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Drune is gone :(((( Why Linden Lab. can't keep it going?


Pavon2
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I have read on Flickr today that Drune sim is gone. I can't believe it. It was literally the best sim in Second Life ever. This sim could bring more people to Second Life than any advertisment ever did. Why Linden Lab. can not reach out to the owner, bring it back and keep this sim going? Isn't it what happened to ChouChou? 

 

 

Edited by Pavon2
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8 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

I have  .[ clearly edited the post, removed overreacting en irrelevant information]

 

links to adult content are not permitted on the forums ..
also the relevance of publishing Dakota's profile page isn't clear to me

if a owner stops paying, regions are taken down, it's also a feature.. making space for something new.
Suggestion : make substantial and periodic gifts to the region owner so he can keep the region running.
 

Edited by Alwin Alcott
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11 minutes ago, Alwin Alcott said:

links to adult content are not permitted on the forums ..
also the relevance of publishing Dakota's profile page isn't clear to me

if a owner stops paying, regions are taken down, it's also a feature.. making space for something new.
Suggestion : make substantial and periodic gifts to the region owner so he can keep the region running.
 

I have removed the link to Flickr. 

Why instead of attacking me immediately, pointing out what I do wrong, and give irrelevant answer, why don't you think for a moment that an amazing sim is gone, something which could bring people to Second Life, because there was simply nothing else even close to this place ever on the grind. And this isn't just my opinion, but a feeling many people have.  

Second Life needs something that would bring new people in. And this sim was one of these things. 

You don't care? Then why are you here?

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14 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

[...] and give irrelevantanswer [...]

Not irrelevant. LL can’t commit to subsidize every region some people like (I myself never heard of it); sure, nice ones can be argued to be a selling factor for SL as a whole. But if we took the argument to the extreme, few region owners would want to pay. SL needs to remain a viable business, Linden Lab can’t pay all the servers and stuff out of their own pockets.

Therefore, Alwin’s suggestion of user donations is also relevant. If enough do it, the region itself remains viable too; if not—or if most otherwise appreciative users still prefer someone else to pay—, we’re back to reality: some will go away.

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Why didn’t you? Or anyone else who thought Drune was worth keeping around? I doubt Linden Lab has the resources to pick up the pieces every time a sim owner decides they’ve had enough for whatever reason. I’m not entirely up on the Chouchou deal, and I’m not sure why they decided to save it. Personally, I think that was a mistake.

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9 minutes ago, Ren Toxx said:

Not irrelevant. LL can’t commit to subsidize every region some people like (I myself never heard of it); sure, nice ones can be argued to be a selling factor for SL as a whole. But if we took the argument to the extreme, few region owners would want to pay. SL needs to remain a viable business, Linden Lab can’t pay all the servers and stuff out of their own pockets.

Therefore, Alwin’s suggestion of user donations is also relevant. If enough do it, the region itself remains viable too; if not—or if most otherwise appreciative users still prefer someone else to pay—, we’re back to reality: some will go away.

I'm a private person as all of you. I can't afford to pay for a full sim. But this not what is it about. This sim was just exceptionally good and could really bring new people to Second Life. If we want to keep Second Life, if LL wants to keep SL going they should invest in what could make Second Life get stronger, better, invest in things that could bring new people in. This sim was one of these things. I don't even understand why you don't support it. Have you been to Drune? Did you see how amazing it was?

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7 minutes ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

Why didn’t you? Or anyone else who thought Drune was worth keeping around? I doubt Linden Lab has the resources to pick up the pieces every time a sim owner decides they’ve had enough for whatever reason. I’m not entirely up on the Chouchou deal, and I’m not sure why they decided to save it. Personally, I think that was a mistake.

Because I can't afford it. And why you don't support keeping ChouChou, this sim is so beautiful. It's one of the Second Life gems - the cathedral in the sky, with the right windlight it's a true piece of art. I think it's amazing they decided to save it.

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2 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

I don't even understand why you don't support it. Have you been to ? Did you see how amazing it was?

No. As I said, I never heard of it. I could’ve found it amazing... or not; no telling what people like. I like certain regions—which, in turn, you may have never heard of, or would’ve liked—, and I support these personally, out of my pocket and time. I think they’re a selling point for SL as well. I would not, however, submit that LL should pay for them or else be in the wrong; that would be in the realm of wishful thinking—which, again, doesn’t actually put the money where it needs to go.

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This is not the first "OMG, SO AWESOME, THIS WILL SURELY BRING IN THE PEOPLEZORS!!!!" post we've seen here. It will not be the last. Your opinion of whatever the place was ... Is just that, your opinion.

There are plenty of places that have disappeared throughout the years and any one of those had their fans that would gush the way you are over this place. Heck we had a "PR Rep" for an entire collection of sims come in some time ago and do a rather poor job of convincing the general user base to help save that set of sims. Yep, in the end it was indeed "saved" - some are more forgiving than others - but it was one of the lucky ones.

That simply does not happen very often nor does intervention by Linden Lab.

That said, welcome to the Forum - it is public and thus everyone who wishes to, may respond. You'll simply have to accept that.

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11 minutes ago, Ren Toxx said:

No. As I said, I never heard of it. I could’ve found it amazing... or not; no telling what people like. I like certain regions—which, in turn, you may have never heard of, or would’ve liked—, and I support these personally, out of my pocket and time. I think they’re a selling point for SL as well. I would not, however, submit that LL should pay for them or else be in the wrong; that would be in the realm of wishful thinking—which, again, doesn’t actually put the money where it needs to go.

 

10 minutes ago, Pamela Galli said:

Why exactly are you here? You want us to do what?

You know what I would really like? I would like people to concentrate on the good things, to not question or undermine everything that's ever being said on the forums by someone who isn't a regular here. I guess... to simply care about Second Life, being nice to people, don't get into discussion, in this particular one - if they haven't even seen the sim. I will just repeat, this sim was amazing. It should be saved. Why everything has to be about money? But if you really think it has to... then I already said it, this sim, could bring a lot of people to SL, if people who never been to SL before saw the sim and realized that's how Second Life CAN LOOK like, it's a very big chance they would decide to join the community. And this would bring LL money.  

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11 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

Because I can't afford it. And why you don't support keeping ChouChou, this sim is so beautiful. It's one of the Second Life gems - the cathedral in the sky, with the right windlight it's a true piece of art. I think it's amazing they decided to save it.

I think it was a mistake to keep Chouchou because now whenever anyone's favorite place closes down it's going to be but they saved Chouchou!

Yeah, Chouchou is nice, but so were the innumerable other places Linden Lab didn't pick up the tab for and save. Here's the flip side, if they didn't save The Refuge and Expansion, why should they make an exception for anyone else?

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I think we should concentrate on the positive here, and not simply assume that the region going away is a bad thing. Do we know the owner didn't remove the region on purpose? Perhaps a finite duration was always part of their plans for the project? Perhaps its successor is already in development? Granted, I've never heard of it before, so maybe the owner made public some displeasure about the region going away, but unless s/he did, I think we should assume it was the owner's choice to make it go away -- and not necessarily because of cost. Just because others may have enjoyed it is no reason the creator should be required to keep it up, nor for them to even allow the Lab to preserve it.

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9 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

You know what I would really like? I would like people to concentrate on the good things, to not question or undermine everything that's ever being said on the forums by someone who isn't a regular here. I guess... to simply care about Second Life, being nice to people, don't get into discussion, in this particular one - if they haven't even seen the sim. I will just repeat, this sim was amazing. It should be saved. Why everything has to be about money? But if you really think it has to... then I already said it, this sim, could bring a lot of people to SL, if people who never been to SL before saw the sim and realized that's how Second Life CAN LOOK like, it's a very big chance they would decide to join the community. And this would bring LL money.  

I repeat: what exactly do you want us to do?  What have you done yourself?
I never heard of Drune.

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1 minute ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

I think it was a mistake to keep Chouchou because now whenever anyone's favorite place closes down it's going to be but they saved Chouchou!

Yeah, Chouchou is nice, but so were the innumerable other places Linden Lab didn't pick up the tab for and save. Here's the flip side, if they didn't save The Refuge and Expansion, why should they make an exception for anyone else?

I do not know The Refuge or the Expansion. I will trust your word these were beautiful sims. Maybe also worth saving from disappearing forever. But I think we can't always say - ok, you didn't save this, so I don't agree on saving anything else, because it wouldn't be fair for the ones that are already gone. It is true, it wouldn't be fair, and I'm not saying Drune is the only sim that should be saved, I am far from that, but it's just the most recent one. One that has never made such an impression on me and many other people, who maybe don't want to join the forums. There were many discussions on Flickr and in-world though. At some point, a change could come. I think it is important for Second Life to save amazing places like this. It's something that could lure people in. But yes... I guess, I will just stop here. I just think it's very sad. 

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4 minutes ago, Pamela Galli said:

I repeat: what exactly do you want us to do?  What have you done yourself?
I never heard of Drune.

I have nothing else to add really. All has been written in my previous post that you just tagged. Also the answer you are looking for. I'm sorry if you don't see it. There is nothing I can do about it. 

What I have done? I started this topic, with unrealistic hope that some of the Lindens will see it and will get interested in saving this amazing piece of art. 

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1 minute ago, Pavon2 said:

I have nothing else to add really. All has been written in my previous post that you just tagged. Also the answer you are looking for. I'm sorry if you don't see it. There is nothing I can do about it. 

 

Nothing to add to what? You come here asking us to DO something, but you never say what you want us to DO. You don’t even want to say what you have done?

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1 minute ago, Garnet Psaltery said:

I've heard of it but never been there.  Considering that some of us already in SL never visited it and others never even heard of it, how exactly would it have drawn people to SL? 

It was relatively new sim. I think only people who are present on Flickr could really discover it on time. I think it would drawn people to SL because it was just exceptionally good. It had the same quality as the best video games have nowadays. That's why I think it could bring young people in. 

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3 minutes ago, Pamela Galli said:

Nothing to add to what? You come here asking us to DO something, but you never say what you want us to DO. You don’t even want to say what you have done?

I answered to all of your questions. It's all up there. Just read again. 

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34 minutes ago, Pavon2 said:

[...] to not question or undermine everything that's ever said on the forums by someone who isn't a regular here. I guess... simply care about Second Life, being nice to people, don't get into ,in this particular one [...]

In other words... to agree with you. If we don’t, you’re all but saying we don’t have a right to express it.

That’s not how forums work. You will get people who agree with you about that sim’s awesomeness and say so, and nothing we’re saying prevents them from doing it. It’s not preventing you from doing it, either: just because we don’t necessarily agree, shouldn’t make you feel like your opinion is less worthy (or compel you to try the known tactic of painting any disagreement as as a “mean personal attack”). It’s just that, by trying to convince us that everyone who didn’t like the sim enough to support it should stay silent, you’re not actually helping your case. People don’t usually take well an “agree with me, or shut up”.

Anyway, we’re not actually talking of whether the sim in question is nice or not. What we’re generally debating is the underlying issue that not all regions who some people like, can and should be subsidized by LL. I already told you that it wouldn’t be a sustainable business if they were expected to do so.

 

Quote

Why everything has to be about money?

Because servers don’t run out of thin air. Someone has to pay for their maintenance, power consumption, broadband usage, software updates, etc., or they will quite simply not run.

Since someone has to pay for them, you have to give them a really good reason. And so you did: you said you like it. Good. All I’m saying is, don’t take it so personally if others have a different taste, or want to comment on the underlying practical issues. We’re not trying to bring you down, precisely because several of us didn’t even know the sim, so we couldn’t possibly have a reason to do so. We’re just trying to do the same thing you did: share our opinion. Just because it’s different doesn’t mean we’re not allowed to share it. It’s a public forum.

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What any user says over on Flickr is irrelevant, any "discussion" that happens within Second Life outside of a Town Hall or similar meeting wherein a Linden is present is just as irrelevant.

You are a singular user, claiming that there are many who share your opinion. Any one of us could do the same and it would have the same weight/meaning - the weight and meaning of a singular user.

We get it, you liked the place. If no one did anything to keep it going or to preserve it in some way, that is on them.

Some places shut down because the owner simply cannot afford to keep them running. others shut down for a myriad of other - valid - reasons. Funny thing of all of this is that a Linden Preserved region ends up with its own set of problems down the road - especially with the scripted objects. Such a region is Preserved As Is - meaning nothing is ever updated or fixed if it breaks.

With that in mind, it simply is not feasible to preserve every "amazing" spot out there. That's Life.

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