Why is VRChat taking over where SL should be? Why is there no Android/IOS client?

[Lucia Nightfire]

A viewer that could allow someone to Vtube with their SL avatar would be nice.

And I do mean with full body tracking and face tracking. 😉

Edited November 11, 2020 by Lucia Nightfire

[Maitimo]

7 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

What about tablets using android or ios? Plenty of people use those in place of laptops and are powerful enough to run SL as is. Mobile doesn't just mean phone.

 

No Android or iOS device exists yet that has enough 3d capability to run SL. A few have tried, and failed. SL just isn't compatible. Plus, it's pretty much impossible to navigate SL without a proper keyboard and mouse.

VR was dropped because the framerates don't get high enough for it, and it made people feel sick.

[Solar Legion]

A fork of a TPV, how nice.

Meanwhile a decent VR headset still costs almost as much (more for some setups) as a brand new, next generation GPU or CPU. Oh and let's not forget the little issue with FPS either.

I'll spend what money I do have on things I'll get more use out of, thanks.

[Arielle Popstar]

5 hours ago, Maitimo said:

No Android or iOS device exists yet that has enough 3d capability to run SL. A few have tried, and failed. SL just isn't compatible. Plus, it's pretty much impossible to navigate SL without a proper keyboard and mouse.

Where do people get this idea from? I've been running Lumiya viewer for android for years on my phones and with each upgrade, have found it to be an increasingly better experience that is directly dependent on the amount of operating ram the phone has. I started with a 2 GB that was ok and am now up to a 6GB LG 8X that works quite well even though the phone itself is just a middle of the road model. 12GB phones expected to be mainstream next year which will wind up surpassing many of the desktop/laptops connecting to S/L today. The only unfortunate thing is that Lumiya is no longer being updated but so far at least it is still usable on newer phones though it is now missing some of the newer features brought in to S/L. Casting it to larger screens and hooking bluetooth mice and keyboards are childsplay if one wishes to use those. For users who are focused mainly on the social and dress up barbie aspects as well as some clubbing, an android viewer like Lumiya is more than usable and has been for years already.

Edited November 11, 2020 by Arielle Popstar

[Solar Legion]

Lumiya is - as you at least partially remembered to note - abandoned. No, you're not going to get much more than "Need to log in to pay this box" or CSR use out of it or any similar mobile application. Your best bet is the use of a streaming system like Stadia or any of the others in development.

I really do wish people would stop trying to use Lumiya as their go to attempt to "prove" mobile devices are capable of running Second Life - they're not, even Lumiya had to make optimizations and limitations to make it usable beyond a messaging application.

This from someone that still has it and uses it on occasion (on an LG V30) - for the express purpose of sending messages and payments.

[Bree Giffen]

Minecraft has VR now. Kids can’t use VR unfortunately. I remember telling kids they can’t use the Nintendo Virtual Boy. 

[Ultima Cloud]

There used to be an app where you could log on and chat. That's about it.  Not sure if it's still around. 

[Rowan Amore]

28 minutes ago, Ultimo Constantineau said:

There used to be an app where you could log on and chat. That's about it.  Not sure if it's still around. 

I do remember that from years ago.

[Crim Mip]

VR Chat hasn't won anything. It's pretty much the only game in town if you're one of the very small percentage with VR gear and want some sort of virtual world setting. It's not nearly as versatile as Second Life. Mostly people standing around in generic default avatars chatting and 'gesturbating' Want a custom AV? I hope you have multiple hundreds of dollars. It's the app that's getting noise about it. Probably will be something you don't hear about a year from now.

[Aluviel Nakamura]

Totally agree with Crim, I get so frustrated when I go there. I had the opportunity to perform there and guess what? cant script an instrument because it sucks all the bandwith.. none of the houses work except Maybe if your lucky a door might swing open. No inventory.. you go from having 100K items to not even be allowed to change your hairstyle!! and it will drive you nuts. I just paid over 100 bucks for a custom avatar, and someone copy botted it right in front of me within 20 minutes. They then started to attack and ram me with my own avatar....bang and bump me while screaming like the exorcist. I had to take it down from the main server.. If I could pull everyone away from Vr chat with all the 3 year old acting trolls and rip off a-holes I would.  Vr chat can burn for all I care.. I only go on there maybe once a week.

 

[Penny Patton]

Reminds me of a twitter thread I saw recently. There were dozens of replies like these I just cropped a few.

 

[Milo Darkheart]

Well to get to the point VR chat is more social and you can talk to random people about anything in SL people dont really talk at all in world most are jsut zombies so its not surprising VR chat is big right now when most of us are stuck inside, and as for minecraft its always been popular its a relaxing game you can play with friends

[Rowan Amore]

9 minutes ago, CopenhagenBlack said:

Well to get to the point VR chat is more social and you can talk to random people about anything in SL people dont really talk at all in world most are jsut zombies so its not surprising VR chat is big right now when most of us are stuck inside, and as for minecraft its always been popular its a relaxing game you can play with friends

I talk to.random people about anything all the time in SL.  It's pretty much why I log in.  I've learned long ago (this isn't a new thing) that people in busy places are mostly chatting in IMs which is how I prefer to chat.  I would also say that 90% of the time when I IM someone, I get a response.  I have never just stood there, had no one message me and assume everyone is a zombie, afk, a bot.  Some days, I may just stand back and people watch and read profiles but if someone does message, I always respond.

[Silent Mistwalker]

On 11/6/2020 at 4:08 PM, FairreLilette said:

I wasn't using profit...I think it's trying to compare night to day.  Second Life and Minecraft attract two different user bases; have different minimum spec requirements; etc.  I wasn't using profit at all, but rather they are just totally different using the parameters I wrote above.  I don't think parents of young kids want their kids on Second Life.  We cannot compare a family game to what is a PG/mostly Adult "game".  

Compare Second Life with a PG/Adult "game" that needs the same specs and doesn't sell toys as Fortnite does.  Fortnite makes a mint off of selling toys.  So, it's probably IMVU that is comparable to Second Life.  I don't know if IMVU is in the same league as SL profit-wise or not but I'd say probably not.  Second Life and Minecraft are in different categories...like watching the Music award shows have different categories. 

IMVU was aimed at the 18 and under demographic which is why you hardly find anyone over 30 there.

SL was and is aimed at 18 and over. 

You're comparing apples to oranges.

[Silent Mistwalker]

On 11/10/2020 at 6:39 PM, lucagrabacr said:

I wish the planned VR viewer / project for SL works out though

They're planning on trying it again?  I'm not so sure that's a good idea after the first and only attempt.

[Silent Mistwalker]

On 11/10/2020 at 7:00 PM, Arielle Popstar said:

Try this link for more up to date info on the current FirestormVR version.

 http://blog.inf.ed.ac.uk/atate/2019/09/27/firestorm-vr-6-2-4/

That isn't LL doing it. So no, LL is not working on a new VR viewer.

Edited January 2, 2021 by Silent Mistwalker

[Silent Mistwalker]

On 11/10/2020 at 9:56 PM, Gabriele Graves said:

VR isn't going to appeal to me until we can jack in a la Matrix style and it feels like I am moving about normally when sat in a chair.  Everything about it even now is clunky, restrictive, potentially damaging, expensive, hot, sweaty and unpleasant.  I'll use my imagination to immerse myself until then.

I'll take a holodeck over VR a la Matrix any day. 🤭

 

[Milo Darkheart]

2 hours ago, RowanMinx said:

I talk to.random people about anything all the time in SL.  It's pretty much why I log in.  I've learned long ago (this isn't a new thing) that people in busy places are mostly chatting in IMs which is how I prefer to chat.  I would also say that 90% of the time when I IM someone, I get a response.  I have never just stood there, had no one message me and assume everyone is a zombie, afk, a bot.  Some days, I may just stand back and people watch and read profiles but if someone does message, I always respond.

Just saying what ive seen no need to get in a huff lol

[Coffee Pancake]

On 11/6/2020 at 3:56 PM, JohnLe Fukai said:

Why did Minecraft (*****ing lego blocks) win over SL?

Minecraft won for accessibility reasons. It presented a simple infinite Lego like experience and did so in a way that even small children could grasp.

SL's accessibility is horrendous, even for nerdy adults with time to learn.

[Rowan Amore]

35 minutes ago, CopenhagenBlack said:

Just saying what ive seen no need to get in a huff lol

Wasn't in a huff at all.  I was just saying what my experience has been.

[Bridget Pinkerton]

I don't think VR Chat is going to last. IIRC lots of old time griefers from the old days of the Welcome Areas went there. At least that's what I saw when I popped in when it first opened. Frankly, I think there's room for SL and VRChat as they also tend to serve different functions.

[Arielle Popstar]

9 hours ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

That isn't LL doing it. So no, LL is not working on a new VR viewer.

Eh? Yah the FirestormVR should be the first clue that it isn't the Lab working on it. Unfortunately between a few in the lab and some forum scoffers, progress in the capabilities of the official viewer will stay stuck at around the 2009 level.

[Arielle Popstar]

On 11/11/2020 at 10:34 AM, Solar Legion said:

Lumiya is - as you at least partially remembered to note - abandoned. No, you're not going to get much more than "Need to log in to pay this box" or CSR use out of it or any similar mobile application. Your best bet is the use of a streaming system like Stadia or any of the others in development.

I really do wish people would stop trying to use Lumiya as their go to attempt to "prove" mobile devices are capable of running Second Life - they're not, even Lumiya had to make optimizations and limitations to make it usable beyond a messaging application.

This from someone that still has it and uses it on occasion (on an LG V30) - for the express purpose of sending messages and payments.

Every viewer has optimizations and limitations to make it work for S/L. They are constant works in progress to stay up to date. What you and the Lab don't seem to get is that there is that mobile is taking an ever increasing share of the market for gamers. There is a number of articles out there right now pointing out how during this Covid lockdown the mobile social and gaming market has grown by leaps and bounds while LL sits on its hands on even the text viewers it has promised to put out. 

The fact that you limited yourself in how you used Lumiya is your deal as there were/are plenty of people who used it for a lot more then just a way to make payments. Had we had updates over the past 3 years on the better mobile hardware available today in comparison to what was normal then, it would no doubt be even closer to a full viewer. You are in a tiny minority who seems to feel S/L should move forward by going backwards in how we access the virtual world. Like it or not, the world is moving to mobile and VR. Fossils are going to get left behind. In that regard S/L doesn't have to suffer that fate and could put a lot more emphasis in at least modernizing itself in those ways even if the renderer is antiquated. Lumiya and FirestormVR have proved that in spite of all your scoffing.

[Solar Legion]

2 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Every viewer has optimizations and limitations to make it work for S/L. They are constant works in progress to stay up to date. What you and the Lab don't seem to get is that there is that mobile is taking an ever increasing share of the market for gamers. There is a number of articles out there right now pointing out how during this Covid lockdown the mobile social and gaming market has grown by leaps and bounds while LL sits on its hands on even the text viewers it has promised to put out. 

The fact that you limited yourself in how you used Lumiya is your deal as there were/are plenty of people who used it for a lot more then just a way to make payments. Had we had updates over the past 3 years on the better mobile hardware available today in comparison to what was normal then, it would no doubt be even closer to a full viewer. You are in a tiny minority who seems to feel S/L should move forward by going backwards in how we access the virtual world. Like it or not, the world is moving to mobile and VR. Fossils are going to get left behind. In that regard S/L doesn't have to suffer that fate and could put a lot more emphasis in at least modernizing itself in those ways even if the renderer is antiquated. Lumiya and FirestormVR have proved that in spite of all your scoffing.

That's quite rich and it seems you've only read what you wish to read - as usual for quite a few when it comes to topics like this.

Lumiya was limited from the very beginning - no amount of wishful thinking or pretending will change that. The newer mobile hardware between the initial release and the time development on it ceased changed nothing either.

Lumiya proved nothing whatsoever and the fork of Firestorm with VR support will do nothing whatsoever either.

That is not "scoffing" - that is facing reality.

As is facing the simple fact that VR setups - any worth a hoot anyway - are prohibitively expensive.

I am in a tiny minority? Funny ... I don't seem to recall telling you how I feel Linden Lab (Second Life is software and can only move where its developers take it) should proceed.

To sum it all up for you in a nice, TL;DR package - Before responding to me in topics like this in the future, perhaps you should know what you're responding to first - you know, so you don't absolutely miss with your response.

[Arielle Popstar]

25 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

That's quite rich and it seems you've only read what you wish to read - as usual for quite a few when it comes to topics like this.

Lumiya was limited from the very beginning - no amount of wishful thinking or pretending will change that. The newer mobile hardware between the initial release and the time development on it ceased changed nothing either.

Lumiya proved nothing whatsoever and the fork of Firestorm with VR support will do nothing whatsoever either.

That is not "scoffing" - that is facing reality.

As is facing the simple fact that VR setups - any worth a hoot anyway - are prohibitively expensive.

I am in a tiny minority? Funny ... I don't seem to recall telling you how I feel Linden Lab (Second Life is software and can only move where its developers take it) should proceed.

To sum it all up for you in a nice, TL;DR package - Before responding to me in topics like this in the future, perhaps you should know what you're responding to first - you know, so you don't absolutely miss with your response.

 

It is your opinions which does not necessarily equate to any reality except as it exists for you. Some of us read the black text and refrain from reading between the lines for what you really meant. The text combined with the myriad of scoffing on various posts though does give an indication of what development paths might be left that you'd be ok with.

Edited January 3, 2021 by Arielle Popstar