Saturation -- Too many events -- Survey of sorts

[Alwin Alcott]

I mostly skip it these days, unless i see something in the previews at seraphim that catches my attention... and that happens rarely.
In the, not so long past i visited the 3, or 4 male aimed events, but it's 99.999% more of the same now ..  i don't need a zillion t shirts or undies, or sneakers with a pinks stripe ór the whole rainbow in the huds. Mostly grabbing the good old things in inventory that i worn for years already. 

[Qie Niangao]

The Forums may be a pretty useless sample for understanding event commerce. I too find less and less I want to buy, but that's because I've seen a lot of stuff and bought what I wanted over the years, and there's just not much new that's of interest. That is to say, us oldbie Forums-users aren't necessarily the right people to ask to find out where people are spending money.

I do wonder if the increased number of events has decreased the value of items available across all events. I find (as others have mentioned) that the events most likely to have something of interest are those more targeted, where it appears to me that the creators have invested real time and imagination in maybe a single product introduced at that event. 

Also—and this is probably idiosyncratic—I just dread "seasonal" events. I didn't really realize how much I truly hate them until this past Halloween when I noticed every merchant at every event had all the same stuff. I foolishly expected things would get interesting again after the holiday, once all that junk was gone. But then it was Thanksgiving/Christmas/New Years and a whole new wave of seasonal kitsch washed over every event. Next it's Valentines. Pretty much every time there's threat of a Shop&Hop, all events get mired in the same annually-recurring sludge. There must be a market for it, but it's a huge turn-off for me.

[steeljane42]

48 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:

Also—and this is probably idiosyncratic—I just dread "seasonal" events. I didn't really realize how much I truly hate them until this past Halloween when I noticed every merchant at every event had all the same stuff. I foolishly expected things would get interesting again after the holiday, once all that junk was gone. But then it was Thanksgiving/Christmas/New Years and a whole new wave of seasonal kitsch washed over every event. Next it's Valentines. Pretty much every time there's threat of a Shop&Hop, all events get mired in the same annually-recurring sludge. There must be a market for it, but it's a huge turn-off for me.

I agree with this. And have noticed it a few years ago. Only upside is less time needed to check all those events filled with seasonal stuff. Spring seems more or less clear from that, although if count summer/beach stuff as season things too, then it starts to show up from May/June rounds already and doesn't go away until it's time to replace it with another batch of Halloween things again.

Edited January 18, 2022 by steeljane42

[Chic Aeon]

)Thank you all for your comments. 

 

Just a couple more thoughts about things mentioned so far since I have been watching this VERY closely for a long time. 

 

The "original creator mesh" events are for the most part no longer that even if original is still part of their tag line and still part of their designer rules. Many to most of even the most popular events are "overlooking" the criteria and woe be the person who reports the infringement to the event owner.  Rules have also changed to let makeup, shapes, poses, eyes etc. be acceptable.    And overall quality is down with brands and items being accepted that were never a part of the original plan.  WHY?  Because the event owners make a ton (TON) (TON) or money off of the fees.  

 

For awhile I was counting the participants in the top events. They were dropping each month along with the quality of products.  There are a few events that I am pretty sure have MANY alts making "easy to make" items as filler and STILL their booths have dropped from over a hundred Wow-I-would-like-to-get-into=that-event to around 25 look-at-everything-in-less-than-five-minutes offerings.  At $3,500 to over $10,000 a booth -- it doesn't take many ACTUAL PAYING CREATORS for the event owner to make money.   There DO seem to still be a few event companies that are doing a great job and trying to keep the quality up, but they are in the minority these days. One very popular and VERY old event is now actively advertising for applications AT THE EVENT!   Oh my.

 

The self-regulation idea has come and gone -- a failure. A few very popular events have closed but most are still chugging along in a shadow of what they originally were.  For each one that finally closes, two or three pop-up.  If there is something new and different, that is one thing. Most often they are just the same as what is already out there.  I see more and more "repeat" offerings on the sales events to boot.

 

The only positive thing I can say for the current trends is that it let's more new creators (template folks as well as original) take part in the EXPERIENCE of being in an event. This is a plus. But it is tainted somewhat by the lack of quality and effort needed to get in.  

 

As a creator I am glad I am "retired" and basically doing customer support.  I signed up to be in a couple of upcoming event company hunts, but not for exposure, just because I want folks to have something worthwhile to do.   I was in ONE event last year - a themed one, and plan to be in at least one this year LOL.    But watching the waves come in is a fine meditative activity :D. 

 

Thanks again. I'll check back.  

[Josephine Carissa]

Hi Chic,

*I hardly ever go to any events at all, ( for me the reason is 2 fold, 1. not much new, and 2. LLLLlllllllaaaaggggg and crash ).....

*there is a thread about furniture down in the Belli section that i check out daily because they post about sales by item and creator.

*there is one creator that i discovered doing something that i really liked during the 52 weeks of color challenge, they have there "promo" and "sales" items listed every week on their MP store, which makes it very easy for me to spend my lindens : ) i think that more creators should try this, ( i know that creators have to loose a % of the transaction but wouldn't that be less expensive than paying for an event?).

Josephine

 

[Ajay McDowwll]

I'll check Seraphim for the weekend sales galleries, and if I'm bored I'll hit some of the big shopping events, or if I'm in the store and see something that's been released at an event that's still ongoing, but it's not a normal part of my SL on my main.  The exception for me, as for others it seems, are the themed events like We ❤️ Roleplay, Midnight Order, etc.  I do some light RP, and finding new medieval/ fantasy options is still fun.  But most of the clothing events feature clothing that either closely mirrors things I already own, or stuff I wouldn't wear... so no thanks.

I do take my male alt to some of the men's events, because he doesn't have a ton of clothes yet (well, he does, but he doesn't).  That said, seriously, he doesn't need 50K pairs of sweatpants and sneakers.  Good grief.

[Marianne Little]

I shop too much in the weekend sales. It is so many of them. But I buy less now than in the start. I was in a frenzy and bought so much because maybe I will use it, and it is so cheap! I am sure I can't remember or find more than 1/10 of that. It was very easy to switch to the EvoX head, I could load up makeup, but how many packs of sooty eyes makeup do I need?

I have my "favorite" stores I look up every weekend, and I actually use their stuff. At least half of what I buy from them...

I have become less interested in the monthly sales, it is almost nothing to save. And why buy a single top for 288L at Collabor 88, when I can buy a similar top for 75L and with a full color HUD in the weekend? But I have a couple of C88 designers I buy from. Hair creators, original mesh clothes and the last is houses. The house creator is the only one, or one of two, that has not let the prices go up to 388, 488, 988 1288 L...

That said, I have spent thousands on one store with 50% inworld sale these days, because it looks original to me. I have not seen any clones of it.

So you can say that I buy full price, reduced price and in store sales when I find something worth it, or else I buy at the cheap weekend sale. But when it is cheap, I often buy too much.

Conclusion: I think it is more than enough weekend sales. But even if I try to hold back on shopping in the weekend, it is plenty of other people who discover them and buy up. For monthly sales, my interest is down. Events like Shop'n Hop am I trying to get the gifts from. But the in last Christmas one, I did not have time to log in and get them before it was over. Too busy in RL.

Edited January 18, 2022 by Marianne Little

[Bree Giffen]

I love events. I usually go the the established ones, not out of habit, but because they have an 'A' team of shops with things I want to look at. I also pick out a few smaller events if they have a preview gallery and I see at least one thing that looks good. The events really do help me find shops that I would have never discovered by searching in SL or the SL marketplace. A hint for creators: Include a landmark with your demos.

To answer the first post, I think what we need is a really accurate way to search for items in all events. Another way would be a curated preview where someone goes to the events and accurately shows what's there. I've seen some youtubers going through an event but the videos are usually too long and I'd get the same info going there myself. Maybe a condensed 5 minute run through an event showing all the demos? 2 minutes? My time is precious. I sense an opportunity for an ambitious youtube influencer.

[Sid Nagy]

I only visit events when I'm a bit bored and want something to do in SL.
Most of them are not worth the time. SL events seem mostly to cater for what I personally find ugly avatars.
A silly trend in SL: How can I exaggerate everything to the max so that I look as ugly as possible. They ain't selling that s*it to me in a million years.

Edited January 18, 2022 by Sid Nagy

[Leahndra]

I have stopped to rush to events during the last year as it happened more and more often that i came home empty handed. there was simply nothing of interest left, except sometimes when i found one piece of interest. Either i had something similar bought already 3 times before or it was much to short (when it came to skirts or dresses) and barely covering. I like to be more casual/classy dressed. So, i stopped end of last year to look at seraphim for the next event and end up there mostly only when i am very bored. 

I personally would like it if there would be events for the more classy look. More COCO and not Walmart. 

[Lysistrata Szapira]

1 hour ago, Leahndra said:

I personally would like it if there would be events for the more classy look. More COCO and not Walmart. 

For me, more Coco, less Hustler.  Some of the worst stuff would never be sold at Walmart, especially pubic-hair exposing jeans and shorts. 

[rasterscan]

12 hours ago, Anna Nova said:

I'm fed up of men who all look alike and start every conversation 'Hi'.... 'How are you?'....

It's just like real life ! ltns Anna, miss yew, how are you ?

[Tarani Tempest]

6 hours ago, Bree Giffen said:

Another way would be a curated preview where someone goes to the events and accurately shows what's there. I've seen some youtubers going through an event but the videos are usually too long and I'd get the same info going there myself. Maybe a condensed 5 minute run through an event showing all the demos? 2 minutes? My time is precious. I sense an opportunity for an ambitious youtube influencer.

https://www.seraphimsl.com/

[Lysistrata Szapira]

And lo and behold, yet another event is born per Seraphim this morning: Dollholic. Again, not an aesthetic for me.  More exposed pubic hair, labia floss, and bbygrl/hooker chic. *sighs*

Sex must sell in SL, but it seems like this aesthetic is going to reach oversaturation at some point.  Judging by the amount of items for this population, does a majority of SL female residents work in the sex trade? 

 

[Scylla Rhiadra]

22 minutes ago, Lysistrata Szapira said:

And lo and behold, yet another event is born per Seraphim this morning: Dollholic. Again, not an aesthetic for me.  More exposed pubic hair, labia floss, and bbygrl/hooker chic. *sighs*

Sex must sell in SL, but it seems like this aesthetic is going to reach oversaturation at some point.  Judging by the amount of items for this population, does a majority of SL female residents work in the sex trade? 

 

First of all, cool name! Is your opposition to overly-sexualized clothing and sex-workers in aid of ending a war somewhere?

From a purely personal perspective, I agree with your comments about the aesthetic of much of the clothing available for women in SL: it is hypersexualized, but much much more to the point (from my perspective), it's ugly as hell. It is entirely possible to dress in a "sexy," alluring, or even revealing manner without wearing clothing that looks it was designed by a 14 year old boy only vaguely aware of what a female body actually looks like, and with an aesthetic sense that derives from the bargain bin at a really awful discount box store.

That said, there is a difference between an aesthetic judgment, and one founded upon a moral or ethical reading of these clothes.

Are you judging the clothing makers, or those who are buying and making these? How do you distinguish between the creators, and the consumers who seem to be confirming by their purchases that this is, in fact, a look that they like?

And is the issue bad taste, or a moral response to their hypersexualized aesthetic: your comments on the "sex trade" sort of suggest the latter.

[Nalates Urriah]

On 1/17/2022 at 9:39 PM, Chris Nova said:

What market? Nothing is regulated. There's no rules. Its do whatever you want. That's why there's 565447765443366 events no matter how much people complain about it.

And guess what? Tomorrow someone is going to create ANOTHER event.... Because they can because Second Life allows it. Nobody in SL cares about oversaturation and markets. Do whatever you want. Create whatever you want. That's the whole selling point of Second Life.

That is the way a free market works. Its how new ideas evolve. Seems to work where ever it is tried.

[Chris Corvinus]

23 minutes ago, Nalates Urriah said:

That is the way a free market works. Its how new ideas evolve. Seems to work where ever it is tried.

Even a free market is self regulated. It just doesn't exist in SL which is why there's problems with over saturation.

Edited January 19, 2022 by Chris Nova

[Chris Corvinus]

1 hour ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

First of all, cool name! Is your opposition to overly-sexualized clothing and sex-workers in aid of ending a war somewhere?

From a purely personal perspective, I agree with your comments about the aesthetic of much of the clothing available for women in SL: it is hypersexualized, but much much more to the point (from my perspective), it's ugly as hell. It is entirely possible to dress in a "sexy," alluring, or even revealing manner without wearing clothing that looks it was designed by a 14 year old boy only vaguely aware of what a female body actually looks like, and with an aesthetic sense that derives from the bargain bin at a really awful discount box store.

That said, there is a difference between an aesthetic judgment, and one founded upon a moral or ethical reading of these clothes.

Are you judging the clothing makers, or those who are buying and making these? How do you distinguish between the creators, and the consumers who seem to be confirming by their purchases that this is, in fact, a look that they like?

And is the issue bad taste, or a moral response to their hypersexualized aesthetic: your comments on the "sex trade" sort of suggest the latter.

Honestly, everything in Dollholic can easily just be thrown into Kinky Event. There's zero need to create another event for that.

[Leahndra]

3 minutes ago, Chris Nova said:

Even a free market is self regulated. It just doesn't exist in SL which is why there's problems with over saturation.

Customers regulate a free market and as long they buy all those things, creators will produce and offer. I might be wrong but maybe SL is on the brink to change because the market is just ... oversaturated. We might see it at the end of 2022 maybe. 

[Chris Corvinus]

Just now, Leahndra said:

Customers regulate a free market and as long they buy all those things, creators will produce and offer. I might be wrong but maybe SL is on the brink to change because the market is just ... oversaturated. We might see it at the end of 2022 maybe. 

I highly doubt it. Might see more new events tho. Dollholic just came out so that's 1 😂

[Rowan Amore]

2 hours ago, Lysistrata Szapira said:

labia floss

Too funny and sad at the same time.  They've actually created some sort of add on that shows this to the extreme.  

[Hunny Bunny]

On 1/17/2022 at 8:55 PM, Prokofy Neva said:

People often wonder why poor folks have so many children, when they are poor. And the answer is, they are in distress, their children die in infancy, they are needed as free farm hands, etc. So in my family we might quote the Irish stories of why they have 10 children, which isn't merely because they don't believe in birth control: 3 die in infancy, 3 become alcoholics or helplessly insane, 2 must be given up to the priesthood and nunnery, that leaves 2 that might work out and support the parents in their own age.

And the real answer is, because sex is cheaper than a trip to the movies.

[Polenth Yue]

I focus on a few themed yearly events (and a couple of hunts that actually have people doing them). Fantasy Faire alone pays for most of my yearly expenses, so I don't technically need to do much after that. The monthly events look exhausting to take part in and I don't visit them often unless someone points me to a specific item.

One issue is merchants feel they must do these events, even to the point of making a big loss overall. Being told to stop taking part in events that don't make money shouldn't be a revelation, but apparently it is.

[Lysistrata Szapira]

I

2 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

First of all, cool name! Is your opposition to overly-sexualized clothing and sex-workers in aid of ending a war somewhere?

That said, there is a difference between an aesthetic judgment, and one founded upon a moral or ethical reading of these clothes.

Are you judging the clothing makers, or those who are buying and making these? How do you distinguish between the creators, and the consumers who seem to be confirming by their purchases that this is, in fact, a look that they like?

And is the issue bad taste, or a moral response to their hypersexualized aesthetic: your comments on the "sex trade" sort of suggest the latter.

Thanks!  I chose the name specifically when I joined back in 2008 specifically because SL is such a hypersexualized environment. It's kind of a test to see how many people get the reference (not many do). 

I don't have any objection to SL sex workers. Get your money however you can.  At least in this world, coercion and human trafficking isn't occurring.  I don't have any moral objections about what people do in SL for the most part.  I've got my own kinks, some of which are definitely not vanilla. 

I just object to the deluge of this style.  I have the money to spend, and I'd love to see new designers pop up, but most of the more recent original mesh stores cater to this aesthetic.   I see some really cute things at a certain feline-themed clothing store, for example, but then the crotch or boobs are on full display.  I love cute things, but not things that would get me arrested if I wore them in public in real life.   I just kind of rue the day that someone thought, "Hey, wouldn't it be a good idea if we never zipped up our pants/shorts again?".  

It would be interesting to see some numbers on how many people in SL engage in sex work vs how many just wear that type of clothing for shiz & giggles.  Stores/events wouldn't offer these items if they didn't sell. 

 

[Blaise Glendevon]

4 hours ago, Lysistrata Szapira said:

And lo and behold, yet another event is born per Seraphim this morning: Dollholic. Again, not an aesthetic for me.  More exposed pubic hair, labia floss, and bbygrl/hooker chic. *sighs*

Sex must sell in SL, but it seems like this aesthetic is going to reach oversaturation at some point.  Judging by the amount of items for this population, does a majority of SL female residents work in the sex trade? 

 

But have you considered tending to your own knitting? If you don't like the aesthetic, the simple answer is to not purchase it.