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As far as complexity goes, I've achieved some shockingly low complexities with Maitreya as long as I don't wear jewelry (which is a whole other kettle of fish and affects all bodies). I'm often under 30K and sometimes under 20K even when fully dressed. I used Freya before this, and while I liked some aspects of it better, it was somewhat higher in complexity across the board. Not having to wear the onion layers makes a world of difference.

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4 hours ago, xoClarisse said:

As for Legacy I just checked and itself it is 14.044

That number doesn't mean much.  Check the triangle count on the Legacy compared to Maitreya.  The way viewers calculate complexity is erroneous and doesn't show the impact avatars have on a region.

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Posted (edited)

Kupra is getting a lot of good press. Legacy is a better looking shape than my Maitreya (I'm an artist and know body shapes very well, even selling a guide to make your shape correct by showing how impossibly long most avatars legs are, and how unrealistic your torso shape is), agreed, but their HUD is laggy and tied to their servers, and regardless of how unlikely it is to mess it up, I don't want my 5000L HUD relying/living on their server.

Sadly, I can not make Kurpa slender enough in terms of hip width and butt size to buy them, either, despite wanting to support the creator. Think 5'6" 110 pound B-cup shape with a tiny tush. If someone can show me a skinny Kupra though, I can be pursuaded.

And oh yes ... DEMO everything you intend on buying from bodies and heads to skins, all the way down to belly piercings and bracelets. No demo, no buy.

@BookishMelinoe I know that the complexity count issue is a big can of worms here, but I'm the same. I usually sit well under 50K even dolled up and jewellery on.

Edited by Katherine Heartsong
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Since you found it amusing @xoClarisse, here are the numbers that matter.

On 4/1/2021 at 4:43 PM, Pussycat Catnap said:

It's also higher polygon count. By an amount that basically shocked me.

 

This is the demo, so subtract some small amount, a few hundred or so, for some signs it rezzes around you.

The Legacy body is 246,172 "triangles" (polygons more or less).

The feet are 406,536 triangles - Holy freak that's lag.

The hands are 193,264 triangles.

TOTAL: 845972

- At that range we are in uncharted "Holy Expletives Batman!" territories of lag.

 

The ENTIRE Belleza body is 521287 triangles. Belleza was the queen of lag before Legacy said "hold my polygons, I got this, let me kill your SL for you.").

The ENTIRE Maitreya body (includes hands and feet) is 176,297 triangles.

There is a furry body that can wear all clothes made for all 3 of thoese bodies (it's a pack of bodies, and one of them works for each of the above). The Belleza fit for that is 33,736 triangles. On a fraction of the lag, they manage the exact same animation and shape responsiveness.

 

 

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I know, it's hard for you to admit you're wrong.  Instead of looking at the complexity number, look under that at VisTris.   Don't get me wrong, I love my Legacy but looking at it now, my complexity is around 95,000.  Not so bad.  Now look at the VisTris and EstMaxTris.  Well over a million.  See what it is for Maitreya.  THAT is what lags the sim.

 

df0e122fcbdf8f2337ff83bdb5da0a6b.png

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Since you found it amusing @xoClarisse, here are the numbers that matter.

 

I do indeed. Outside of this forum clique nobody care about polygons or complexity, they wear clothes and accessories they love and they rarely exceed 100-150k complexity anyway. Most people set 350.000 as complexity limit to avoid griefers and that's it. People aren't responsible of you using a computer from the last decade who can't run SL decently and surely do not have to spoil their fun for you. I never heard anyone complaint about Freya's lags outside of here, nor even Legacy. If you want to have a pointless contest on who will have the lowest complexity/polygons counts between you that's good for you, but when a newcomer is looking for a new body I prefer to give tell them the best looking one with the best features and not an outdated one. I'll be more mature than you and just agree to disagree and not waste more time arguing with you. 

Edited by xoClarisse
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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, xoClarisse said:

I do indeed. Outside of this forum clique nobody care about polygons or complexity, they wear clothes and accessories they love and they rarely exceed 100-150k complexity anyway. Most people set 350.000 as complexity limit to avoid griefers and that's it. People aren't responsible of you using a computer from the last decade who can't run SL decently and surely do not have to spoil their fun for you. I never heard anyone complaint about Freya's lags outside of here, nor even Legacy. If you want to have a pointless contest on who will have the lowest complexity/polygons counts between you that's good for you, but when a newcomer is looking for a new body I prefer to give tell them the best looking one with the best features and not an outdated one.

I never said one was better than the other.  Never.  I was correcting your statement about complexity and how it isn't the true measure of how the body effects those around you.  You had the wrong information.  I was providing the correct information, nothing more.  I love my Legacy.  People do need the correct information, though.  Not just opinions based on incorrect information.

Edited by Rowan Amore
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Posted (edited)

I'm not a fan of Legacy by any means, but regarding of all those triangles and complexity. Until people will stop making and using 750k triangles hair and 1.5m triangles clothing it's all pretty irrelevant. From the recent example:  there's a certain creator that makes all sizes combined into one object (can change them through the HUD). The result is "wonderful" 1.4m triangles fishnets that were up on the recent event. And another one that made non less wonderful fur coat with 1.8m (or so, it was released early this year) triangles. I won't name those creators because of the forum rules, but not like that stuff is difficult to find anyway. Bodies are the lesser of evils compared to all the rest, and that's just wearables.

Also Kupra body is ~450k triangles, despite being full BoM and not even having alpha cuts.

Edited by steeljane42
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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, xoClarisse said:

People aren't responsible of you using a computer from the last decade who can't run SL decently and surely do not have to spoil their fun for you.

   The 'last decade' ended less than 18 months ago. In terms of computer lifespans, that's not necessarily old.

   In modern video games running on modern game engines, the asset and world designers usually have a limit of 1-2 million visible triangles at any given moment, as beyond that it's likely to begin having a negative impact on framerate and, as a result, gameplay. With Unreal 4.5 they expect the limits to raise considerably - but most video game character models from well-known games such as Assassins Creed 3, Devil May Cry 4, Batman: Arkham Asylum/City tend to be from around 7,000 triangles (the 'thugs' in the Batman games) to 25,000 triangles (playable characters and main characters in most of those games). In games where framerate issues aren't acceptable due to the competitive gameplay (and with E-sports, competitive gameplay = potential for revenue), designers are often strictly enforced not to go over 10,000 triangles for any given character model (CS:GO for example). 

   You do not increase a model's visual quality through increasing the topographic detail alone; you increase visual quality through materials and textures. 

normal_mapping_comparison.png

   The thing about Second Life is, the vast majority of the content are made by laymen. Back when SL used just prims, that worked fine, because there was a hard limit on the polygon count - a cube was '1 prim' worth of land resource, a cube is 12 triangles (6 4-cornered polygons = 12 triangles), so if you had a 1024 sqm plot and rezzed as many cubes as you could, you had used 4,212 triangles. There are much more complex prims than cubes, a prim sphere for example has 576 triangles, but under normal circumstances you still wouldn't have too much of a problem.

   But when people started meshing, creators suddenly had to learn how to mesh - and many of them only learned to make high-poly models to achieve the visuals they wanted, and that practice is the norm in SL to this day (and probably never will change). After all, doing things correctly is a lot of work and takes a lot of time, and most people could hardly tell the 4M triangle model apart from the normal-mapped 500 triangle model anyway - and then no one seems to understand why SL runs like lukewarm pitch. 

   Avatars are, by far, the worst offenders though. Because the LI calculation of meshes does create some limitations (although you still can get low LI high-poly models, which seems less than ideal), but you don't have any LI limit on your avatar - a Maitreya body is 38 land impact, which most people would consider 'way too high' if it were a statue, but no one notices it when you're wearing it. 

   As per LL's own (slightly paraphrased) statement on mesh and lag in the wiki, the old rumour that 'mesh is laggy' isn't true - bad mesh is laggy, good mesh isn't. Maitreya's mesh isn't 'good' out of a resource perspective, heck, the most popular 'high-poly' body mod for Skyrim has roughly 12,000 triangles compared to Maitreya's 215,000, but Legacy almost multiplying that by 4 is not 'progress' or 'more advanced', it's actual, Lovecraftian-level madness. 

Edited by Orwar
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Someone has to be wearing those Catwa HDpro heads.. I mean the whole market place crashed out with people flocking to get them.. hehehehe

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Posted (edited)
On 6/2/2021 at 7:35 PM, SyndraJade said:

If this is posted in the wrong place,I'm sorry. Not looking for a specific person's help, just opinions on some Marketplace stuff.

I don't understand Avatars or what it takes to make them, so I decided I'm gonna get a complete one so I don't have to worry about it. I found 3 options, and I'd like some opinions. My current avatar looks good but I'd like to update her and change her look. I don't know what works, or what is outdated, so if you could please give me opinions I would appreciate it. These were all well reviewed, and look good to me, but what do I know. If they're all good to you ,then please tell me which you would pick.

THANKS! AND A BUG HUG!

Option 1-https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Kalhene-ANYA-BENTO-fitted-mesh-bodyHead-v40/19973384?page=1

Option 2-https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Star-Bento-Mesh-Body-Fitted-body-bento-head-bento-hands-Bakes-on-Mesh/18696950

Option 3-https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/50HEAVEN-avatar-animated-Mesh-head-MO-TANNED/9134493

The first one, I thought I would demo it just out of curiosity.. I don't know about the two others below it, but the Kalhene is a body and a head, so you could use other heads with it..

I tried it with my genus head and it fit perfectly with no neck seam line or anything..

Also, there is another body you can try and get which might actually be free if the promotion is still going on.. it's a pretty nice body but doesn't come with a head, which may be not up your alley..

But if you want to try it  anyways I'll put the link below..

You just teleport there and click the midnight madness sign and soon as it fills up they will send you the body.. it usually takes about the next day for  them to send it to you..

Also, there is a bom hud right below the mindnight madness sign which I think cost like 100 lindens if I remember right, which turns the body into BOM body. Most Maitreya clothes fit it as well..

Just thought I would mention it since it's a nice free body..

http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Coral Reef/19/46/2003

Edited by Ceka Cianci
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Posted (edited)
On 6/4/2021 at 2:21 PM, Rowan Amore said:

I know, it's hard for you to admit you're wrong.  Instead of looking at the complexity number, look under that at VisTris.   Don't get me wrong, I love my Legacy but looking at it now, my complexity is around 95,000.  Not so bad.  Now look at the VisTris and EstMaxTris.  Well over a million.  See what it is for Maitreya.  THAT is what lags the sim.

df0e122fcbdf8f2337ff83bdb5da0a6b.png

Not sure (as a newbie) I understand what you are saying, Rowan (and I love your posts and contributions btw).

I'm assuming that the screen shot above is your Legacy? So, I fired up my Maitreya with both my Lelutka and my CATWAHDPro Majer Strong head.

Granted, I am only wearing a tight dress, heels, bracelets and rings, hair from DOUX, and a choker around my neck (RLV enabled but turned off, I just loved the choker design, dislike the RLV stuff).  I am sitting at ...

54706 complexity
VisTris 1.19M
EstMaxTris1.08M
275m^2 (I have no clue what this measures)

Is this low? Good? Better than Legacy?

Edited by Katherine Heartsong
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46 minutes ago, Katherine Heartsong said:

Not sure (as a newbie) I understand what you are saying, Rowan (and I love your posts and contributions btw).

I'm assuming that the screen shot above is your Legacy? So, I fired up my Maitreya with both my Lelutka and my CATWAHDPro Majer Strong head.

Granted, I am only wearing a tight dress, heels, bracelets and rings, hair from DOUX, and a choker around my neck (RLV enabled but turned off, I just loved the choker design, dislike the RLV stuff).  I am sitting at ...

54706 complexity
VisTris 1.19M
EstMaxTris1.08M
275m^2 (I have no clue what this measures)

Is this low? Good? Better than Legacy?

You'd have to try without all the clothing and accessories to get a good reading.  I was also fully dressed with mine.   Here is a good explanation.

 

Avatar Rendering Cost (ARC) is a way of measuring how difficult an avatar is for the viewer to render. It is not always accurate to your machine’s capabilities.

VisTris is Visible Triangles, the current number of triangles (tris) visible for the current level of detail (LOD). Includes sculpties.

EstMaxTris is Estimated Maximum Triangles, an estimate of the highest LOD of the most complicated object worn. This does not include sculpties, only mesh (so full-sculpt avs often show 0).

You should use all three of these readings together, plus a grain of salt, to give you a rough idea of how hard an avatar is to render.

https://theavatarindex.wordpress.com/2018/09/27/complexity-and-triangles-an-explanation/

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Posted (edited)

THANK  YOU to everyone who posted in here. I got #1,and it looks good. It oddly "broke" for a bit, and I almost panicked a little,but unpacked the original from the box again and now it works fine. I will now go head shopping? (Head hunting?  😮 LOL. ) THANK YOU EVERYONE. But feel free to continue your discussion, of course. 

Edited by SyndraJade
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On 6/4/2021 at 2:30 PM, xoClarisse said:

I do indeed. Outside of this forum clique nobody care about polygons or complexity, they wear clothes and accessories they love and they rarely exceed 100-150k complexity anyway. Most people set 350.000 as complexity limit to avoid griefers and that's it. People aren't responsible of you using a computer from the last decade who can't run SL decently and surely do not have to spoil their fun for you. I never heard anyone complaint about Freya's lags outside of here, nor even Legacy. If you want to have a pointless contest on who will have the lowest complexity/polygons counts between you that's good for you, but when a newcomer is looking for a new body I prefer to give tell them the best looking one with the best features and not an outdated one. I'll be more mature than you and just agree to disagree and not waste more time arguing with you. 

It's interesting that you're saying this while many of your other posts are about how you personally are experiencing graphics problems. Have you considered the possibility that it's your body that's causing them - i.e. that you're complaining about its complexity without realizing it?

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Posted (edited)

It makes me sad how many people are unaware of triangle count and the concept of resource intensity. Of course you can make an aesthetically immaculate body if they have no limit to triangle count.

Plus, it's not about how old a user's computer is, it's about measuring whether or not it's worth that much of your resources to render, say, your friggin toenail. If you own a beast car, are you always going to rev it to the max all the time?

I demo'd the Legacy body and piled it on top of the Maitreya, and the shape is so close. Of course Legacy is smoother but that is attributed to the ridiculously high triangle count. My computer now is custom built and brand new but regardless, resource is resource. Just because I've got a beast machine, I'm not going to make sure each of my eyeballs is a million triangles. We all have a choice to use our brains, at least sometimes.

What Maitreya has done with their add-ons and updates is clever, efficient and also affordable (instead of a money grab).

It's hard to imagine anyone would make a body like Legacy if they cared about the grid.

Edited by AdminGirl
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So the premade avatars in my opinion aren't the best idea and I'll explain why. 

You're better off buying a mesh head and a mesh body that you like, and then also buying a shape that's made for that head and body that comes with a style card (lists everything worn in the photo) so you can go buy those items separately and get the complete look in the photo, because the full avatar pack ones won't be compatible with the majority of other products out there. Most designers only create clothing and skins for the most popular mesh bodies, and the ones included in the complete avatar packs are no-name bodies  and heads that aren't compatible with anything unless it's specifically made for that body or head. Not to say they can't look nice or be of good quality, but designers have to go through an application process to get the developer kit to make clothing and skins for each body and head, so they generally only stick to making stuff for the ones that the most people wear and will buy. 

Basically, the complete avatar packs contain one-off products that aren't compatible with anything but each other and you won't be able to wear the majority of fashion on the grid with them because textures won't line up properly, or clothing will clip and not fit correctly. 

With that being said, here's a small list of the more popular mesh heads and bodies to look into. I'd go around and grab a couple demos until you make a choice on which head and body to wear, and then look for an avatar shape that's made for that head and body (so it looks like the photo, bodies and heads are rigged differently and will look wildly different on heads and bodies they aren't made for). Look for a shape that comes with a style card so you can still get the whole look, you will just most likely have to visit multiple stores to get the items. I know it sounds like a huge pain in the ass but it's way more worth it to do it this way so your avatar will be compatible with other products and you can actually wear the things you see designers create.

Bodies: 
TMP Legacy (Most realistic out there in my opinion, but the hud sucks. If you use Bakes On Mesh then you barely need to use the hud at all and it's great)
TMP Legacy Perky (same as Legacy but with perkier boobs)
Inithium Kupra (Curviest body out there, really extreme look)
Maitreya Lara (Very basic mesh body, realistic looks best for very thin or athletic avatars)
Belleza Freya (Realistic curvy body, used to be more popular, tons of clothing for it, but most new releases do not include Belleza anymore due to lack of support/updates from Belleza).

Heads:
Lelutka EVO/EVO X (most popular currently, very versatile. Evo and evo x use different uv maps though so the same skins and makeups will not work with both, you'll need to pick one and buy products specifically for that one)
Genus Project (realistic, several different looks ranging from strong and angular to soft and round to alien-esque. HUD is kinda meh, but the head quality is great)
Catwa/Catwa HD Pro (HD Pro is the newest from Catwa, much higher quality than their older heads. All are mostly younger looking so depends on preference). 

If you'd like help picking something out please let me know, I'm happy to help!

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On 6/4/2021 at 8:30 PM, xoClarisse said:

I do indeed. Outside of this forum clique nobody care about polygons or complexity, they wear clothes and accessories they love and they rarely exceed 100-150k complexity anyway. Most people set 350.000 as complexity limit to avoid griefers and that's it. People aren't responsible of you using a computer from the last decade who can't run SL decently and surely do not have to spoil their fun for you. I never heard anyone complaint about Freya's lags outside of here, nor even Legacy. If you want to have a pointless contest on who will have the lowest complexity/polygons counts between you that's good for you, but when a newcomer is looking for a new body I prefer to give tell them the best looking one with the best features and not an outdated one. I'll be more mature than you and just agree to disagree and not waste more time arguing with you. 

I have a matreya and a lelutka head and score about 21k complexity and 21 sqm dressed with shoes, nice dress and glasses (no jewellery). Iv set my preferences to avatar complexity 71K. That means everything above that is a jellydoll to me. So the person you recommend to take the "prettiest" (i think Maitrya is pretty) body without thinking about complexity will maybee be my next jellydoll. And maybee she or he wants to have that information before they decide. I have a gaming computer which can indeed handle a lot of pressure but for me a smooth experience is more important than see other ppls jewellerys, sorry ;) My choise, and im no expert but iv read up on the subject because i think its important to have in mind and I do think the lab should control this stuff a lot better. And its just my private opinion because lag really upsets me. (Maybee because im an avid pvp player outside SL and lag makes me die a horrible death in that game ;) )

complexity.JPG

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25 minutes ago, Always Incognito said:

I have a gaming computer which can indeed handle a lot of pressure but for me a smooth experience is more important than see other ppls jewellerys, sorry ;)

   SL is hardly optimised for performance, and due to the nature of the user created content any given area can cap out at a much higher processing power requirement than the latest AAA games do for the assets and textures; it's not at all difficult to make SL lag, even on high-end rigs.

29 minutes ago, Always Incognito said:

My choise, and im no expert but iv read up on the subject because i think its important to have in mind and I do think the lab should control this stuff a lot better. And its just my private opinion because lag really upsets me.

   I don't think anyone really enjoys low framerates, unfortunately neither the complexity system or the jelly dolls are particularly great. I've often found that rendering an avatar fully reduce their impact on my framerate compared to what the jelly dolls do - and the complexity count doesn't properly represent how much avatars actually require to render. 

   If I'm out shopping, I'll usually just switch on 'show friends only'. If I'm at a club or such and don't want to hide everyone, I'll just individually pick out the worst offenders and derender them. But you can't do anything about other avatars' scripts and their impact, which is the primary cause of performance lag (i.e. causing unresponsiveness and rubberbanding). Some venues limit visitors' scripts and automatically eject people who aren't within the limits, but this practice is very rare at shopping events (where it's just as important as clubs, IMO), and a lot of clubs don't bother either.

   The two other primary ways of reducing lag when out and about is to reduce draw distance and the LOD factor. Well made mesh that is designed for its purpose shouldn't require high LOD (and if a creator suggests you go into the advanced menus to set your LOD to 8, what they really says is 'I don't know anything about mesh, but it's not my product that is faulty!'). 

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36 minutes ago, Orwar said:

   SL is hardly optimised for performance, and due to the nature of the user created content any given area can cap out at a much higher processing power requirement than the latest AAA games do for the assets and textures; it's not at all difficult to make SL lag, even on high-end rigs.

   The two other primary ways of reducing lag when out and about is to reduce draw distance and the LOD factor. Well made mesh that is designed for its purpose shouldn't require high LOD (and if a creator suggests you go into the advanced menus to set your LOD to 8, what they really says is 'I don't know anything about mesh, but it's not my product that is faulty!'). 

Thats true and we can only do so much... but I keep my jellydolls, they work for me ;) 

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18 hours ago, Always Incognito said:

I have a matreya and a lelutka head and score about 21k complexity and 21 sqm dressed with shoes, nice dress and glasses (no jewellery). Iv set my preferences to avatar complexity 71K. That means everything above that is a jellydoll to me. So the person you recommend to take the "prettiest" (i think Maitrya is pretty) body without thinking about complexity will maybee be my next jellydoll. And maybee she or he wants to have that information before they decide. I have a gaming computer which can indeed handle a lot of pressure but for me a smooth experience is more important than see other ppls jewellerys, sorry ;) My choise, and im no expert but iv read up on the subject because i think its important to have in mind and I do think the lab should control this stuff a lot better. And its just my private opinion because lag really upsets me. (Maybee because im an avid pvp player outside SL and lag makes me die a horrible death in that game ;) )

complexity.JPG

Gaming computers are optimized for real time 3D rendering. CPU, GPU, memory, storage, and data buses are selected and tweaked for that task. Unfortunately, most of the tweaking is mostly oriented toward DirectX rendering not OpenGL. But, nVidia has provided recommended settings for SL's OpenGL. So, you can improve SL performance.

For you ‘smooth performance’ I important. For others seeing the engraving in the necklace is more important.

Today’s social conditioning leads people to think OTHERS should do something to solve things to suit their preferences. The Lab has consistently opt’ed to provide creative freedom and inclusiveness for all players over technical performance for the limited number of people interested performance.

Wanting performance is a matter of degrees. We balance what we are willing to give up for performance. Thus, the Lab has given us a viewer with over 3,000 settings to control our experience. Performance is in our hands. With a few clicks anyone with a half decent gaming machine can maintain 100+ FPS in most places within SL.

I’ll point out that SL servers running at 100% will only ever produce 45 FPS. That is their max. So, we can improve the quality of the render in the viewer until we have the viewer at 45FPS without any actual loss of performance.

Of course, there are places where no matter what we do performance will degrade. The land owners often make design decisions I disagree with that cause a region/parcel to lag. But I am NOT willing to infringe on their freedom for my personal preferences and beliefs. Instead, I will do what I can to mitigate their poor decisions (IMO) impact on me. If I can’t get to a place where performance is acceptable to me… I can go somewhere else and let them enjoy their SL. Calling on 'the authorities' to control

others for my individual benefit seems fascist.

I’ll also point out that SL is the 7th longest running MMORPG (as of 6/15/21) still online. So, the Lab is doing something right.

If you think SL has lag… join a massive battle in EVE Online. My point in the comparison is that the current state of MMORPG's is such that lag is a part of the tech. Understanding what can and can't be fixed with current tech

saves a lot of frustration.
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Just now, Nalates Urriah said:

Gaming computers are optimized for real time 3D rendering. CPU, GPU, memory, storage, and data buses are selected and tweaked for that task. Unfortunately, most of the tweaking is mostly oriented toward DirectX rendering not OpenGL. But, nVidia has provided recommended settings for SL's OpenGL. So, you can improve SL performance.

 

For you ‘smooth performance’ I important. For others seeing the engraving in the necklace is more important.

 

 

Today’s social conditioning leads people to think OTHERS should do something to solve things to suit their preferences. The Lab has consistently opt’ed to provide creative freedom and inclusiveness for all players over technical performance for the limited number of people interested performance.

 

Wanting performance is a matter of degrees. We balance what we are willing to give up for performance. Thus, the Lab has given us a viewer with over 3,000 settings to control our experience. Performance is in our hands. With a few clicks anyone with a half decent gaming machine can maintain 100+ FPS in most places within SL.

 

I’ll point out that SL servers running at 100% will only ever produce 45 FPS. That is their max. So, we can improve the quality of the render in the viewer until we have the viewer at 45FPS without any actual loss of performance.

 

Of course, there are places where no matter what we do performance will degrade. The land owners often make design decisions I disagree with that cause a region/parcel to lag. But I am NOT willing to infringe on their freedom for my personal preferences and beliefs. Instead, I will do what I can to mitigate their poor decisions (IMO) impact on me. If I can’t get to a place where performance is acceptable to me… I can go somewhere else and let them enjoy their SL. Calling on 'the authorities' to control

 

others for my individual benefit seems fascist.

I’ll also point out that SL is the 7th longest running MMORPG (as of 6/15/21) still online. So, the Lab is doing something right.

 

If you think SL has lag… join a massive battle in EVE Online. My point in the comparison is that the current state of MMORPG's is such that lag is a part of the tech. Understanding what can and can't be fixed with current tech

 

saves a lot of frustration.

wow that was a LOT of text! Thanks for the input X)) But as i said, i dont care about what other ppl wear or if they appear as jellydoll to me. I set up my rig as it suits me. As long as we still can communicate and have a nice time its chill. (Eve is too old for me but maybee you have experience of it, grandma? ^^ ).

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1 hour ago, Nalates Urriah said:

For others seeing the engraving in the necklace is more important.

   You don't engrave a necklace by putting a bunch of vertices into the mesh. You do that with the normal mapping and the texture, at which point it should barely add to performance usage.

1 hour ago, Nalates Urriah said:

Today’s social conditioning leads people to think OTHERS should do something to solve things to suit their preferences.

   It's one thing to act entitled, and another when people are hogging resources like crazy and not letting that impact your experience.

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