Jump to content
lucagrabacr

My analysis on how LL's marketing of SL can be even better while simultaneously increasing its cultural relevance

You are about to reply to a thread that has been inactive for 149 days.

Please take a moment to consider if this thread is worth bumping.

Recommended Posts

5 hours ago, animats said:

Summary:

  • Strawberry: Adult side ignored by marketing/PR. "Scary" says marketing guy. Google, Facebook, etc. have guidelines with extreme limitations. Restricted by mainstream marketing channels. At risk of ability to advertise on mainstream channels. "Romance" campaigns do very well.

Considering that every video on PornHub starts with an advert for an online sex game, perhaps they should try advertising there...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/1/2020 at 4:13 AM, Mollymews said:

yes

it gets mused sometimes what is SL culture ? Is there such a thing ? If so then what is it ? And if this is true then how can it shown ?

a way to think about culture, is that it can be (and most often is) an outward reflection of ourselves.  What others think about when they see us. When we reflect ourselves then people see this and think about who we are. And when we tell our story well then others know and understand us, and most important is when reflected, told, well then others can relate to and identify with some part of our story. Touching their heart and mind

storytelling is key

the story plot of Linden is:  Second Life - Your World, Your Imagination

changing this up for a moment.  Second Life - Your World, Your Story

Your Imagination is a tool to create a story.  Your Story is real even when it is imagined. Your Story is about you, you doing something that is happening. Is not about a tool in your possession

if I was the boss. I would make 2-3 minute promo vids, movie trailer style, which touches the heart and mind of the watcher.  A vid which tells a story about a greater story. The greater story being you, the person watching the vid

each vid having a central character, with supporting characters

examples: In the Bryn Oh case. Our character/avatar is an art lover and collector. They see the work thru their own eyes and relate to the audience what they think it is about. Then our character meets the artist character. O.M.G !!  Not Bryn Oh the real world person, Bryn Oh the inworld character who relates to our hero thru the medium of SL within the artwork itself

a more every day example. Linden Homes.  Our story character/avatar gets a home. There is nothing in this story about webpages or buttons to click on. Our story is about the new homeowner. Our character tells their story of moving in, furnishing it, making it habitable. Making it their home. With a few friends who drop by during the story, like helping out by moving stuff about. Ending in the kind of contentment being expressed, which every home/nest maker can relate too

another every day example.  Getting ready for the ball. Story opens in our dressing room. All the tribulations of what to wear. Our friend in the room, chatting away trying to give helpful advice, like they do, being nosey about who we going to the ball with. All the conversations that happen in these situations. Ending with our date, at the door. We make our grand appearance, and all swoons happily ever after

and so on. A story about a character riding a horse. Sailing. Encountering a mer. A road trip. Hooking up with some absolutely adorable person at a club. A story about a picnic and bicycles. etc etc

a story done live gamer podcast style. Looting on Linden Realms, and gamer styling other such action games in SL also in real time

culture can be seen as some higher level abstract. Culture tho is also seen in ordinary every day things, in ordinary every day lives. And for most of us in Second Life this is what we do - ordinary every day things. And when our story is told well then you, the audience, can relate to it, and when so then this is your story also

Have you seen our MADE IN SL series at all? 

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/1/2020 at 4:49 AM, Rolig Loon said:

Yes.  This is it exactly.

That is what I am trying to accomplish in the travelogue posts that I have been putting in the Linden Homes subforum.  I could be simply posting a set of photos from a particular part of Bellisseria, but I find it more interesting to use the photos to tell the story of a short exploration.  I'm not just showing a set of slides, I am providing a narrative that says what I am feeling as I visit places, complete with the sort of silly asides that I would interject if you and I were looking through photos that I took along the way.  I have no idea how well I am drawing other people into my story, but it makes sense to me.  If I were making videos to "sell" SL to potential residents, that's exactly how I would do it.

Have you considered submitting to our MADE IN SL series? Check it out sometime!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/3/2020 at 3:35 PM, Beth Macbain said:

Second Life isn't one thing and it is never going to be able to create a singularly focused advertising campaign and be very successful with it. They need to be diverse with their marketing efforts (and budget). This is not exclusionary and limiting. It's the opposite, actually. If all their efforts were focused on what would be appealing to you, it likely wouldn't be appealing to me. What would appeal to me likely wouldn't appeal to builders. What appeals to builders likely wouldn't appeal to the family RP people. What appeals to them likely wouldn't appeal to the steampunk folks. What would appeal to them likely wouldn't appeal to the furries. See how that works? Or doesn't work? 

Diversity is good. Putting all your eggs in one basket is bad. 

1025133711_giphy(1).gif.5b5b53759568520ede09f94835c2a553.gif

Have you seen our MADE IN SL videos? Trying for diversity :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/4/2020 at 11:06 AM, AlexandriaBrangwin said:

Against my better judgement I decided to give it one last try.

I went to Ahern to try and do a comic on "Second Life Avatar uses Second Life to see what the fuss is about".😄

Okay...some surprised facial animations....wait...no scripts?

Well then.....................um.............................yeah.....so much for that idea!

Try attaching your facial animation HUD in an area where you can run scripts, before you tp to Ahern.   

If the HUD is properly scripted, it should continue to work in no script areas, so long as it's attached and running when you arrive there.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Draxtor Despres said:

Have you seen our MADE IN SL series at all? 

yes. The Made in SL series is realworld people showing what they make in SL

did you read what I wrote at all ?

 

edit add

i probably sound a bit snippy.  I just explain that all your works cast a realworld person as the topic of interest. Your vids are documentaries. They are not character based stories

Edited by Mollymews
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, Quartz Mole said:

Try attaching your facial animation HUD in an area where you can run scripts, before you tp to Ahern.   

If the HUD is properly scripted, it should continue to work in no script areas, so long as it's attached and running when you arrive there.

No that doesn't work...the second thing I tried!

The same method would allow abusive residents to use griefing objects...the very reason I suspect scripts were banned there in the first place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Draxtor Despres said:

Have you seen our MADE IN SL series at all? 

 

3 hours ago, Draxtor Despres said:

Have you considered submitting to our MADE IN SL series? Check it out sometime!

 

2 hours ago, Draxtor Despres said:

Have you seen our MADE IN SL videos? Trying for diversity :)

no, and these responses aren't really very inviting, so thanks but never.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Draxtor Despres said:

Have you seen our MADE IN SL videos? Trying for diversity :)

When are you releasing the Sex Made in Second Life episode?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Beth Macbain said:

When are you releasing the Sex Made in Second Life episode?

I did a feature documentary about that in 2011 which was very successful and seen around the globe. Highly recommend = it is called "Login2Life"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Mollymews said:

yes. The Made in SL series is realworld people showing what they make in SL

did you read what I wrote at all ?

 

edit add

i probably sound a bit snippy.  I just explain that all your works cast a realworld person as the topic of interest. Your vids are documentaries. They are not character based stories

Ah I see. Are you familiar with all of the work I do for the official channel and my own? I was not aware that "all my works" do that :) If you like to email me and suggest a framing please do. Would love to hear from talented storytellers = madeinsl@draxtor.com 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Draxtor Despres said:

I did a feature documentary about that in 2011 which was very successful and seen around the globe. Highly recommend = it is called "Login2Life"

I should add that the film contains a lot more than just sex but it was very important to us to show the sex "industry" in a objective light without the stigma attached to it by other media

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Alwin Alcott said:

 

 

no, and these responses aren't really very inviting, so thanks but never.

That is too bad. LL is investing a lot in video since last year and our door is wide open for all sorts of stories. It is quite exciting to be able to tell them :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Quartz Mole said:

If the HUD is properly scripted, it should continue to work in no script areas, so long as it's attached and running when you arrive there.

6 hours ago, AlexandriaBrangwin said:

The same method would allow abusive residents to use griefing objects...the very reason I suspect scripts were banned there in the first place.

As I recall, it's possible to turn off scripts altogether in a sim, as one can disable physics, but I don't think that's relevant to Ahern. Rather, I suspect the HUD isn't "properly scripted" for this purpose. It's standard practice to sidestep parcel-level bans on attached scripts by calling llTakeControls() as soon as possible (and then not even bothering to register a control() event handler). This is no kind of secret at all and has been used since forever, but it's possible some scripters might eschew the practice because, indeed, even griefers know how to use it.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Draxtor Despres said:

I should add that the film contains a lot more than just sex but it was very important to us to show the sex "industry" in a objective light without the stigma attached to it by other media

I appreciate what you do. I think you love SL just like the rest of us and want to show everyone all the reasons why you love it. I watched the trailer for your movie and due to the fact that avatars have changed so much in the last decade, what I saw hasn't aged well. Absolutely not your fault... there's nothing you can do about mesh improving avatars so much that a project from 10 years ago doesn't project an image of what SL looks like now. 

And that makes me think it would be cool to see a project showing how things have changed in the last 10 years for those who knew the old SL and either dismissed it, or lost interest in it. 

Also, if I'm looking for sexy immersion, seeing the RL people behind the avatars... no. Hell, I don't want to see myself much less anyone else! Most people come into SL as an escape from the real world. We don't really want to see the man behind the curtain. 

Please don't get me wrong... I think your videos are great and appeal to a certain audience. But in reaching for diversity, I think LL needs to feature work by other videographers, and the talent pool in SL runs deep. Your videos have a distinctive style that is yours, just as every artist does. I'd like to see SL take pride in others, as they do with photography. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:
6 hours ago, AlexandriaBrangwin said:

The same method would allow abusive residents to use griefing objects...the very reason I suspect scripts were banned there in the first place.

As I recall, it's possible to turn off scripts altogether in a sim, as one can disable physics, but I don't think that's relevant to Ahern. Rather, I suspect the HUD isn't "properly scripted" for this purpose. It's standard practice to sidestep parcel-level bans on attached scripts by calling llTakeControls() as soon as possible (and then not even bothering to register a control() event handler). This is no kind of secret at all and has been used since forever, but it's possible some scripters might eschew the practice because, indeed, even griefers know how to use it.

It's quite easy to check whether Linden Lab has found some way to completely disable scripts there, including ones that use the llTakeControls trick.  That "trick" is widely used in AO's, to make sure that people don't stop being properly animated when they enter no-script areas.  So .... go to Ahern and see if your AO stops.  If it doesn't, then the problem  has nothing to do with the region. Your own HUD wasn't well-scripted, as Quartz suggests.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Beth Macbain said:

I appreciate what you do. I think you love SL just like the rest of us and want to show everyone all the reasons why you love it. I watched the trailer for your movie and due to the fact that avatars have changed so much in the last decade, what I saw hasn't aged well. Absolutely not your fault... there's nothing you can do about mesh improving avatars so much that a project from 10 years ago doesn't project an image of what SL looks like now. 

And that makes me think it would be cool to see a project showing how things have changed in the last 10 years for those who knew the old SL and either dismissed it, or lost interest in it. 

Also, if I'm looking for sexy immersion, seeing the RL people behind the avatars... no. Hell, I don't want to see myself much less anyone else! Most people come into SL as an escape from the real world. We don't really want to see the man behind the curtain. 

Please don't get me wrong... I think your videos are great and appeal to a certain audience. But in reaching for diversity, I think LL needs to feature work by other videographers, and the talent pool in SL runs deep. Your videos have a distinctive style that is yours, just as every artist does. I'd like to see SL take pride in others, as they do with photography. 

The door is WIDE open and we constantly do outreach [Strawberry, I and others] but we can only respond to people who come forward. As for style I would encourage you to check out the full offerings of videos including the ones that do NOT feature real life footage. And in regards to what "most people in SL" want = with all due respect I disagree with your opinion. I think it is pretty unknowable what "people" actually want. And that is true for any gigantic place with countless subcultures and micro niches ;)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Draxtor Despres said:

The door is WIDE open and we constantly do outreach [Strawberry, I and others] but we can only respond to people who come forward. As for style I would encourage you to check out the full offerings of videos including the ones that do NOT feature real life footage. And in regards to what "most people in SL" want = with all due respect I disagree with your opinion. I think it is pretty unknowable what "people" actually want. And that is true for any gigantic place with countless subcultures and micro niches ;)

Fair enough. I certainly can't speak for what most people want - I don't have any data on that other than my own anecdotal data which is worth approximately nothing. 

Would be interesting if LL sent out a really comprehensive survey to all their active residents (and perhaps a different one for inactive residents) asking these questions and a lot more, and sharing the data. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And, by the way, I love that these conversations are happening, and that LL is listening and engaging. I personally feel that SL is in a state of flux at the moment in a very good way and the next year or two is really going to define the path forward. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Draxtor Despres said:

The door is WIDE open and we constantly do outreach [Strawberry, I and others] but we can only respond to people who come forward. As for style I would encourage you to check out the full offerings of videos including the ones that do NOT feature real life footage. And in regards to what "most people in SL" want = with all due respect I disagree with your opinion. I think it is pretty unknowable what "people" actually want. And that is true for any gigantic place with countless subcultures and micro niches ;)

As documented on Twitter, I reached out to you...but you blocked/muted me after you posted a picture of yourself in a Bernie Sanders T-shirt and I reacted with confusion.

I know it's a savage battleground of "you're either with me or against me" at the moment, but there is life after an election.

Smashing perceived threats with a brick doesn't bode well for community building!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Just my personal opinion, LL should at least highlight freebie/cheap stuffs more, I remembered the first time I login to SL, I was just messing around with freebie stuffs, like funny guns, funny banana dance, funny "this is sparta!!" animation and so much more that I feel so old now trying to remembering them, Invest more with memes not with just "elite/super realistic stuffs". I will never spend a dime on the first few months on something that I have no time investments.

This way when people login to SL, It's not that disappointing that you don't look like the avatar from the ads and don't feel that there's a pay wall to actually play SL.

Re-create the freebie library sim where it's super organized and show in top searched place as "official" or something that they won't lost on bloated traffic freebie dungeons, how can people stay on something they're lost, and no idea what to do? My first few months in SL is hoarding a lot of freebie scripts to mess around, and make my own giant Axe from Torley's Tutorial "How to make a flag that waves in wind - Second Life TuTORial"

 

Some of old residents are so focused with realistic and what I call end game contents and very expensive for new player that never explored SL.

SL still need those new era of builders that will make, simple stuffs and easier to produce and will most likely be cheap, and affordable by new users, but LL need to step up a little more and update the in-world building tools for slightly complex shapes or even clothes that doesn't need external 3d software to make.

Here's my personal experience with SL when I first login, what's yours?

Edited by xMister Dash
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, AlexandriaBrangwin said:

As documented on Twitter, I reached out to you...but you blocked/muted me after you posted a picture of yourself in a Bernie Sanders T-shirt and I reacted with confusion.

I know it's a savage battleground of "you're either with me or against me" at the moment, but there is life after an election.

Smashing perceived threats with a brick doesn't bode well for community building!

Hi Alexandria, my Twitter is my private place where I share my passions for a lot of different things. It is not confined to SL activities by any means.  And please do not misrepresent our interaction on this forum? I am more than happy to work with you on a piece about your passion in SL. The submission guidelines are well established through LL [where I am not an employee] and you can reach me via madeinsl@draxtor.com. Looking forward to hearing from you :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Beth Macbain said:

Fair enough. I certainly can't speak for what most people want - I don't have any data on that other than my own anecdotal data which is worth approximately nothing. 

Would be interesting if LL sent out a really comprehensive survey to all their active residents (and perhaps a different one for inactive residents) asking these questions and a lot more, and sharing the data. 

I don't have that data either. LL does have a LOT of it though and we address our video stuff accordingly. I think we might do a live show where we illuminate this more. Again I encourage folks to get in touch with me, check out ALL the very different video formats our time produces and suggest ideas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

As someone who has never seen an SL ad on the internet (I know shocking), it was good to see in that blog post what they do look like, however looking at them, I myself thought they were poor in the same sense as what Rathgrith posted but also in other ways.

Why do I say they are poor?

Firstly, the image advertisements offered no discernible context to any specific audience and just gives the appearance that you picked a picture off the net and added 'Join for Free' button. Whilst I understand that its a small image space for advertising there can certainly be a lot that can be placed in such a small space to get your point across. None of the picture adverts provided any form of showing what a person can expect to do in SL (apart from the DJ one) or most of all why they should join. A picture just showing an avatar with black wings or a picture of two avatars close to each other offer no incentive for anyone to see what it is all about and don't get me started on the cheesiness of the summer one.

With these image adverts LL need to make sure that they encompass exactly what SL is like and all its positives with in a precisely imaged and worded advert. Things like be anyone or anything or bring your imagination to life or meet someone from another country without going there. Those are the core fundamentals of second life (now at least considering inworld creation is so poor) and encompass everything that SL is, Be anyone, create anything and meet everyone. That should be the focus of adverts and they should be done in a creative (non cheesy) manner to reflect the personality second life has. Showcase its strong points not just 'here's a random picture of two people close to each other with a join now button'... That is done to death by the likes of the sims, or imvu or any other dress up or meetup virtual world/game. Think of something different and more engaging.

For example (and keeping in the theme that SL offers) of how impacting image marketing in a small space can be images like these need to be produced: 

creative-ad-06.jpeg

This image (one of a series) is simple yet brings across the point in a directed manner. Reading a book you can become anyone. There is no ambiguity in the picture and is a perfect example of how to advertise the reason WHY you need to try something. In this case reading. SL has the same characteristics of a book in that you can be anyone or live any life or be anywhere in any time. Focus on that and show it. Don't just show a picture that shows nothing or reveals nothing about what you can do in SL. Be creative. For example get a picture of a famous crowded landmark and blend it seamlessly into the SL built equivalent and simply caption it "To crowded to see? Join SL now and skip the queue". Whilst yes, they will see it isn't as good as the real thing, it showcases to the new user what can be seen and done in SL all the while engaging them in something they are passionate about, travelling and seeing the sites.

As to the video marketing ad's, they are better but are still flawed. As some have mentioned, don't showcase things that are badly implemented in SL like the sword fighting scene in that advert for role play. Just watching it with the bad animations, poor look avatars and not to mention horrendous blood splatter looks like a game made in 2005. It wont appeal to many if any. By all means focus on the RP aspect of SL as it is a major drawcard and bonus of it, however if you want to engage people don't show them things that put SL in a bad light or will disappoint them down the track. For RP focus on old school RP, or acting. Those kind of things that don't showcase combat which just doesn't work at all in SL due to the limit in scripting and etc. Focus on things like Harry Potter themed RP where you can attend classes, be a wizard, act it out as if you were part of it with custom hud, custom spells etc. Get permission to use a snippet of the classic Harry Potter music (though that might be a tough ask!).

Never mention anything in the advertising about making things as, like Rathgrith mentioned, it gives the false impression that you can create beautiful things in world. That ship has sailed due to the prim system not being updated. Either fix it or just don't advertise it unless you can somehow advertise creation with 3rd party software in a good way (good luck with that).

With the 'avatar customisation/fashion' advert, within the space of 15 seconds you could have skipped all of the sign in to SL irrelevant stuff and started off with a moving (dancing) avatar changing into various outfits slowly (with no jerky camera movement) and then over the course of the advert it speeds up showcasing many more outfits and avatar looks (and not just human) all while the avatar moves. Instead, all you did is made a really jerky off putting advert that, with the camera moving around like it does, just makes it really hard to focus on the main subject (the avatar) as your eyes are constantly trying to focus on the right place. To make it even more engaging and to showcase multiple aspects of SL you could have the background changing with the outfits fitting the outfit theme. So a dance club with a dance outfit, and medieval outfit with a medieval background. Within 15 seconds you could have by the end showcased 100's of outfits and backgrounds, all the while also giving the impression that there are hundreds of possibilities not just 4!

Lastly, whilst the surfing advert was interesting, try not to mention things like "the best thing about this beach is that no one is here" it gives the wrong impression. No, it doesn't give the impression that it is an exclusive beach in some hideaway place only locals know of therefore it is quite with no one around. All it does is highlight to people that SL is vastly unpopulated. You want to give people the impression that it is full of life, not just one person surfing and Drax being the extra 'cause there was no one else.

Edited by Drayke Newall
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You are about to reply to a thread that has been inactive for 149 days.

Please take a moment to consider if this thread is worth bumping.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...