Luna Bliss Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said: 8 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said: Biblical Literalism, especially when combined with political parties, stunts people's lives and even kills them. This is becoming more and more pronounced in the U.S. Get out from under your rock and do a little research. So I will call it out when I see it. Take your red herring fish about me not being able to cope with people different from me and stuff it you know where. Expand Expand One has to wonder how much of the bible literalism is in reaction to the socialist/communist agenda that is becoming so pronounced in the US, which is stunting people's lives, cancelling them when they don't toe the lefty line and increasingly encroaching on freedoms. Blaming Socialism and 'lefty stuff' now? Man, you are the Queen of Red Herrings: Edited March 17, 2021 by Luna Bliss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arielle Popstar Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 3 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said: Recovery groups don't necessarily equate to a relationship with God. Straws? Success on a day to day basis in a 12 Step group is rare without a relationship with a G/god of your understanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 lol this a funny one... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunawayBunny Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) This whole discussion reminds me importance of viewpoint and perspective. "The Remote South Pacific Island Where They Worship Planes" No comment.. decent example 2 groups perceive events differently: https://guardian.ng/life/culture-lifestyle/the-remote-south-pacific-island-where-they-worship-planes/ Edited March 17, 2021 by RunawayBunny 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Arielle Popstar said: 5 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said: Recovery groups don't necessarily equate to a relationship with God. Straws? Success on a day to day basis in a 12 Step group is rare without a relationship with a G/god of your understanding. Well you know lots of feminist recovery groups don't like the higher power stuff.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madelaine McMasters Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, roseelvira said: saying this very respectfully saying people is as i read it saying all who tying truth to the bible how they perceive it they will abuse others ,,,,, not so, but the phrasing reads anyone who believes sooner or later will be abusive and say the bible said its ok and that is not true ,,,, and that is worrisome . Mother Teresa was far from abusive so is she included in that statement,,,, just trying to clarify I am aware of some of the stories and saw that post but not every one who believes or read would do that . on a lighter note if one calls the psychic hotline and they are told do this and that /////are they not as dangerous being they could also abuse due to the interpretation that was told to them or reading the horoscope ???? Grrr, Rose. While you're quite correct that following the Bible does not invariably lead to abusing others, I have a problem with Mother Theresa as an example of that. From what I've read over several decades, she might well be a better example for Luna. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/mother-teresa-was-no-saint_b_9470988 As for horoscopes, I loved them in The Onion, which stopped updating them last November. Now I'll have to make up my own. Here's today's: Though you are half Irish, you'll decline your extended family's invitation to their annual St. Patrick's Day celebration because of your stubborn dislike of vomit. Geez, these things can be eerily accurate. ;-). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairreLilette Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said: Success on a day to day basis in a 12 Step group is rare without a relationship with a G/god of your understanding. I don't know how rare it is but I did it. One day turned into a few days, then weeks, then months, then years...til more than a decade had passed. I did it because I realized I loved living life sober. I guess loving life sober was my higher power but I'd say it was more my common sense. I never used 12-step. One of my neighbors has been sober 34 years and one I had met fairly recently 50 years! Amazing what power we have within ourselves also. However, if it's what you need, I'm glad you have it. But, there are people who just want to be sober and that is what they look upon as well as the hell they were once in and don't want to go back there - to blackouts, hospitalizations, or what-have-u which is and can be utter mayhem. I simply love life sober and I am not going to let anyone talk me out of it. Edited March 17, 2021 by FairreLilette 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquila Kytori Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, Arielle Popstar said: Based on those previous creations, it was a logical conclusion that there must be signs for that and sure enough the following year, the Eldredge and Gould paper on punctuated equilibrium proved that scientists were seeing signs of sudden explosions of new life in a very short time periods. Exactly what one would expect of a Designer who at various times interjected in His creation to tweak the life forms already there or restart it all after massive extinction events. Which is what happened 6000 or so years ago 6000 years ago? 4000 BC was the beginning of the Bronze age. A period when the first cities were starting to form. Perhaps you forgot to add a few zeros ? Approximately 600,000,000 yeas ago the Cambrian Explosion. Ooooops 😵 ...... Edited to correct the attribution of the quote. See @Rowan Amore post below. Edited March 17, 2021 by Aquila Kytori Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairreLilette Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 43 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said: Well you know lots of feminist recovery groups don't like the higher power stuff.. I've never heard of that. But, what also really helped me and not by myself, I had substance abuse counsellors in several hospital stays after nearly poisoning myself to death with alcohol and went into a coma or a blackout, was them telling me I have a disease and explaining things to me. 12-Step, imo, needs to focus on the disease. A disease the person needs to take control over and not let the disease control them. The disease will control me to falling asleep with a bottle in my hand. I know that for a fact and I don't want that anymore. If I start drinking I know I cannot put the bottle down and I know where it will go - into a blackout and I will have serious alcoholic poisoning because I have no shut off mechanism due to a disease. I will drink until I pass out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowan Amore Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 28 minutes ago, Aquila Kytori said: 6000 years ago? 4000 BC was the beginning of the Bronze age. A period when the first cities were starting to form. Perhaps you forgot to add a few zeros ? Approximately 600,000,000 yeas ago the Cambrian Explosion. Oh no no no...I did not say that! Please fix the quote before everyone thinks I've gone off the deep end. I quoted that quote with 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roseelvira Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 14 hours ago, Luna Bliss said: Perhaps I should say 'most' would, or will. I doubt you would directly do so. However, sometimes by participating in something that has a negative effect on the world (Biblical Literalism) one can indirectly harm others Respectfully ,,,the most or will would not...... I was raised RC/ in my personal family and it is huge we have RC/Jewish/ Agnostic/ Atheist/ Methodists {,,,note love the Saturday dinners and pot lock wink} Lutheran, Baptist , assemble of GOD, Mennonite etc and two spaghetti monster s And we all respect each other and discuss each others beliefs with openness and love and see how the path each has chosen or practice has helped them become the most wonderful beautiful person s . NO ONE ACCUSES OR CONDEMN S OR BELITTLES We treasure each other WE attend each others services be it mass or temple ....the Bar Mitzvah was wonderful !!!! We have love and respect for each other we not only love w our heart but hear each others heart's ❤. and seeing life through the others eyes and walk in their shoes ,,,, And i have relatives that are lesbians and gay and no one has ever said they were bound for Hell . Reading the bible Praying Saying the rosary They are all passive participation so how can that have a negative effect on the world...??? Feeding the hungry?? The many out reach and ministries that do good and help from our parish??? And no they do not expect you to believe . Where does that harm the world ??? So when i am making boxes of food to deliver to the needy i am causing harm??? How?? Or paying for a persons bill for utilities and when they try to pay me back and i tell them no ,,, get the kids something . How is that harming another ??? These are some of the things we meaning my personal huge family who follow what Jesus said love one another do ??? So how does that hurt the world and indirectly harm another ??? please explain....... Edited March 17, 2021 by roseelvira SPELLING the checker and post thinggy messing up 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madelaine McMasters Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 34 minutes ago, Aquila Kytori said: 6000 years ago? 4000 BC was the beginning of the Bronze age. A period when the first cities were starting to form. Perhaps you forgot to add a few zeros ? Approximately 600,000,000 yeas ago the Cambrian Explosion. I have, in my RL library, a 50lb slab of sandstone from the late Cambrian, showing a Climactichnites trackway that looks like a sliver of this... Everyone who see it asks what it is. I tell them it's incontrovertible fossil evidence that alien rovers were driving around on Earth 510 million years ago. If we can do it, anyone can do it. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roseelvira Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Madelaine McMasters said: As for horoscopes, I loved them in The Onion, which stopped updating them last November. Now I'll have to make up my own. i know i do not express myself correctly was trying to use that as a comparison ,,,,,and when i try to post the writing goes poof and i have to start over what i was trying to say was reading the bible or reading the horoscopes does not make one do crazy stuff , ,,,i am not good at written expression 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanuarySwan Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 21 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said: Oh no no no...I did not say that! Please fix the quote before everyone thinks I've gone off the deep end. I quoted that quote with Oh my. Sorry this happened to you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanuarySwan Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 19 minutes ago, roseelvira said: and i have relatives that are lesbians and gay and no one has ever said they were bound for Hell . Possibly not allowing same sex marriage is the harm Luna is speaking of? The Pope has said we do need to find a way to allow civil unions but that was only recently though, some time last year. I don't want to get into a longer discussion about it though so I will leave you with an article. (Sorry, text cut off, so I left the link at the bottom.) ROME — The Vatican has confirmed the pope’s remarks on gay couples deserving civil protections as it sent an explanatory note to bishops underlining that Francis’s comments did not mark a change in church doctrine. The pope’s remarks made headlines last month after they appeared in the documentary “Francesco,” at its Oct. 21 premiere at the Rome Film Festival. In the documentary, he reiterated his view that gay people are “children of God,” and said: “What we have to create is a civil union law. That way they are legally covered.” Last week, acknowledging the “various reactions and interpretations” provoked by the pope’s apparent break from his predecessors, the Vatican Secretary of State sent an explanatory note to its nuncios, or ambassadors, to be shared with bishops, “with the desire to favor an appropriate understanding https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/02/world/europe/pope-gay-civil-unions.html Edited March 17, 2021 by JanuarySwan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madelaine McMasters Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 9 minutes ago, roseelvira said: i know i do not express myself correctly was trying to use that as a comparison ,,,,,and when i try to post the writing goes poof and i have to start over what i was trying to say was reading the bible or reading the horoscopes does not make one do crazy stuff , ,,,i am not good at written expression Your central claim was clear and correct, Rose. Reading the bible or horoscopes does not make one do crazy stuff. My quibble was that Mother Theresa might be an example of how questionable behavior can be buffed to a high gloss by the application of religion rather than analysis. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madelaine McMasters Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Arielle Popstar said: No, your story just reminded me of the time that the realization hit me that I was really projecting my Father as God which I suppose he was as I was growing up but when I became an adult I should have been letting go of that. I was just slow in doing so. It was not meant as any sort of barb towards your relationship with yours. In fact I will admit I am somewhat envious of the relationship you had with yours as other then a few rare occurrences, I can't say I had much of one with my Father. It was really only after he had passed away that I really started to appreciate him for who he was. My father was fond of this Mark Twain quote: "When I was a boy of fourteen, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be twenty-one, I was astonished at how much the old man had learned in seven years." I think he'd be tickled to know I did some digging and find there's no good proof Twain ever said it. His own father died when he was eleven. ETA: I missed the most important part. My father did not know his own father, and was raised by his grandfather, who was his best friend until he died. Edited March 17, 2021 by Madelaine McMasters 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowan Amore Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roseelvira Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, Madelaine McMasters said: Your central claim was clear and correct, Rose. Reading the bible or horoscopes does not make one do crazy stuff. My quibble was that Mother Theresa might be an example of how questionable behavior can be buffed to a high gloss by the application of religion rather than analysis. With great Respect and not challenging this article posted below was published by the huff post as well Sen Dick Durbin and Mother Teresa which is completely opposite of the link you mentioned Note this was published as well by the same news source the Huff post .I found other articles some positive and some negative about Mother Teresa . It seems the negatives were trying to derail the Canonization of Mother Teresa Sen. Dick Durbin, Contributor U.S. Senator from Illinois A Day With Mother Teresa | HuffPost Edited March 17, 2021 by roseelvira Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted McGregor Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, roseelvira said: It seems the negatives were trying to derail the Canonization of Mother Teres Meet the devil's advocate ( pro bono ) during said Canonization : Edited March 17, 2021 by TDD123 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madelaine McMasters Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, roseelvira said: With great Respect and not challenging this article posted below was published by the huff post as well Sen Dick Durbin and Mother Teresa which is completely opposite of the link you mentioned Note this was published as well by the same news source the Huff post .I found other articles some positive and some negative about Mother Teresa . It seems the negatives were trying to derail the Canonization of Mother Teresa Sen. Dick Durbin, Contributor U.S. Senator from Illinois A Day With Mother Teresa | HuffPost Mother Theresa, now Saint Theresa of Calcutta, does get very positive press. She wouldn't have been canonized if not for that. This is the high polish of religion, the same polish which was stripped away by the Boston Globe's "Spotlight Investigation" when they exposed rampant and widespread sexual abuse perpetrated by the Catholic Church. I have several cousins in my extended family (Mom was from a classic Irish-Catholic family) that knew priests who were found to have abused children. Here's the story of a priest from my own childhood church, known to my parents... https://www.archmil.org/clergy-abuse-response/restricted-priests/Widera.htm Imagine how difficult it would be for Walmart to perpetrate such abuse across its customer base. The special place religion holds in the human psyche is what allows the Catholic Church (and Mother Theresa) to receive so little scrutiny. Dick Durbin's one day in Mother Theresa's world was hardly enough for him see what was actually going on. That requires serious investigation and analysis. Canonization is not that. Edited March 17, 2021 by Madelaine McMasters 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luna Bliss Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 13 hours ago, roseelvira said: 15 hours ago, Luna Bliss said: Perhaps I should say 'most' would, or will. I doubt you would directly do so. However, sometimes by participating in something that has a negative effect on the world (Biblical Literalism) one can indirectly harm others Respectfully ,,,the most or will would not...... I was raised RC/ in my personal family and it is huge we have RC/Jewish/ Agnostic/ Atheist/ Methodists {,,,note love the Saturday dinners and pot lock wink} Lutheran, Baptist , assemble of GOD, Mennonite etc and two spaghetti monster s And we all respect each other and discuss each others beliefs with openness and love and see how the path each has chosen or practice has helped them become the most wonderful beautiful person s . NO ONE ACCUSES OR CONDEMN S OR BELITTLES We treasure each other WE attend each others services be it mass or temple ....the Bar Mitzvah was wonderful !!!! We have love and respect for each other we not only love w our heart but hear each others heart's ❤. and seeing life through the others eyes and walk in their shoes ,,,, And i have relatives that are lesbians and gay and no one has ever said they were bound for Hell . Reading the bible Praying Saying the rosary They are all passive participation so how can that have a negative effect on the world...??? Feeding the hungry?? The many out reach and ministries that do good and help from our parish??? And no they do not expect you to believe . Where does that harm the world ??? So when i am making boxes of food to deliver to the needy i am causing harm??? How?? Or paying for a persons bill for utilities and when they try to pay me back and i tell them no ,,, get the kids something . How is that harming another ??? These are some of the things we meaning my personal huge family who follow what Jesus said love one another do ??? So how does that hurt the world and indirectly harm another ??? please explain....... Those sound like heavenly picnics indeed. But you can't escape the fact that the larger organization you belong to, the Catholic Church, also does harm when it interprets the Bible literally and/or forces religious beliefs on its congregation and the rest of society. (Not all Catholics are Biblical Fundamentalists, btw, but Biblical Fundamentalism is on the increase in both Catholic and Protestant faiths in the U.S. today). Breaking bread together, whether outside at a picnic or inside at a potluck, is a very positive experience for all involved. Unfortunately, my potluck experience was a bit different than your picnic -- it was with a group of women (mostly lesbian ones along with a few beloved so-called 'token' straight women) where we comforted those from Catholic Fundamentalist families thrown out of these families for being gay, who had nowhere to go for Christmas because their family had disowned them and never wanted to see their face again. So we were their family during Christmas with our compensatory potluck. Imagine having your family reject you totally and completely and never wanting to see you again, simply for being who you are. Such is what the majority of religions are made of. Despite the above example, and many more heart-wrenching stories I could speak of, I actually love spirituality (not religion). Spirituality is the essence of all religions -- the mystic, contemplative dimension of love. Unfortunately, 'man' being what he is, manages to fork up whatever he gets his hands on and turns religion into the total opposite of what it should be, claiming that his way is the only 'one true way' and trying to force others to follow what he determines is right while making outcasts of those who don't tow the line. This is why religion should have no place in the laws of any nation, and why I hate, with a passion, Biblical Fundamentalism. Edited March 17, 2021 by Luna Bliss 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairreLilette Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 56 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said: Not all Catholics are Biblical Fundamentalists As my Mother told me who was raised RC, the masses used to be only allowed in Latin this is why many Catholics may not be fundamentalists. The Bible read outside of the Latin and the protestant translation is considered falsified by many RC. Also, even though my Mom later became a liberal catholic, perhaps a catholic of the heart and no longer attended mass nor went to church, she still believed the only appropriate, possible English translation of the Bible is the Douay-Rheims translated from the Latin Vulgate. My Mom hung around the RC church on some weekends to play bingo and knew a few priests but she was far more into her liberal Democratic life than anything. I also wanted to mention my Mom later told me the Roman Catholic church gave her panic attacks. We didn't talk in any length about why but I can assume this may be a reason my mother left as well as her beliefs against discrimination. My Mom was pro-LGBT. I have a cousin who married heterosexually. She is quite an out-going girl so could hide any problems quite well as she always made everyone laugh. About two years into the marriage, she came out as a lesbian who was living a lie. It was gut-retching at the time for the family to see the demise of this couple who did in a way love each other. My cousin later married her lesbian partner in Hawaii. My Aunt had a difficult time with it. My Mom helped my aunt a lot. 1 hour ago, Luna Bliss said: This is why religion should have no place in the laws of any nation, and why I hate, with a passion, Biblical Fundamentalism. Yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roseelvira Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, TDD123 said: Meet the devil's advocate ( pro bono ) during said Canonization : I did not know who he was but after reading he had dislike for GOD. HE WAS NOT OR EVER THE DEVILS ADVOCATE FOR THE CATHOLIC CHURCH OR DID ANY PRO BONO WORK FOR THE CHURCH ,,,,, THE CLIP IS HIS OPINION,,,,,,, .SO THAT IS VERY MISLEADING TITLE the clip is his opinion,,,,, That being said , a small number of individuals not all if they do not like something be it a person ,politics church whatever some will give an unfavorable report. Fact of life . If someone wanted to destroy a persons reputation they could follow someone film it edit it , put their spin on it . Write in a way to evoke negative emotions,,,,,, on and on many ways I look at both sides and the truth is somewhere in the middle I in asking my question my error was writing Mother Teresa [[[ NOTE i do not believe the bad press or negative opinions from that guy ,,,, if it was from Eddie izzard maybe.]]] as she was the first that came to mind other than Jesus . I should have written St Francis of Assisi but then again for all the good he has done there are some who have a problem w him. I get the feeling that NO MATTER who i put someone would have found fault. I can say my belief in GOD and Jesus has always brought me through so many horrible unspeakable times. I am not a scholar or expert, just a simple person trying to do the right thing always w love ,kindness , respect and understanding Note at no time have i ever told anyone to believe in my beliefs. I have questioned to understand others and respect how and why they made/ make their choices .Again others life it is their choice . If i read anyone of you were horrid etc would i believe it ,,,,, NOPE ,,,, why.... because i was not there or know every second to second detail of your situations . no one is perfect No situation is perfect the world is not perfect Judge not. Help as much as you can doing every thing w love and understanding, For those who do not believe in the divine - their choice For those who believe in the divine- their choice live and let live . Edited March 17, 2021 by roseelvira spell check thinggy not working 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orwar Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 50 minutes ago, roseelvira said: live and let live I much prefer to live and let die. ... Is going to have that riff stuck in his head for a week. Worth it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Facebook
Instagram
Twitter
YouTube
Flickr
Recommended Posts
Please take a moment to consider if this thread is worth bumping.
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now