Smoking: Influencing vs Programmability

[Arielle Popstar]

2 minutes ago, Ayeleeon said:

This is true, but it is a two way street, the artist also needs to be responsible, he or she cannot say "my viewers need to be responsible so I don't have to be."

If artists start having to self censor, we would lose those artistic works that are the most provocative and motivate the viewer to think. If a portrait of a smoker smoking is disturbing then I feel the artist has accomplished his purpose. He/she has made you think.

[Sammy Huntsman]

3 minutes ago, Ayeleeon said:

This is true, but it is a two way street, the artist also needs to be responsible, he or she cannot say "my viewers need to be responsible so I don't have to be."

That is not what I was saying, everyone has to be responsible for their actions. It is just not the fault of the artist, if someone does something expressed in the photo or video. That is literally my point, if I take a photo of myself drinking at a party. It is not my responsibility to tell you not to drink, or drink in moderation. You should know that, and if you don't, it is not my fault that you drank like a fish. You need to deal with the consequences of your actions. So if you drink like a fish, then you need to deal with the consequences of a hangover or puking yourself and not blame the artist for somehow influencing you. 

[Sammy Huntsman]

2 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

If artists start having to self censor, we would lose those artistic works that are the most provocative and motivate the viewer to think. If a portrait of a smoker smoking is disturbing then I feel the artist has accomplished his purpose. He/she has made you think.

Yes this

[Shiera Kealoha]

2 minutes ago, Alwin Alcott said:

a combination with that factor is often a promess for a sooner or later locked thread.

I assume it will happen soon, since it devolved into emotional BS of "you are blaming me!!"

[LittleMe Jewell]

3 minutes ago, xLunaea said:

The question was, "does it...increase the chance that others might smoke in RL?"

IMO, I really don't think that a picture in SL is going to encourage anyone in RL to smoke.  

I personally do not think that any picture in SL will encourage anyone in RL to do anything. 

 

Then again, maybe I give people way too much credit for not being easily influenced by pictures of cartoon characters doing things in a make believe world.

 

[Sammy Huntsman]

1 minute ago, xLunaea said:

I assume it will happen soon, since it devolved into emotional BS of "you are blaming me!!"

What is going  on, is the OP wants people to self censor or be more careful what they put in their art. As they feel like it is propogating or glamorizing smoking.  We might as well get rid of art all together, because if it doesn't make you think, doesn't bring forward emotions that the artists wants. Using that imagery, then what is the point in art. 

[LittleMe Jewell]

2 minutes ago, xLunaea said:

I assume it will happen soon, since it devolved into emotional BS of "you are blaming me!!"

Not all posts that disagree with your point of view are emotional or playing any sort of blame game.

[Shiera Kealoha]

Just now, LittleMe Jewell said:

Then again, maybe I give people way too much credit for not being easily influenced by pictures of cartoon characters doing things in a make believe world.

You are giving people too much credit, considering that people are influenced by anime. You haven't heard of boys being stabbed nearly to death by their girlfriends and being okay with it? Lol, we live in crazy times. 

[Sammy Huntsman]

Just now, xLunaea said:

You are giving people too much credit, considering that people are influenced by anime. You haven't heard of boys being stabbed nearly to death by their girlfriends and being okay with it? Lol, we live in crazy times. 

You really can't blame media for that. I am sorry, if the girl stabbed the dude, there was prior ideations before she saw the anime. 

[LittleMe Jewell]

14 minutes ago, Ayeleeon said:

This is true, but it is a two way street, the artist also needs to be responsible, he or she cannot say "my viewers need to be responsible so I don't have to be."

There are some that would say that explicit sexual art work further denigrates & sexualizes women and feeds the porn addiction of men.

Should such art be restricted in SL or in the pictures posted in the forums?

Edited September 30, 2021 by LittleMe Jewell

[Istelathis]

To be fair, I remember when I quit smoking and seeing other people smoke could at times be difficult, and I would crave a cigarette.  I'm sure some people who may be trying to quit, will likewise see an avatar smoking and have that desire arise.  Seeing that picture of a cheeseburger a few posts up, legitimately lead to a desire for a cheeseburger.  

We all are influenced in one way or another, but we can not expect the rest of the world to tip toe around us in order to avoid temptation.  We need to build our tolerance to such temptations, because short of shutting out the entire world, they will always be there.

Now, I'm going to have a cheeseburger.. but it will be made from impossible meat 😜

[LittleMe Jewell]

5 minutes ago, xLunaea said:

You are giving people too much credit, considering that people are influenced by anime. You haven't heard of boys being stabbed nearly to death by their girlfriends and being okay with it? Lol, we live in crazy times. 

Possibly, but I don't think that folks should worry too much about the influence of their actions on a few crazies out there.

 

Truly, every single action that is done by anyone has the potential to negatively impact someone.  I think we should concern ourselves more with the general outcome of actions and how things we say and do impact society as a whole, rather than how it impacts the fringe cases.

Edited September 30, 2021 by LittleMe Jewell

[Arielle Popstar]

6 minutes ago, xLunaea said:

You are giving people too much credit, considering that people are influenced by anime. You haven't heard of boys being stabbed nearly to death by their girlfriends and being okay with it? Lol, we live in crazy times. 

It points out that there are those who lack the ability to self regulate. That unfortunately only comes from growing up and no amount of white knighting enablement is going to help such a person as from personal experience, some are just an addiction looking for an opportunity to manifest.

[Catrie]

I like how you're only putting smoking in pictures on blast, and not all the other multiple vices. 

Let's extend that, shall we?  If we remove smoking from pictures, we need to remove pictures that portray murder,  violence in general, sex, and anything else that people could possibly either be offended or influenced by.  What would that leave us with?  Pictures of animals and landscapes and fruit.

I grew up in the 80s surrounded by smokers.  I have had one cigarette, after work on my first job.  Didn't see the point of it then, and still don't.  I grew up with the ads of the Marlboro Man, Joe Camel, etc plastered all over TV.  Yet, that didn't make me want to smoke any more.  I also grew up with Spot the Budweiser Dog and ads full of glamorous parties making it look cool to drink.  Didn't make me take up drinking, either.

At what point does personal responsibility come into play?  Online worlds and games usually have a 13+ age rating.  When you're a teen, regardless of what you play or log into online, your parents should be aware of what you are looking at and reading anyway. Pulling this "oh, but it's bad for the children" crap is an excuse. You don't like something, fine. Don't give it a Like and move on.  Be an adult and just say " I don't like looking at pics of smoking."

Also, I find it hilarious that the person who started the whole " smoking in pics is bad" discussion in that thread is also the same one who has plastered their Flickr account with pic after pic of one of their avatar having e-sex with countless other people in game.  Those pictures are completely fine, but smoking in pictures isn't?  Okay.  Your hypocrisy is showing. 

 

[Sammy Huntsman]

Just now, Catrie said:

I like how you're only putting smoking in pictures on blast, and not all the other multiple vices. 

Let's extend that, shall we?  If we remove smoking from pictures, we need to remove pictures that portray murder,  violence in general, sex, and anything else that people could possibly either be offended or influenced by.  What would that leave us with?  Pictures of animals and landscapes and fruit.

I grew up in the 80s surrounded by smokers.  I have had one cigarette, after work on my first job.  Didn't see the point of it then, and still don't.  I grew up with the ads of the Marlboro Man, Joe Camel, etc plastered all over TV.  Yet, that didn't make me want to smoke any more.  I also grew up with Spot the Budweiser Dog and ads full of glamorous parties making it look cool to drink.  Didn't make me take up drinking, either.

At what point does personal responsibility come into play?  Online worlds and games usually have a 13+ age rating.  When you're a teen, regardless of what you play or log into online, your parents should be aware of what you are looking at and reading anyway. Pulling this "oh, but it's bad for the children" crap is an excuse. You don't like something, fine. Don't give it a Like and move on.  Be an adult and just say " I don't like looking at pics of smoking."

Also, I find it hilarious that the person who started the whole " smoking in pics is bad" discussion in that thread is also the same one who has plastered their Flickr account with pic after pic of one of their avatar having e-sex with countless other people in game.  Those pictures are completely fine, but smoking in pictures isn't?  Okay.  Your hypocrisy is showing. 

 

I grew up in the 90s, and it was the same thing. But I also had a dad, I was raised by my dad mainly. My mom was an uber alcoholic and barely took care of herself let alone me. Who taught me responsibility and accountibility.  That all being said, I dislike that we use any form of media as a scapegoat, to not take responsibility or accountability for our actions. 

[Luna Bliss]

wow...I just could not in good conscience glamorize smoking in any of my art projects:

"Cigarette smoking is responsible for more than 480,000 deaths per year in the United States, including more than 41,000 deaths resulting from secondhand smoke exposure. This is about one in five deaths annually, or 1,300 deaths every day. On average, smokers die 10 years earlier than nonsmokers".

https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_statistics/fact_sheets/fast_facts/index.htm

[Luna Bliss]

5 minutes ago, Catrie said:

plastered their Flickr account with pic after pic of one of their avatar having e-sex with countless other people in game.  Those pictures are completely fine, but smoking in pictures isn't?  Okay.  Your hypocrisy is showing.

But does e-sex cause 500,000 yearly deaths in the U.S.?

[Nick0678]

Remember kids smoking is bad for your health (also please don't act like super heroes,, you aren't.)

 

[Luna Bliss]

13 minutes ago, Istelathis said:

Now, I'm going to have a cheeseburger.. but it will be made from impossible meat 😜

lol you are doing better than me...I saw that pic and pulled some hamburger out of the freezer for tonight..

[Shiera Kealoha]

This was just supposed to be a discussion about the influence of smoking, and just smoking. I smoke IRL and still posted a picture of my character smoking a joint in the avatar thread, despite what we are talking about. *shrugs* I don't advocate for censorship and never will. But I won't deny that what people portray (including myself) can't influence someone in some way. Everyone should still obviously take accountability for their own actions, I know I do. And I'll never disagree with that.

[Luna Bliss]

17 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

There are some that would say that explicit sexual art work further denigrates & sexualizes women and feeds the porn addiction of men.

Should such art be restricted in SL or in the pictures posted in the forums?

Well, we do have restrictions relating to graphic sex and violence...

[Luna Bliss]

2 hours ago, Ayeleeon said:

Artists generally are very concerned with their content and how it affects others. Especially great artists are driven by the desire to make the World a better place. Picasso painted Guernica to protest war. Similar feelings led John Lennon to write "Imagine". The notion that artists just create in a vacuum with no regard for anything else is wrong.

You get the best comment award for the thread   

[Catrie]

2 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

But does e-sex cause 500,000 yearly deaths in the U.S.?

Can you prove that smoking in a digital world does?

What about all the drunk driving deaths that happen each year? Yet, I don't see the original post talk about alcohol abuse?

What about domestic violence deaths?  Don't see those mentioned here either. 

[Blaise Glendevon]

Oh, good. Now we're going to re-litigate the sex wars discourse of the 80s. Good deal. 

[Luna Bliss]

39 minutes ago, Blaise Glendevon said:

6 hours ago, Nalates Urriah said:

The infamous example is Nazi propaganda and censorship (aka controlled media and cancel culture).

Yes. Holding people responsible for things they say and do is just like *checks notes* genocide, forced labor, and waging war on an entire continent. 

Jesus Christ.

lol I didn't even see that...my eyes tend to glaze over when I see the word 'Nazi' on a forum.

Unbelievable...has to be the most stupid analogy on the forum I've ever seen..