Coffee Pancake Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 20 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said: The only thing the hammer has fallen on is the term "Gacha". Make false claim ... .... defend it with something different. 1 minute ago, Arielle Popstar said: "We realize that this announcement may leave the community with questions. This forum thread is going to be monitored and we will answer any related questions in there. " It’s widely known as "gacha", and is defined by a chance-based outcome as a result of a payment. The hammer has fallen. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowan Amore Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 28 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said: Make false claim ... .... defend it with something different. It’s widely known as "gacha", and is defined by a chance-based outcome as a result of a payment. The hammer has fallen. I also didn't see a question. Opinions, yes. Any questions lately are just a rehash of questions already ask. Some answered, some not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finite Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said: It sounds like you're basing your whole argument on what happened when you got very lucky while pulling at prices that are about a third of normal. Here's the shopping guide for the last Arcade event. Note that most of the clothing was $75 per pull; also note how often matching sets are split. http://thearcadesl.com/shopping-guides/june-2021/ Eek yes a bunch of those I wouldn't recommend playing. Cheezu is normally very reasonable ( i have a couple of their gacha sets) and Luas are fun to play if you're into those sort of outfits. Black Nest normally has a flat rate fatpack option. I only have one rare from them. It was the only thing I wanted of the set. So I bought it from the MP rather than play it. Edit: Actually I bought 2 since it was mod and I could "break" one and still have a backup. A few of the others I am a bit disappointed since I like their main stores and they don't seem to use a similar gouging model when selling their usual stuff. Edited August 9, 2021 by Finite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muffinstuff Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 (edited) In my opinion, Gachas are no different than purchasing a key to unlock a loot crate. They employ tactics used in free to play mobile games. I've never minded them, but let's not deceive ourselves. They're addictive by design. Edited August 9, 2021 by Muffinstuff 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennie Ling Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 It seems rather simple, same as they did with the EA Sports Loot boxes. Make a gacha machine that requires people to pay and it tells them what item they get.., and if they wish to proceed, they get it, and if not.., they get the money back (with for example a 24h ban to use the same gacha machine again?). That way people know exactly what they get., and it's no longer gambling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelina Sinclair Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 On 8/6/2021 at 6:01 PM, Kyau Brodie said: Happy to see some creators already working on the new conveyor vendors! Now I don't have to buy a fatpack for 3000L of 20 dogs just to get 1 dog for 50L. If the one you want isn't coming up, just get it from a reseller. Let's imagine for a moment this replaces gacha and becomes the new trend. Here's what is going to happen: Shoppers will look at the array of 11 items and see no rares or colors they like and move on. Shoppers will notice a color they like and do the mental math and decide if it is worth it. Shoppers will notice that there is a rare and spend wildly to get it so they can resell it or enjoy it. (mostly resell it) ^This is what you think will happen. Let me tell you what will really happen. 1) Gacha Sellers who try this system with the basic Gacha scripts will see a sharp decline in sales because no one cares about teal, green, random pastel color, etc. Sales will drop but they will get a little something. It will be a flop until a savy scripter comes along and changes the game. 2) Next iteration of this will involved rares showing very frequently. Maybe after 3-5 purchases it will pop up at the end of the train almost requiring you to purchase it cause what idiot is gonna leave a 3,000L gacha item when the price to invest for it is only 500-750L or whatever. Oddly enough you'll only see 1 rare item ever in a train until it is purchased. Hm it is almost like it knows to not drop a second one... anyway! Vendors start making about what they use to. This will catch on until....! Suddenly there is too many rares popping up in the 3rd party market of sales. Suddenly that 3k item will drop in price to like 1500 or 1,000 cause everyone can get it and now sell it. Some resellers won't like that and will avoid Vendors who are known to drop a ton of rares, hurting that Vendor's sales. It'll be tough to figure out the perfect balance, frustrating Vendors over time. 3) Next iteration comes out and now the Conveyor Belts will conveniently recycle its contents. Those 10 items you see there? Yeah they will just re-roll them all again after the vendor was left alone for 5-10mins. It would be advertised as the new Lucky Chairs! A new way to boost traffic sales! Now if customers aren't getting the rare they want they can wait for it to recycle and see if it pops up or after a few pulls it finally drops and you know, you know... it will be tracking who is around it and how long they've been standing there. You know... cause innocent naive reasons. 4) The 3rd and final iteration will be birth once customers start complaining about having to wait so long. They hate it, don't like and wish the darn thing will recycle itself when they want it to! Well jolly good! Boy do we have the solution for you! You can PAY to reroll and bonus, it'll even increase the chances of a rare to pop up! If it doesn't, pay again and it'll be even higher! It'll totally not feel like a slot machine and hey, you know, you don't to pay to re-roll them, you can always wait... but who will do that, hm? Alternative the nicer ones might let you turn in unwanted gachas for a chance to re-roll it and in doing so they help control the marketplace prices so there is less of the same thing for sale and the prices for them are higher up. They say this is a nice thing they do, to not be predatory like the others but you still gonna be paying cash money either to the reseller or them, regardless. ----------------------------------- There you have it. My predictions for the conveyor belt system over the next year or so. Aren't I evil? 2 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimmi Zehetbauer Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 And that "MiePon" device is the stupidest looking thing I've seen. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rei Waifu Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 I'm almost tempted to say "let the new system through" just so those foolish enough to use them get burnt and hopefully regret advocating for this system. You know the old adage "Be careful what you wish for" 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Mistwalker Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, Aria Fae said: I'm almost tempted to say "let the new system through" just so those foolish enough to use them get burnt and hopefully regret advocating for this system. You know the old adage "Be careful what you wish for" I reached that point around page 10. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beth Macbain Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 5 hours ago, Dictatorshop said: I have my own stuff to sell that I made myself, why would I want to become somebody else's reseller? And, lord, we thank you for that. Not for not becoming a reseller, but for the stuff you make... rubs her sore bottom... Ds makes some of the highest quality (and most fun!) stuff on the grid. This creator sure as hell doesn't need to scrape together a few thousand Lindens by selling hyper-inflated "rares" on the MP. *this is not a paid endorsement Do I have this conveyor thing right? I walk up to a machine that has 10 items in it. I want item #1, but the only item I can buy is #3. #1 may or may not pop up for sale after I, or some other schmuck, buys #3. Am I missing something? I want to buy a thing and the machine won't allow me to buy the thing I want unless I buy things I don't want first? And even then there is no guarantee that the thing I want will ever actually pop up for sale? Oh hell no. This is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever heard. Is it going to be allowed? Apparently. Why in every single hell would anyone think this is a good selling tactic, though? What is enticing about this? Just sell me the damn thing I want, and since I'm not focused on one single machine, I might even look around the shop and find more things I want to buy. Any creator that employs this goofy system will never, ever see a single L$ from me. Make quality shizz. Put a fair price tag on it. Sell item. Anything else is just a ploy to foist off low quality merch on people with poor impulse control. grumbles and goes to climb back into her Port Royal bed 11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finite Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 11 minutes ago, Aria Fae said: I'm almost tempted to say "let the new system through" just so those foolish enough to use them get burnt and hopefully regret advocating for this system. You know the old adage "Be careful what you wish for" Yes kind of like telling gacha creators to sell their complete sets at a flat rate. Be careful what you wish for. 3 hours ago, Aria Fae said: you want to see creator greed .... one of the stores that i bought from (not sure whether i will in the future) is selling fatpacks of gachas for 10k .... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Huntsman Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Beth Macbain said: Do I have this conveyor thing right? I walk up to a machine that has 10 items in it. I want item #1, but the only item I can buy is #3. #1 may or may not pop up for sale after I, or some other schmuck, buys #3. Am I missing something? I want to buy a thing and the machine won't allow me to buy the thing I want unless I buy things I don't want first? And even then there is no guarantee that the thing I want will ever actually pop up for sale? Oh hell no. This is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever heard. Is it going to be allowed? Apparently. Why in every single hell would anyone think this is a good selling tactic, though? What is enticing about this? Just sell me the damn thing I want, and since I'm not focused on one single machine, I might even look around the shop and find more things I want to buy. Any creator that employs this goofy system will never, ever see a single L$ from me. Make quality shizz. Put a fair price tag on it. Sell item. Anything else is just a ploy to foist off low quality merch on people with poor impulse control. You have it right, and you are certainly right on it's stupidity. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Huntsman Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 3 hours ago, Aria Fae said: you want to see creator greed .... one of the stores that i bought from (not sure whether i will in the future) is selling fatpacks of gachas for 10k .... I mean there is one store, that sells her fatpack of skins for 15k. But this is the thing, I have bought fatpacks of skins with the same or more skin colours at a lower price. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muffinstuff Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 29 minutes ago, Beth Macbain said: Make quality shizz. Put a fair price tag on it. Sell item. Anything else is just a ploy to foist off low quality merch on people with poor impulse control. Gacha! That's capitalism. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Davros Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Beth Macbain said: And, lord, we thank you for that. Not for not becoming a reseller, but for the stuff you make... rubs her sore bottom... Ds makes some of the highest quality (and most fun!) stuff on the grid. This creator sure as hell doesn't need to scrape together a few thousand Lindens by selling hyper-inflated "rares" on the MP. *this is not a paid endorsement Do I have this conveyor thing right? I walk up to a machine that has 10 items in it. I want item #1, but the only item I can buy is #3. #1 may or may not pop up for sale after I, or some other schmuck, buys #3. Am I missing something? I want to buy a thing and the machine won't allow me to buy the thing I want unless I buy things I don't want first? And even then there is no guarantee that the thing I want will ever actually pop up for sale? Oh hell no. This is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever heard. Is it going to be allowed? Apparently. Why in every single hell would anyone think this is a good selling tactic, though? What is enticing about this? Just sell me the damn thing I want, and since I'm not focused on one single machine, I might even look around the shop and find more things I want to buy. Any creator that employs this goofy system will never, ever see a single L$ from me. Make quality shizz. Put a fair price tag on it. Sell item. Anything else is just a ploy to foist off low quality merch on people with poor impulse control. grumbles and goes to climb back into her Port Royal bed Alternative: go to buy from a shop that fit for you , simple and easy!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollymews Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said: Gacha racks up the cash as you don't think about how much it might actually cost to get the item, it's a flutter and every roll has the same chance .. at least you hope. Conveyor invites you ponder, to do the math and wait. It's chilling, there is no way these will take off. I don't even feel inclined to browse them. i suspect that you are right. A display queue of 11 is one of those things that operators think wow! that will be cool. I am going to make my customers really happy to play this, as a thing at L$20 a pull say, costs $20 to pull the 12th item into the view. Then $220 more to get that item assuming we want it. So minimum spend is L$240 to get the 12th item, and we get 11 other items as well, some of which will be the same as the others when the 12th item is not what we want then L$20 a pull til it is. And up it goes $260, $280, $300 and so on and on the other end, when there is an item in the queue that we want then minimum spend L$20. Then upwards: $40, $60, $80 and so on upto L$220 a 11 item display queue at L$100 a pull is minimum spend $1200 to secure the 12th item. A 3 item queue. At L$50 a pull costs L$200 to get the 4th item. If not wanted then $250, $300, $350, etc people can ordinarily work all this out, but as you say there is a tediousness to it. And for the casual shopper it all starts to feel like hard work so i think that what will happen is that the long queue machines won't be 'random'. What these machine algorithms will do is put a not-a-common into the last queue position on a non-random basis on the first pull of each new player, the hook a byproduct of the hook mechanic is that the length of the queue plus the pull price will effectively set an indicative minimum reseller price for the not a common items there are pluses and minuses in all of this for shopkeepers, buyers and resellers from their respective povs. And I am not sure where this is all going to end up. But I do think it is going to be tedious to get to the end, where ever that end is Edited August 9, 2021 by Mollymews 240 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maryanne Solo Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 ->>> "Rares" <<<-👀 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionalein Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Mollymews said: a byproduct of the hook mechanic is that the length of the queue plus the pull price will effectively set an indicative minimum reseller price for the not a common items On the pro side commons will be cheaper the dozen. I expect them to appear as low as one digit sales items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollymews Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Fionalein said: On the pro side commons will be cheaper the dozen. I expect them to appear as low as one digit sales items. yes. The longer the queue, the less the pull price I would think is where this will up. So customers who are happy to get any common of a complete object will benefit from lower pull prices. Which is a plus for that customer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollymews Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 14 minutes ago, Maryanne Solo said: ->>> "Rares" <<<-👀 some of the gacha machines don't do plain old rares anymore, rares are sooo common they have Not-A-Common Rares, A-Little-More-Not-So-Common Rares, A-Lot-More-Not-So-Common Rares and Totally-Not-A-Common Rares 😸 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maryanne Solo Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 I like my gachas done rare please. Dripping with blood having been ripped straight from the original creators heart. ❤️ 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nathkyo Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 so I have an ideea . what if the gotcha machines were free they can be used for a daily item ggiver or in the case of some stores maybe as a extra for purchassing an item you would get the value of the item such as going to a hair store purchasinng a new hair and that hair coming with a free token to use for thee gotcha machine to get another hair randomly. Items could still bbe transferable because because it's merely a freee extra randomly selected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollymews Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 6 hours ago, Fionalein said: I see you never played for a cottage gacha with common fencing pieces... i think long queue conveyors will benefit these kinds of product sets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Pancake Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 1 minute ago, nathkyo said: so I have an ideea . what if the gotcha machines were free they can be used for a daily item ggiver or in the case of some stores maybe as a extra for purchassing an item you would get the value of the item such as going to a hair store purchasinng a new hair and that hair coming with a free token to use for thee gotcha machine to get another hair randomly. Items could still bbe transferable because because it's merely a freee extra randomly selected. Buying a product to buy a roll of a random chance machine is against the rules. It's just gacha with an extra step. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollymews Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 7 minutes ago, Maryanne Solo said: I like my gachas done rare please. Dripping with blood having been ripped straight from the original creators heart. ❤️ wheres the eep button 😺 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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