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22 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

We need to be helping the people that are out of work or making less than before due to Covid -- not just handing out money left and right to people that are still working as before

Well, I wish there had been a stipulation for at least the lockdown counties or states to receive 2k.  L.A. County is nearing four weeks now since we dipped below the 15% required by law available emergency care.  L.A. County is at 0% available emergency care now.  We need alternative emergency care now aside from hospitals.    

Since California locked down for Christmas and New Year's, we may come out of strict lockdown as other states go in and especially now "new strain" has been found.  I am not going to give a lecture to anyone, however, who could not give up one Christmas.  I can only deal with me - I (me alone) would have gladly given up one Christmas even if we didn't have a lockdown.  

But, I'm pretty sure other states will be going into lockdown as California comes out.  It's still a wait and see, however...I have no crystal ball.  But, if there had been a stipulation for those in lockdown to receive it, then as each of those in each state needed it, it would have been there and available.  Stock up on some things just in case.  I plan too with my money.

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*****ing *****ed up mother *****ers are *****ing the whole *****ing *****ed up ****sucking *****head *****s. And then some.

Cutting in with a rando side comment because I haven’t kept up - I’m tired of all the conspiracy theories behind it, and all the Americans on my feeds (note: I am also an American) pointing fingers at

Welp y'all have been warned before about keeping this thread on topic but it continues to delve into Politics and other off topic subjects. So consider this thread closed. If something similar is star

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13 hours ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

Did 1.8 billion people actually get treated with HCQ?

No? Then why are they in the treatment group?

I await a paragraph from your sources that doesn't contain such egregious errors.

No, 1.8 billion was the total of the populations of those countries that had the treatment group while 663 million is the total population of the countries with the control group as per what it says in the page you linked:

Quote

Collectively the countries we identified with stable and relatively clear assignments account for 31.1% of the world population (2.4B of 7.8B). Details of the groups and evidence, including countries identified as having mixed use of HCQ, can be found in Appendix 13.

https://hcqtrial.com/

So far the egregious errors are not in the sources but in the readership.

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27 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I'll probably piss damn near everyone off, but I hope the $2000.00 amount does not pass.

We need to be helping the people that are out of work or making less than before due to Covid -- not just handing out money left and right to people that are still working as before (though that does make everyone happier and make them like the politicians more).   If everyone didn't just get handed a check, they could actually divert that money to unemployment/under-employment aid, we might actually help many folks come a lot closer to earning what they were before.

However, that would take a bit more effort to figure out............. and politicians & government prefer the easy way, especially if there is a chance it will get them more votes.

For the people that lost jobs they bumped unemployment to 300.00 in addition to what they would get regularly plus extended..The bill was also to stop eviction and I believe also to help those land owners with people owning the places where people can't pay their rent..

The thing that pisses me off is they were arguing over 1.9 trillion and 2.3 trillion before the election.. After the election they get 2/3's of the house, a bipartisan agreement on like 500 billion and half the stimulus check..

All those people suffering while politicians on both sides casually bicker for reputation points and how their side is going to look after it's all said and done,as well as it being about getting their guy in office.. there is just way too much in front of the people that they work for..

There is a lot of reasons to whoop some politician asses these days..  I'm not a fan of the country being in a position to where we have to look to the government for financial anything.. But when we do, they should make the people a top priority.. What we saw this past summer from both sides was inexcusable in my eyes..

If they would have gotten off their asses back then, we wouldn't be in near the bad shape we are now.. I put it all on them..

30% of the businesses back then looking for help, From them, have gone out of business because of their game playing..

Who knows how many more went homeless, had to turn to stealing, committed suicide and everything else that comes into all of it.. Yet half a year later they will pat themselves on the back as if they did their jobs..

They had a deadline back at the end of July for a reason.. They'll throw money everywhere else like it's going out of style.. but when it comes to those that really needed them in that 11th hour, they failed them without even a care in the world.. They aren't feeling the pain..

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1 hour ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I'll probably piss damn near everyone off, but I hope the $2000.00 amount does not pass.

We need to be helping the people that are out of work or making less than before due to Covid -- not just handing out money left and right to people that are still working as before (though that does make everyone happier and make them like the politicians more).   If everyone didn't just get handed a check, they could actually divert that money to unemployment/under-employment aid, we might actually help many folks come a lot closer to earning what they were before.

However, that would take a bit more effort to figure out............. and politicians & government prefer the easy way, especially if there is a chance it will get them more votes.

You know after I wrote "stock up on some things now...", I got to thinking perhaps not sending out the 2K checks was to avoid hoarding.  However, still a stipulation should have been put that those counties and/or states in lockdown would receive the 2K as it wouldn't be hoarding money but necessary and vital living expense money if you're in lockdown.  I'd hope they could make a stipulation.  Hoarding would not be a good thing.  When I say "stock up"...I don't mean hoard.  But, also, there is a new strain and it's cold in other states and this virus gets stronger the colder it gets because the cold puts a kind of coat on the virus to protect it.  California had odd freezing whether in November but now we are enjoying mild Spring-like weather.  It is not cold here except at night.  But, I do feel other states will be going into lockdown as California is coming out and this is just so messed up with no logical plan for living expenses and personal needs like insulin for example!   

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https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/hydroxychloroquine-does-not-benefit-adults-hospitalized-covid-19

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A National Institutes of Health clinical trial evaluating the safety and effectiveness of hydroxychloroquine for the treatment of adults with coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) has formally concluded that the drug provides no clinical benefit to hospitalized patients.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanrhe/article/PIIS2665-9913(20)30378-7/fulltext

Quote

We found no evidence of a difference in COVID-19 mortality among people who received hydroxychloroquine for treatment of rheumatological disease before the COVID-19 outbreak in England.

https://victr.vumc.org/community-faq/

Quote

Current research suggests that hydroxychloroquine is not safe or effective for treating patients with COVID-19 (as of October 8, 2020). Early in the pandemic, patients may have received hydroxychloroquine under “Emergency Use Authorization,” but it did not reduce morbidity or mortality.

 

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32 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

You know after I wrote "stock up on some things now...", I got to thinking perhaps not sending out the 2K checks was to avoid hoarding.  However, still a stipulation should have been put that those counties and/or states in lockdown would receive the 2K as it wouldn't be hoarding money but necessary and vital living expense money if you're in lockdown.  I'd hope they could make a stipulation.  Hoarding would not be a good thing.  When I say "stock up"...I don't mean hoard.  But, also, there is a new strain and it's cold in other states and this virus gets stronger the colder it gets because the cold puts a kind of coat on the virus to protect it.  California had odd freezing whether in November but now we are enjoying mild Spring-like weather.  It is not cold here except at night.  But, I do feel other states will be going into lockdown as California is coming out and this is just so messed up with no logical plan for living expenses and personal needs like insulin for example!   

Mitch was the one that stopped the 2000.00 check increase.. I agree with LittleMe that those that don't need it really don't need it.. But with uncertainty of what is coming and if they shut things down even more than last year, who knows what people are going to need in the near future..

We sure can't count on the government being speedy about things in a time of need.. The reason he put a stop to it is because as the republican leader, He'd lose his spot making a jump decision like that.. He has to go back and try to persuade his crew or at least discuss it..

It was kind of a last minute bump from 600.00 to 2000.00 with Trump holing out signing the bill.. He put things into a spin for sure.. hehehe

Right now all the pressure is on Mitch and the republicans, because when the house went bipartisan and passed the bill.. It dropped everything right in the lap of Mitch and the Republicans in the senate.. Now they have to act quick because of the Georgia senate election coming at the beginning of next month..

 

I'm thinking Turtle boy just got caught off guard and couldn't make a move other than going against it..

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1 hour ago, Arielle Popstar said:

No, 1.8 billion was the total of the populations of those countries that had the treatment group while 663 million is the total population of the countries with the control group as per what it says in the page you linked

You seem to be rather missing the point, and simply restating the obvious, and fallacious, premise of the comparison does nothing to address it.

The study is comparing one very large population, of which only a relatively small proportion have been diagnosed with Covid 19, with another even larger population group, of which, again, only a small proportion have been identified as having the disease, and an even tinier proportion were treated with HCQ. What percentage, do you suppose, of that 1.8 billion people were treated with HCQ? It would be a statistically and scientifically negligible amount -- not even close to large enough to account for the differences the study purports to document.

A straight-up comparison of Covid 19 patients treated with HCQ and those who were not might be scientifically and statistically valid, assuming other factors were also weighted properly. This study doesn't come even close to doing that -- its samples are indiscriminate and the number of actual treatments far too small a percentage of the whole to yield anything useful.

And speaking of "other factors," there are pretty sizeable and statistically significant differences in the mortality rates within each of these two groups -- differences that are far more pronounced than the ones the study associates with HCQ. For instance, both Canada and the US appear within the "control group," but the mortality rate in latter per 100,000 population is two and a half times that in the former. Now, I suspect that that stat is more complicated than it looks*, but it does suggest that there are other factors -- political, cultural, economic -- that are vastly more important in determining recovery rates than HCQ.

 

* Case in point: according to Worldometer, the US has about 4 times as many cases per capita as Canada -- which means that, although Canada has a lower per capita death rate, its mortality rate among those who actually have contracted the disease is actually higher than in the States. See how complicated statistics can be? And why comparing mishmashed numerical salads with each other can be misleading?

Edited by Scylla Rhiadra
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2 hours ago, Ceka Cianci said:

You guys may want to have a look at your bank accounts and SSC accounts or where ever you have things deposited..

People are already getting their 600.00 stimulus checks..

Now they are talking about a total separate bill just for the 2000.00..  Turtle boy is feeling the pressure right now from Reps and Dems and Exect..

We'll see I guess.. They need to do something after keeping so many people hanging..

My bank got slammed so hard I couldn't login to the website.

That $600 isn't going to go far. That's not even a month's lot rent and that's about as cheap rent as you can find in the US without living in an apartment, which I will never do again. I'll live in a cave or tent first.

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2 hours ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I'll probably piss damn near everyone off, but I hope the $2000.00 amount does not pass.

We need to be helping the people that are out of work or making less than before due to Covid -- not just handing out money left and right to people that are still working as before (though that does make everyone happier and make them like the politicians more).   If everyone didn't just get handed a check, they could actually divert that money to unemployment/under-employment aid, we might actually help many folks come a lot closer to earning what they were before.

However, that would take a bit more effort to figure out............. and politicians & government prefer the easy way, especially if there is a chance it will get them more votes.

That doesn't help those of us who are no longer employed, no longer qualify for unemployment because the initial claim ran out and also are unable to work outside of the home due compromised immune systems.

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Just now, Silent Mistwalker said:

That doesn't help those of us who are no longer employed, no longer qualify for unemployment because the initial claim ran out and also are unable to work outside of the home due compromised immune systems.

And what I specifically said was that we need to be helping those that are unemployed/under-employed due to Covid.  Unlike the government, I do not put a time limit on the unemployment.  Thus, rather than giving all us folks working from home $2000, they should be extending and increasing the benefits for those that cannot work or are not working full hours.

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2 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

And what I specifically said was that we need to be helping those that are unemployed/under-employed due to Covid.  Unlike the government, I do not put a time limit on the unemployment.  Thus, rather than giving all us folks working from home $2000, they should be extending and increasing the benefits for those that cannot work or are not working full hours.

I'm not unemployed due to covid. I'm unemployed due to a compromised immune system.

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Just now, Silent Mistwalker said:

I'm not unemployed due to covid. I'm unemployed due to a compromised immune system.

If there was no Covid right now, could you work with compromised immune system?  If not, were you working before Covid?  If not, that is a totally separate issue that something that  Covid Relief package should be dealing with.  There are other problems with aid to people that need to be fixed, but are not related to a Covid discussion.

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1 minute ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

If there was no Covid right now, could you work with compromised immune system?  If not, were you working before Covid?  If not, that is a totally separate issue that something that  Covid Relief package should be dealing with.  There are other problems with aid to people that need to be fixed, but are not related to a Covid discussion.

No. I can't work with a compromised immune system unless I want to die. I haven't worked since before Covid. My unemployment ran out just as Covid was hitting the US.

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19 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

And what I specifically said was that we need to be helping those that are unemployed/under-employed due to Covid.  Unlike the government, I do not put a time limit on the unemployment.  Thus, rather than giving all us folks working from home $2000, they should be extending and increasing the benefits for those that cannot work or are not working full hours.

I think the only reason they are giving it to everyone is, they already have that system in place..

I don't think they can pull off dividing everyone into sections.. I believe that's why they did it the last time too, if I'm not mistaken..

They may have been able to get a system in place by now with as much time as they've wasted.. But they probably didn't know what to do or when to start because of all the, maybe coming to an agreement, then not, then being farther away in talks.. Like a roller coaster of, start and stopping..

If it wasn't an election year, none of that would have went on and they probably would have a better system in place for who gets one and who doesn't.. instead they are stuck with the same thing.. with people already getting checks, it's a good sign that's what they are using..

It's a cluster of clutter and they still have their jobs and don't have any fear of losing them any time soon..

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11 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

I think the only reason they are giving it to everyone is, they already have that system in place..

Quite probable.  But, couldn't they have figured out how to divide by states at least?  Perhaps a new number is needed for individuals then - a number that would include a code number for state and county.  

California needs to declare a state of emergency and see if FEMA can help or somebody....

*****************

About FEMA

The Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) is an agency of the United States Department of Homeland Security, initially created under President Jimmy Carter by Presidential Reorganization Plan No. 3 of 1978 and implemented by two Executive Orders on April 1, 1979.[1][5] The agency's primary purpose is to coordinate the response to a disaster that has occurred in the United States and that overwhelms the resources of local and state authorities. The governor of the state in which the disaster occurs must declare a state of emergency and formally request from the President that FEMA and the federal government respond to the disaster. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Emergency_Management_Agency

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10 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

I think the only reason they are giving it to everyone is, they already have that system in place..

I don't think they can pull off dividing everyone into sections.. I believe that's why they did it the last time too, if I'm not mistaken..

Definitely, but they also had to put something in place to be able to help businesses and they did manage that.

It is simply EASIER to do it the way they did ---- and as I said, it makes everyone like them more.

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Just now, FairreLilette said:

Quite probable.  But, couldn't they have figured out how to divide by states at least?  Perhaps a new number is needed for individuals then - one that includes a number for state and county.  

California needs to declare a state of emergency and see if FEMA can help or somebody....

It's all coming from IRS I believe like last time.. For them to get any kind of new system in place to divide things up would take forever and a day..

Some people didn't ever get their checks and will have to wait for when they file their taxes, others didn't get them until like really late in the year..

it was a big mess back then and still a big mess now.. it's a wonder we haven't had a collapse already..hehehe

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3 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Definitely, but they also had to put something in place to be able to help businesses and they did manage that.

It is simply EASIER to do it the way they did ---- and as I said, it makes everyone like them more.

Imagine if it was a business and they were the board.. xD

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4 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

Quite probable.  But, couldn't they have figured out how to divide by states at least?  Perhaps a new number is needed for individuals then - a number that would include a code number for state and county.  

I'm not totally sure what you are wanting here.  Are you trying to say that the people in California should get more money just because they are on a tighter lockdown right now or because their hospitals are at 0%? 

 

 

6 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

California needs to declare a state of emergency and see if FEMA can help or somebody....

California declared a State of Emergency back in March (like many states) and it is still in effect.  Further steps by the Governor might be needed, assuming that COVID even falls within the things that FEMA might help with.

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10 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

It's all coming from IRS I believe like last time.. For them to get any kind of new system in place to divide things up would take forever and a day..

Some people didn't ever get their checks and will have to wait for when they file their taxes, others didn't get them until like really late in the year..

it was a big mess back then and still a big mess now.. it's a wonder we haven't had a collapse already..hehehe

There were enough places for it to been seen to sign into the appropriate IRS website to get a check.  People just didn't want to do it.  There are American's who don't like "Big Brother" government plus many people don't want to give out their address to "Big Brother".  It's sometimes considered "redneck thinking" but not always.  I don't know exactly what it is but some people just would not sign onto the IRS website to secure their check.  

But, anyhow...going forward...perhaps a code placed into our number for county and state is something that should be done.  It's weird and amazing how they just sent out so many checks at once though.  

But, California needing FEMA assistance is a different story but my government has been making me literally ill from stress with their mis-handling of real dire situations in my home state.  We have to have federal assistance and a state of emergency must be declared.  FEMA has the power to issue checks the same day.  I know, I received a check the morning of the 1994 Northridge earthquake in California.   

Edited by FairreLilette
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5 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

California declared a State of Emergency back in March (like many states) and it is still in effect.  Further steps by the Governor might be needed, assuming that COVID even falls within the things that FEMA might help with.

California is at -0% emergency room capacity...that is a different and immediate kind of state of emergency.  I never heard California had declared an official state of emergency anywhere and I browse through news every day.  

 

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1 minute ago, FairreLilette said:

California is at -0% emergency room capacity...that is a different and immediate kind of state of emergency.  I never heard California had declared an official state of emergency anywhere and I browse through news every day.  

 

https://www.nga.org/state-covid-19-emergency-orders/

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