Are You Showing Support for Black Lives Matter in Second Life?

[Innula Zenovka]

3 minutes ago, kiramanell said:

 

That was pretty sad, Luna; especially "the darker-skinned children reject the darker-skinned doll more often."  Was any explanation ever offered?

It must depend on the children's age, and where and when the study was conducted, but maybe they had already formed the impression from their exposure to the world around them (particularly TV and adverts) that light skin and blonde hair are considered good and attractive, but had not yet realised why, and what this meant for them.     

Or, to put it more neutrally, perhaps it's simply that they had seen white dolls advertised far more frequently than they had seen adverts for black ones, and advertising works.

 

[JanuarySwan]

Just now, Madelaine McMasters said:

I have seen NO research to suggest this.

 

Are you suggesting that young children learn to prefer light over dark because of Second Life?

Excuse me?  I never said that.  I said I prefer the lighter hair and skins in SL because of my eyes and that the darker skins and hairs are more difficult to see and the dark hairs have less definition in SL.

As far as the black doll, I thought she meant the children were given dolls with no pre-existing prejudice and were choosing by color only.  

[Beth Macbain]

1 minute ago, JanuarySwan said:

But, many blacks have over-come those racial stereotypes.

So... you're saying they assimilated. They are overcoming those racial stereotypes by acting white? Do you really not see how grotesque that is? 

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, JanuarySwan said:

7 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

January...yes...all people (both Blacks & Whites) are taught to place less value in POC (People Of Color).  Many Black people suffer from terrible self-esteem issues until they break out of what society has thrust on them and come to a place of valuing themselves.

But, many blacks have over-come those racial stereotypes.  That's why I said I feel this is taking some black people into the 1950's.

Look, I'm of Polish decent.  Certain countries in Europe, I'd prefer not to say, think Poland is simply their's.  Hilter stole over 50% of all Polish property.  Do people even mention it?  Should I carry a chip on my shoulder that Polish people never matter?  And, as a matter of fact, Trump is moving troops out of Germany and into Poland at this time, and Germany is crying "Well, be a target of the Russians".  But, I'm like...here we go again, Poland doesn't matter.  

I think three Black people murdered within a week by cops ignited a pile of hay that has been building up for years.

Edited June 8, 2020 by Luna Bliss

[Janet Voxel]

No response on the police reactions to the protests huh?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgWtvcQLm9k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ww-Xq0yZfw

(notice the other officer stops the one officer from helping him)

There's a reason  people are responding to the claims of "I can't support this because of the rioting and looting, defacing monuments" because it seems to be disingenuous. A monument can be cleaned, restored, rebuilt, nuff said. There isn't a response to all of the video of police responding to protesters and media with violence though.

So my question is to anyone that is choosing to detract from BLM: Are you seeing the other side to these protests, where the police are reacting violently to peaceful protests? How do you feel about that?

 

 

[Luna Bliss]

5 minutes ago, JanuarySwan said:

But, many blacks have over-come those racial stereotypes.  That's why I said I feel this is taking some black people into the 1950's.

It's a little bit difficult to overcome racial stereotypes when you're one of the Black people shot or imprisoned at  far greater rates compared to White people.  Or one of the Black people living in poverty at far greater numbers than their White counterparts.

[Lilathvom]

If you are concerned about police violence, I can understand that. I share your concern.

However, if you are concerned specifically about police violence toward one single ethnicity, then frankly... you are a racist. Around 400 White people are shot by the police every single year. More than one a day. For every Black person killed by the police, two White people are shot. Do White Lives Matter? Meanwhile, Hispanic fatalities are nearly equal to Black deaths. Do Hispanic lives matter? At all?

I realized the other day that I know, by name, a large number of African-Americans who have been shot by the police. When, where, the details of what happened. Black deaths get a lot of publicity and news coverage. However, I can't honestly name any White person shot by the police, even though more than twice as many are shot. I'm struggling to even think of one. Should I also care if a White person is killed? Nor can I think of any Hispanic individuals. Should I care? I think so, and if the BLM movement does not agree, then no - no, I can't support it.

There's a popular cartoon showing a man with a firehouse, spraying water at a house which does not appear to be on fire. Meanwhile, the other house is burning. BLM supporters pretend that only the Black house is burning, and its racist to even express concern about other houses. That's simply unreasonable. Police violence affects all races. It's not solely a "Black" problem. If you are genuinely opposed to racism, then you can't define police violence solely in terms of race.

I've also realized that not one of the African-Americans I know is out there protesting, wearing BLM t-shirts, or even talking about George Floyd. George Floyd's own brother told people to stop. The BLM movement is often said to represent Black people, but it doesn't. It's a very narrowly focused subset of the populace, which advocates for an extremist political ideology, and most BLM supporters are actually White 'activists'. Racist white activists are exploiting this issue for their own political agenda. Normal people don't want to defund the police. They understand that we need police, and that crime is a much bigger concern than the occasional instance of police brutality. The reality is that drunk drivers kill way more people than the police do. In addition, murderers murder way more people than the police do. The primary reason police are violent is because people are violent toward the police. That's a fact. When you attack the police, you are causing police violence. If you are doing that, then YOU are the problem.

The BLM website claims that Black lives are being "systematically" targeted for "demise". This is utter nonsense, an exaggerated false narrative. The United States may have a sordid history of race relations, but the United States also fought a very long difficult war to support the abolition of slavery. Yes, American police departments may have issues, but they are not deliberately implementing a genocide. There are lots of Black police officers, and Black politicians, and Black business owners, and Black generals. There are also Black drug addicts, sex offenders, murderers, and thugs.

Ultimately, while I sympathize with George Floyd's family, and I think the arresting officer should be held responsible for criminal negligence resulting in Floyd's death, the reality is that George Floyd used meth, and fentanyl, and he was convicted of armed robbery. He didn't deserve to die, but he wasn't an innocent angel. You are well within your rights to protest and demand that police reforms be implemented, but if you are setting cars on fire, robbing stores, throwing rocks, or hitting people in the head with a skateboard, then frankly I hope the police arrest you, and I won't be protesting if they treat you roughly.
 

Edited June 8, 2020 by Lilathvom

[Luna Bliss]

3 minutes ago, Janet Voxel said:

So my question is to anyone that is choosing to detract from BLM: Are you seeing the other side to these protests, where the police are reacting violently to peaceful protests?

Oh we can't respond to that, because 'Black people are just violent', right, and so this is the pressing issue for many. 

Once again, the negative stereotypes about Black people prevail.

[JanuarySwan]

11 minutes ago, Beth Macbain said:

So... you're saying they assimilated. They are overcoming those racial stereotypes by acting white? Do you really not see how grotesque that is? 

No, they are just being themselves.  This country and it's multi-racial communities are very diverse.  It's just people being people.  

What the heck is acting white anyways by your definition?  

Edited June 8, 2020 by JanuarySwan

[kiramanell]

4 minutes ago, Lilathvom said:

but if you are setting cars on fire, robbing stores, throwing rocks, or hitting people in the head with a skateboard, then frankly I hope the police arrest you, and I won't be protesting if they treat you roughly.

 

What about those  -- and this is going to bake your noodle, later on -- who are protesting, precisely because they've been treated roughly?!

[Madelaine McMasters]

9 minutes ago, JanuarySwan said:

But, many blacks have over-come those racial stereotypes.  That's why I said I feel this is taking some black people into the 1950's.

Though the cited data goes back only to 1962, that's close enough for me to suggest that, economically, many black people have yet to leave the 1950s.

https://www.clevelandfed.org/newsroom-and-events/publications/economic-commentary/2019-economic-commentaries/ec-201903-what-is-behind-the-persistence-of-the-racial-wealth-gap.aspx

[Beth Macbain]

4 minutes ago, JanuarySwan said:

No, they are just being themselves.

Have you asked them that? Are they truly being themselves, or are they doing what they feel they have to do to be accepted in white society?

[Lilathvom]

4 minutes ago, kiramanell said:

 

What about those  -- and this is going to bake your noodle, later on -- who are protesting, precisely because they've been treated roughly?!

I've been treated roughly by the police. I've also been treated roughly by people that are not the police.

Anyone is free to go stand outside the courthouse and chant all day long. Good luck to you. However, if you are running around in violation of a curfew, while people are setting buildings on fire, throwing bombs, and killing people - during a pandemic - well, don't expect any sympathy from me.

Edited June 8, 2020 by Lilathvom

[kiramanell]

1 minute ago, Beth Macbain said:

Have you asked them that? Are they truly being themselves, or are they doing what they feel they have to do to be accepted in white society?

 

You ask an excellent question.

[JanuarySwan]

2 minutes ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

Though the cited data goes back only to 1962, that's close enough for me to suggest that, economically, many black people have yet to leave the 1950s.

https://www.clevelandfed.org/newsroom-and-events/publications/economic-commentary/2019-economic-commentaries/ec-201903-what-is-behind-the-persistence-of-the-racial-wealth-gap.aspx

This is true.  Being held back in poverty is true though it's true for all people all over the world who are in poverty.  

2 minutes ago, Beth Macbain said:

Have you asked them that? Are they truly being themselves, or are they doing what they feel they have to do to be accepted in white society?

There is no white society in multi-racial communities.  Why because they own a van they are acting white or what?  What should they own "a truck" or what to please you?   I think you are grotesque in your imagination of others and how they should "act".   

[Arielle Popstar]

17 minutes ago, Janet Voxel said:

No response on the police reactions to the protests huh?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgWtvcQLm9k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ww-Xq0yZfw

(notice the other officer stops the one officer from helping him)

There's a reason  people are responding to the claims of "I can't support this because of the rioting and looting, defacing monuments" because it seems to be disingenuous. A monument can be cleaned, restored, rebuilt, nuff said. There isn't a response to all of the video of police responding to protesters and media with violence though.

So my question is to anyone that is choosing to detract from BLM: Are you seeing the other side to these protests, where the police are reacting violently to peaceful protests? How do you feel about that?

 

 

No but then this is the other side of the coin:

 

[Luna Bliss]

16 minutes ago, Lilathvom said:

Black deaths get a lot of publicity and news coverage. However, I can't honestly name any White person shot by the police, even though more than twice as many are shot. I'm struggling to even think of one. Should I also care if a White person is killed?

the reality is that George Floyd used meth, and fentanyl, and he was convicted of armed robbery. He didn't deserve to die, but he wasn't an innocent angel. 

[redacted]

[Innula Zenovka]

10 minutes ago, Lilathvom said:

However, if you are running around in violation of a curfew, while people are setting buildings on fire, throwing bombs, and killing people - during a pandemic - well, don't expect any sympathy from me.

I think that sentence lacks an important component.

"Well, don't expect any sympathy from me if ...."   

If what?   If you get a ticket?  If you get arrested?   If you're peacefully making your way home but nevertheless you get tear gassed and then arrested?   If something else unpleasant happens?

Which is it?

[Beth Macbain]

20 minutes ago, Lilathvom said:

However, if you are concerned specifically about police violence toward one single ethnicity, then frankly... you are a racist. Around 400 White people are shot by the police every single year. More than one a day. For every Black person killed by the police, two White people are shot. Do White Lives Matter? Meanwhile, Hispanic fatalities are nearly equal to Black deaths. Do Hispanic lives matter? At all?

Police Deaths	% of Deaths	% of Population
White (399)	40%	60.4%
Black (209)	20.9%	13.4%
Latinx (148)	14.9%	18.3%

 

 

 

These are numbers from 2018. Explain the disparity. 

[Lilathvom]

1 minute ago, Innula Zenovka said:

If what? 

If you get shot by the police, because you are running around 'protesting' during a riot, during a pandemic, don't expect any sympathy from me.

You violate the curfew at your own risk. That's on you.

[Luna Bliss]

18 minutes ago, JanuarySwan said:

This is true.  Being held back in poverty is true though it's true for all people all over the world who are in poverty.

You keep trying to make the point that others in addition to Blacks have various problems. This is true. But what's wrong for a group to come together and protest regarding their particular issues?

For example, take the women who formed a group to protest violence against women, particularly by men and/or domestic partners. They sometimes gather in protest in public places, or go on walks with candles at night proclaiming "take back the night".  Is this wrong?  Does their coming together for support and educating the public invalidate all of the other types of people who die from violence?  For example, those who might not be women or who are not attacked via men/domestic partners.

Edited June 8, 2020 by Luna Bliss

[Innula Zenovka]

5 minutes ago, Lilathvom said:

If you get shot by the police, because you are running around 'protesting' during a riot, during a pandemic, don't expect any sympathy from me.

You violate the curfew at your own risk. That's on you.

If someone is breaking curfew, that is sufficient reason to shoot on sight, at the officer's discretion?   Is that what you're saying?

That is, are they still at risk if they not "running around 'protesting'" but, for example, standing there peacefully holding a sign, or peacefuly making their way home, in order to comply with the curfew, or are there reporting the whole incident for local or national news media?

Edited June 8, 2020 by Innula Zenovka

[Extrude Ragu]

Quote

or are they doing what they feel they have to do to be accepted in white society?

 

Every society, every country, every place has social norms rules and expectations of it's people. I don't think that is racist or unreasonable. 'When in Rome, do as the Romans do'. I crossed out the word 'White' and it reads much more reasonably to me.

[Lilathvom]

Just now, Innula Zenovka said:

If someone is breaking curfew, that is sufficient reason to shoot on sight, at the officer's discretion?   Is that what you're saying?

I am inclined to think that the police should enforce the curfew, yes. I also think they have a right to defend themselves from a perceived threat.

Curfews are implemented, at night, because the police can't see in the dark. If you are out in violation of a curfew, they can reasonably assume that your intent is criminal.

You have no legal right to protest during a riot, which is also during a pandemic. Go home.

[Lillith Hapmouche]

RIP sanity.