Jackson Redstar Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 being 2022 I would think the majority of the user base would be able the run ALM with shadows OFF even in crowded places. But as long as will still be able to turn on local lites or not and attached lites or not I dont see a problem having ALM on by default. As long as we can can still apply whatever EEP we want and not be forced to accept region lighting. Then that would be very bad indeed 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarlanderGoods Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 Skybox and sky dome creators will have to figure out how to recreate light inside their builds, or find different means for privacy other than a huge simwide sphere that blocks all the light. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Sharkfin Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 Just now, StarlanderGoods said: Skybox and sky dome creators will have to figure out how to recreate light inside their builds, or find different means for privacy other than a huge simwide sphere that blocks all the light. Between that and learning how to use reflection probes they're going to be pretty busy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 59 minutes ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said: reflection probes /me raises her hand Excuse me, Miss? What's a "reflection probe"? And why does it sound painful? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenna Huntsman Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 6 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said: /me raises her hand Excuse me, Miss? What's a "reflection probe"? And why does it sound painful? Fancy new-fangled technology that allows objects to reflect the scene around them (see the below example, particularly the windows!) 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Jenna Huntsman said: Fancy new-fangled technology that allows objects to reflect the scene around them (see the below example, particularly the windows!) Right! I knew they were working on something like this. I'd imagine this is going to involve some heavy lifting for computers, though? That scene is not SL, btw, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenna Huntsman Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 Just now, Scylla Rhiadra said: That scene is not SL, btw, is it? *whistles* Things are about to get exciting. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Sharkfin Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 36 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said: I'd imagine this is going to involve some heavy lifting for computers, though? I haven't had a chance to try it yet but from what I read in some of the previous meeting notes here it sounds like the majority of the heavy lifting is dependent on the number of probes sampled. Quote Currently only 8 maps are active at any one time. However, given sampling of just 8 maps for rendering can take up to 70% of an RTX 3080 GPU, this number is likely to be dropped to 4, unless a more targeted means of sampling for a given pixel can be determined. I'd assume an additional consideration would be the rate at which probes are updated which according to the blog post is currently... Quote whenever the number of objects in them changes or the Day Cycle changes, although the update rate is no more than one probe per frame. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliseAnne85 Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 2 hours ago, Jenna Huntsman said: *whistles* Things are about to get exciting. 0.0 What? When? Can you shed a little more light on this, no pun was intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wulfie Reanimator Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 (edited) @Fluffy Sharkfin @EliseAnne85 Things have evolved quite a bit since the first CCUG, below are just a few summaries that focused on reflection probes a lot: https://modemworld.me/2022/05/06/2022-ccug-meeting-week-18-summary-reflection-probes/https://modemworld.me/2022/05/20/2022-ccug-meeting-week-20-summary-reflection-probes-update/https://modemworld.me/2022/06/03/2022-ccug-meeting-week-22-summary-reflection-probes-update/https://modemworld.me/2022/06/18/2022-ccug-meeting-week-24-summary-materials-alm/ Edited September 21, 2022 by Wulfie Reanimator 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Sharkfin Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 16 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said: @Fluffy Sharkfin @EliseAnne85 Things have evolved quite a bit since the first CCUG, below are just a few summaries that focused on reflection probes a lot: https://modemworld.me/2022/05/06/2022-ccug-meeting-week-18-summary-reflection-probes/https://modemworld.me/2022/05/20/2022-ccug-meeting-week-20-summary-reflection-probes-update/https://modemworld.me/2022/06/03/2022-ccug-meeting-week-22-summary-reflection-probes-update/https://modemworld.me/2022/06/18/2022-ccug-meeting-week-24-summary-materials-alm/ Thanks, I had a look through a few of the meeting notes and linked the blog post that had information relevant to impact on performance, but there's definitely a ton of additional information in subsequent posts that's worth reviewing. I'm quite excited to see the old SL environment/reflection map getting replaced, hopefully it won't take long for people to start utilizing them once the feature is released. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliseAnne85 Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 40 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said: @Fluffy Sharkfin @EliseAnne85 Things have evolved quite a bit since the first CCUG, below are just a few summaries that focused on reflection probes a lot: https://modemworld.me/2022/05/06/2022-ccug-meeting-week-18-summary-reflection-probes/https://modemworld.me/2022/05/20/2022-ccug-meeting-week-20-summary-reflection-probes-update/https://modemworld.me/2022/06/03/2022-ccug-meeting-week-22-summary-reflection-probes-update/https://modemworld.me/2022/06/18/2022-ccug-meeting-week-24-summary-materials-alm/ That's a lot of material to get through, no pun intended again. What I've gotten so far is old normal maps will not work; we will need 4 maps now (some with names) I've never heard of, and something or other about Unreal Engine(?). Unreal engine? Wow! I hope they will have classes to teach how to make the maps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Sharkfin Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 5 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said: That's a lot of material to get through, no pun intended again. What I've gotten so far is old normal maps will not work; we will need 4 maps now (some with names) I've never heard of, and something or other about Unreal Engine(?). Unreal engine? Wow! I hope they will have classes to teach how to make the maps. The PBR compatible maps they're implementing are pretty much industry standard at this point so will probably be easier to work with than the current SL materials for those using 3D software that supports PBR workflows. The reference to Unreal Engine is only in regards to the upcoming support for the .gltf format, it's certainly not going to be a requirement for any aspect of creating content for SL. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wulfie Reanimator Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said: That's a lot of material to get through, no pun intended again. What I've gotten so far is old normal maps will not work; we will need 4 maps now (some with names) I've never heard of, and something or other about Unreal Engine(?). Unreal engine? Wow! I hope they will have classes to teach how to make the maps. To explain the new PBR names in simple terms: Albedo = Regular SL texture Normal = Normal map in SL Emissive = Fullbright in SL (for specific parts of the texture) Metallic-Roughness = Shininess in SL, or Glossiness and Environment together Blender can easily bake all of these textures for you, it's just a couple clicks different from what you'd normally do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaylinbridges Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 (edited) 12 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said: I just press Ctrl-Shift-Y! All that does is set Sky to Midday, you still need to select a better Sky setting. Does not set the Day Cycle to Default either. Edited September 22, 2022 by Jaylinbridges Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 4 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said: To explain the new PBR names in simple terms: Albedo = Regular SL texture Normal = Normal map in SL Emissive = Fullbright in SL (for specific parts of the texture) Metallic-Roughness = Shininess in SL, or Glossiness and Environment together Blender can easily bake all of these textures for you, it's just a couple clicks different from what you'd normally do. So, the one that is new here is Emissive? Is there any change to the effect, or ways in which one can tweak, Normal and Specular (i.e., Metallic-Rougness)? Or is it that this separates the last two, which are together now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid Nagy Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 So the next hot thing in 2023 could be: "Sorry, but I have to unfriend you, because the lamps in your living room don't reflect in your windows!" 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Sharkfin Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 4 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said: So, the one that is new here is Emissive? Is there any change to the effect, or ways in which one can tweak, Normal and Specular (i.e., Metallic-Rougness)? Or is it that this separates the last two, which are together now? You're close but, as usual, it's a wee bit more complicated. At the moment we can toggle between using the alpha channel in the main diffuse texture for either transparency or emissiveness (glow), so essentially we already have an 8-bit (greyscale) emissive map but it's being changed to a separate full colour texture. They are including a new type of map, the Occlusion map, which will be in the red channel of the Metallic-Roughness map (which will actually be three separate greyscale textures combined into the red, green and blue channels of a single image). The materials system we have now is basically the equivalent of a Specular PBR workflow while the new system will be a Metallic PBR workflow. You can find a fairly straightforward explanation of the differences between the two and a list of pros and cons for both in this blog post PBR Textures Metallic vs Specular Workflow but essentially this quote sums it up pretty well... Quote PBR Specular Workflow uses a Specular Color map in conjunction with the Gloss Map for correct specularity. This has both a strong benefit and a significant disadvantage, especially in terms of game creation. PBR Metallic workflows are memory friendly in nature and hence often more suitable for game development. 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChinRey Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 14 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said: Albedo = Regular SL texture No, it isn't. A texture is a baked surface map with the base color and static simulations of shading, reflections and all the little lumps and bumps across the surface it covers. An albedo map only has the base colors. Everything else is supposed to be generated dynamically from other maps and from shaders. It does not work on its own at all. A diffuse map is a bit of a mix. It contains some shading, reflection and surface details. It really needs shaders and other maps to shine (no pun intended) but it can do on its own in a pinch. We already have problems with the confusion between textures and diffuse maps in SL. Adding textures as albedo maps and albedo maps as textures will make this much worse. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wulfie Reanimator Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 1 hour ago, ChinRey said: An albedo map only has the base colors. Everything else is supposed to be generated dynamically from other maps and from shaders. It does not work on its own at all. My post was only trying to relate the new maps in layman's terms with the ones we're used to, without having to caveat and explain the technical differences. 😋 I think you can understand why I put it the way I did, and I appreciate you adding the details either way. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akane Nacht Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 20 hours ago, Sid Nagy said: So the next hot thing in 2023 could be: "Sorry, but I have to unfriend you, because the lamps in your living room don't reflect in your windows!" do not worry, just make a female avie with big boobies and you will have friends no matter where the shadows fall. As for ALM, I still leave it off except for pics because it makes my (souped up super duper newly built by a professional geek gaming computer) get hotter than it should. No idea why, but off ALM stays. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarlanderGoods Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 4 hours ago, Akane Nacht said: do not worry, just make a female avie with big boobies and you will have friends no matter where the shadows fall. As for ALM, I still leave it off except for pics because it makes my (souped up super duper newly built by a professional geek gaming computer) get hotter than it should. No idea why, but off ALM stays. My not suped up, regular duper, newly built (with some old parts included) built by me gaming computer runs 2 ALM enabled viewers in ultra, at 60 fps. Maybe you just have a hot rig. My previous video card was super hot, constantly firing up the fans like it was about to take off, but it turned out that that´s how that video card worked. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akane Nacht Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 1 hour ago, StarlanderGoods said: My not suped up, regular duper, newly built (with some old parts included) built by me gaming computer runs 2 ALM enabled viewers in ultra, at 60 fps. Maybe you just have a hot rig. My previous video card was super hot, constantly firing up the fans like it was about to take off, but it turned out that that´s how that video card worked. Possibly I've picked equipment that doesn't play nice with SL, but that's been the case for my last 3 computers. I can run other games on ultra settings without my GPU & CPU breaking a sweat, but SL with ALM on and standing still = 🔥 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janet Voxel Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 On 9/21/2022 at 4:00 PM, Scylla Rhiadra said: That scene is not SL, btw, is it? That is doable now. There's a couple people that do custom work with materials and lighting that really make SL pop. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliseAnne85 Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 (edited) 21 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said: My post was only trying to relate the new maps in layman's terms with the ones we're used to, without having to caveat and explain the technical differences. 😋 I think you can understand why I put it the way I did, and I appreciate you adding the details either way. I looked up the first map - Albedo and looks interesting BUT what are the requirements of a machine going to be to run this proposed ALM with four maps thingamajig? Do you or anyone have any idea on what the system requirements are going to be? Edited September 23, 2022 by EliseAnne85 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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