'Banned' while flying at Bellisseria

[TrophySpouse]

4 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

It .... wasn't that hard to understand/parse, especially when in context with this - and other, older - threads/"discussions".

 

Some people are slower than others to understand things. You couldn't even bother to elaborate when I asked for clarification. 🙄 🙄🙄

[Solar Legion]

6 minutes ago, TrophySpouse said:

Some people are slower than others to understand things. You couldn't even bother to elaborate when I asked for clarification. 🙄 🙄🙄

There wasn't anything to elaborate on - for starters - as well as by the time I got around to reading the thread, someone else was already handling it.

Threads do not exist in a vacuum nor do most responses/comments.

[Silent Mistwalker]

48 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

Adding to this it would seem that more than a few are incapable of perceiving that not everyone that does use Security systems has them set unreasonably.

Mind, what some seem to find "reasonable" is - to me anyway - rather laughably generous.

 

Well... I do have to admit I am getting a tad bit slower in my old age so the extra time is nice. I mean, the older we get the less we have to lose right?

[Sid Nagy]

9 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

Someone wondered why people are use security orbs since it's not as if people could steal your stuff (kind of a snide remark IMO) .  The points being mentioned here as to why people use them was apparently missed.   The 'people can't steal your stuff" is a common response to people who use orbs.  The fact I don't want to come home and find someone I don't know sitting in my house as it upsets me and others?  A very valid reason.  

I guess it all depends on how you perceive things in SL.

To me my RL home and my home in SL are two totally different things.
My RL apartment is very real and I would totally freak out if I found someone was/is there when coming home.

My SL home?
I like having one, but it is in the end just smoke, duct tape  and mirrors on a computer to me. So I could not care less if someone is or was there.
My avatar never feels like me either. Sid is the puppet and I'm the puppeteer.
SL is in my computer and I'm at home in RL drinking my coffee.

So I guess mileages vary a lot in SL.

Edited May 20, 2021 by Sid Nagy

[Schatzi Timmerman]

In the spirit of having a security orb, has it ever been suggested to simply set the orb to 'passive mode'? While the orb won't boot anyone at a set time limit, it will tell the owner that someone was in range for 1 - 2 minutes. This shows they were likely just driving, flying, walking or sailing by the house. That is acceptable.

If a pattern begins showing longer than say, 7 minutes and happens on a continuous basis, this could give reason to list them in the ban section (key being: could give reason).

My $ says they were just wandering by with no nefarious intentions.

[Silent Mistwalker]

22 hours ago, Eddy Vortex said:

Firestorm otakus are an odd bunch.

 

 

Sorry to disappoint but I have no interest in anime or  manga or whatever it's called, so your insult fails.

[Solar Legion]

I'd say it ought to be quite clear by now that what is "acceptable" is going to differ.

No Auto-Ban is "acceptable". Timer duration at a minimum of 15 seconds is "acceptable".

Having this ridiculous covenant be limited to places covered by the project that spawned Bellisseria is "acceptable". Having a proper successor to the existing Linden Homes is "acceptable" - and no, Bellisseria is not it.

[Sid Nagy]

23 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

 Having a proper successor to the existing Linden Homes is "acceptable" - and no, Bellisseria is not it.

Each his/her own opinions, but I think that Bellisseria is the best project LL ever did so far.

Would I have done some things differently if it were my project, of course I would. 
But is it a failure because it is not 100% like I would have done it?  No of course not.
It is not even 80% the way I would have done this project when at the wheel, but I still like the Bellisseria project a lot.

 

Edited May 20, 2021 by Sid Nagy

[Solar Legion]

34 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

Each his/her own opinions, but I think that Bellisseria is the best project LL ever did so far.

Would I have done some things differently if it were my project, of course I would. 
But is it a failure because it is not 100% like I would have done it?  No of course not.
It is not even 80% the way I would have done this project so far, but still like the Bellisseria project a lot.

The Bellisseria Project is perfectly fine/successful for what it is - a community built for vehicular users/explorer types in mind.

The Homes project and areas are - presently - set up to allow Users as much freedom and control as possible over their parcels with the rather few restrictions being that one cannot deed the land to a Group and one cannot have a Skybox as seen below:

Quote

== Linden Home Restrictions ==

Linden Home has unique restrictions in addition to those outlined in the Linden Home Terms and Conditions. By accepting a Linden Home, you agree to additional restrictions as follows:

    * Linden Home is for residential use only.
    * Business use of any kind is prohibited, including parcel rental, rental boxes, classified ads or other forms of advertising, and event listings.
    * Land cannot be terraformed, sold, deeded to group, joined, or divided.
    * Land cannot contain sky boxes, temp-rezzers, or individual prims beyond the allocated size of the Second Life Viewer build tools — 10x10x10m (no megaprims).
    * Linden Homes may not be removed, modified, exchanged, set or deeded to group, or transferred.
    * Linden Homes should be kept presentable and in-theme.
    * Linden Homes should not be used as sandboxes.
    * Linden Homes do not include traffic tracking.
    * Ownership is limited to one Linden Home per Premium Account.

This is "acceptable" and "reasonable" though I'd personally update it a bit - build floater (at least in the Viewer I use) has maximum Prim dimensions as 64x64x64 - doubt anyone is going to have something quite so large in their Home or on their Parcel but still) as well as the ability to have a Skybox if one so desired. As far as a few of the others go ... meh. Many of these were not really enforced.

As a place to "hang up your hat" so to speak, this works quite well.

ETA: As I said above however, adding in a Covenant mandated delay of 15 seconds minimum and requiring that any Security system in use only function within the Parcel boundaries is also "acceptable" .... I'd go so far as to say that having such systems soft restricted (recommended/preferred) to the interior of any buildings present would also be "acceptable".

Edited May 20, 2021 by Solar Legion

[Phil Deakins]

Now I'm puzzled. I'd assumed that skyboxes are allowed, otherwise what is the point of having the vertical column above 2000m securable. So I went back to the beginning of this thread to where security up there was discussed - or I thought it was discussed. While there I noticed group-access mentioned as being not allowed. But it is allowed.

What isn't allowed is setting group-only access in the About Land floater, because that produces ban lines for everyone else. Group-only access is allowed when it is implemented by a security device.

Now I'm off back to find where skyboxes were discussed while some Moles were posting.

[Solar Legion]

That Covenant segment was pulled from the Linden Homes region where my current Linden Home is located, Phil.

I am not counting any Covenant located on Bellisseria.

[Phil Deakins]

Ah. Thank you for that, Solar. I popped over to Bellisseria and found this in the covenant:-

*Skyboxes are only allowed above 2000m.

So I hadn't misunderstood it

 

[Solar Legion]

Not a problem. I thought - however - that my posts here made it quite clear how I view the Bellisseria project in terms of it being a "Linden Homes" segment.

[Phil Deakins]

Tbh, I haven't really tried to follow that type of discussion. I've only been interested in Bellisseria from the point of view of a security device. And only that because I realised that my LevelGuard is ideal for that area.

Edited May 20, 2021 by Phil Deakins

[Solar Legion]

Meh, understandable I suppose.

[LittleMe Jewell]

9 minutes ago, Phil Deakins said:

Ah. Thank you for that, Solar. I popped over to Bellisseria and found this in the covenant:-

*Skyboxes are only allowed above 2000m.

So I hadn't misunderstood it

 

Skyboxes are allowed in the Bellisseria Linden Homes, but not in the original Linden Homes. 

Whereas in the original Linden Homes, I'm pretty sure you are able to click the Group Only checkbox in the About Land, thereby putting up ban lines.  

And I'm pretty sure there are no rules at all regarding anything about security devices -- TP everyone home if you want.

 

I'm not sure if the  " llGetEnv( "estate_name" )"  will show a distinction between the two types of Linden Homes.

 

Edited May 20, 2021 by LittleMe Jewell

[Solar Legion]

2 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Skyboxes are allowed in the Bellisseria Linden Homes, but not in the original Linden Homes. 

Whereas in the original Linden Homes, I'm pretty sure you are able to click the Group Only checkbox in the About Land, thereby putting up ban lines.  

And I'm pretty sure there are no rules at all regarding anything about security devices -- TP everyone home if you want.

 

I'm not sure if the  " llGetEnv( "estate_name" )"  will show a distinction between the two types of Linden Homes.

 

Yes, in the Linden Homes section I am at, one can indeed enable Group Only if one so desires.

[Phil Deakins]

5 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I'm not sure if the  " llGetEnv( "estate_name" )"  will show a distinction between the two types of Linden Homes.

It does. Bellisseria comes back as Linden Homes 2 whereas other Linden Homes return Linden Homes

[Maitimo]

Don't even need the script. It's right there on the Covenant tab of About Land.

[LittleMe Jewell]

3 minutes ago, Maitimo said:

Don't even need the script. It's right there on the Covenant tab of About Land.

If this is referring to my comment to Phil about the " llGetEnv( "estate_name" )" function, that is because he is modifying his security product to detect whether or not the device is in the new Bellisseria Linden Homes and if so the device will only allow settings that are in line with LL's rules for security devices.  

[Innula Zenovka]

On 5/18/2021 at 12:56 PM, Alwin Alcott said:

not very much i think ... a huge majority signs up, but never enters inworld.

And a lot of the people who do actually make it through the sign-up and first login process don't come back.   

I would imagine there's a difference between the people who log out after only a minute or two, never to return, and those who give it a bit longer, but nevertheless those of us who actually managed to log in and decided SL was interesting enough to spend a bit of time learning how to use the viewer and who bothered to return the first visit are errm... not normal.

[Sid Nagy]

Thanks. 🤪

 

Edited May 21, 2021 by Sid Nagy

[Silent Mistwalker]

3 hours ago, Innula Zenovka said:

And a lot of the people who do actually make it through the sign-up and first login process don't come back.   

I would imagine there's a difference between the people who log out after only a minute or two, never to return, and those who give it a bit longer, but nevertheless those of us who actually managed to log in and decided SL was interesting enough to spend a bit of time learning how to use the viewer and who bothered to return the first visit are errm... not normal.

We're the new normal. 🤭

[Solar Legion]

3 hours ago, Innula Zenovka said:

And a lot of the people who do actually make it through the sign-up and first login process don't come back.   

I would imagine there's a difference between the people who log out after only a minute or two, never to return, and those who give it a bit longer, but nevertheless those of us who actually managed to log in and decided SL was interesting enough to spend a bit of time learning how to use the viewer and who bothered to return the first visit are errm... not normal.

 

4 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

We're the new normal. 🤭

Even back in the Viewer 1.x days, there were issues with new user retention. usually revolving around Second Life not being what was expected (an actual, "modern game") and varying levels of disinterest in doing any real reading/learning for the interface/controls (the expectation being simply being able to jump right on in).

That is a "normal" that should be scoffed at.

[Silent Mistwalker]

48 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

 

Even back in the Viewer 1.x days, there were issues with new user retention. usually revolving around Second Life not being what was expected (an actual, "modern game") and varying levels of disinterest in doing any real reading/learning for the interface/controls (the expectation being simply being able to jump right on in).

That is a "normal" that should be scoffed at.

Why bother to scoff at the ones that only sit in the cockpit and never learn to fly? 

If someone really wants the "look and feel" of V1/Snowglobe they can always use the Phoenix mode in Firestorm which causes the UI to emulate Snowglobe. I'm pretty sure one or two of the other TPVs have that feature but maybe not. It's there for people who refuse to use the V2 or V3 UI. I used to be one of them. But after a few months I finally let Snowglobe go. I prefer the current UI now.

SL has always had user retention issues. More so than any company that I have done business with or heard about. Back then we used to have to "run the gauntlet" that ended with never leaving orientation if you didn't learn how to fly because that was the only way to get to the exit portal(s). As frustrating as that was for me when I first logged in in 2003/4 (I came this || close to giving up) I can't blame that on LL because I was trying to rush through things to get inworld. Just like I imagine most people do. Except I figured out how to scale that brick wall instead of giving up. 

If people give up that easily, then SL may not be a good place for them. One thing that SL does require is determination.

Edited May 21, 2021 by Silent Mistwalker
typo OCD