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Knowl Paine wrote:

The greatest fallacy of modern economics is the belief that perpetually accelerating growth is possible.

Linden Labs Can do anything they want.

What LL should do is absolutely nothing.

Resident created, the good the bad and the ugly.

The thing is, LL have been trying to increase usership. That was the purpose of the failed display names. So they *want* to increase it, and this thread is about ideas of what might work. The idea that "LL should do absolutely nothing" doesn't come into it. When a business is struggling, regardless of the reason (such as the global economy), it has to take steps to try and improve things. When the economy is really bad, it isn't the businesses that save money by not spending on advertising that survive - it's those that keep on spending on advertising, even though they can barely afford it.

The SL system can handle a lot more users - it did in the past - and LL have been trying, and failing, to increase the usership. Imo, there are a lot of non-users who would take to SL if they got into it. For me, that means making SL more attractive - more desirable. The initial time (when a person joins) is paramount, and some great suggestions have been made. I particularly like the idea of small "quests", designed to teach new people about SL and how it works, and going up beginner levels when completing the quests so that new people can start out being quite familiar with what SL is and the way that it works. After that, it's making full participation more attractive by greatly improving the land ownership system., plus a huge change in LL's attitude to users - support, etc. It's common knowledge that LL doesn't care about their customers, and new people no doubt soon discover it. It's a big reason why many people leave (including me when I go in the not too distant future). Without putting that right, their attempts to increase usership is like running as hard as you can but staying on the same spot. Getting people in is good, but not so good when you are leaking people at the other end all the time.

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Phil Deakins wrote:


Knowl Paine wrote:

The greatest fallacy of modern economics is the belief that perpetually accelerating growth is possible.

Linden Labs Can do anything they want.

What LL should do is absolutely nothing.

Resident created, the good the bad and the ugly.

The thing is, LL have been trying to increase usership. That was the purpose of the failed display names. So they *want* to increase it, and this thread is about ideas of what might work. The idea that "
LL should do absolutely nothing
" doesn't come into it. When a business is struggling, regardless of the reason (such as the global economy), it has to take steps to try and improve things. When the economy is really bad, it isn't the businesses that save money by not spending on advertising that survive - it's those that keep on spending on advertising, even though they can barely afford it.

The SL system can handle a lot more users - it did in the past - and LL have been trying, and failing, to increase the usership. Imo, there are a lot of non-users who would take to SL if they got into it. For me, that means making SL more attractive - more desirable. The initial time (when a person joins) is paramount, and some great suggestions have been made. I particularly like the idea of small "quests", designed to teach new people about SL and how it works, and going up beginner levels when completing the quests so that new people can start out being quite familiar with what SL is and the way that it works. After that, it's making full participation more attractive by greatly improving the land ownership system., plus a huge change in LL's attitude to users - support, etc. It's common knowledge that LL doesn't care about their customers, and new people no doubt soon discover it. It's a big reason why many people leave (including me when I go in the not too distant future). Without putting that right, their attempts to increase usership is like running as hard as you can but staying on the same spot. Getting people in is good, but not so good when you are leaking people at the other end all the time.

In a way, he's correct, to a certain extent. We can come up with many and valid ideas for what Linden Lab can do to not only draw people in, but keep the people who are already here, but in the end, it's up to Linden Lab as to whether or not they wish to listen. In many ways, I often wonder if they really ARE interested in hearing what their residents have to say on the matter of improving Second Life. In other platforms, there is always a suggestions forum for customers to post their suggestions on how they think their experience could be improved. LL doesn't even offer us that. Certainly, they have other ways of supposedly communicating with residents, but how difficult or easy is it, when compared to simply posting one's idea on the forums?

In any event, while I actually do hope that some Linden, out there, will actually see this thread and take notes about what is being said in it, I do think there ought to be another thread on what residents can do to help improve the SL experience of all, new and experienced. Because, in the end, even if Linden Lab followed through on every suggestion we make, here, Second Life is such that what will ultimately keep residents continually logging in are the residents, themselves.

If anyone is interested in starting such a thread, here are a few ideas (I don't seem to have much luck in making threads that can stay alive--reference my MMORPG thread, if you don't believe me; I'm now posting there, all by my lonesome!):

1. The community, as a whole, needs to come to terms with the fact that LL is NOT going to interfere in what it considers private disputes between residents, and that includes arguments over trade. As such, I think it is up to residents, as a community, to decide how best to go about handling such situations. Many suggestions have been made in the past. My favorite is the idea of a Second Life Better Business/Resident Bureau, where people can look up the reputations of businesses and individuals, and choose whether or not to deal with them, based on their reputation.

2. Many people mourn the loss of the mentoring program that LL once had in place. Like another resident noted, I didn't even know that such a program existed, until it had been taken away. This being said, there's nothing that says that people who really feel comfortable in their knowledge of SL can't go to these newbie island places and give new people a hand in familiarizing themselves with SL.

3. Along the same vein of idea number two, if there are people with the resources who are genuinely concerned, perhaps they can turn their sim, or at least a part of it, into the type of introductory quest system that allows new people to get to know how to use their viewers and navigate through the world.

4. In addition to the quest tutorial system, perhaps the rest of the sim can be constructed such that it gives new people a chance to get a taste of the many things that people can do, in-world, from shopping, to clubbing, to dueling with swords, to fishing, to bowling, to golfing, to roleplaying, to building, etc. Did you know that there are places where people can go to seek counseling and therapy for free? And while people speak of education, it would be nice to have the reputable educational institutions in SL be represented among these small areas on the resident-run newbie island. The point, of course, of having these little areas means that each area can then have a list of places that they can further explore, that allows them to fully engage in these activities.

5. Of course, this means that, to make these things work, volunteers would be needed to greet new people and bring them to these places. These could be the same greeters who have decided to help new people familiarize themselves with SL.

6. As much as we talk about the "blight" of the mainland, in all honesty, that really isn't within LL purview, I would think. Again, the residents of each mainland sim will have to be willing to come together and come to a compromise on what can be done to make their sim beautiful, by their standards.

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The Business is not struggling, the Residents are.

Merchants at Market Place should increase the Price of their products by 25% Today and 50% within 30 days.

Renters should increase Rent

Land Sellers should ask 5L$ per meter across the board.

Employers should Double the working wage for their employees Today. Then ask for more work from them.

 

Discussing the Economy.... a new thread would be in order.  

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Well, I suppose I was incorrect in thinking that Linden Lab didn't care about what their customers think. Up until last year, Linden Lab actually had an F rating with the Better Business Bureau. But it seems that, in September of 2010, Linden Lab went out of its way to gain an A+ rating with them. This explains why Linden Lab was suddenly concerned with closing and resolving all of its complaints and tickets. I guess they're actually trying to do what they can to restore their repuation with both present and future consumers. That's actually a pretty good sign, in my opinion. If they care enough to try, then maybe they'll really care enough to listen.

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KeeperS Karu wrote:

Well, I suppose I was incorrect in thinking that Linden Lab didn't care about what their customers think

Not only does the LL management not care about what customers think, but they simply don't care about customers. They care about having enough customers to be profitable, of course, but they don't care who they are. As long as people are coming in to replace those who are leaving due to LL's bad management, they are content. They would like to increase the numbers, and they've taken failed steps to do it, but they are not concerned with the "people" at any time.

That's the generally perceived view, which has been generated by the LL management over the years. Personally, I believe it to be the correct view. I've no idea how LL could go from an F rating to an A+ rating with the BBB but it's a smokescreen. If they managed it, it was for the sake of their reputation and not an indication of any change in attitude towards customers.

An example (one of many):- How often do we see threads and posts about items being unlisted from the marketplace, where the seller isn't given any indication as to where the items should be listed? It's every day. And how often do people post that such sellers should be told where the items belong? Very often. If the person who unlisted an item knows where it belongs (and they must know since they could see it was in the wrong category), they would tell the seller where it beloings IF THEY WERE IN ANY WAY INTERESTED IN THE CUSTOMER (the seller). There are even cases where items are in exactly the right place, but there is more than one exactly right place and the person who unlists them decides that it belongs in the other place, but doesn't tell the seller. That's all been going on for so very long and what does LL do about it? Absolutely nothing. They don't even explain why they don't pass the information on to sellers. They simply don't give a damn. I've never used the marketplace so it doesn't affect me in the slightest. I just read about it in the forums and add it to the long list of why I would never lift a finger to benefit Linden Lab. The long list of not giving a damn about customers is the reason why I abandon land rather than sell it - to prevent LL from getting any tier on it for a while.

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Phil Deakins wrote:

Astonishing.

Incidentally, scripts do run even when nobody is using them - they have to if they are to perform when someone wants something of them. But they shouldn't be chewing large amounts of time.

Yup, but there is a massive difference between "Event Driven" coding style and "forever loop" coding. The worst offenders tend to be written so that they are continually running some task ... be it from a timer or in a continuous polled mode. Newer scripts tend to be more Event Driven and mostly stay asleep.

I was quite frankly astonished when I saw the script time stats on the Photo Studio I mentioned. I even went and "visited" it to see what it might be doing .. on the assumption is was randomly changing backgrounds or something similar. Nope, everything I could "see" was static. However I did notice that the other very high usage scripted object was the detached control panel for it. Apparently the two parts are continually chatting back and forth .. perhaps repeating the same settings over and over again.

Whatever the cause, I know from talking to others that this particular model is one of the most famous and most popular (owing to its long-term presence in the market). I'm quite sure newer competing devices of the same capabilities probably are much more sophisticated and much less consumptive of script time, but because of the name recognition and history of this one, it will continue to dominate and lag well into the future.

I'm just thankful it's the only one on the entire Sim. If someone else moves in and rezzes another one, we'll be rubber-banding no end .. just because of two devices. OUCH!

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Darrius Gothly wrote:


Phil Deakins wrote:

Astonishing.

Incidentally, scripts do run even when nobody is using them - they have to if they are to perform when someone wants something of them. But they shouldn't be chewing large amounts of time.

Yup, but there is a massive difference between "Event Driven" coding style and "forever loop" coding. The worst offenders tend to be written so that they are continually running some task ... be it from a timer or in a continuous polled mode. Newer scripts tend to be more Event Driven and mostly stay asleep.

I was quite frankly astonished when I saw the script time stats on the Photo Studio I mentioned. I even went and "visited" it to see what it might be doing .. on the assumption is was randomly changing backgrounds or something similar. Nope, everything I could "see" was static. However I did notice that the other very high usage scripted object was the detached control panel for it. Apparently the two parts are continually chatting back and forth .. perhaps repeating the same settings over and over again.

Whatever the cause, I know from talking to others that this particular model is one of the most famous and most popular (owing to its long-term presence in the market). I'm quite sure newer competing devices of the same capabilities probably are much more sophisticated and much less consumptive of script time, but because of the name recognition and history of this one, it will continue to dominate and lag well into the future.

I'm just thankful it's the only one on the entire Sim. If someone else moves in and rezzes another one, we'll be rubber-banding no end .. just because of two devices. OUCH!

Yeah, it was actually because of the comments about scripts and vendors that, after a bit of a hiatus from SL, due to university, I decided to go in and see just how badly my vendors at my shop were affecting things. Everyone esle's vendors only took up about 64kb each, while mine EACH took 640. Ywoch! That was a pretty big difference, there, so I went to see if Hippo had updated their vendors. Turns out, yes and no. I had to buy an add-on to get my vendors down to 64kb each. If it weren't for the sales logs, I would have just used the vendors my buddy made. Oh, well.

I have to say that that's the one thing I DO like that LL did: being able to see just how much in the way of resources one's toys are taking up can be a real eye-opener. I'm going to have to take some time to go and retake some scripting workshops, so I can learn how to build some of my scripts so they don't lag out the sim.

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