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Jeff Bezos Space Tourist


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Just now, Innula Zenovka said:
16 minutes ago, Moondira said:

True, there are some who did not inherit their wealth. Not sure of the percentage who did.

I would have to add though, that it is the exploitation of the worker-bees that allow their wealth.

I would have said that it's mostly simple good fortune, whether that's the good fortune of having inherited valuable assets from their parents, or of having formed a company the value of which subsequently became huge, or (like Soros and many more of the super rich) of gambling huge sums of their own and their clients' money and making more good bets than bad ones.

An important point -- simple luck. And of course I don't agree that luck for some people should allow others to live in abject poverty.

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1 minute ago, Moondira said:

My life situation is beside the point, and this is also an ignorant way to frame your argument.

I champion the poor and dispossessed in our world who deserve better. A minimum wage would be a start, yet the wealthy have frequently opposed providing a living wage to large segments of our population.

The issues facing the poor are not caused by the wealthy but by the government. We don't need more laws, we need to remove regulations that make it harder for individuals to start businesses, and laws that prevent truly affordable housing. 

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1 minute ago, Ayeleeon said:
6 minutes ago, Moondira said:

My life situation is beside the point, and this is also an ignorant way to frame your argument.

I champion the poor and dispossessed in our world who deserve better. A minimum wage would be a start, yet the wealthy have frequently opposed providing a living wage to large segments of our population.

The issues facing the poor are not caused by the wealthy but by the government. We don't need more laws, we need to remove regulations that make it harder for individuals to start businesses, and laws that prevent truly affordable housing. 

The wealthy own the government and influence laws to favor themselves. At least where I live.

I don't know of any solution other than taxing them at the rate we did during the New Deal so that the poor have more of a share. It seems they don't allow that however unless the country pretty much collapses to a degree that threatens their wealth, as it did during the Great Depression.

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4 hours ago, Ayeleeon said:

NASA shoots off a rocket and everyone gets all.giddy about progress for the human race. A private individual does that same thing and everyone is up in arms about extravagance and wasted resources. That right there is what is wrong with the world today.

No. These things are not the same at all.

NASA is openly publicly funded. They do a tremendous amount of very important work and science. NASA is our collective desire for a better world and we share the fruits if their labor. Try the NASA website sometime, you can loose weeks of you life, and that's just the tip of the iceberg. 

Jeffums Bozos is a billionaire who forces his employees to work in horrific conditions explicitly to divorce him, personally, from the realities and responsibilities of our shared human existence. Every penny he has is off the back of someone else who just had their warehouses job's "wellness booth" removed. His net worth is 10 times NASA's annual budget. His rocket project is secretive, they do no science, they share nothing and try to get NASA contracts without being entirely honest about conflicts of interest.

Jayf Bunzo is a parasite.

But somehow, all you noticed was they both have rockets.

Edited by Coffee Pancake
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17 minutes ago, Moondira said:

An important point -- simple luck. And of course I don't agree that luck for some people should allow others to live in abject poverty.

Luck -- that is, the mathematics of probability and/or karma, depending on how you look at it -- will do as it does.

Governments, on the other hand, certainly should do something to ameliorate the conditions of those who live in abject poverty and do their best to avert the circumstances poverty is likely to arise, but that's different. 

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4 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

No. These things are not the same at all.

NASA is openly publicly funded. They do a tremendous amount of very important work and science. NASA is our collective desire for a better world and we share the fruits if their labor. Try the NASA website sometime, you can loose weeks of you life, and that's just the tip of the iceberg. 

Jeffums Bozos is a billionaire who forces his employees to work in horrific conditions explicitly to divorce him, personally, from the realities and responsibilities of our shared human existence. Every penny he has is off the back of someone else who just had their warehouses job's "wellness booth" removed. His net worth is 10 times NASA's annual budget. His rocket project is secretive, they do no science, they share nothing and try to get NASA contracts without being entirely honest about conflicts of interest.

Jayf Bunzo is a parasite.

But somehow, all you noticed was they both have rockets.

He is so wealthy because investors want to buy shares in his company, and they want to buy shares in his company because so many of us would rather enjoy the convenience of Amazon, despite the way Bezos treats his employees, than do  without them,  just as we willingly turn a blind eye to working conditions in China, Vietnam, Bangladesh, and so many other places from which the goods we buy on Amazon and the high street originate.

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10 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Jeffums Bozos is a billionaire who forces his employees to work in horrific conditions explicitly to divorce him, personally, from the realities and responsibilities of our shared human existence. Every penny he has is off the back of someone else who just had their warehouses job's "wellness booth" removed. His net worth is 10 times NASA's annual budget. His rocket project is secretive, they do no science, they share nothing and try to get NASA contracts without being entirely honest about conflicts of interest.

Jayf Bunzo is a parasite.

But somehow, all you noticed was they both have rockets.

I do wonder how often those who so much complain about places like Amazon, Walmart etc also use them for much of their shopping needs. Myself I have never bought anything from Amazon mostly because I do try to buy Canadian whenever possible and not so much out of principle against either of those 2 employers. My brother does work for Amazon and to be honest, the rate of pay is pretty much equivalent for that type of work in the area. Bezos has made a lot of money regardless of how much he pays workers but there is plenty of other companies who pay similar and yet the owners of those companies are not flush with cash so I would say Jeff has maximized his profit in other ways.

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20 minutes ago, Innula Zenovka said:

He is so wealthy because investors want to buy shares in his company, and they want to buy shares in his company because so many of us would rather enjoy the convenience of Amazon, despite the way Bezos treats his employees, than do  without them,  just as we willingly turn a blind eye to working conditions in China, Vietnam, Bangladesh, and so many other places from which the goods we buy on Amazon and the high street originate.

We don't turn a blind eye as opposed to simply not having a choice.

Want any modern electronic device, guess those children better go dig up some cobalt.

Recycle anything, like ever? .. guess the third world better be ready for container loads of "recyclable" goods.

Food , plastics, electronics, movies, video games, stationary, toiletries, furniture, bicycles, clothing, shoes, cutlery, practically everything in your house that's been made in the last 20 years and the entire supply chains that have supported their manufacture.

Shopping at Amazon or Wallyworld is the least egregious part of the whole mess.

 

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4 hours ago, Bree Giffen said:

I think it's a good thing that these billionaires are advancing technology for space travel. In the past billionaires just spent money on super yachts.

After thinking about this, with Bezos and Branson their rockets essentially are the new super yacht. They do nothing to advance technology and have no practical use. They're super expensive thrill rides for the obscenely rich.

SpaceX on the other hand is actually building rockets that to useful things very well. At least Musk got something right.

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14 hours ago, Anna Nova said:

Did anyone else watch Jeff Bezos become a space tourist.  I was honestly quite amazed that anyone would want to pay that much for an experience that lasted 10 minutes.

The world is full of lunatics.  I think we need to accelerate climate change, and have some more pandemics.

And the stupid man had the temerity NOT to use a proper fossil-fuel!

I'm concerned that each rocket launch harms the ozone layer. A Belarusian scientist interested in creating environmentally-conscious transportation has done the calculations, and it's alarming. It means if there is a plan to launch garbage into space, or launch industrial operations with robots into space, which are conceived by some to deal with earth's pollution, you have to factor in this launch destruction.

It also seems like a shameful waste of money in a world of hunger and lack of COVID care and vaccines.

Having said that, the Ben 'n Jerry's hysteria from MOVEON about how we must "tax" Bezos/Amazon some way differently than they are taxed already, enabling them to have some havens, is just socialist twaddle. Tycoons should be encouraged to give to charity more, and the older ones do. In fairness, as has been mentioned, Bezos, who is now the richest man on earth, correct? -- has donated millions to charity like "Feeding America". It's Google that should do more than just fund more opportunities to use their product with broadband schemes and Brin's disease research.

 

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12 minutes ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Tycoons should be encouraged to give to charity more, and the older ones do. In fairness, as has been mentioned, Bezos, who is now the richest man on earth, correct? -- has donated millions to charity like "Feeding America". 

Scraps from the tables of ultra wealthy is not a systemic solution to systemic problems.

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5 hours ago, Ayeleeon said:

The issues facing the poor are not caused by the wealthy but by the government. We don't need more laws, we need to remove regulations that make it harder for individuals to start businesses, and laws that prevent truly affordable housing. 

Hmm. Deregulation already happened in the 80s. It's mostly to blame for the widening gap in wealth today in the US. During this same period, prices have gone up while wages stayed stagnant. People griped about a raise in minimum wage to 15 from 7.50. Which was less than what minimum wage was in the 60s factoring inflation (works out to about $12).

We need more deregulation? Trickle down economics only works in theory. It's failed miserably in practice.

A small business hits big in todays economics and gets bought out or drowned out by the big guys. Or it goes public and ends up cutting corners or the people that made it successful to begin with. Customers pay more, employees get paid less while executives and investors milk it for whatever it's worth.

Edited by Finite
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I suppose if I had a billion I'd go on a space trip too (though would want more than 10 minutes :S). I just don't know why we all need to know he went? It's like when you get stories about some hedge fund manager who spends £300,000 on a meal and drinks. Why do we need to know?

I know it's their money and they can do what they want with it, but I think it's bad taste and insensitive to flaunt it, especially when so many are scared for their jobs, and after all the lockdowns. 

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4 hours ago, Finite said:

Trickle down economics

That is the theory that if you let the rich make money it will eventually help the poor and middle class, that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about removing the barriers that keep the middle class and poor from being able to start businesses and help themselves.

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26 minutes ago, Ayeleeon said:

That is the theory that if you let the rich make money it will eventually help the poor and middle class, that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about removing the barriers that keep the middle class and poor from being able to start businesses and help themselves.

https://www.economist.com/leaders/1997/07/31/for-profit-medicine

Rise-of-College-Tuition_Datastream-1.jpg

 

I don't know what to add. I've felt it's as if someone decided "let's do all the things that will make life hell and destroy peace, stability, prosperity, and goodwill among peoples. Let's lie about what we're doing, going to great lengths to gain confidence or strongarm or use extralegal tactics. Let's kill the soil, the air, the birds, the bees, the bats, the butterflies, the abzu, the hope for balance with nature. Let's do this really gradually, let's apply behavioral psychology. Let's play a long game and give no ground. Let's basically act like it's a slow-burn civil war and let's shout down anyone who points this out.

Everyone in the world can see this happening, it's as plain as day, and yet they're culpably silent. That's been the way of things. They just can't imagine why any controversy would be worth being socially awkward. Surely pleasant conversations to the exclusion of reality is the only way to live, what could possibly go wrong?

Edited by Chroma Starlight
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1 hour ago, Chroma Starlight said:

https://www.economist.com/leaders/1997/07/31/for-profit-medicine

Rise-of-College-Tuition_Datastream-1.jpg

 

I don't know what to add. I've felt it's as if someone decided "let's do all the things that will make life hell and destroy peace, stability, prosperity, and goodwill among peoples. Let's lie about what we're doing, going to great lengths to gain confidence or strongarm or use extralegal tactics. Let's kill the soil, the air, the birds, the bees, the bats, the butterflies, the abzu, the hope for balance with nature. Let's do this really gradually, let's apply behavioral psychology. Let's play a long game and give no ground. Let's basically act like it's a slow-burn civil war and let's shout down anyone who points this out.

Everyone in the world can see this happening, it's as plain as day, and yet they're culpably silent. That's been the way of things. They just can't imagine why any controversy would be worth being socially awkward. Surely pleasant conversations to the exclusion of reality is the only way to live, what could possibly go wrong?

It isn't just college that has gone up in price. It's literally everything.

 

1 hour ago, Ayeleeon said:

That is the theory that if you let the rich make money it will eventually help the poor and middle class, that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about removing the barriers that keep the middle class and poor from being able to start businesses and help themselves.

No, the theory has nothing to do with helping anyone. It's the top make more and since they are making more the people working hard and not asking for handouts below them make more since the top can afford to pay more. In practice, the top makes more and the people working hard and also not asking for handouts make less while paying higher prices for things we need.

Which barriers are you referring to? The US has never been more deregulated than it is now. It's probably the one of the least regulated of the western world. You know what is a barrier? Living paycheck to paycheck, working full time paying off  house, student loans and everything else while paying more for the everyday things that we need. Some people don't even dream of owning a house anymore. That used to be a regular thing in the States. Get a house,  start a family, live happily blah blah and all that. Now its go to school, pay off debt until you're like 40, then maybe buy house with all that credit we built up. Then spend the rest of our days paying off that.

 

Edited by Finite
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