Are we all being too nice ?

[FairreLilette]

9 hours ago, Polenth Yue said:

The times I've said something about anything like this on the forums, it's never ended with anyone apologising. Usually people telling me I'm wrong and then mods deleting it all (but often not the comments that started it, as the moderators only really deal with outright insults). Most times, I just keep quiet, because the original comments hurt less than the way people respond.

What do you mean by "something like this" on the forums?

My concern was genuine and still is.  I am sorry if others mis-read what I wrote.  I am not the first one to say something about these scorn laughs in particular and I doubt I will be the last.  But, my concern was genuine regarding people, age had nothing to do with my reasoning. 

[LittleMe Jewell]

5 hours ago, AdminGirl said:

 

She has since corrected herself.

Yes, that makes it all better for those she insulted

[Rowan Amore]

10 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Yes, that makes it all better for those she insulted

And I didn't see an apology either.  Not that I'd expect one at this point.

[AdminGirl]

9 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Yes, that makes it all better for those she insulted

No, my post was to highlight what I think she meant, which was that she was first talking about children and their interactions with their parents. Then she went on a separate thought about people with conditions. They were not one and the same. Her reference to children was not her reference to those with conditions - they were separate and were not meant to be used as comparisons. Unless she said something else offensive that I missed. Anyway, I'm done. You guys fight it out.

[Arielle Popstar]

Just seems to me it is the non autistics who are still stewing about this. Give it up already.

[Luna Bliss]

12 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

And I didn't see an apology either.  Not that I'd expect one at this point.

Look, you guys have been after Fairre for months (some people for years even) -- scorn-laughing her, trying to make her feel stupid because she sometimes is not clear with her wording or goes off-topic.  I'm afraid you're not going to find a scapegoat in her this time -- give it up -- go find someone else to rail against so you can bond your little clique.

Rowan, you would not believe how bad it was for her before. They even took her forum photo here and altered it, then reposted, just to mock her. I could go on. Should someone who sometimes doesn't speak clearly or goes off-topic (according to our standards, right?) be belittled in this way?

[Luna Bliss]

10 hours ago, Polenth Yue said:

It's hard for someone marginalised to come forward and say something is hurtful. It's difficult to get across that even if something seems small or unintentional, it's something that happens constantly. It's the difference between one pin sticking in you and a thousand. Linking one group with another group by just happening to always mention them in the same context is one of the classics.

I had a job working with autistic people and have a deep affinity with them. There is nothing wrong with pointing out that they are one of the marginalized groups in society along with a list of other marginalized groups, and children are included in this list. All marginalized groups deserve a certain amount of protection tailored individually to their skills and abilities because they typically have less power in society and so are at a disadvantage.

As Fairre pointed out, new people coming to the forum are deserving of protection too. I wouldn't call them a marginalized group exactly, but they are definitely at a disadvantage in terms of power because regular forum members know the ropes, know what is acceptable or not. All people coming to a new situation are in a more vulnerable state, and this is why we typically welcome new people and aren't as harsh when they transgress boundaries as we're aware they simply lack knowledge in many cases. Likewise, we make exceptions for those who do not have English as their first language and attempt to make sure this is not adding to the problem when it appears they transgressed boundaries. There's so many situations I could cite where sensitive people realize they have are at an advantage and so cut others a little slack.

Fairre was trying to point out that new users of the forum could be confused or offended by some emoticons. People didn't seem to get it, and I believe it's because some regular users of the forum don't understand or won't admit to the greater power they have simply by being regular forum users. Plus a clique typically likes to wield their power by ousting others from the group.

Anyway, Fairre proceeded to list others who have less power in society -- children, those with autism. Via this list she was attempting to get people to see that indeed there is a power difference between new forum members and more established ones. She never said autistic individuals are like children in the way some are interpreting it here.

Edited June 26, 2021 by Luna Bliss

[Silent Mistwalker]

[AdminGirl]

1 hour ago, FairreLilette said:

My concern was genuine and still is.  I am sorry if others mis-read what I wrote. 

 

Well there is an apology but it's probably not to the standard of this crowd. Her post was not meant in the way that others interpreted, which she tried to convey. She then tried to correct her wording, but was not good enough. So I'm sure this apology will be nit-picked with faults and how wrongly worded it is. Semantics at this point.

[Solar Legion]

Par for the course with that one.

[Luna Bliss]

1 minute ago, AdminGirl said:

1 hour ago, FairreLilette said:

My concern was genuine and still is.  I am sorry if others mis-read what I wrote. 

 

Well there is an apology but it's probably not to the standard of this crowd. Her post was not meant in the way that others interpreted, which she tried to convey. She then tried to correct her wording, but was not good enough. So I'm sure this apology will be nit-picked with faults and how wrongly worded it is. Semantics at this point.

The point is, they want someone for the kill. That's how an ill clique bonds...by excluding others.

[Luna Bliss]

11 hours ago, Jordan Whitt said:

We all remember how well that went for BangU...

 

[Arielle Popstar]

No children here but certainly some childishness expressed by the get off my lawn types..

[Luna Bliss]

I remember when someone on the forum said something good about Fairre during the time she was being mercilessly bullied, and then removed it. I messaged her privately and asked why she removed it. She said she was afraid her friends that were berating Fairre wouldn't like the fact that she said something good about her. Apparently there was behind the scenes stuff going on, just to scapegoat Fairre.

This person felt ashamed by her actions and left the forum not long after.

[Ceka Cianci]

7 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

No children here but certainly some childishness expressed by the get off my lawn types..

I just had to see if there was a song about it and found one.. hehehe

 

[Luna Bliss]

13 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

No children here but certainly some childishness expressed by the get off my lawn types..

I might accept (just a tiny bit) the young guys who haven't realized that conquering and domination are sick behaviors.

It's the women in their 50's and 60's on the forum involved in this dynamic that disgust me.

[Orwar]

22 minutes ago, AdminGirl said:

Well there is an apology but it's probably not to the standard of this crowd.

   No, it certainly isn't. "I'm sorry if you took offense to my outrageously offensive statement, but I stand by it" isn't an apology.

[Luna Bliss]

5 minutes ago, Orwar said:

29 minutes ago, AdminGirl said:

Well there is an apology but it's probably not to the standard of this crowd.

   No, it certainly isn't. "I'm sorry if you took offense to my outrageously offensive statement, but I stand by it" isn't an apology.

You should apologize for attacking others, like that poor woman who simply likes to post her photos at an angle, causing you to to gang up in a group and mock her mercilessly..

Again, attempting to conquer and dominate others, making fun of them, is sick behavior.

Edited June 26, 2021 by Luna Bliss

[Rowan Amore]

36 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Look, you guys have been after Fairre for months (some people for years even) -- scorn-laughing her, trying to make her feel stupid because she sometimes is not clear with her wording or goes off-topic.  I'm afraid you're not going to find a scapegoat in her this time -- give it up -- go find someone else to rail against so you can bond your little clique.

Rowan, you would not believe how bad it was for her before. They even took her forum photo here and altered it, then reposted, just to mock her. I could go on. Should someone who sometimes doesn't speak clearly or goes off-topic (according to our standards, right?) be belittled in this way?

I've done none of that.  I corrected YOUR post.  Said that there were no children here.  She finally acknowledged that she did say what I quoted yet did not apologize.  She apologized if people misinterprete what was said.  Putting it on us for somehow not reading between the lines.  What I have not seen from her or you, is an apology for what was ACTUALLY said or from you jumping on people for reading exactly what she wrote and being annoyed.

As I mentioned, I've been adult enough to apologize in private and public when there is a misunderstanding.  We should all be.

 

[FairreLilette]

57 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

And I didn't see an apology either.  Not that I'd expect one at this point.

I worded it the way I did because me nor anyone in this thread has said autistic people are children or like children or should be compared to children.  I'd say a good 90% of people involved in SL are good people and do not think that way regarding autistic people.  There could be a bad 10% who might grief on them or you or me for whatever reasons they want to grief, but I am not trying to cause grief to anyone here.  

[Rowan Amore]

12 minutes ago, Orwar said:

   No, it certainly isn't. "I'm sorry if you took offense to my outrageously offensive statement, but I stand by it" isn't an apology.

It was more of a sorry YOU mistook what I actually said for what I meant to say.

Exactly the type of misunderstanding proclaimed comes from the reaction buttons.

Anyway, some people will only see their version of reality and nothing will dissuade them.

[AdminGirl]

23 minutes ago, Orwar said:

   No, it certainly isn't. "I'm sorry if you took offense to my outrageously offensive statement, but I stand by it" isn't an apology.

That's fair. I only made my comment because I didn't interpret her posts that way.

@FairreLilette I think I know what you meant, but for everyone else's benefit, you could apologise for wrongly wording your thoughts?

Anyway seriously, I'm not enjoying this anymore so have fun people.

[FairreLilette]

17 minutes ago, AdminGirl said:

wrongly wording your thoughts

I am sorry for wrongly wording my thoughts.  

[Orwar]

4 minutes ago, AdminGirl said:

I think I know what you meant, but for everyone else's benefit, you could apologise for wrongly wording your thoughts?

   You'll have to forgive my autistic nit-pickiness, but that's not how an apology works either. 

   But it doesn't really matter (to me, anyway), as the appropriate measures have been taken and the person in question can be as offensive or falsely apologetic as they want to; neither of it is going to reach me - so as far as I'm concerned, this tangent may quite readily be relegated to the past tense. 

   So - on topic: No, I don't think we're being 'too nice'. 

[Rowan Amore]

34 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

 

*

Edited June 26, 2021 by Rowan Amore
Posted before seeing the apology