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Is the Universe a computer simulation?


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As a physical scientist, I do too. Science is in the business of solving puzzles, which is one of the most demanding things you can do with your life (and is great fun too). As far as I am concerned,

I don't have a problem with people having faith in whatever they want to have faith in.  For various reasons, I do have an issue with most organized religion. And I have an issue with people that try

I am, in the broadest sense, an atheist. I do not believe in the divine. There are dogmatists who go further, claiming with certainty there is no divine. I can't go there. I share your dissatisfa

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Oo that would be interesting to watch because of the mention of Second Life and Neil de Grasse Tyson. How I see it personally, theoretically it's more probable that our universe is a simulation because it's possible, but sentience is sentience and meaning, and purpose remain subjective constructs of their beholders so whether or not our universe is a computer simulation, is a trivial matter imo c= but of course it would be nice to figure out the nature of our universe just for the sake of it

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2 hours ago, rasterscan said:

Is the Universe a computer simulation? This was the subject discussed by Neil de Grasse Tyson and David Chalmers amongst other high falutin' scientists in a Youtube vid I watched. Imagine my surprise when David Chalmers of all people dropped Second Life into the equation ! The moment occurs at 49.25 mins in !

 

Can you imagine, if none of you exist, there is just me, in a white room, being fed images and scenarios just to drive me out of my tiny mind.

Which is actually how it feels right now!!!

(Drama llama)

If you think about the chicken and the egg situation, and don't quite believe the theory of the big bang, then what are we all left with.

Brain ache, that's what! 

 

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Whatever it is.. it's much more complicated then who we think we are, what we really are, what we will become. theory's abound is a step closer to the truth, we will never know that truth as the human mind in cosmic terms is prenatal, but our collective human ego combined with short cultural memory, that in an aspect, would have us on a godly throne with our collective over perception of importance.

Intelligence, thought, emotions are not limited to or exist because of humanity, I would say it is something very common across time, space & dimension.

 

 

 

Edited by Shansi Kenin
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The answer is yes, and then the question is: is the universe inside which we are simulated in its turn also a simulator? And the answer is also yes. And then the question is: where does it stop? And the answer to that is: it's turtles all the way down. Q.E.D. And then the next question is: who's the d**wad on the turtle beneath us who threw the coronaswitch?

Edited by Arduenn Schwartzman
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The answer to the question is an obvious no.

Simple reason

If anyone gets to the point it becomes possible to create such a detailed universal simulation as the one we live in then they obviously have to assume their own is also a simulation and therefore they will be simulating a universe within a universal simulation and that any universe they simulate will also eventually produce someone who can create a perfect universe simulation. They then realise that all universes must be simulations which bend back on themselves and their brains melt and dribble out their ears

 

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9 hours ago, rasterscan said:

Is the Universe a computer simulation? This was the subject discussed by Neil de Grasse Tyson and David Chalmers amongst other high falutin' scientists in a Youtube vid I watched. Imagine my surprise when David Chalmers of all people dropped Second Life into the equation ! The moment occurs at 49.25 mins in !

 

I can't get the video to play for me, so apologies if this has already been covered.

The question should be, "Is it possible to simulate a universe?"

If the answer to that question is no, then no, our universe cannot be a simulation.

If the answer is yes, then yes, our universe is almost certainly a simulation: it'll be possible to create numerous such simulations, and within those simulations it'll be possible to create even more. Thus the number of simulations will vastly exceed the number of "real" universes. The odds of us living in a "real" universe would be vanishingly small.

I do think, however, the more accessible/interesting/relevant/immediate question is, "Is the universe digital?", whether it's "real" or just a simulation.

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Among all the reasons Atheists come up with to explain their dogmatic faith in the belief of an absence of divinity I've always found this one to be the top of the stupid pile.

It just dodges the question.

"The universe was made up by some geeks in a lab".

Ok... who made those geeks? What is their universe?

Sooner or later you hit the first universe - and you have to finally answer that question you've been dodging...

 

Fundamentalist Atheism can come up with some better ones than this... and has... but this one... is just a question dodge and no more.

 

 

 

 

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You may be interested in the movie "The 13th floor" which explores this quite well!

As for computer simulation, we will never know. There is no evidence proving or disproving any theories. Is there a computer simulation? Is there a God? Are we destined for forever nothingness? We may never know, only time will tell!

I say let people believe in what they want to believe. The universe is a very big and scary thing that we are more likely to either end in mutual destruction or the sun to go into super nova, than we discover the answers to it. If believing in one theory helps calm the fear of the unknown, I don't see any harm in it as long as they do not use it as an excuse to harm others.

If you want to believe it is a computer simulation, then you do you! Just don't go hurting other people because of what you believe, because you will never truly know if it is true or false.

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 Ok , peeking out from behind my chair,,,, Sl is a computer simulation.   I can only share what i believe  . I Believe in GOD , I Believe there is life after this. I know  a   few people who have crossed over and come back and no it was not lack of oxygen or  brain shutting down.  This is what  i believe .

 Mother Teresa – Do Good Anyway! – Online Fellowship

Edited by roseelvira
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2 hours ago, roseelvira said:

 Ok , peeking out from behind my chair,,,, Sl is a computer simulation.   I can only share what i believe  . I Believe in GOD , I Believe there is life after this. I know  a   few people who have crossed over and come back and no it was not lack of oxygen or  brain shutting down.  This is what  i believe .

 Mother Teresa – Do Good Anyway! – Online Fellowship

I agree.  Not necessarily a guy in a white coat. But imagining such complexity deriving from nothing defies my understanding. I know some who have crossed over and returned. I've had supernatural experiences. Something is running in the background.

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The universe is much more complicated than being a computer simulation. We, as humanity, are simply choosing to understand it using the newest thinking that has been discovered. The universe as a computer simulation certainly seems like intellectual thinking compared to what people in previous centuries thought, e.g. a god created the universe. In the future when even grander theories of existence are created, we will try applying those to the universe as well. 

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a thing with measuring our universe is that we are inside it, and have no knowledge (other than by hypothesis or imagination) of what the universe looks from the outside

in another thread is a discussion about the SL world. Is it flat, is it round, is it some other shape ? In working this thru we have God (God meaning linden/user) knowledge of its construction. From an avatar's pov tho and only using observation, measurement and deduction available to the avatar within, then the deduction is the SL world would most likely be some kind of donut/torus. Which is not the actual case and demonstrably not the case when god/linden/user knowledge is applied

as humans we have the same difficulty. We are like the avatar, inside the universe. Our understanding of our universe is only as good as the tools available to measure it from the inside

this said, Maddy once told me some long time ago now in another similar thread on here. It doesn't make any difference to the avatar what the universe looks like from the outside. We/human/avatar are inside it with no way out other than by hypothesis and/or imagination. Which led me to better understand how to reconcile faith with science

faith (belief) like hypothesis and imagination can move our viewpoint anywhere. What faith/belief/hypothesis/imagination can't do is change the actual outcomes of measurements taken on the inside using the tools available to us. The inside is where we actually are and the measurements are what they are, and how we live/survive inside is by those measurements. Which is what science is: a method of measurement

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It's hard to tell the Unknowable from the Unknown. In the face of uncertainty, sometimes faith is the right answer. That, or absurdity.  As Arduenn says, it's turtles all the way down.

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4 hours ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

Among all the reasons Atheists come up with to explain their dogmatic faith in the belief of an absence of divinity I've always found this one to be the top of the stupid pile.

It just dodges the question.

"The universe was made up by some geeks in a lab".

Ok... who made those geeks? What is their universe?

Sooner or later you hit the first universe - and you have to finally answer that question you've been dodging...

Fundamentalist Atheism can come up with some better ones than this... and has... but this one... is just a question dodge and no more.

I am, in the broadest sense, an atheist. I do not believe in the divine. There are dogmatists who go further, claiming with certainty there is no divine. I can't go there.

I share your dissatisfaction with geeks in labs. That's turtles, all the way down.

I don't see how understanding that there are questions we can't yet, or might never answer, is somehow dodging them. We'll just keep learning. Curiously, the more we know, the more we know we don't know. That's okay.

Religion has produced a bumper crop of "true" answers, many in conflict with each other, and on the wrong side of history. Deciding you have the answer because it's uncomfortable to say "I don't know"? That's dodging the question.

To the extent we might improve our lot by avoiding that discomfort, without causing harm to ourselves and each other, I've no problem with "belief". To the extent that dodging serious questions for the security of simple answers harms us, I'll take the uncertainty.

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3 minutes ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

To the extent we might improve our lot by avoiding that discomfort, without causing harm to ourselves and each other, I've no problem with "belief". To the extent that dodging serious questions for the security of simple answers harms us, I'll take the uncertainty.

I think we just said the same thing, but you were more eloquent.  ;)

 

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5 hours ago, roseelvira said:

 Mother Teresa – Do Good Anyway! – Online Fellowship

24 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:

This goes for anyone and everyone, btw. I don't care if you hate me, I don't care if you just don't like me. I don't care if you don't even know me. If you need a sounding board, for whatever reason...find me. Send me a msg here, send me a msg inworld, nc, send me a friggen carrier pigeon...don't care. Find me. I don't know that I can help, but even if I can't, keeping it in is stupid and will end up hurting you, I know it will. 

If it's not me, find someone, anywhere, just somewhere. 

This is what I believe in.  I am an atheist.  I believe in what exists inside this universe.  I believe in people.

What exists outside of our universe is not important and is unknowable from inside our universe.  There is either a whole universe of universes out there or there is nothing.  No turtles at all in either of those choices.  So no, it is not a simulation inside a simulation nor is it the divine will of Bob. 

But that's the universe and it is simple to answer.  What is life?  That's the real question.
Life is a time of pain until we are welcomed by the comforting embrace of death.  There is plenty of pain to go around; there is no need to be creating more.  Thus the two quotes.

At least that is what I believe.

YMMV

 

 

 

 

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