Drune is gone :(((( Why Linden Lab. can't keep it going?

[Tolya Ugajin]

2 hours ago, Pavon2 said:

I have removed the link to Flickr. 

Why instead of attacking me immediately, pointing out what I do wrong, and give irrelevant answer, why don't you think for a moment that an amazing sim is gone, something which could bring people to Second Life, because there was simply nothing else even close to this place ever on the grind. And this isn't just my opinion, but a feeling many people have.  

Second Life needs something that would bring new people in. And this sim was one of these things. 

You don't care? Then why are you here?

Alwin didn't even come close to an attack.  Her answer was succinct and accurate.  She probably doesn't "think for a moment" because there are literally thousands (if not tens of thousands) of sims and she's never been to Drune - I've never heard of it myself.  Great sims come and great sims change and great sims go every week.  LL is watching the cash flow - they can't be taking over sims that the owners no longer want, they have enough work keeping mainland up to date.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

Drune is (was?), by all accounts, a really nicely done sim. It had become something of a favourite with photographers: you'll see a number of pics set there in the picture threads in "Your Avatar." I've been there twice, but never ventured outside a club there, so I can't really speak from personal experience to how well done it is (was?), but the images I've seen suggest it was a worthwhile place to visit. Personally, I think SL rather overdoes the dystopian / Blade Runner kind of thing (just as we have a surfeit of charming rural sims with abandoned pickup trucks), but then that's not really my thing, so my opinion doesn't actually matter much in that regard.

@Pavon2 -- it sounds as though not all hope is lost, so keep your fingers crossed?

I'll just say, as I said when we went through this with the imminent closing of Hangars Liquides (another dystopian sim), that Linden Lab, if they give any thought at all to stepping in, will engage in the kind of calculation that you might expect any for-profit business to perform: they'll ask themselves whether their product, i.e., SL, is sufficiently enhanced by the sim to justify the expense that might be involved in supporting it. LL doesn't keep sims going out of the goodness of their hearts, or a sense of public spiritedness: they do so, I very much suspect, on the basis of a cost/benefits analysis.

Presumably, having done so, they decided that ChouChou was worth saving. They possibly may make the same determination about Drune (which, despite what is being said here, does seem to have actually been a pretty popular place). And they might well be wrong in their analysis, one way or another.

The point is, arguments about whether LL should or shouldn't save sims like Drune are kinda missing the point: LL will support them, or not, for reasons that have little or nothing to do with the kinds of arguments being made here. You can argue with the logic of any decision they may ultimately make, but it's not actually about saving something because it's "good" or even "popular": it is, as I say, a calculation. The best we can really do is have faith that LL knows what they are doing when they make such decisions.

As for supporting it through donations, group fees, and so on -- does anyone really know a sim that is self-sustaining in this way? The only way, I suspect, that this can be accomplished is through rentals. And that can sometimes be a problematic solution as well.

[Pavon2]

5 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Drune is (was?), by all accounts, a really nicely done sim. It had become something of a favourite with photographers: you'll see a number of pics set there in the picture threads in "Your Avatar." I've been there twice, but never ventured outside a club there, so I can't really speak from personal experience to how well done it is (was?), but the images I've seen suggest it was a worthwhile place to visit. Personally, I think SL rather overdoes the dystopian / Blade Runner kind of thing (just as we have a surfeit of charming rural sims with abandoned pickup trucks), but then that's not really my thing, so my opinion doesn't actually matter much in that regard.

@Pavon2 -- it sounds as though not all hope is lost, so keep your fingers crossed?

I'll just say, as I said when we went through this with the imminent closing of Hangars Liquides (another dystopian sim), that Linden Lab, if they give any thought at all to stepping in, will engage in the kind of calculation that you might expect any for-profit business to perform: they'll ask themselves whether their product, i.e., SL, is sufficiently enhanced by the sim to justify the expense that might be involved in supporting it. LL doesn't keep sims going out of the goodness of their hearts, or a sense of public spiritedness: they do so, I very much suspect, on the basis of a cost/benefits analysis.

Presumably, having done so, they decided that ChouChou was worth saving. They possibly may make the same determination about Drune (which, despite what is being said here, does seem to have actually been a pretty popular place). And they might well be wrong in their analysis, one way or another.

The point is, arguments about whether LL should or shouldn't save sims like Drune are kinda missing the point: LL will support them, or not, for reasons that have little or nothing to do with the kinds of arguments being made here. You can argue with the logic of any decision they may ultimately make, but it's not actually about saving something because it's "good" or even "popular": it is, as I say, a calculation. The best we can really do is have faith that LL knows what they are doing when they make such decisions.

As for supporting it through donations, group fees, and so on -- does anyone really know a sim that is self-sustaining in this way? The only way, I suspect, that this can be accomplished is through rentals. And that can sometimes be a problematic solution as well.

Thank you very much for this post. It's the only post that brings something valuable to this discussion. 

I will keep hoping someone will see it as valuable enough to keep. 

[Maitimo]

2 hours ago, Pavon2 said:

It was relatively new sim. 

This is exactly why Linden Lab would not have done anything, even if they'd been asked. The only prior cases in which they have stepped in to save a place from closure is when its been somewhere very longstanding that is a part of SL history. That's why they saved Chouchou and the SS Galaxy. 

Not because they are popular, or because they look good, but because they were part of SL's early years.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

1 minute ago, Pavon2 said:

I will keep hoping someone will see it as valuable enough to keep.

For your sake, and for others who clearly love the place, I hope so too, or that the owners do find a way to sustain it.

Anyone who has been in SL longer than 6 months comes to expect that sometimes a particularly favourite sim will disappear (or be changed in ways that make it less attractive to us): depending upon your viewpoint, that's a strength or a weakness of the platform. Over the years, I've seen many places I love vanish. The fact that it is a function of how SL operates doesn't make it any easier or more pleasant when it happens.

So, fingers crossed, as I said.

[Alwin Alcott]

8 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

I will keep hoping someone will see it as valuable enough to keep. 

you keep repeating this, but answer now: what did you spend already to support the owner?
If the region was quite new, it's perhaps a total miscalculation by the owner... and a group supporting in words, but no money.
If 50 of those many you mentioned donate 4 dollars a month it's solved.

Edited January 30, 2020 by Alwin Alcott

[Scylla Rhiadra]

27 minutes ago, Tolya Ugajin said:

I've never heard of it myself

It's never heard of you either.

And yet . . . here you are.

[Lyssa Greymoon]

I've never heard of it, either. If it's valuable enough to keep, it's also valuable enough to tell people about. Preferably before the doors get closed.

[Pamela Galli]

13 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

fingers crossed,

Finally, some direction of what to DO!🤞

[Cindy Evanier]

36 minutes ago, Tolya Ugajin said:

Her answer

his  

[Luna Bliss]

[Pavon2]

5 minutes ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

I've never heard of it, either. If it's valuable enough to keep, it's also valuable enough to tell people about. Preferably before the doors get closed.

Unfortunately, as usual in life, to find the most valuable things you need to make a research yourself. 

[LittleMe Jewell]

4 hours ago, Pavon2 said:

I have read on Flickr today that Drune sim is gone. I can't believe it. It was literally the best sim in Second Life ever. This sim could bring more people to Second Life than any advertisment ever did. Why Linden Lab. can not reach out to the owner, bring it back and keep this sim going? Isn't it what happened to ChouChou? 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Rachel1206 said:

From the group notice in the Drune Group, read from the source.

"I want to reiterate the "for a while" part of the notice she sent earlier. I am getting some IMs that took her notice a little too tragically. The sim still exists; it's just closed while Hera takes some time to consider what to do next. I don't know more than that.

Group chat is closed during this time. I'll share more when there is more to share.

You're a wonderful community. Let's stay that way."

So take it easy - keep calm 😁

 

 

So basically:

[Lyssa Greymoon]

Just now, Pavon2 said:

Unfortunately, as usual in life, to find the most valuable things you need to make a research yourself. 

 

[Pavon2]

Just now, LittleMe Jewell said:

 

 

 

So basically:

No, the sky is not falling. No need to be sarcastic. 

[Madelaine McMasters]

As Scylla explained, LL calculates the expected return on any investment they make, and makes only those investments expected to increase the value of the company. They do, of course, miscalculate now and then, but to stay alive as a business, you can't do that often. Though you claim Drune would attract new residents, only LL is in a position to actually know if that's true to the extent it's worth preserving.

Upsetting as it might be, the loss of Drune pales in comparison to the loss of SL. By extension of your argument, should that happen, would you petition your RL neighbors or your government to preserve Linden Lab?

I lost Forgotten City, my home of over five years because the owners could no longer afford to keep it running. It was a sad day for me, but I did not expect anyone else to rush in and preserve something that I, and a handful of others, cherished.

[Madelaine McMasters]

2 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

Unfortunately, as usual in life, to find the most valuable things you need to make a research yourself. 

For Linden Lab to find the most valuable things, they need to do the research themselves. I suspect they do.

I long ago learned that my personal likes and dislike are not widely shared. Fortunately, I love searching and it's not hard for me to find new things I like when the old things go away.

[Pavon2]

1 minute ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

As Scylla explained, LL calculates the expected return on any investment they make, and makes only those investments expected to increase the value of the company. They do, of course, miscalculate now and then, but to stay alive as a business, you can't do that often. Though you claim Drune would attract new residents, only LL is in a position to actually know if that's true to the extent it's worth preserving.

Upsetting as it might be, the loss of Drune pales in comparison to the loss of SL. By extension of your argument, should that happen, would you petition your RL neighbors or your government to preserve Linden Lab?

I lost Forgotten City, my home of over five years because the owners could no longer afford to keep it running. It was a sad day for me, but I did not expect anyone else to rush in and preserve something that I, and a handful of others, cherished.

But I don't want to just sit and do nothing. I don't expect them to save it. I hope they will save it. If there is at least 1% of chance a Linden will see it, if they don't know about the sim yet, then I think it's worth to post it.

 

[Luna Bliss]

4 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

But I don't want to just sit and do nothing. I don't expect them to save it. I hope they will save it. If there is at least 1% of chance a Linden will see it, if they don't know about the sim yet, then I think it's worth to post it.

I admire your love of something beautiful in virtual worlds, and your attempt to find out how you might be able to keep it..

[LittleMe Jewell]

9 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

No, the sky is not falling. No need to be sarcastic. 

You are the one that created a post screaming bloody murder about the region closing -- i.e. the end of the world / sky is falling -- when a later post showed that you were most definitely over-reacting.

Thus my post might appear sarcastic, but it is also totally true.

 

Sometimes the truth hurts.

[BelindaN]

The sim owner may have tired of running it, and want something new, or may have simply found it too expensive to continue as it was.

If group chat is still running, that's the place to keep up to date with developments.

[Beth Macbain]

Reading this reminds me of another recent thread about moderating the forums.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

"Do as I say, not as I do."

[Pavon2]

8 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

You are the one that created a post screaming bloody murder about the region closing -- i.e. the end of the world / sky is falling -- when a later post showed that you were most definitely over-reacting.

Thus my post might appear sarcastic, but it is also totally true.

 

Sometimes the truth hurts.

Yes, maybe I was too emotional. But I was just sad the sim is gone. 

[Pamela Galli]

5 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

Yes, maybe I was too emotional. But I was just sad the sim is gone. 

Next time just say that, you will receive some commiseration, as we have all had the same experience.

Also, it’s not in fact gone.

Edited January 30, 2020 by Pamela Galli

[Scylla Rhiadra]

26 minutes ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

I lost Forgotten City

So . . . you remember Forgotten City?

Maybe the reason it failed is that it was so clearly misnamed?