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Physics Shape Uploading Help


BEGOCER Lehmann
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So I'm feeling pretty noobish right now. I've got an issue with a physics shape I'm working on for a ship, but its being a right piece of work when it comes to uploading it. 

I made it super low detail, just enough to encircle the ship and give it basic interior walking space, but whenever its uploaded and set to prim physics shape it goes from the calculated 4LI when physical to 160+LI...

70972ba802919e9e41411a6952d566ab.png

Now it is long, about 30M but I've seen ships larger than this with their own, much more detailed physics shape have nearly a quarter of the LI of what I'm getting with mine.

I've checked 2309572039 times that there are no small faces in the .dae file that would cause it to flip out, but nothing is coming up or even appearing to be wrong.

Also I noticed when I view the physics shape in Firestorm the opposite sides of the exterior faces are calculated on the inside as well, which is something that is definitely not needed...I don't know what I'm doing wrong. I've uploaded about 30 (seriously) different tests and they all result in the same issue. I uploaded the shape with the custom physics shape of the actual model shown here as a tester too

c6581f2df9fe9a5f239690b858394d85.png

This pic is in the tail end, where it should've only had that small walkway as a shape you can interact with.

What on earth am i doing wrong...?

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12 hours ago, BEGOCER Lehmann said:

What on earth am i doing wrong...?

Edited to re_direct you to @arton Rotaru's  replies below.

So you can probably skip the rest of this post.

 

 

 

 

 

Don't know ..........we need more information :)

Can you say if you are using triangle based (Not Analyzed in the mesh uploader)  or hull based  (Analyzed) physics? For such a model I think the Non Analysed  (triangle type) would be the better choice because it should give the lower Physics cost.

I did a quick approximate mock-up of your Physics model and the Physics cost was only 1.2 (Not Analysed) with physics shell on both inside and outside surfaces.

Can you add a screen-shot of your Physics tab Upload window like in the image below so that we can see the relevant numbers, (This is non Analysed physics) :

875431946_ShipPhysicsuploader-min.thumb.png.ea8c75476b6f9b9ecba1958cefbbba16.png

 

And can you share your Physics model ? If you are using Blender then you can use this .blend file share link  https://pasteall.org/blend/.

A screen-shot of your visual model "ship" may be useful as well  :)

Edited by Aquila Kytori
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There is an additional land impact penalty for large models when set physical. That's causing the jump in land impact (Physics weight). You also need to Analyze the physics to keep it's shape while set physical. Ideally, you construct the physics shape out of convex boxes with some spacing between the boxes on your own. This way the decomposer in the uploader won't do funky things with it when pressing Analyze.

Edited by arton Rotaru
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One thing from personal experience (when working with buildings with multiple rooms/doorways/windows) I would recommend trying is to not use a "single surface" mesh that is hollow. Instead, you can use multiple solid hulls joined as a single object as your physics shape.

To explain what I mean, here's an example. Both cubes are a single object, but the one on the right is made up of multiple cubes joined together and intersecting each other. This may seem counter-intuitive at first, but the complexity of each individual hull is significantly less than the one on the left.

image.thumb.png.186661e896eb853da9f11740972ff9d7.png

Related:

 

Edited by Wulfie Reanimator
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4 hours ago, arton Rotaru said:

You also need to Analyze the physics to keep it's shape while set physical. Ideally, you construct the physics shape out of convex boxes with some spacing between the boxes on your own. This way the decomposer in the uploader won't do funky things with it when pressing Analyze.

I am completely confused now and feel that I have missed something important ! 😕

I was recommending BEGOCER to use Triangle based, not Analyzed, physics as I would for any large building type model but you are  suggesting that BEGOCER  use Box/Hull shaped, Analyzed physics. ??

 

 And also Wulfie seems to be suggesting to use Analyzed physics as well :

1 hour ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

To explain what I mean, here's an example. Both cubes are a single object, but the one on the right is made up of multiple cubes joined together and intersecting each other. This may seem counter-intuitive at first, but the complexity of each individual hull is significantly less than the one on the left.

image.thumb.png.186661e896eb853da9f11740972ff9d7.png.f5800faf8a316cf4ff57cd5d2edf52a3.png

 

This is also going to be confusing for BEGOCER , so can you please explain why, in this case, box/hull based, Analysed physics should be used instead of triangle/plane based, not Analyzed physics ?

 

The double walled, triangle/planes based example model that I was suggesting :

2095850333_TribasedPhysicsmodel-min.thumb.png.f14b0a627b764ece2112a480ceb32a58.png

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1 hour ago, Aquila Kytori said:

This is also going to be confusing for BEGOCER , so can you please explain why, in this case, box/hull based, Analysed physics should be used instead of triangle/plane based, not Analyzed physics ?

I am not suggesting the use of analyzed physics shapes.

Maybe my suggestion has a similar effect, but I don't claim any technical understanding of what exactly causes physics shapes of certain levels of complexity to shoot up in LI. It's just an educated guess with enough practical experience with the same issue. I can't say much about the 'analyze' option in the mesh uploader because I've never seriously tried to use it. It seems very difficult to control; either it creates way too many hulls, or it doesn't create the overall shape I want.

If OP can provide the problematic physics shape as a dae/blend, I'll happily experiment with it.

Edited by Wulfie Reanimator
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2 hours ago, Aquila Kytori said:

This is also going to be confusing for BEGOCER , so can you please explain why, in this case, box/hull based, Analysed physics should be used instead of triangle/plane based, not Analyzed physics ?

Since this is a ship, and BEGOCER mentioned:

11 hours ago, BEGOCER Lehmann said:

it goes from the calculated 4LI when physical to 160+LI...

So I guess he makes it physical, which would explain the high LI count due to the penalty for large physical models. And when set physical, a triangle collision shape won't be walkable inside while physical. Hence my recommendation to decompose the collision mesh.

Edited by arton Rotaru
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ok, Thanks Wulfie and arton 

 

43 minutes ago, arton Rotaru said:

So I guess he makes it physical, which would explain the high LI count due to the penalty for large physical models. And when set physical, a triangle collision shape won't be walkable inside while physical. Hence my recommendation to decompose the collision mesh.

I will edit my first post.  :)

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Hey thanks for the help! So I'll post a pic of my upload window and what is happening in it. 

c467fa97dd793363cc3c2db2b9aac1ee.png

For uploading, I always click the Analyze button as I've had other physics shapes go wonky if I didn't. 

Here's the .blend file with the physics shape I'm trying to get to work.

https://pasteall.org/blend/e4ebce5db836492293b771ac866caa2e

Now this is right after I calculate the fees and what not. 

3b09ce4f8df633d5d6de59b300f96d2e.png

...and this is using the official SL viewer. I've never gotten this result on Firestorm lol 

a05724942ed17bc08965eff93d3e4246.png

This is the lowest physical number I've gotten in any of for just the physics shapes....man lol

But alas when I link it to my ship it goes from a 180LI to a 327LI

531c0c4701ddb95f22cd3df7ccc28f3d.jpg

The only other things that have physics shapes are two landing gear struts and a front landing gear wheel, all with super basic physics shapes. And when I set their physics shapes to none the LI doesn't jump from the 180LI when physical. I should try to reupload them in the official SL viewer since I got this result....

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As you are setting the model t0 be Physical then I have to refer you to anton's replies above, he Knows about vehicles.

 

But I should point out that in this screenshot you have not Analysed the physics model because it is showing the number of Triangles (156). :

2 hours ago, BEGOCER Lehmann said:

Now this is right after I calculate the fees and what not. 

985582635_setchupnotanalyzed-min.thumb.png.e6ce9cc1fc508fe14d56be522f6673b7.png

 

When Analysed it will indicate a number of Hulls :

753939014_setchupanalyzed-min.thumb.png.52fbd18fc1474906ea19882adda6ced1.png

 

 

2 hours ago, BEGOCER Lehmann said:

Though the weird thing is that the physics is showing its all there but its reacting like its a convex physics shape type when its definitely set to a prim shape..

Because the Physics model was not Analyzed in the mesh uploader see artons reply:

10 hours ago, arton Rotaru said:

And when set physical, a triangle collision shape won't be walkable inside while physical. Hence my recommendation to decompose the collision mesh.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Aquila Kytori
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One other thing, before exporting from Blender you should always check that the objects Transforms have been applied. ( Objects X, Y and Z Rotations all set to 0°   and X, Y and Z Scales are 1.00)

Your Physics model has Scale values of 0.025 !

To Apply the Transforms : in Object mode, select the model, open the Object menu > Apply > All Transforms 

204595273_ApplyTransforms.thumb.gif.ce3ea3f5c5552b80aec86c93dc097d10.gif

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