I don't think LL's implementation of ES is doing that, so anything that matches even the slightest little bit ends up displayed.

Can be kind of a difficult situation for newer users of ES as the score depends on each query, so it's not as simple as "ignore score < .5" You have to do some math and figuring things out since the score is always different. At least they are taking this seriously, I think they've been swarmed enough to realize they have made a pretty big mistake. I just hope this is a big enough hit in their revenue for them to realize how important it is to make sure MP search works very well and everything is reliable.

[SerArthur56]

day 8 with no sale....doesn't matter what is the problem....the point is many merchants with no sales....the only answer is "in the coming days"...seriously?but the owner of second  life read the forums? knows about what is going on ? or maybe he dont care too? they even did not mentioned of this ISSUE into the grid status......they can backup eveything as it was and try to understand how elasticsearch works into a beta version, figure out properly and after update the marketplace....the only truth till now is 8 DAYS WITH 0 SALES!!!!!

Edited March 10, 2023 by SerArthur56

[Ardy Lay]

What if all of your previous sales were just "happy accidents" in that people only saw your listings when searching for something else?  What is your Merchant or Store name?  Let us have a look in Marketplace by finding you by name and maybe we will buy something.  

I am currently not having a damn bit of trouble finding what I am looking for in Marketplace, but I am not a merchant, so I guess my opinion doesn't matter in this forum.

I search for items on the left tab and merchant / store names on the right tab.

Gimme an example of a search that fails.  I'll JIRA that sucker for you!

Now, I don't doubt for a minute that search result ranking has changed and believe that's what is causing the most trouble here.

I do NOT want "fuzzy string matching" to come anywhere near my search results.

If I type something stupid, I should get no results or perhaps I could discover something new.  If I don't know the difference between desert and dessert, then let Marketplace results educate me with pictures instead of just dumping both into a temp-table then sorting that mess by whatever collating sequence happened to be in the list box.  (desert and dessert were selected at random and are not being presented here as an ideal example)

Edited March 10, 2023 by Ardy Lay

[Rowan Amore]

I'd imagine it's always hit or miss as far as resellers are concerned.

[Ardy Lay]

3 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

I'd imagine it's always hit or miss as far as resellers are concerned.

Ah, resellers.  There is a tricky situation.  They sure can't use the creator's name, brand or store name as their own name, brand or store name.  Something I would ask for if I was a reseller is a way to indicate to "the system" what the original creator, brand or store name is so that can perhaps be searched for properly as a name instead of as buried in a proper description or description title.

Another thing that plagues me when searching Marketplace is finding things that compliment things.  Say I have an Item from one creator and am looking for a "mod kit" for it from a second creator, but I do not know that creator's name.  Finding the right way to search for those is weird because everybody makes up their own listing format and pollutes their item listings with `~!@#$%^&*()-_=+{[}]|\:;"'<>/ ... connection lost.

[Rowan Amore]

5 minutes ago, Ardy Lay said:

Ah, resellers.  There is a tricky situation.  They sure can't use the creator's name, brand or store name as their own name, brand or store name.  Something I would ask for if I was a reseller is a way to indicate to "the system" what the original creator, brand or store name is so that can perhaps be searched for properly as a name instead of as buried in a proper description or description title.

Another thing that plagues me when searching Marketplace is finding things that compliment things.  Say I have an Item from one creator and am looking for a "mod kit" for it from a second creator, but I do not know that creator's name.  Finding the right way to search for those is weird because everybody makes up their own listing format and pollutes their item listings with `~!@#$%^&*()-_=+{[}]|\:;"'<>/ ... connection lost.

When I search for something, I always tick the boxes to not show limited quantities AND demos.  Then, I choose newest first.  To be fair, I rarely shop the marketplace unless it's for something specific where I know the store name or creator name.  I'm sure I'm not the typical MP shopper, though.

[Ardy Lay]

Dumb idea:  Let buyers advertise what they want to buy and let creators and resellers make offers!  Heheh, I can imagine the chaos already.

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Ardy Lay said:

Dumb idea:  Let buyers advertise what they want to buy and let creators and resellers make offers!  Heheh, I can imagine the chaos already.

[Wulfie Reanimator]

2 hours ago, Ardy Lay said:

Gimme an example of a search that fails.  I'll JIRA that sucker for you!

It's been Jira'd and the fix will come.

The problem with product search currently is that it'll show you products that include any of your search terms by default, unlike before where all search terms had to match.

Edit:

2 hours ago, Ardy Lay said:

Finding the right way to search for those is weird because everybody makes up their own listing format and pollutes their item listings with `~!@#$%^&*()-_=+{[}]|\:;"'<>/ ... connection lost.

Special characters are ignored in product searches. It doesn't matter if a product is named something obnoxious like ~{*Cool+Product*}~, you can find it by searching for "cool product" (quoted or not... after the fix).

Edited March 10, 2023 by Wulfie Reanimator

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

It's been Jira'd and the fix will come.

The problem with product search currently is that it'll show you products that include any of your search terms by default, unlike before where all search terms had to match.

"OR", "AND".. logic is hard!

[Ardy Lay]

4 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

It's been Jira'd and the fix will come.

The problem with product search currently is that it'll show you products that include any of your search terms by default, unlike before where all search terms had to match.

Oh!  Google made that change some time ago.  It disrupted a search engine game I was playing with a group.  We would type in published phrases and try to get exactly one result.  Google's help pages told us to quote the phrases but then we found that the published phrases would get NO RESULTS triggering the search engine to return the results as if the search string wasn't quoted.  The game was ruined!

[Drake1 Nightfire]

2 hours ago, Ardy Lay said:

Ah, resellers.  There is a tricky situation.  They sure can't use the creator's name, brand or store name as their own name, brand or store name.  Something I would ask for if I was a reseller is a way to indicate to "the system" what the original creator, brand or store name is so that can perhaps be searched for properly as a name instead of as buried in a proper description or description title.

Another thing that plagues me when searching Marketplace is finding things that compliment things.  Say I have an Item from one creator and am looking for a "mod kit" for it from a second creator, but I do not know that creator's name.  Finding the right way to search for those is weird because everybody makes up their own listing format and pollutes their item listings with `~!@#$%^&*()-_=+{[}]|\:;"'<>/ ... connection lost.

I assume you mean things like gatchas? Just put the original creators store name in the keywords...

[Lunachelsea]

Day 8 - Same thing ,This is like Groundhog Day

There is 1 thing working well on search though. I noticed if you type up crap you get crap Back.Just dont type up Blue Shirt crap, or Blue AND  shirt AND crap

 

 

Edited March 10, 2023 by Lunachelsea

[Ardy Lay]

1 hour ago, Drake1 Nightfire said:

I assume you mean things like gatchas? Just put the original creators store name in the keywords...

No, not like gatchas.  Like everything else that is resold on Marketplace.  Putting creator's name or store name in keywords results in the "description search results being polluted with creator and store names" mess that Linden Lab was trying to clear up at shoppers' requests.  The <noun> Store lists all sorts of things that are not <noun>.  If item search matches store name, then someone searching for an item that is <noun> gets every not <noun> listed for sale by The <noun> Store.  If they want every item listed by The <noun> Store the shopper clicks on and enters The <noun> Store and clicks .

What is missing is a way for me to find that used, transferrable item originally sold by The <noun> Store, now discontinued but being resold by a resident who no longer needs it.  I suppose I could resort to searching for quoted strings, but I have found that many listings do not show up when I do, possibly because the store name copied into "keywords" in the description are "decorated" with ~`!@#$%^&*()_-+={[}]|\:;"'<>/ ... connection lost.

Edited March 10, 2023 by Ardy Lay

[Wulfie Reanimator]

33 minutes ago, Ardy Lay said:

No, not like gatchas.  Like everything else that is resold on Marketplace.  Putting creator's name or store name in keywords results in the "description search results being polluted with creator and store names" mess that Linden Lab was trying to clear up at shoppers' requests.  The <noun> Store lists all sorts of things that are not <noun>.  If item search matches store name, then someone searching for an item that is <noun> gets every not <noun> listed for sale by The <noun> Store.  If they want every item listed by The <noun> Store the shopper clicks on and enters The <noun> Store and clicks .

What is missing is a way for me to find that used, transferrable item originally sold by The <noun> Store, now discontinued but being resold by a resident who no longer needs it.  I suppose I could resort to searching for quoted strings, but I have found that many listings do not show up when I do, possibly because the store name copied into "keywords" in the description are "decorated" with ~`!@#$%^&*()_-+={[}]|\:;"'<>/ ... connection lost.

If the store name is in the product name, it will be matched. Special characters are also ignored for search (besides asterisk, which now has its own meaning). Do you have an example of a search that doesn't find a specific product? (with a link to the product that should be found)

Edited March 10, 2023 by Wulfie Reanimator