How to get a SL avatar into Marvelous Designer

[princxsamileena]

I've been striggling to find a way to get a SL avatar into MD? How do you do it? Does it matter what avatar you use in MD to make the clothing?

 

Thank you! 

[Janet Voxel]

5 hours ago, princxsamileena said:

I've been striggling to find a way to get a SL avatar into MD? How do you do it? Does it matter what avatar you use in MD to make the clothing?

 

Thank you! 

Export the avatar as an obj from Blender, import into MD. Once you set up the arrangement points save as avatar in MD so you can just open it back up again.

[Cyrule Adder]

If you mean an existing SL Avatar, you need a developer kit from the devs themselves. Otherwise, you would need full permissions in order to download the avatar from the SL servers. But that download data does not normally have skinned information I think.

[BinBash]

Hi \o

Someone suggested that having full permission on a mesh allows you to download it from the servers, which is incorrect.  You cannot extract a mesh uploaded by someone else, regardless of permissions, thankfully.

However, I have the impression that you're talking about the classic avatar mesh provided by LL, in which case there are many resources available for download, even specifically prepared for Marvelous Designer, including arrangement points.

Contact me in-world for download links and more details...

... and, have fun \o/

 

[princxsamileena]

Thank you all!!!! 

[Kyrah Abattoir]

It sounds to me like you might want to learn more about blender first.

[BinBash]

Someone suggested that Blender is effectively required learning before diving into Marvelous Designer *sigh*

Telling someone that they need to learn Blender first is suggesting that they hold off trying to learn a vary valuable tool before diving into another one that is unrelated.

Blender is NOT related to Marvelous Designer, in any way, and is not required learning in order use, understand and enjoy Marvelous Designer.  Blender is not even required in a creators pipe-line to create anything at all for Second Life.  When I first started I was using 3ds Max since I purchased it as part of my work-flow in the field.

It seams to me that anyone suggesting this aught to expand their world of knowledge, step out of their door and see that there are other things besides what they think they know.

And don't forget to have fun on the way \o/

 

[Wulfie Reanimator]

12 minutes ago, BinBash said:

Telling someone that they need to learn Blender first is suggesting that they hold off trying to learn a vary valuable tool before diving into another one that is unrelated.

Blender is NOT related to Marvelous Designer, in any way, and is not required learning in order use, understand and enjoy Marvelous Designer.

You're not wrong in saying that Blender and Marvelous Designer are unrelated and that learning one doesn't necessitate the other.

However, using just one or the other might not get you where you need to be if your end-goal is to start selling clothes on SL.

Marvelous Designer is a great tool for designing clothes, but it's not enough on its own. It cannot rig clothes to a skeleton, for example. For that, you must use another program.

12 minutes ago, BinBash said:

Blender is not even required in a creators pipe-line to create anything at all for Second Life.  When I first started I was using 3ds Max since I purchased it as part of my work-flow in the field.

It seams to me that anyone suggesting this aught to expand their world of knowledge, step out of their door and see that there are other things besides what they think they know.

🤔

I'm glad you were able to start out with 3ds Max, but I don't think anyone should be suggesting it to a beginner. It seems you're the one who needs to think a bit.

Blender is free and popular, with lots of tutorials and plugins specifically intended for creation for Second Life.

Edited December 27, 2020 by Wulfie Reanimator

[BinBash]

A person without options uses what's pushed at them.  I'm guessing your options have been limited.  Is it the general consensus that a person  aught to not invest financially in their business, even in their hobby?

When I first started out Blender was a contender, and not because it was free.  Because of some limitations it was unusable in my work-flow so I landed on 3ds Max.

I can appreciate your argument, that Blender is free, but one doesn't choose a tool because it's free, one would hope, but because it's functional.  Blender is limited in its function with regard to Second Life and is why the targeted tools are necessary.

Giving a "beginner" a single option seems to make sense to some people.  I find this to be limiting, ignorant and even insulting.  Do we suggest only free things to people because we think they are not willing, or able, to afford alternatives?   While the tools mentioned that are targeted for Second Life are almost a requirement because of Blenders limitations, they are comparatively very inexpensive, including my very own "Bento Buddy".

As we delve into the world of "free" I suggested, in no way, that someone aught to use 3ds Max, but someone chose to use it as a target for their posturing.  But this subject is relative.  The assertion of what's expensive is not in the same field of what's "free".  They may seam like the same subject but they only seam that way.  So, comparing the cost of using 3ds Max against what is free must feel like a big win, but it's meaningless.

I once had a free toaster.  It gave me a lot of grief when trying to use it for 3d modeling.  Hay, but it was "Free"!

 

Edited December 27, 2020 by BinBash

[Wulfie Reanimator]

27 minutes ago, BinBash said:

A person without options uses what's pushed at them.  I'm guessing your options have been limited.  Is it the general consensus that a person  aught to not invest financially in their business, even in their hobby?

Giving a "beginner" a single option seems to make sense to some people.  I find this to be limiting, ignorant and even insulting.  Do we suggest only free things to people because we think they are not willing, or able, to afford alternatives?

I would never assume that a person can (or is willing to) afford $200 per month on a hobby they're just starting.

One option is better than none, and it's only a starting point. It's not very difficult to find alternatives, just as you did. Nobody is hiding ZBrush, Maya, SketchUp, Rhino, etc.

The reason why I would personally suggest Blender to someone, besides it being free, is that it would be easier for me to assist them with any problems they might have. If you were a beginner and I told you to get 3ds Max (despite me having barely used it), how could I answer any of your questions in a meaningful way? "Sorry, I don't know. Google it?" With Blender, I can write or take screenshots or even record a video to explain step-by-step how to do something, no matter how specific it needs to be.

Edited December 27, 2020 by Wulfie Reanimator

[BinBash]

Now you are making sense Wulfie, we definitely would like to be able to help someone if they are asking for our help.  Often I would suggest to a person to use 3ds Max's educational edition because it is a free learning tool, and does not suffer Blender's downfalls requiring them to purchase an add-on, including mine, in order to start having fun.  After some experience with that, it's not difficult to swap tools or even use it in their work-flow.  I find 3ds Max to be a very useful tool when comparing output from various kits, Blender tools, and even my very own "Bento Buddy" add-on, for Blender no less.

\o/

 

Edited December 27, 2020 by BinBash

[Kyrah Abattoir]

On 12/27/2020 at 7:49 PM, BinBash said:

Blender is not even required in a creators pipe-line to create anything at all for Second Life.  When I first started I was using 3ds Max since I purchased it as part of my work-flow in the field.

I only picked Blender in my example because Blender is free and has excellent tools focused on SL content, but whatever modeling package floats your boat, to make optimized, clean, efficient models for a game/realtime application (SL), I don't have any allegiance to Blender, I worked with 3D Studio for 15 years before I decided to abandon it.

It doesn't matter if you use MD, Zbrush, Mudbox, or any of the more sculting/styling oriented tools out there, the output of those tools, is simply not ready for upload.

Any creator (even hobbyists) should acquire strong foundational skills in the generalistic 3D package of their choice before, they start diving into those other tools.

Edited January 1, 2021 by Kyrah Abattoir

[Monstaar Mama]

Blender is by far the easiest tool for beginner creators to learn, and for those without the financial means to acquire programs like 3ds Max/Maya/etc it is indispensable. However, aside from that, @Wulfie Reanimator is correct. Marvelous Designer alone is not sufficient to create mesh for SL. Wulfie seems to be inferring that the poster is not experienced enough to know their way around marvelous designer and that they don't seem to have a backup program to complete -the rest- of the content creation pipeline such as rigging/UVing/etc. If they did, they would certainly know how to export an OBJ to import into Marvelous Designer. Hence why they suggested learning their way around a simpler/easier to access tool like Blender first :).

To the original poster:

To answer your question,

the easiest method for you is going to be to:

-download Blender (2.79 has the most stable support) and purchase Avastar (It's not expensive, and totally worth it if you plan to go into content creation seriously)

-Once you have the Avastar Add-on installed, you can export the generic Avatar model as an OBJ (object)

-and then import that object into MD (look up a tutorial on importing models into Marvelous Designer)

-You can then design your clothes, export them, and from there you will need to rig them/Texture them and etc. I do not know if you already know how to do this so I'm not going to assume.

 

If you want to make mesh for something like Maitreya/Legacy/Slink etc, you will need to apply for the kits. Most of them come with OBJs already prepared for use in programs like Marvelous Designer :). These steps will help you get the basic Second Life Avatar mesh into Marvelous Designer. You may hit me up in world if you'd like clarification on some things :D.

[BinBash]

30 minutes ago, Kyrah Abattoir said:

I only picked Blender in my example because Blender is free and has excellent tools focused on SL content, but whatever modeling package floats your boat, to make optimized, clean, efficient models for a game/realtime application (SL) you need to get some proficiency at modeling/editing/cleaning up models directly, at the polygon level.

It doesn't matter if you use MD, Zbrush, Mudbox, or any of the more sculting/styling oriented tooks out there, the output of those tools, is simply not ready for upload.

Any creator (even hobbyists) should acquire strong foundational skills in the generalistic 3D package of their choice before, they start diving into those other tools.

I've been around a few days and I'm not aware of Blender having excellent tools focused on SL content.  Please educate me.

I AM aware that Blender is not capable of exporting content compatible with some of Second Life's features, without additional tools.  The "free" tools, that I have bumped into over the years are not as functional as one might think and the purchased ones, well, that makes Blender a non-free avenue doesn't it?

While it may appear that I'm not a proponent of using Blender it really is far from it, but it does create a "bump in the road" for those new to creating content for Second Life, especially skinned items and animations.

I certainly appreciate your point Kyrah but your expanded view still doesn't suggest a functional work-flow without additional tools though you seem to believe that it does.  You're suggesting that it doesn't matter what you use, and in some other argument it would be true, but that is not the point we are having here.  The deviated point is about Blender NOT being the first/correct choice for a beginner, without paying for additional tools, it is NOT a free pipeline.  Having it as a first suggestion, and the only one, especially when it is presumed that they cannot, or are unwilling to, afford a different avenue except "free" is not functional.

But what is the inference when using Marvelous Designer in a Second Life content creation pipe-line?.  It could very well NOT be clothing, but I find that unlikely.  And if it is clothing, well, that's skinning, don't we think?  And if it is skinning, we expect fitted mesh?  And if it is fitted mesh, do we expect Blender to be able to export those specific bone properties?  Of the later, let's hope not because it can't.  Any other sane 3d application can, it's simple.

Without clarification the solution you offered earlier was not helpful to the creator since it requires additional tools and neither is your revision.

I'm all for learning, it's what I do when I'm not sleeping, so give me some learnin' please!

 

Edited January 1, 2021 by BinBash

[Kyrah Abattoir]

13 minutes ago, BinBash said:

But what is the inference when using Marvelous Designer in a Second Life content creation pipe-line?

Marvelous designer is closer to some kind of digital sculting tool than 3D modeling and you won't get better at making low poly models no matter how much you practice with it.

It is a nice took, but it is the wrong tool to begin low poly modeling.

A quick inspection makes it painfully obvious whether A PRODUCT is basically MD's export output with zero remeshing or unwrapping done to it.

Edited January 1, 2021 by Kyrah Abattoir

[Monstaar Mama]

Marvelous Designer is closer to Zbrush in concept, when you think about it. It's a highly specialized sculpting program with very limited tools in other areas. One of the benefits to using it though is that it does create some very simple easy UVs that are easy for starting Texture artists to find their way around :D. I actually own and and now that I'm comfortable enough with mesh, I plan to start using it this year!

5 minutes ago, Kyrah Abattoir said:

A quick inspection makes it painfully obvious whether A PRODUCT is basically MD's export output with zero remeshing or unwrapping done to it.

Yeeees god. You can tell when you inspect the mesh. It both deforms weirdly when rigged and nearly crashes my viewer when I try to inspect it. MD mesh should always be retopologized before it is rigged, hence most of us assuming that the OP needs to learn Blender/Some other program first.

 

[BinBash]

18 minutes ago, Monstaar said:

Blender is by far the easiest tool for beginner creators to learn, and for those without the financial means to acquire programs like 3ds Max/Maya/etc it is indispensable. However, aside from that, @Wulfie Reanimator is correct. Marvelous Designer alone is not sufficient to create mesh for SL. Wulfie seems to be inferring that the poster is not experienced enough to know their way around marvelous designer and that they don't seem to have a backup program to complete -the rest- of the content creation pipeline such as rigging/UVing/etc. If they did, they would certainly know how to export an OBJ to import into Marvelous Designer. Hence why they suggested learning their way around a simpler/easier to access tool like Blender first :).

To the original poster:

To answer your question,

the easiest method for you is going to be to:

-download Blender (2.79 has the most stable support) and purchase Avastar (It's not expensive, and totally worth it if you plan to go into content creation seriously)

-Once you have the Avastar Add-on installed, you can export the generic Avatar model as an OBJ (object)

-and then import that object into MD (look up a tutorial on importing models into Marvelous Designer)

-You can then design your clothes, export them, and from there you will need to rig them/Texture them and etc. I do not know if you already know how to do this so I'm not going to assume.

 

If you want to make mesh for something like Maitreya/Legacy/Slink etc, you will need to apply for the kits. Most of them come with OBJs already prepared for use in programs like Marvelous Designer :). These steps will help you get the basic Second Life Avatar mesh into Marvelous Designer. You may hit me up in world if you'd like clarification on some things :D.

It makes sense that Monstaar isn't aware of a free avenue, many people think there is only one solution so even though 3ds Max's free educational version can be used to tinker with, and is compatible with Second Life specific features, let's put that aside for a moment and, again, address the "single pipe-line" model that so many seem to be preporting as a means for creating and using mesh in Second Life.

First, creating mesh, uploading it to Second Life, if it's not skinned, I guess that's not what we're talking about right?  Because that can be done with MD.

So skinned, mesh, kits, yea, let's do that.  This is a process from my "Bento Buddy" Add-on for Blender.  It's quick, almost automatic, and allows for things others say can't be done, go figure.  https://youtu.be/vyH4Q1NBVDE

To the original poster:

To answer your question,

the easiest method for you is going to be to:

-Download Blender (2.8x, 2.9x) series, Bento Buddy is written specifically for this newer Blender remodeling, we love it \o/
-Purchase Bento Buddy, it's half the price of Avastar, it does everything, and the other thing too, the support is over the top
-Once you have Bento Buddy Add-on installed you select your kit mesh and click a button... not even any menus to look for
-Import that into MD, see the included video for the complete work-flow
-Make yourself some clothing using the kits that are freely available and some for purchase, contact me in-world for information
-After you have some skinned mesh in your store, which proves you're committed to the process, you'll be able to get accepted for other kits easily

[BinBash]

And please, like the others said, be kind, do not upload raw MD files without retopo first, it's just mean.

[Kyrah Abattoir]

12 minutes ago, BinBash said:

educational version

Those usually don't allow commercial use however, worth noting I think. Not that it is gonna stop anyone obviously.

[Monstaar Mama]

6 minutes ago, BinBash said:

It makes sense that Monstaar isn't aware of a free avenue, many people think there is only one solution so even though 3ds Max's free educational version can be used to tinker with, and is compatible with Second Life specific features, let's put that aside for a moment and, again, address the "single pipe-line" model that so many seem to be preporting as a means for creating and using mesh in Second Life.

I was aware of that, actually! The problem with suggesting that to a potential -beginner- is that there is not as much documentation for 3DS content creation for Second Life as there is for Blender/Avastar. Blender/Avastar are far more widely supported than anything else I've encountered in my years of being just a general content creator, so I do see it as a solid option for those just dipping their toes into creating mesh for Second Life.

However, I am a thorough proponent for being resourceful and having options, -I- will likely buy the "Bento Buddy" Add on you made :3. It does look handy. Avastar does have it's drawbacks, and most serious content creators should have more than one way to get things done!

[BinBash]

1 minute ago, Monstaar said:

I was aware of that, actually! The problem with suggesting that to a potential -beginner- is that there is not as much documentation for 3DS content creation for Second Life as there is for Blender/Avastar. Blender/Avastar are far more widely supported than anything else I've encountered in my years of being just a general content creator, so I do see it as a solid option for those just dipping their toes into creating mesh for Second Life.

However, I am a thorough proponent for being resourceful and having options, -I- will likely buy the "Bento Buddy" Add on you made :3. It does look handy. Avastar does have it's drawbacks, and most serious content creators should have more than one way to get things done!

Your point is well taken, I stand corrected.

Well I tried, but I had to hop instead.

 

 

[BinBash]

4 minutes ago, Kyrah Abattoir said:

Those usually don't allow commercial use however, worth noting I think. Not that it is gonna stop anyone obviously.

Definitely an important point to make and I would never suggest that anyone use it in a commercial setting, without a proper license.  Many of use moved to a proper license when we became confident that our ability to use the tool would be consistent.

[Kyrah Abattoir]

10 hours ago, BinBash said:

Definitely an important point to make and I would never suggest that anyone use it in a commercial setting, without a proper license.  Many of use moved to a proper license when we became confident that our ability to use the tool would be consistent.

Many also claim that they have :3