Tracker HUDs

[AltynTagh]

 

51 minutes ago, Lucia Nightfire said:

2 times in 4 years?

Maybe they were just exploring SL and not hunting you down?

I sometimes decide to check out places I've never been to before and run into people I haven't talked to in years in the process.

@Lucia NightfireNo, the 2nd time I intentionally left the av parked for several days on a sim I have never been to in the past as a test to see how long it would take them to show up and to rule out some of the possible scenarios of how they had found me the first time that people have been suggesting. Because they also tracked down the friend I was with during the first incident I mentioned. They were able to find his SL house and saw him with the woman he was seeing and assumed it was me on an alt. During my test,  it took about a week before they walked right up to my av. I knew her being online suddenly for days at a time would pique their interest. I was correct. These sorts of things are part of why I am no longer with the person who has done this, but I know them well enough to know they will still watch to see what avs I use regardless.

[Mollymews]

Altyn, you were being hacked by a social engineering method not by a technical engineering method. The social engineer picks up on associations to discover you

if you were to create a new alt, dress it a new account default outfit, pick some region completely at random, turn your media off and never chat/communicate to anyone, then no social engineering method or technical engineering method will ever discover that it is you on that account

[Ceka Cianci]

2 times in 4 years sounds more like, just bad luck than  anything else..I'm more than likely going to run into someone I haven't seen in years in a sim I never go to, than ones I'm in more..

It's probably the reason i haven't seen them in years..

That happens in RL also..

I'll try a new store and end up running into someone I hadn't seen since high school.. hehehe

Edited February 23, 2021 by Ceka Cianci

[Qie Niangao]

  

6 hours ago, AltynTagh said:

I intentionally left the av parked for several days on a sim I have never been to in the past as a test to see how long it would take them to show up

How did you select that sim? If it was rigorously picked at random (meaning a real, formal pseudo-random algorithm to select from a list of all active regions) then there's something to consider here. Otherwise, any selection is very apt to be unconsciously biased in favor of a place somebody could eventually guess, given enough time -- and in this test, they had plenty of time.

If it weren't for this test where they apparently actively tracked you down (eventually), twice in four years really would seem almost surely coincidental... like when you start paying attention to a particular rare word and suddenly you'll start hearing it everywhere.

8 hours ago, AltynTagh said:

I have been told in the past that they use viewers that have nefarious purposes sometimes. 

It's not really what viewer they might be using, it's all about which one you're using. The challenge here is figuring out how you're leaking location information; once it's leaked, it's trivial to track, so a "tracker HUD" is useless without something providing it information; same with a naughty viewer. (Note that years ago there was briefly a bug that allowed a script to track somebody else's teleport if running on the region from which they teleported at the moment they teleported; in that case everybody was leaking that very ephemeral location information.)

Also, it's very true that the RLV protocol doesn't itself support any location tracking, but it can make it harder to rule out an unobserved attachment. Still, though, something somewhere would have to trigger that attachment, and the viewer would have to have RLV enabled and configured to accept silent attachments and... anyway, it's extremely unlikely to be relevant to the situation described here.

(Before anybody worries about Experiences: yes, once Experience permissions are granted they could trigger silent attachments, but they can't really track because the attachments auto-detach when leaving the region or parcel where the land-scope Experience is active.)

[Rowan Amore]

10 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:

  

How did you select that sim? If it was rigorously picked at random (meaning a real, formal pseudo-random algorithm to select from a list of all active regions) then there's something to consider here. Otherwise, any selection is very apt to be unconsciously biased in favor of a place somebody could eventually guess, given enough time -- and in this test, they had plenty of time.

If it weren't for this test where they apparently actively tracked you down (eventually), twice in four years really would seem almost surely coincidental... like when you start paying attention to a particular rare word and suddenly you'll start hearing it everywhere.

It's not really what viewer they might be using, it's all about which one you're using. The challenge here is figuring out how you're leaking location information; once it's leaked, it's trivial to track, so a "tracker HUD" is useless without something providing it information; same with a naughty viewer. (Note that years ago there was briefly a bug that allowed a script to track somebody else's teleport if running on the region from which they teleported at the moment they teleported; in that case everybody was leaking that very ephemeral location information.)

Also, it's very true that the RLV protocol doesn't itself support any location tracking, but it can make it harder to rule out an unobserved attachment. Still, though, something somewhere would have to trigger that attachment, and the viewer would have to have RLV enabled and configured to accept silent attachments and... anyway, it's extremely unlikely to be relevant to the situation described here.

(Before anybody worries about Experiences: yes, once Experience permissions are granted they could trigger silent attachments, but they can't really track because the attachments auto-detach when leaving the region or parcel where the land-scope Experience is active.)

I agree.  Twice in 4 years would seem more of a coincidence than any planned stalking.  

When this person appeared on the same region as you, did they engage with your avatar?  Did they harass you in any way?  

[FairreLilette]

I was on MP one day and per the usual with MP, all kinds of items appear all over the place.  A thread had been started about the man's wife feeling SL was porn and she was mad at him for being involved in SL a few days prior to me being on MP that day.  So, that day I'm on MP and there appears this LISTENING HUD or gadget thing that can listen to your IM's and chats although I am not sure of the name.  The OP or anyone would have to be wearing a device, like RLV, that allows your partner or sub or dom or whomever to listen to your IM's and chats though.  There is an LSL listening script.

Anyhow, 2 times in 2 years is not very much...it's the fact that they are that interested to know where and what this person or any person is doing is unsettling.  I gotta agree with January, it sounds like someone who doesn't have a life and there is something wrong there with them and probably especially in regards to their maturity.  

I have never seen a person I knew on SL before, only a few in the forums do I remember.  

[Rowan Amore]

9 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

IThe OP or anyone would have to be wearing a device, like RLV, that allows your partner or sub or dom or whomever to listen to your IM's and chats though.  There is an LSL listening script.

 

You can't listen in on IMs.  Only local chat.  

[FairreLilette]

25 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

You can't listen in on IMs.  Only local chat.  

I was pretty sure through that thread about the man's wife saying SL is porn we had established this listening HUD could listen to both local chat and IM's.  That thread had just occurred and then I was on MP and saw the device so I posted the link to that HUD in that thread and wrote "here, now you can check if YOUR partner is cheating", but I thought it was established it could listen to both.  I just woke up, so it would be a lot of posts for me to go through to find that thread where I linked that listening HUD.

I think the OP may have some kind of listener on him.  It's worth checking under worn.  What if someone passes you a script from an object that is turned invisible and thus the person forget they were even wearing it.  It makes sense in that okay now he's on this avi, since said person has a listening HUD, as soon as the person starts typing or saying where they are going, the other person knows.  

The best thing to do is re-build your avatar with nothing old worn.  Get all fresh copies of your parts and start your avatar completely over.  

To the OP, I don't believe this person you are speaking about has a tracking HUD, I believe they have some kind of listening HUD, which if you type where you are, then they know.   This would also explain why it hasn't been very often because you aren't typing where you are very often.

 

Edited February 23, 2021 by FairreLilette

[Ceka Cianci]

20 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

I was pretty sure through that thread about the man's wife saying SL is porn we had established this listening HUD could listen to both local chat and IM's.  That thread had just occurred and then I was on MP and saw the device so I posted the link to that HUD in that thread and wrote "here, now you can check if YOUR partner is cheating", but I thought it was established it could listen to both.  I just woke up, so it would be a lot of posts for me to go through to find that thread where I linked that listening HUD.

I think the OP may have some kind of listener on him.  It's worth checking under worn.  What if someone passes you a script from an object that is turned invisible and thus the person forget they were even wearing it.  It makes sense in that okay now he's on this avi, since said person has a listening HUD, as soon as the person starts typing or saying where they are going, the other person knows.  

The best thing to do is re-build your avatar with nothing old worn.  Get all fresh copies of your parts and start your avatar completely over.  

To the OP, I don't believe this person you are speaking about has a tracking HUD, I believe they have some kind of listening HUD, which if you type where you are, then they know.   This would also explain why it hasn't been very often because you aren't typing where you are very often.

 

I think I remember that thread.. Yea, you can't listen to anyone elses IM's..

  I think I even remember going into a story where someone planted a listening device in our sim to listen in on our meetings and us finding it and started to make a bunch of junk up to mess with them.. hehehe

I believe you can lock someone out from getting IM's in RLV, but I think that's about it.

 

[AltynTagh]

@Qie NiangaoYes, it was a sim type I would never normally frequent. I selected something way out of my normal habits or tastes. I have really done my due diligence on this to ensure it wasnt coincidence, that was the entire reason for the test, bc when they found me the first time, they claimed it was coincidence. That time I happened to be at a sim type they definitely would frequent. Also, as I mentioned, they also tracked down that friend of mine at his house so it definitely wasn't coincidence. Yes, during the test, they walked right up to my av and began engaging me in conversation. I happened to have just logged in when they arrived there, so I was not afk when this happened. When I saw them walk up, I said, “I knew it wouldn't take you long to show up here” and they laughed and joked about it. It was intentional. To those suggesting AV remakes to eliminate any old, forgotten attachments, this AV had been completely remade in both incidences and again, this person only knew my av existed, they were not in her friends list and had never given her anything. This was an avatar that has largely gone unused for most of her existence. Not one I hang out on a lot, so no one in her friends list other than my own avs and an RL friend of mine who didnt know my alt or the other party at the time of the first incident. 
 

@MollymewsYour suggestion is that this person is using some kind of algo to find me based upon my interactions with other people? Plausible I suppose, except that I sat her down and interacted with no one. She wasnt a totally new av, although totally remade, she was one they knew I had, but I logged her in, parked her and walked away for the entire time she was logged in, until the day they showed up when I had just logged back in.

[Rowan Amore]

2 minutes ago, AltynTagh said:

@Qie NiangaoYes, it was a sim type I would never normally frequent. I selected something way out of my normal habits or tastes. I have really done my due diligence on this to ensure it wasnt coincidence, that was the entire reason for the test, bc when they found me the first time, they claimed it was coincidence. That time I happened to be at a sim type they definitely would frequent. Also, as I mentioned, they also tracked down that friend of mine at his house so it definitely wasn't coincidence. Yes, during the test, they walked right up to my av and began engaging me in conversation. I happened to have just logged in when they arrived there, so I was not afk when this happened. When I saw them walk up, I said, “I knew it wouldn't take you long to show up here” and they laughed and joked about it. It was intentional. To those suggesting AV remakes to eliminate any old, forgotten attachments, this AV had been completely remade in both incidences and again, this person only knew my av existed, they were not in her friends list and had never given her anything. This was an avatar that has largely gone unused for most of her existence. Not one I hang out on a lot, so no one in her friends list other than my own avs and an RL friend of mine who didnt know my alt or the other party at the time of the first incident. 
 

@MollymewsYour suggestion is that this person is using some kind of algo to find me based upon my interactions with other people? Plausible I suppose, except that I sat her down and interacted with no one. She wasnt a totally new av, although totally remade, she was one they knew I had, but I logged her in, parked her and walked away for the entire time she was logged in, until the day they showed up when I had just logged back in.

Well, regardless of how it happened, when it happened or where it happened, the fact remains the same.  There is no SL function that allows a person to track another person all over the grid unless it's a scripted item you are wearing or an item they have rezzed in a region you are on.  My security orb IMs me when someone lands, giving me their name.  Totally allowable and doable.  Putting your name in some HUD to know where you are?  No.

[FairreLilette]

5 minutes ago, AltynTagh said:

She wasnt a totally new av, although totally remade

Not to upset you nor doubt you but just to make sure, did you CHARACTER TEST your avatar.  In other words, Ruth her?  I would think Ruthing her would make everything come off, and then re-build.  I just wanted to make doubly sure how you re-built for the record so we can completely rule out any possibility of a listening device being on you.

Although with your "tests" you have described, I think you would have known if you typed your location and I am sure you did not.  So, the listening device is most likely not the cause, although it could help others get one off if they have one on their avatar.  Just character test and ruth yourself before re-building and that's just general fyi information I'm giving here.

I can't think of anything else that would help.  Speaking of stalkers, many of us have experienced them.  I have too and have reported to LL who took care of it.  

[AltynTagh]

5 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

Not to upset you nor doubt you but just to make sure, did you CHARACTER TEST your avatar.  In other words, Ruth her?  I would think Ruthing her would make everything come off, and then re-build.  I just wanted to make doubly sure how you re-built for the record so we can completely rule out any possibility of a listening device being on you.

Although with your "tests" you have described, I think you would have known if you typed your location and I am sure you did not.  So, the listening device is most likely not the cause, although it could help others get one off if they have one on their avatar.  Just character test and ruth yourself before re-building and that's just general fyi information I'm giving here.

I can't think of anything else that would help.  Speaking of stalkers, many of us have experienced them.  I have too and have reported to LL who took care of it.  

@FairreLiletteNo, I didnt do character test before remaking her, but again, this is an AV that has largely gone unused and was never given anything by this person or doesnt live anywhere, so no orbs or anything would come into play on this. This person also wasnt in her friends list. 

@Rowan Amore Well, having ruled out just about every other option, and intentionally tested to verify it wasnt random, I’m really not sure how they figured it out apart from some kind of HUD or viewer or something that told them. Guess it doesnt matter. It isnt like they do this constantly and now that we arent together I doubt they will come hunt me down. But I am certain they will continue to notice when I am on that av, so if it really bothers me, I just wont ever use her. I dont normally, so not a big deal, it’s just I did actually just remake her and like her new look LOL. 

[AdminGirl]

@AltynTagh Honestly it's not worth changing your complete sl over one person. That person will get over it and find something else to obsess over, just give it time. If you like your new av, then use her and ignore the stalker. Who cares if he knows when you're logged on. Unless he constantly shows up wherever you are, then it's not worth worrying about. Use the sl tools available to you - block/derender/abuse report.

[FairreLilette]

6 minutes ago, AltynTagh said:

this is an AV that has largely gone unused and was never given anything by this person or doesnt live anywhere, so no orbs or anything would come into play on this. This person also wasnt in her friends list. 

Just to understand this better, okay could an avatar other than the person you are speaking about be on your friend's list as an alt who may have given you something that listens?  So say then that alt knows where you are by "listening" and then this person knows because THEY ARE the alt.  

Honestly, I don't think any of us are that intriguing that someone needs to stalk us around.  This is a power play, however.  Someone wants to power trip you.  

If you like the way this avatar looks but don't like this person power tripping you, you need to decide for yourself which is more important to you - the avatar or peace of mind away from the person.

 

[Talligurl]

I once had a guy who would randomly pop up in the sims I was in. He was a freind so I was not bothered that much by it. I was mostly curious as to how he did it. For quite some time he kept his secret. I did everything I could think of to make it impossible.  Eventually he let me know my mistake. I would post pictures to my dashboard and I had the show picture location thong enabled. Soon as I did that he showed up. 

[Rowan Amore]

2 minutes ago, Talligurl said:

I once had a guy who would randomly pop up in the sims I was in. He was a freind so I was not bothered that much by it. I was mostly curious as to how he did it. For quite some time he kept his secret. I did everything I could think of to make it impossible.  Eventually he let me know my mistake. I would post pictures to my dashboard and I had the show picture location thong enabled. Soon as I did that he showed up. 

People often post in their profile picks and the slurl for their home shows up when setting location.  

[Scylla Rhiadra]

16 minutes ago, Talligurl said:

show picture location thong

Freudian slip?

[Talligurl]

8 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Freudian slip?

Probably spell check knows me to well. Lol

Edited February 23, 2021 by Talligurl

[Ceka Cianci]

27 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

People often post in their profile picks and the slurl for their home shows up when setting location.  

Yep, That's one big thing.. I make sure I'm at some random sim when I put pics in my profile.. I think I did all mine at the help island or orientation station or something like that the last time I did mine..

I would take the pictures at my house or where ever, then just pick a different place to put them in..

I haven't changed mine in years.. hehehe

[FairreLilette]

@AltynTagh, I wanted to say I'm just giving general fyi opinions and information in my posts as there are "listeners" most people don't know about.  I'd think if someone passes a listener on a user, the Lindens have ways to check for these and disable them because it really is as simple as January said:  If someone doesn't want to be with you, they don't want to be with you.  I reported mine to the Lindens and am just giving encouragement for others, not necessarily the OP, to do so, report it to the Lindens because the OP says doesn't want to report it.  After my report, my problems were dead and gone.    

Edited February 23, 2021 by FairreLilette

[Silent Mistwalker]

Twice in 4 long years is nothing more than coincidence. Even twice in one year is coincidence. Twice in one day could still be coincidence but it isn't likely.

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 hours ago, Talligurl said:

I once had a guy who would randomly pop up in the sims I was in. He was a freind so I was not bothered that much by it. I was mostly curious as to how he did it. For quite some time he kept his secret. I did everything I could think of to make it impossible.  Eventually he let me know my mistake. I would post pictures to my dashboard and I had the show picture location thong enabled. Soon as I did that he showed up. 

There's also the locations on each pick in all profiles on Pick Tab, with teleport button. 

People don't realize they are giving themselves away until they start looking at things they think are totally unrelated.

Don't want people to know your home sim/region? Don't use it in your Picks!

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

People often post in their profile picks and the slurl for their home shows up when setting location.  

I should have finished reading the thread but instead I picked the post above yours to stop reading. 🤭

[Kyrie Deka]

On 2/21/2021 at 11:59 PM, AltynTagh said:

tracker HUDs people use generally track by

 

On 2/22/2021 at 3:17 AM, AltynTagh said:

 

 

naive and wrong if you believe that. They have never given me any object to track me...

So many to quote here I will stop there.

This individual(s) are playing head games, and you just weren't prepared for it so its freaking you out, and many of us (RL or SL!) have been there.  I'm so sorry.  But let's start with the fact that you seem to take the word of the nutcase(s) stalking you (=yes you can be tracked) *over* with knowledgeable folks here who have no reason to be freakin you out (=no you cannot be tracked except if...) are telling you.  What nutcase is trying to do is freak you out to see your reaction, and its workin pretty good.  That said, if you truly came here for answers to actions you can take to feel less freaked out/stalked, then first line of business is recognize that, it's cool, chill a little, donuts for everyone, and then slowly back away from believing stalker more than folks out here who have pretty vast experience to help.  

It's all good.

Highly recommend, regardless of what you think you have/not worn or joined inworld or touched, that for EACH of your avatars - that is every alt, every main, every tester:

*Open your Avatar > Appearance pop and SAVE YOUR OUTFIT.

*click CTL-ALT-T to add red overlay where invisible items are.  LOOK FOR items not expected that show invisible and attached > right click and EDIT > General Tab and look at the name.  Be sure you recognize the item - that it makes sense.  IF NOT recognized, then RIGHT-CLICK Detach.  Just take it off!  If it breaks your stuff, look at your just saved outfit and RIGHT-CLICK ADD.  You will not break anything.  If you find something, just take it off, and FIRST put it in a folder in inventory you clearly name CAUTION!  If you don't miss the item in a few weeks, just delete the thing totally.

 

I received a gift rose from someone back in the day, and somehow (perhaps I didn't realize I put it on who knows) there was an invisible ball on my left arm... when I detached the rose later, the invisible ball was not detached, and transmitted where I was all the time and showing up there.  I read up, took advise of experienced others, searched as above, took off the invisible item, and moved on learning to pay attention else it would happen again.

 

You need to do above with every single avatar you use.  Clean em up.  Snicker all the way to tomorrow because stalker will never be "fed" by your discomfort ever again... unless you give permission of course.  Some role like that

 

Wishing you the fun and peace on your own terms that you deserve in SL *hugs*