This is soo disapointing.

[Madelaine McMasters]

3 minutes ago, Cali Souther said:

Alas,  Maddy --  you are by far  --  a more interesting conversationalist than I am. 

I wonder how true that is. I wonder how important that is.

If I want something, I figure out how to get it. If I want a conversation, I must get someone else to want one, too. That might mean mining profiles or the context of our encounters for something I think they're interested in that I can use as an ice-breaker. That little bit of research also makes it clear (I hope) that I'm at least as interested as I am interesting.

I enjoy my own company and weather rejection fairly well. If I do have an advantage here, it might be Winston Churchill's...

"Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm."

[Scylla Rhiadra]

1 hour ago, Cali Souther said:

Oh,  I don't mean if you send someone an IM ...   I meant,  you go to a club and a few people say hello and then you become a wall flower.   Even when you try to join the chat --- if there is any --- it is often just a few people, going on about something between them - like a private joke.   

Not all places are like this,  but in my experience (which is all I have to go by)  ---  just because a place is "hot" doesn't necessarily mean it's friendly.    I actually look for smaller groups.   People at less popular clubs seem to be more friendly and chatty and less cliquish.    As always,  it's only my 2 cents.

This is totally my experience. Once the number in the club tops about 20 or so, open conversation seems to wane, possibly because it's just more difficult to manage with that many people.

29 minutes ago, Cali Souther said:

Alas,  Maddy --  you are by far  --  a more interesting conversationalist than I am. 

Eh, well . . . um, sure. Yeah. 😏

[Madelaine McMasters]

23 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Once the number in the club tops about 20 or so, open conversation seems to wane, possibly because it's just more difficult to manage with that many people.

Absolutely.

As a teacher, I'm sure you've experienced the difficulty of keeping a class discussion going, even though you've got a topic everyone should be interested in. With that many voices in the room, some are sure to fall silent. The remaining voices grow ever louder, forcing others silent as well. Only the most gregarious are eventually left in the fray. If you don't constantly reengage the silent ones, the room becomes uninviting to them. This is how cliques achieve recognition, even when they don't actually exist.

There's another huge difference for me between public chat and one-to-one IM. Though I am a very fast typist, my nerve and RSI injuries want to be in control of the pace. I can throw myself into a flare-up in mere minutes when playing a video game that rewards agility. Public chat is like that, the more people participate, the less time you have to insert your wit. Though I might keep up intellectually, it eventually becomes physically impossible, even for the rugged.

One of the most intellectually impressive people I've had the pleasure of knowing in SL was a very slow typist. We first butted heads in the forum, where she had the time to bring every one of her army of IQ points to bear, often on me. In-world, in public chat, she was a wallflower. In IM we found ideal ground for engagement and had the most wonderful conversations. To me, who loves fast banter, she was a shining example of the rewards of being patient. I try to keep that in mind when encountering new people.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

7 minutes ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

One of the most intellectually impressive people I've had the pleasure of knowing in SL was a very slow typist.

Dahling, what are you talking about?

I'm a very quick typist!

[Madelaine McMasters]

5 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Dahling, what are you talking about?

I'm a very quick typist!

And I'm thankfully able to defend myself against multiple armies... so far.

[StarlanderGoods]

12 hours ago, cunomar said:

A reference to something completely lost on me ?

The Truman Show, its an OK movie, with a good performance and a great concept.

[cunomar]

Truman Burbank , a real person in a fake world .

Applicants should have no history of facebook or twitter or anything similar .

[Setsuki Takeda]

On 3/15/2022 at 1:55 AM, Maitimo said:

This. Especially if you are male and the avatar you're trying to talk to is female. 

I respond, unless it's a "hru babygirl wyd?"

 

If they can't be bothered to spell out such short words I can't be bothered to answer them.

 

Not a "mesh snob" either, despite having an avatar that ticks all the boxes for being "modern" and "high end" myself, so I talk to noobs the same as I do models.

 

I am a little discriminatory toward blank profiles, though.

[Maitimo]

19 hours ago, NanashiNyx said:

I respond, unless it's a "hru babygirl wyd?"

If they can't be bothered to spell out such short words I can't be bothered to answer them.

 

I'm with you on the "hi hru" rubbish. I don't respond unless they've actually given me something solid to respond to, like a comment on something in my profile or something about the location we're mutually at. Some of the best conversations I've had with strangers have been based on a comment about my profile (or theirs).

[Prokofy Neva]

On 3/12/2022 at 4:49 AM, Zzevir said:

It's Saturday morning still on holiday.  Why not log in Sl, do a bit of a teleport around find random ppl to chat. this is what happened.

And that's why I don't log in as much as I used to.

[01:17] Sandbox Cleans every 3 hours. No Combat. No Selling., Sandbox Island (TG) (211, 142, 27):
[01:18] Moose Beach Infohub, Moose Beach (76, 55, 23):
[01:19] Nova Albion Infohub - Miramare, Miramare (7, 23, 26):
[01:21] Welcome Area, Morris (2, 247, 40):
[01:23] Gulf of Lauren, Landres (52, 178, 22):
[01:25] Zzevir: is somebody home?
[01:26] Unique View, Ambat (163, 115, 46):
[01:26] Ben-go! (only works on the ground): You aren't the owner
[01:27] Zzevir: hello
[01:28] Zzevir: I'm guessing everybody a bot here
[01:28] Zzevir: is a
[01:29] Hyles Swamp Infohub by Kim Anubis & Friends, Hyles (41, 31, 23):
[01:30] Zzevir: well, well, well another bunch of bots
[01:30] Zzevir: nothing surprising
[01:31] Temple of Iris - Linden Historical Site, Iris (201, 120, 30):
[01:32] Zzevir: if you are a bot put your hands down.
[01:33] Zzevir: that was what I expected.
[01:33] 2022-03-03 : Abandoned Land, Aglia (152, 33, 34):
[01:34] slbots, Arches (223, 157, 276):
[01:36] 2022-02-08 : Abandoned Land, Bloomfield (250, 213, 278):
[01:36] 2021-12-02 : Abandoned Land, Gioacchini (250, 210, 49):
[01:38] 2021-05-07 : Abandoned Land, Scurfield (135, 58, 122):
[01:38] .::Bella Pointe::. http://www.mybellapointe.com/support/, Ranchero (137, 121, 41):
[01:39] Zzevir: nope
[01:39] 2021-11-27 : Abandoned Land, Gyaltsen (50, 62, 55):
[01:40] Moose Beach Infohub, Moose Beach (76, 55, 23):

 

And then I gave up.

I'm sorry that neither I nor my tenants were available to greet you either at the Iris infohub, where we have our Moth Temple Preserve surrounding it, or at the Hyles Swamp infohub, where we have Coney Island right across from it.

Most people figure out how to fight their way from the throng of bots over to the green dots where they will find people to socialize with or various games or free content or whatever.

But I have a feeling that even if 10 of us made a Welcome Wagon party for you, if our conversation wasn't thrilling by your lights, or we didn't have something shiny enough to offer you, you would get bored and leave.

Which is why we don't spend our time sending out greeting parties. People who want to bowl and play other games or shop along the boardwalk find Coney Island in Baileya across from Hyles; people who want to hang out and enjoy Nature or get freebies or tutorials come to Iris and the Moth Temple. We also have a build with second-tier tutorials and activities in Ross called Memory Bazaar on the old Linden telehub land.

If I'm abandoning waterfront snow land this minute, it's because no one wants to buy it or pay even a low rent barely covering costs for it. And that's fine, out it goes to cover the new sales tax. That's life in the big city. Someone else will find $1/m to get it abandoned from LL.

There is a song that goes like this, that is the anthem of a generation:

Here we are now

Entertain us

I feel stupid

And contagious

If this generation wasn't stupid and contagious when it got started in the 1990s seeking endless entertainment from helicopter parents, it is stupid now from video games and contagious because  they won't wear a mask or get vaccinated.

So did I call it right?

Or you think LL should lay on entertainment for you. Well, they have, with some of it only available for $11.99 a month, and I agree that the rock and glych game is kinda dull and Bellisseria isn't that enchanting, but then, you only paid $11.99, not $99.99 which might give you dinner, a movie, and a drink afterwards.

I do agree that these throngs of bots at the infohubs are for the birds. The Lindens have a policy that bots that fall offline from a sim where they have been deployed get to fall back on an infohub if they are logged in, but the sim is down for a rolling restart or if it is broken or if their owners manage them poorly. 

We all endlessly complain about this and I often file a ticket or reach live customer service to get the Lindens to re-start an infohub sim which often shakes off all those bots, they truly then go offline. Or maybe they merely go to another infohub to plague the people there.

The point is, bots that are on a sim that goes down should go offline period, and stay offline until their owner logs them in again. Their owner has to control them as he would his own account. The Lindens could easily set up a group of sims that are the temporary home off bots kicked of sims that go down in a rolling restart. This bot haven would mean more server costs for them without revenue, but they could simply charge more to have a bot account. Currently they make owners register those scripted entities and make each one have to be paid for by a premium account (although maybe some merchants have got around that). But let them pay more, and reduce this insidious population.

I think the cheapest and simplest solution is simply to log them off, period. Let their owners revive them for whatever purpose they have, infesting the grid with them. I'm for making them pay more for that infestation, and not us paying in the form of less customers, less help to newbies, etc. because they infest infohubs and people seeing these lifeless mannequins don't want to be there.

 

[Nalates Urriah]

On 3/15/2022 at 6:56 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

Concurrency statistics don't talk in local chat .. also .. notice the difference in spikyness before and after the SL api broke .. one side of these numbers is not like the other, maybe don't put too much stock in that upward trending curve.

Maybe... At least I have data from the system supporting my thinking. Spikiness in the data is handled by smoothing the data to see a more representative value.

On 3/15/2022 at 6:56 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

The SL viewer is bound to the main thread, pointing out there are lots of threads (doing nothing most of the time) is really being a bit economical with the truth. For all intents and purposes, it's single threaded with a smattering of threads for quality of life purposes - like not stalling the viewer when you have the file upload dialog open. See not single threaded !!

But at least my quote of Monty is true. And Monty describes the thread differently than your earlier post. And those of us that used the earlier viewers are aware of how much the additional threading has helped.

On 3/15/2022 at 6:56 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

because they come with the expectation of getting 60+++ fps and don't get close to that, because SL is CPU and IO bound and games are not.

Those other games are not having a problem because they don't have to deal with 200+ terabytes of game data.

But I seldom see my computer bottleneck when running Firestorm.

Those are 4 cores churning along a few minuets after my area finished rezzing all the textures. Anyone can check their computer while running FS and see who is more "economical" with the truth.

On 3/15/2022 at 6:56 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

They are not complaining about being unable to run their game and SL at the same time.

You missed my point...

On 3/15/2022 at 6:56 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

No it doesn't, it might gobble up a load of VRAM, but it's not even close to the percentages reported in task manager in terms of GPU processing .. but it's easy to think that it is with the horizontal scale on the graph in task manager measuring 5+ seconds and the overall data being very smoothed. That usage percentage is simplistic to say the least.

Your viewer of choice will have support for external profiling tools at this point, although you may need to compile from scratch to enable them.

Yeah it does. Your assumption as to what I used to measure was again wrong, clueless might be more accurate. Thinking I am simple is just projection on your part.

The GPU Load is showing startup, first tall spike. About half way through the middle tall block the region completed render. Switching back and forth between GPU-Z and FS the minimum load is >20%.  Play with TPing through SL I find the GPU Load bouncing between 20 to 60%. Anyone can make their own tests.

I checked to see how much GPU-Z loaded the numbers. Running on its own the GPU-Z load is ZERO.

[Coffee Pancake]

1 hour ago, Nalates Urriah said:

 

Yeah it does. Your assumption as to what I used to measure was again wrong, clueless might be more accurate. Thinking I am simple is just projection on your part.

 

I'm not suggesting you're simple. You're still using tools that are doing a lot of averaging & compressing of the data. This is fairly accurate for tasks which present a far more typical load (like games ), but not for SL due to the way the rendering is accomplished.

Games are designed for GPUs and GPUs are designed around gaming workloads, the tooling to quickly gauge performance & usage are also predicated on this assumption. SL does not present anything remotely close to an idealized gaming workload

You need profiling tools built into the viewer to get an accurate picture of what's going on, but as I have said that might not be trivial to get working. 

SL is barely managing to get your GPU out of bed except in very tiny bursts for very specific tasks at specific points during each frame.

 

The overall usage figure is more an indicator how render focused the viewer is at any given moment rather than how much work the GPU is actually doing. This is why the more stuff the viewer has to render (and the more complex the scene), the lower the overall usage gets because more of the frame loop is consumed by non rendering tasks.

I can hit 80% (120fps) on my own in an empty sky box and 25% (93fps) on the ground in Belli.

 

[Wulfie Reanimator]

On 3/12/2022 at 6:01 PM, Nalates Urriah said:

As I write there are 8 places listed with 71 to 32 people hanging out.

That's more bleak than I would've guessed.

I can only assume that's just the maximum amount they'll show, or they're excluding A-rated places, because I still see many high traffic/population sims that are mostly filled with obvious bots. (And if they were properly marked as Scripted Agents, they wouldn't count towards parcel traffic.)

Edited March 17, 2022 by Wulfie Reanimator

[cunomar]

Contemplating this , the world is a hostile place despite humans being social creatures so what brings people together .

Not talking about mass marches and burning effigy's for the right to wear odd socks , just in general through our daily lives .  School and then work obviously thrust us into a mini society in which we have no choice but to find our place but in our downtime its done at leisure .

I come from a small place with a population far larger than SL and if its mentioned in my absence that i was seen somewhere i'm pretty sure nobody ever asked "who was he with"  . I go where i go and do what i do and see who i see , friends , family and strangers most of who will greet me next time like i''m an old friend   while im doing it . In my 50 years i don't actually recall falling out with a friend barring a few punch ups that we ended up laughing about over a beer the next day .

So what is the tie that binds , or the fabric of our own little social existence , and why is it missing from SL ?

History or the lack thereof perhaps ?  RL if you don't know them you might know of them , and if you don't somebody does .

Consequence has been toted and discarded as impossible to impose in many threads but reputation requires no policing . What if previous names were listed in profiles .

The worst of the worst would sooner or later become isolated and have no choice but to start again with a new name and empty inventory .

[Robberinthemuseum]

32 minutes ago, cunomar said:

Contemplating this , the world is a hostile place despite humans being social creatures so what brings people together .

Not talking about mass marches and burning effigy's for the right to wear odd socks , just in general through our daily lives .  School and then work obviously thrust us into a mini society in which we have no choice but to find our place but in our downtime its done at leisure .

I come from a small place with a population far larger than SL and if its mentioned in my absence that i was seen somewhere i'm pretty sure nobody ever asked "who was he with"  . I go where i go and do what i do and see who i see , friends , family and strangers most of who will greet me next time like i''m an old friend   while im doing it . In my 50 years i don't actually recall falling out with a friend barring a few punch ups that we ended up laughing about over a beer the next day .

So what is the tie that binds , or the fabric of our own little social existence , and why is it missing from SL ?

History or the lack thereof perhaps ?  RL if you don't know them you might know of them , and if you don't somebody does .

Consequence has been toted and discarded as impossible to impose in many threads but reputation requires no policing . What if previous names were listed in profiles .

The worst of the worst would sooner or later become isolated and have no choice but to start again with a new name and empty inventory .

I think people know each other on multiple platforms these days and meet in SL too. I know people from flickr and these forums and I only have 2 friends I met in world 🤷‍♂️

[cunomar]

So not a second life then but rather an alternative chatroom .

The discord thing baffles me , if everyone is going to chat there then why login to sl ?

[Wulfie Reanimator]

17 minutes ago, cunomar said:

If everyone is going to chat there then why login to sl ?

Exactly.

[Polenth Yue]

My experience of Discord is that it's used to deal with some of the issues with group chat, not as a replacement for group chat. Some examples are that Discord chat remains even if you're not there, so you can ask a question and check back later for the answer. Notices aren't time limited. Also, it doesn't take a group slot, so people can juggle groups to be in the ones for active events, but remain in the Discord all year round.

In the initial build to the event, the people chatting are mainly creators and there's a big overlap in the people who use group chat and those who use Discord. You can see this going down with Fantasy Faire right now, as it's still a fair bit of time until the event for regular people, but the creators are already working. Most will be standing alone on a build grid somewhere, so chats that don't require being in a certain place are useful. As the event approaches, chat in both places will shift towards the actual stuff happening and getting people to the events within the event.

Those events could be a party, avatar chess or slowly digesting Patch in stomach acid. But whatever the event, this is when chat shifts to local. It's noticeable that people who are active in group chat and/or Discord are the ones who are most likely to turn up and talk in local. So it's not that the other things replace local. It helps people get where they need to be and means everyone else isn't a stranger when they get there.

In other words, this is a bit like refusing to use a phone or email to arrange a meeting with your friends, because you want to be talking face-to-face. Instead, you wander about and hope you'll happen to run into them. This is not likely to work very well, as the original post demonstrated.

[cunomar]

I see . So like them trendy pubs that cater to plastic wine drinkers who get paid monthly and 1 weekend in every 4 they enjoy sitting in groups staring at their phones .

When i'm someplace new i usually wander the backstreet bars , an unconscious drunk on the doorstep is usually a good sign the place has an interesting clientele 🤣