Chewy, meaty & philosophical... Here?

[Madelaine McMasters]

3 hours ago, Gatogateau said:

You spend a great portion of your life working at minor activities rather than the major ones—for example, washing the dishes, talking to a friend, or driving to work. Therefore, it is precisely in these daily activities that you walk your loving path, or else you have at most a few isolated loving events. Regardless of how you fare with major activities, you need the skills to love even the smallest creature and the humblest activity in order to cherish the day-to-day circumstances of life. You don’t have to gain evidence of success or find somebody mind-shatteringly wonderful in order to be able to live in love.

I don't think love of the little things gets me through the day, but rather this, which I've posted a few times already...

 

[Luna Bliss]

Nice film Maddy, and I was just copying another poem about Gratitude 

Poem: "The Place I Want to Get Back To" by Mary Oliver from "Thirst"

 

is where 

in the pinewoods
in the moments between
the darkness

and the first light
two deer
came walking down the hill
and when they saw me

 

they said to each other, okay,
this one is okay,
let's see who she is
and why she is sitting

on the ground, like that,
so quiet, as if
asleep, or in a dream,
but, anyway, harmless;

 

and so they came
on their slender legs
and gazed upon me
not unlike the way

 

I go out to the dunes and look
and look and look
into the faces of the flowers;
and then one of them leaned forward  

 

and nuzzled my hand, and what can my life
bring to me that could exceed
that brief moment?
For twenty years

 

I have gone every day to the same woods,
not waiting, exactly, just lingering,
Such gifts, bestowed,
can't be repeated.

 

If you want to talk about this
come to visit. I live in the house
near the corner, which I have named
Gratitude.

[Luna Bliss]

22 minutes ago, LexxiXhan said:

46 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I think, ultimately, that ultimate love is beyond sensuality, but we all experience love at whatever stage we need to at any particular stage in our life, and so nothing is ever wrong for you when you are at the stage you need to be at.

I agree. We learn ways to express or give love through our life experiences and different stages of self awareness or realization...as parents, as friends, as lovers, as neighbours, as teachers...and the forms can be verbal, through actions, or sensual..and the wisdom to know how or what the other person needs or what will give them the space to figure that out comes with that. It forms, and is informed by, our intuitive understanding of how our presence, including our bodies or understanding of another's physical intuition and communication can serve others.

The saddest thing is when people get stuck at a stage and can't move beyond -- they lose love for themselves and can't give love to others.

[LexxiXhan]

5 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

The saddest thing is when people get stuck at a stage and can't move beyond -- they lose love for themselves and can't give love to others.

Or if they don't get to experience, learn and express love in the ways they need to, because of trauma.

[Madelaine McMasters]

8 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

two deer
came walking down the hill
and when they saw me

they said to each other, okay,
this one is okay

Ten years or so ago, I drove into my driveway on a winter's afternoon and encountered a doe standing on the right side. I inched forward, expecting her to bolt, but she just stepped out of the way and let me pass. Intrigued, I stopped the car a few yards later and got out. I started talking to her, and she have me a quizzical look, much like I used to get from the family dog.

Curious to see just how far I could push, I started throwing snowballs at her. My first lobs were well short of her position, intended to introduce her to the idea. Subsequent throws edged closer, until I dropped one at her feet. She pawed and sniffed at it, then front-crouched a little in what looked to me like a canine play bow. As I tossed another snowball, she reared up, then batted at the snowball as it hit the ground under her. I took a step towards her, which was a step too far. She turned and pranced away.

I choose to believe that we had just engaged in a little bit of play. For a moment she thought I was okay, and it was marvelous.

[Ted McGregor]

1 hour ago, Rat Luv said:

I'd love a robot to wash the dishes, not me ☹️

 

Why would I do your dishes ? Clean them yourself ..

 

[Pixie Kobichenko]

Someone asked for a tangent? 

 

[Rowan Amore]

[Silent Mistwalker]

What's going on in here? ...

 

Oh hell no.

Edited September 6, 2020 by Silent Mistwalker

[Silent Mistwalker]

4 hours ago, LexxiXhan said:

Who had the smoke last? Do I need to roll another?

Don't bogart.

[Gatogateau]

Well, if you don't give an eff for PhDs, how about MDs? Based primarily on Aristotle and Plato, this is a list of 7 types of love:

1. Eros  Eros is sexual or passionate love, and is the type most akin to our modern construct of romantic love. 

2. Philia  Friendship, shared goodwill.

3. Storge Familial love

4. Agape is universal love, such as the love for strangers, nature, or God.  Charity and altruism.

5. Ludus is playful or uncommitted love. Flirting, seducing.

6. Pragma practical love founded on reason, duty, sexual attraction takes a secondary role

7. Philautia self-love, for better or worse

For the full article:  https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hide-and-seek/201606/these-are-the-7-types-love

FWIW I'm just adding in here, not necessarily presenting my views.

 

[Gatogateau]

Ok, a little of my views: I think when most of us hear the word "love" we take it to mean eros, or romantic love. The word can be used to describe many other things besides eros. (I don't think the doctor's list above has a correct listing, in that I don't think everything listed is "love"). I do think the quote in the OP is more of the agape variety. The Buddhist Metta (Loving Kindness prayer) gets to the gist (and this is the truncated version): My heart fills with with loving kindness. I love myself. May I be happy. May I be well. May I be peaceful. May I be free. ... May all beings in my country be happy. May they be well. May they be peaceful. May they be free

But to me, showing loving kindness to my dirty dishes? No. I might be able to make that as an expression of self-love, in that it is taking care of my environment. I really see that as more gratitude, though. Being happy when I wash the dishes (hahahahaha) is more like being grateful I *have* dishes to wash, that I have to wash them because I *have* food to get them dirty, and that I *have* a sink in an apartment... etc. I can use the washing of dishes as a mindfulness meditation. Both gratitude and mindfulness can set one up for being more receptive to the more universal love. Washing the dishes for someone else can be an expression of love, but love itself? Yeah, no.

I do think you can show loving kindness to plants, animals, and even general "nature" of rocks, oceans, etc. I think you can train yourself to expand your understanding of "love" and eventually it can become habit to have a more open heart. Which is amusing coming from this old misanthrope. 

Edited September 6, 2020 by Gatogateau

[LexxiXhan]

2 minutes ago, Gatogateau said:

Washing the dishes for someone else can be an expression of love, but love itself? Yeah, no.

Have you tried different washing up detergent? Mine smells of Bluebell Woods

[Rowan Amore]

18 minutes ago, Gatogateau said:

Well, if you don't give an eff for PhDs, how about MDs? Based primarily on Aristotle and Plato, this is a list of 7 types of love:

1. Eros  Eros is sexual or passionate love, and is the type most akin to our modern construct of romantic love. 

2. Philia  Friendship, shared goodwill.

3. Storge Familial lovemy 

4. Agape is universal love, such as the love for strangers, nature, or God.  Charity and altruism.

5. Ludus is playful or uncommitted love. Flirting, seducing.

6. Pragma practical love founded on reason, duty, sexual attraction takes a secondary role

7. Philautia self-love, for better or worse

For the full article:  https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hide-and-seek/201606/these-are-the-7-types-love

FWIW I'm just adding in here, not necessarily presenting my views.

 

I'm still going to stick.with my original statement.  All these examples involve either yourself or another human being aside from agape.  No where does it say I need to love the humblist of activities to cherish the day to day circumstances of life.  Activities that make you happy, content and experiences like the fawn encounter Maddy described may make you feel more open to loving but are not in and of themselves, love.

[Gatogateau]

2 minutes ago, LexxiXhan said:

Have you tried different washing up detergent? Mine smells of Bluebell Woods

I actually have allergic reactions to scented soaps. I have to run through the soap/detergent aisle in the grocery store or I get an asthma attack.

I think I could love washing the dishes if each dish magically produced a Krugerrand as it was being washed.

[Akane Nacht]

are we at the song part yet? 

 

[Gatogateau]

3 minutes ago, Akane Nacht said:

are we at the song part yet? 

 

Gah! I hate that song! Be gone from this thread! I cannot show loving kindness to this abomination!

Hey, I just know that there is often a grumble that there isn't anything intellectually stimulating to respond to in the GD subforum. This is me trying to be a warm and fuzzy member of the community. I even put my kitteh suit on!

This is me trying!!!!

 

[Rowan Amore]

1 hour ago, Gatogateau said:

Gah! I hate that song! Be gone from this thread! I cannot show loving kindness to this abomination!

Hey, I just know that there is often a grumble that there isn't anything intellectually stimulating to respond to in the GD subforum. This is me trying to be a warm and fuzzy member of the community. I even put my kitteh suit on!

This is me trying!!!!

 

 

[Ceka Cianci]

I've tried typing up a few different posts and have erased every one of them trying to express when the definition of love came to me clear as glass..

When I truly love, I know what that love is, but can never explain it to anyone else to where they would understand.. It's just as my Father had tried but could never really make me understand.. He said to me, you will understand my love, with your first child..

He was never more right. It's not a love that can be explained but has to be experienced to know it.. I see the same love in my husband with our children..

I don't love doing the dishes, I don't love bailing hay, I don't love going to my job..I do those things for the ones that I love..Just as my husband does what he does for the ones he loves..

I can explain why I might give someone at work a ride home or why I might hire someone on the farm when they are down on their luck or why I like to create something..

I can't explain love when I love someone or something, especially with my children..

ETA: I had put a video in here, but after watching it again, it just didn't express what I am trying to..

 

Edited September 6, 2020 by Ceka Cianci

[Orwar]

   I'm just going to drop this here.

 

   Gratitude and love are not the same thing. Gratitude is a tool with which we establish harmony. When we are in harmony, we are happier and more prosperous, and more likely to be capable of creating strong relationships that may develop into love. 

[Silent Mistwalker]

 

[Luna Bliss]

Well it's 15 or so hours later and we haven't figured out what love is yet!   Pfffft

[Luna Bliss]

16 hours ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

16 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

two deer
came walking down the hill
and when they saw me

they said to each other, okay,
this one is okay

Ten years or so ago, I drove into my driveway on a winter's afternoon and encountered a doe standing on the right side. I inched forward, expecting her to bolt, but she just stepped out of the way and let me pass. Intrigued, I stopped the car a few yards later and got out. I started talking to her, and she have me a quizzical look, much like I used to get from the family dog.

Curious to see just how far I could push, I started throwing snowballs at her. My first lobs were well short of her position, intended to introduce her to the idea. Subsequent throws edged closer, until I dropped one at her feet. She pawed and sniffed at it, then front-crouched a little in what looked to me like a canine play bow. As I tossed another snowball, she reared up, then batted at the snowball as it hit the ground under her. I took a step towards her, which was a step too far. She turned and pranced away.

I choose to believe that we had just engaged in a little bit of play. For a moment she thought I was okay, and it was marvelous.

What an experience!  What a meeting! I can't think of a better way to describe the experience of love than "a lovely meeting".

[Luna Bliss]

8 hours ago, Ceka Cianci said:

When I truly love, I know what that love is, but can never explain it to anyone else to where they would understand.. It's just as my Father had tried but could never really make me understand.. He said to me, you will understand my love, with your first child..

He was never more right. It's not a love that can be explained but has to be experienced to know it.. I see the same love in my husband with our children..

You described that well. I don't think I've ever experienced such love as when they first brought my newly birthed daughter in my hospital room and placed her on the pillow beside me. It is, as you say, an experience, and it does defy description, though that doesn't keep us from trying!

[Luna Bliss]

Okay, going with my new description of love as "a lovely meeting" -- what prevents a lovely meeting, what prevents experiencing the world in the astonishment it 'deserves'? A lifetime of experiences & conditioning forming patterns, keeping oneself in a mind-rut. How can one meet anything in the present with a mind clogged with patterns from the past? There are techniques to remove those mind-ruts, meditation being my favorite.  I think this baby, the wonder they express, the astonishment, captures some of the key ingredients in love: