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Prokofy Neva
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1 hour ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Um, it's not my AV going nuts as that would not be happening on just one or two sims, as is the case. It would happen on all sims. I travel to lots of sims. It's only happening on one, sometimes two.

It could be your AV to be fair & it's not unusual for this to happen on only certain regions.
The usual cause is either parcel media, or a media enabled object rezzed on the land or worn by an avatar on the land (if you have play media attached to avatars enabled) that either points to a known malicious URL or it could be a perfectly legit URL that the antivirus just happens to take a dislike to for some reason.

If there is a particular region on which your AV always gives a warning, can you post the region name & I'll go & have a look.
Can you also take a screenshot of the warning from the AV the next time it happens so we can see if it's slplugin or dullahan that's triggering the warning & if a URL is mentioned.

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The Edit Window opening over the object being edited....

This happens to me, too, in Firestorm. It is annoying, and has been discussed elsewhere. I don't have time to search for the topics right now, but this is not a one-off problem.

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As far as I can tell (*) the edit window always opens at the position you last closed it in, so assuming it initially opens mid-screen where your object is, drag it to one side or the other of the window, and when you re-edit the object it should stay at that side out of the way?

 

* Thinking back, I'm not sure if it retains the remembered position between logins/

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11 minutes ago, Odaks said:

The Edit Window opening over the object being edited....

This happens to me, too, in Firestorm. It is annoying, and has been discussed elsewhere. I don't have time to search for the topics right now, but this is not a one-off problem.

See below and response to below

4 minutes ago, Profaitchikenz Haiku said:

As far as I can tell (*) the edit window always opens at the position you last closed it in, so assuming it initially opens mid-screen where your object is, drag it to one side or the other of the window, and when you re-edit the object it should stay at that side out of the way?

 

* Thinking back, I'm not sure if it retains the remembered position between logins/

It does retain that position between sessions. Which brings us all the way back to it not being normal behavior and something being quite wrong somewhere on the user's end.

All that really needs to be figured out is what is wrong.

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19 hours ago, Whirly Fizzle said:

 

This is a thing. It's a "feature" not a bug. It's something Vir added during a round of SSA fixes years ago but I'm too lazy to find the commit.
If a system clothing layer in your COF can't be found or is missing from database or whatever, the viewer creates a new asset of the same type Called "New Shirt" or whatever the asset type it is & forces it to be worn.  It's created in the Lost & Found folder of inventory & has a blank white texture.

 

LOL. This has then never worked for me then. If that would fix getting your COF locked and unable to detach items that are in limbo, that would be great. I'd gladly take this over having to relog.

1 hour ago, Profaitchikenz Haiku said:

As far as I can tell (*) the edit window always opens at the position you last closed it in, so assuming it initially opens mid-screen where your object is, drag it to one side or the other of the window, and when you re-edit the object it should stay at that side out of the way?

 

* Thinking back, I'm not sure if it retains the remembered position between logins/

1 hour ago, Solar Legion said:

See below and response to below

It does retain that position between sessions. Which brings us all the way back to it not being normal behavior and something being quite wrong somewhere on the user's end.

All that really needs to be figured out is what is wrong.

This. Any other behavior is either a very very very deep bug that needs extremely specific conditions or as explained before its simply the settings not saving. In that case all windows won't save their size and position on screen. Again i've never seen this happen but i know some users who had something like this and it was their settings.xml file not being able to save for whatever reason (permission problems)

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7 hours ago, Solar Legion said:

The Edit Window opening over the object being edited....

Oh fun.....I've been editing objects tonight, and guess what? It's behaving exactly as it should - i.e. staying where it was last put!

So, whatever it was that was misbehaving in the past, it isn't now.

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Interestingly, nobody else has mentioned the only annoyance I have with the newer crop of viewers, the hidden requests.

Time was, when you clicked on a scripted object, a blue-box message popped up "Dancing fool, an object owned by Frank Zappa, wants to animate your avatar ..."

Now, it doesn't warn you visibly, instead one of two tiny little number icons up near the top right hand corner increments by one, and if you do happen to have suitable spectacles and click on that numbered icon, you will see the message requesting permission to make you go YowZah Zowzah Zowzah. If you don't see it because you're concentrating on the figure(s) in the centre of the screen and the typed chats and emotes, you are left with a dull feeling of "Why did I even bother sitting on that?"

I really wish, (and hope somebody is going to respond with a setting I've not managed to find so far,) that there was a return to the big blue "you cannot ignore this popup" box.

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On 10/7/2020 at 4:31 AM, Whirly Fizzle said:

It could be your AV to be fair & it's not unusual for this to happen on only certain regions.
The usual cause is either parcel media, or a media enabled object rezzed on the land or worn by an avatar on the land (if you have play media attached to avatars enabled) that either points to a known malicious URL or it could be a perfectly legit URL that the antivirus just happens to take a dislike to for some reason.

If there is a particular region on which your AV always gives a warning, can you post the region name & I'll go & have a look.
Can you also take a screenshot of the warning from the AV the next time it happens so we can see if it's slplugin or dullahan that's triggering the warning & if a URL is mentioned.

All of the screenshots and logs have been submitted to the Lindens who have been looking at this since July.

There are no URLs on the parcels that trigger this.

There are no deeded objects

There are no avatars

There is nothing in "media" and it is switched to "none".

Yet it persists.

It can be seen on logs and Lindens accepted it as an issue.

There's no explicable reason for an AV to be triggered only on one or two adjacent regions, and never anywhere else, i.e. not other sims on that same channel, or any other kind of sim at all. 

I know it's hard to ever accept that there could EVER be anything wrong on the Lindens' side, but it is unscientific not to question their servers, too.

You're welcome to go fly around Grote and Slosser and see if it triggers for you. But it might not. Maybe you don't have the same AV (AVG). Maybe some other factor like ISP or browser or who knows what in combination triggers this. But all the areas have been policed for URLs, etc. and they aren't the cause and all have been erased anyways and it still triggers.

 

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20 hours ago, Odaks said:

I wonder if this is Experiences?

On 10/7/2020 at 10:36 AM, Profaitchikenz Haiku said:

As far as I can tell (*) the edit window always opens at the position you last closed it in, so assuming it initially opens mid-screen where your object is, drag it to one side or the other of the window, and when you re-edit the object it should stay at that side out of the way?

 

* Thinking back, I'm not sure if it retains the remembered position between logins/

There are no experiences and experiences have not done this anywhere else.

As I mentioned, even when you push the tear-off screen over to the left or right, it doesn't STICK, even during THE SAME LOG-IN. 

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On 10/6/2020 at 11:25 AM, Aishagain said:

@Prokofy Neva:Prok, I've been following your tussle with Linden Lab since 2008.  Did it ever occur to you that you have irritated LL so much that they really ARE messing with you?

Nearly all your gripes over the years have been down to your odd local system configuration or ISP maladies.

 

I don't have a "tussle". I make legitimate criticisms which -- interestingly -- over the years have become mainstreamed with regard to all the major platforms of Google, Twitter, Facebook, etc. -- same awful Silicon Valley culture.

I don't have any odd configuration or ISP maladies. They're the most standard there are. And some of the things didn't occur 6 months ago or last year, i.e. the AV trigger so it's something new in the software on LL's end.

 

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2 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

I know it's hard to ever accept that there could EVER be anything wrong on the Lindens' side, but it is unscientific not to question their servers, too.

Literally nobody thinks LL is perfect or that SL is some impervious technical marvel. Countless threads over SL's entire history are a testament to that.

But what good does it do for us to always jump directly to "yeah it's just LL's fault?" The problem persists. What are we supposed to do, shout about it? Then what? Wait for LL to hopefully fix it for you sometime within the next 3 years? I genuinely do not understand what your goal is with these threads.

Here's a video of me opening and closing the edit window on the official viewer, version 6.4.4. LL's servers have nothing to do with the position of the edit window to begin with, that decision is entirely in the hands of the viewer that is running locally on your computer. The servers are the same for you and me, but our behavior differs. That eliminates LL as the culprit, at least for this particular issue.

Edited by Wulfie Reanimator
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23 hours ago, Profaitchikenz Haiku said:

I really wish, (and hope somebody is going to respond with a setting I've not managed to find so far,) that there was a return to the big blue "you cannot ignore this popup" box.

I had a look around Firestorm Preferences, and some of the labels used, which the preferences search uses, feel a bit off, on the "why did they call it that" level.

"Use legacy list layout" is a restart option under User Interface -> 2D Overlay

I don't have that set. If you do, it might be what you need to change. Or could it be lurking in debug?

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7 hours ago, arabellajones said:

"Use legacy list layout" is a restart option under User Interface -> 2D Overlay

I don't have that set. If you do, it might be what you need to change.

It was set, but after changing it I can't see any difference. I also worked through all of the notifications listed and could not find ones for requesting animation permissions. it's such a basic thing within SL I would expect it to be non-hideable. Anyway, I thought I'd just add a gripe to the list, but I can elarn to get along with it.

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On 10/5/2020 at 8:53 PM, Prokofy Neva said:

I know that techs like to chase things like avatar feet shadows and Windlight bugs but it's helpful to remember the bog-standard experience for the average person and what annoys them:

1. System puts a t-shirt on you, unasked, and you can't delete it, you first have to take it off, then delete it.

2. When you log on, your money shows ???, and if you forget to click on it once, when you attempt to buy something, it tells you that you have "no" money.

3. Group chat lags or doesn't show at all.

4. Edit window opens directly over the object you are editing, so you can't see it. When you push it to the side, it doesn't stay put even in one long-on session.

5. Some sims are triggering anti-virus programs and showing malware not on users' land, not on their URLs, and not in deeded objects. This leaves: Linden sims.

6. TPs often don't work from the World Map

7. Objects with images on them continue to show as gray squares long after you have been on the sim.

8. Names in full cannot be search on groups; you have to type one or two letters and scroll through.

9. In large inventories, the cursor slips and sometimes will not stay put even after you click on it.

10. When Advanced Lighting is checked off, along with show parcel boundaries, the boundary lines from the sim you are on and nearby sims bleed through all objects, creating visual annoyances.

 

You forgot five even more important things:

11. Most places I visit are so dark I have to override with midday so I can see where I'm going.

12. In places with walls, like er.... any building, the camera is often in a different room to the avatar if you're looking over their shoulder.

13. There's so few people using Second Life for the size of it you seldom meet anyone.

14. You very quickly run out of things to do.

15. The graphics look like something from 20 years ago, even on full settings on a decent machine.

I think I'll hold off playing for 5 years and see if they improve it.  I can think of 20 better games than this.
 

Edited by sunnyrio
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1 hour ago, sunnyrio said:

You forgot five even more important things:

11. Most places I visit are so dark I have to override with midday so I can see where I'm going.

12. In places with walls, like er.... any building, the camera is often in a different room to the avatar if you're looking over their shoulder.

13. There's so few people using Second Life for the size of it you seldom meet anyone.

14. You very quickly run out of things to do.

15. The graphics look like something from 20 years ago, even on full settings on a decent machine.

I think I'll hold off playing for 5 years and see if they improve it.  I can think of 20 better games than this.
 

@ #11  I always set my own WL so this isn't an issue for me.  I only change to region WL if it's important for viewing things properly.

@ #12  Fix your camera angle like so.  http://blog.nalates.net/2011/07/24/second-life-camera-position-tips/

@ #13  I have no trouble finding people

@ #14  Usually said by people expecting to log in and be entertained

@ #15  Well, this isn't a video game

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1 hour ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Can I haz your stuff?

 

@Cindy Evanier - beat ya

There's not much to have.  Just a bunch of free bits I "bought" to build a house.

 

1 hour ago, RowanMinx said:

@ #11  I always set my own WL so this isn't an issue for me.  I only change to region WL if it's important for viewing things properly.

@ #12  Fix your camera angle like so.  http://blog.nalates.net/2011/07/24/second-life-camera-position-tips/

@ #13  I have no trouble finding people

@ #14  Usually said by people expecting to log in and be entertained

@ #15  Well, this isn't a video game

Can you set noon permanently?  I have to do it for every world I visit.

I've changed my camera angle and created about 5 presets I use for various things.  But there's no way I know of to stop the camera getting caught outside the small room the avatar is in.  Apart from viewing what the avatar sees, but I prefer to see him moving about.

When I do find people they're all either doing their own thing or not interested in any conversation, or away from the keyboard.  I guess it's like real life, walk into a crowded pub and most people aren't interesting.

Of course I want to be entertained, that's why I got the game!  And if it's not a video game, what would you call it?  Don't say it's a life.  We have a long way to go before you can say that.  I'd need a VR helmet, graphics worthy of this century, and everything so good I can forget it's not real.

 

1 hour ago, Cindy Evanier said:

Thats what I get for being distracted shoving spag bol in my gob 🤣

Weird, I just ate that.  But without the bol!

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4 minutes ago, sunnyrio said:

There's not much to have.  Just a bunch of free bits I "bought" to build a house.

 

Can you set noon permanently?  I have to do it for every world I visit.

I've changed my camera angle and created about 5 presets I use for various things.  But there's no way I know of to stop the camera getting caught outside the small room the avatar is in.  Apart from viewing what the avatar sees, but I prefer to see him moving about.

When I do find people they're all either doing their own thing or not interested in any conversation, or away from the keyboard.  I guess it's like real life, walk into a crowded pub and most people aren't interesting.

Of course I want to be entertained, that's why I got the game!  And if it's not a video game, what would you call it?  Don't say it's a life.  We have a long way to go before you can say that.  I'd need a VR helmet, graphics worthy of this century, and everything so good I can forget it's not real.

 

Weird, I just ate that.  But without the bol!

You can permanently set your WL in the firestorm viewer.

Stop going into tiny rooms?  If your cam is close enough to the back of your head and you still run into walls, get out!

Well, your profile is blank.  I, personally, wouldn't IM you and if you were to IM me, I might ignore you as I'd think you were either too boring to bother putting anything in your profile or you were an alt of someone I know.  Either way, yeah, I'd probably just not respond.

It's more of an interactive chat room IMO.  A place to meet people, build things, explore what other people build.  When people come to SL with an expectation of it being anything like a game, they are sorely disappointed.  There is no goal, there are no power ups, there isn't any way to 'win'.  So yes, I guess if you expect certain things like that you'll find if boring.  I've been here 10 years and have never found it boring.  I've also found that people who whine, "I'm bored!" inworld are probably pretty boring people.

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52 minutes ago, RowanMinx said:

You can permanently set your WL in the firestorm viewer.

Stop going into tiny rooms?  If your cam is close enough to the back of your head and you still run into walls, get out!

Well, your profile is blank.  I, personally, wouldn't IM you and if you were to IM me, I might ignore you as I'd think you were either too boring to bother putting anything in your profile or you were an alt of someone I know.  Either way, yeah, I'd probably just not respond.

It's more of an interactive chat room IMO.  A place to meet people, build things, explore what other people build.  When people come to SL with an expectation of it being anything like a game, they are sorely disappointed.  There is no goal, there are no power ups, there isn't any way to 'win'.  So yes, I guess if you expect certain things like that you'll find if boring.  I've been here 10 years and have never found it boring.  I've also found that people who whine, "I'm bored!" inworld are probably pretty boring people.

I tried Firestorm and didn't like it, it had a few things missing and was less easy to use than the standard viewer.

It's not just tiny rooms, you only need to be close to a wall and turn round, and the camera goes outside.

I don't like the cam close to my head, it's more realistic if I can see the avatar.

Never thought about a profile or knew such a thing existed.  Actually I think I saw something when I clicked on another player once.  But I can't find yours on this website though.  Where do you look?  And I've no idea what to write in one anyway.  My hobbies in real life?  Is that of any interest inside the game?

Yeah well I never did like chatrooms.  It's not like real life is it?  I'll discuss a topic on a newsgroup or forum, but I've never seen the point in "friends" in a virtual world.

I've explored what others have built and it's not really that interesting.  Mainly because of the limitations of the engine.  You can't do much apart from look at, sit on, and have sex on everything.

I'm not boring in real life, because in real life there are thousands times more things you can do.

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2 hours ago, RowanMinx said:

Well, this isn't a video game

It really isn't a "game" as such, at all, despite what some people think. I wonder sometimes what people's expectations are when they join. There's the thread running at the moment about the onboarding experience. Perhaps this should include "what were you expecting/looking for" in the process?

 

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