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Why Are Things Disappearing?

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48 minutes ago, Profaitchikenz Haiku said:

Have you tried lowering the network bandwidth and seeing if that makes any changes?

I have for all three of my viewers but it appears to not make much difference. Currently I am down to 200kbps in all three.

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1 hour ago, DilliDallagio said:

I have for all three of my viewers but it appears to not make much difference. Currently I am down to 200kbps in all three.

 

Clickie! You know you wanna!

1 hour ago, Selene Gregoire said:

It's not a new bug. It's a "quirk" that's been happening for more than 10 years. It happens on all viewers, not just FS. 

https://wiki.firestormviewer.org/fs_vanishing_prims

 

/me waits for it

 

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1 minute ago, Selene Gregoire said:

Clickie! You know you wanna!

hehehe... I already had when you posted it earlier. I just have not gone out into the wilds to see if it made any difference (working on avatar physics at the moment). But I will. :)

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Well, I checked the FS wiki page as suggested and all my viewers' debug settings were already set to the default. I dropped my network bandwidth down to 200kbps, and though things take longer to download, that did not help. Still getting the same "missing textures" and "wire chewed by rabbit" error messages in the debug console/log.

The same items rezzed on land still disappear unless I right-click in the emptiness where they should be or I use the viewers' equivalent of reset vertex buffer/reload displayed objects. In some cases that does not work so I relog and that mostly works.

As to the problematic worn tentacles, when rezzed on the ground they are visible. When worn they are not. If I edit them while wearing, they are visible but as soon as the edit floater is closed, they go invisible again. None have scripts and up until a week or so ago I did not have this problem with them.

I guess it is SL just being SL?

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It certainly seems to be reproducible, at least for you, and for those products.  I would send an IM to the creator, not as a complaint but as a "heads up", and file a JIRA with both LL and the Firestorm team.

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Alyona Su said:

I have been experience this a LOT during login. Not just inventory, but things razzed in-world, sometimes even including LL-owned stuff. And occasionally even the *land* - right-clicking sometimes restores it, but sometimes it's although nothing is being sent from the simulators to my viewer and a full reblog is required.

I have this problem all the time, have for a while if I am reading what happens to you correct when you log in or go somewhere items are invisible but technically still there. I find this happens to me if I teleport to numerous sims one after the other and then after a while the objects don't rez.

That said to fix this issue of items not showing, rather than clicking individual objects you are better off going into wireframe (Ctrl+Shift+R) and then back out of wireframe again. This, at least for me, seems to refresh the entire scene and load all the missing objects.

Edited by Drayke Newall
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With the help of network specialists, I think I have the missing rezzed objects thing taken care of. Basically, even though my network connection has plenty of bandwidth, there is some serious ping times involved, especially when it my viewer(s) are trying to make connections with LL's Akamai CDN servers. They suggested some debug settings changes which seem to have helped most of the missing rezzed object problems.

As for the thing with worn attachments that are invisible when not being edited... still working on that.

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1 hour ago, DilliDallagio said:

With the help of network specialists, I think I have the missing rezzed objects thing taken care of. Basically, even though my network connection has plenty of bandwidth, there is some serious ping times involved, especially when it my viewer(s) are trying to make connections with LL's Akamai CDN servers. They suggested some debug settings changes which seem to have helped most of the missing rezzed object problems.

As for the thing with worn attachments that are invisible when not being edited... still working on that.

As a fellow Linux user with low latency (but great bandwidth) to the LL Servers, can you share the debug settings that have helped?

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10 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

you are better off going into wireframe (Ctrl+Shift+R) and then back out of wireframe again. This, at least for me, seems to refresh the entire scene and load all the missing objects.

OH! Thank you for this tip! I'll make a note to go that a go when it happens next. :)

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12 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

That said to fix this issue of items not showing, rather than clicking individual objects you are better off going into wireframe (Ctrl+Shift+R) and then back out of wireframe again. This, at least for me, seems to refresh the entire scene and load all the missing objects.

I'll try this next time I experience the issue. 

My issues are not like the OP though -- with items going invisible and then coming back in view and then going invisible again.  Over the past many months (maybe a year), I often land in places where things simply do not rez, no matter how long I sit there waiting -- things like walls or items that I know should be there because I see the price tag floating in the air, etc....  Usually, though not always, a TP away and back will make everything show.  I have started experiencing the no-rez thing a lot more lately - even at my house over the last few days - so I've started playing around with various settings to see if anything other than a TP will fix things.  It also seems like the longer I am logged in for a session, the more it happens.  

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27 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I'll try this next time I experience the issue. 

My issues are not like the OP though -- with items going invisible and then coming back in view and then going invisible again.  Over the past many months (maybe a year), I often land in places where things simply do not rez, no matter how long I sit there waiting -- things like walls or items that I know should be there because I see the price tag floating in the air, etc....  Usually, though not always, a TP away and back will make everything show.  I have started experiencing the no-rez thing a lot more lately - even at my house over the last few days - so I've started playing around with various settings to see if anything other than a TP will fix things.  It also seems like the longer I am logged in for a session, the more it happens.  

That is exactly the same issue I have been getting for about the same time period and due to the same issues. Hopefully someone smarter than me can provide a more permanent solution and that my wireframe fix works for you like it does me in the meantime rather than needing to tp out.

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5 hours ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I'll try this next time I experience the issue. 

My issues are not like the OP though -- with items going invisible and then coming back in view and then going invisible again.  Over the past many months (maybe a year), I often land in places where things simply do not rez, no matter how long I sit there waiting -- things like walls or items that I know should be there because I see the price tag floating in the air, etc....  Usually, though not always, a TP away and back will make everything show.  I have started experiencing the no-rez thing a lot more lately - even at my house over the last few days - so I've started playing around with various settings to see if anything other than a TP will fix things.  It also seems like the longer I am logged in for a session, the more it happens.  

I've been noticing this recently and in my experience there are two places it happens most frequently - to the point of it being nearly every time I visit them; one is the Truth store, and the other is the No Match store. In both cases it's primarily the vendors that fail to rez. I haven't experienced it anywhere else. So I suspect it's something related to the vendors these two stores are using, and I wonder if they are the same. 

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Posted (edited)

I think it might be a side effect of some rendering changes LL has been doing for a while, possibly pipelining ones too. I did notice it started to happen from time to time in places with a LOT of stuff (after teleporting there), after upgrading to latest FS with BoM, which has latest "love me render" stuff from LL along with other "fixes".

Whole cache system seems to work a bit slower compared to older (6.0.2 and below) releases too, if open texture console it's quite obvious there are small delays sometimes before viewer starts to load things from the cache (no clue why, though. they are very inconsistent). It's not very visible in everyday usage, but if zoom all over the region with lots of objects in it, then difference is there. And if go even before that, then on FS 5.0.1 it's even faster to rezz the same scene. Same hardware/software and conditions (my own region with just me there), so can't really be anything, but some viewer related changes. Too bad 6.0.2 is needed for animesh and latest one for BoM, otherwise I'd stick with 5.0.1 despite it "being blocked" it works as good as it ever did, except those new things.

Edited by steeljane42
typos

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After the brilliant project, I had some teleporters that would disappear when they moved, and had to switch to the sort of teleporter that rezzes another prim for you to sit upon.  There are days when I have to right-click on mesh buildings to see them.  Once most of the sim/region is in my cache, that's less of a problem.  

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On 1/2/2020 at 5:50 PM, Selene Gregoire said:

It's not a new bug. It's a "quirk" that's been happening for more than 10 years. It happens on all viewers, not just FS. 

https://wiki.firestormviewer.org/fs_vanishing_prims

 

/me waits for it

When I read threads like this, I think "that's never happened to me". I should stop thinking that, because now it just happened. I rezzed a PrimPossible bed - no copy of course. I was changing textures in the menu, and the first 2 went fine, then - poof. Copy PrimPossible cost so much, it is like cutting virtual stripes off my back.

I followed the advice in that link. Logged off and in again. took off shadows and all that.

I am not upset. I know every time I rez no copy items, it can be the last time. So I was prepared for that some day the inventory, or SL could do a trick on me.

Does the items usually come back after some days?

 

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3 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

Does the items usually come back after some days?

They usually come back after they age out of cache, a process you can expedite by deleting the entire cache folder before your next login.

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3 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

I followed the advice in that link. Logged off and in again. took off shadows and all that.

Before pressing the nuke button to wipe out cache, have you used the area search to see if it went to 0,0,0 or up to 4000 metres for some reason? Also, have you tried turning ALM off?

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Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

That is exactly the same issue I have been getting for about the same time period and due to the same issues. Hopefully someone smarter than me can provide a more permanent solution and that my wireframe fix works for you like it does me in the meantime rather than needing to tp out.

I only had the "no rez" issue a few times yesterday, but switching to wirefame and back did fix it -- so at least I don't have to TP away and back anymore for that problem.

 

Additionally, after reading lots and lots and lots of things when I searched the Forums and Google, using all sorts of different words, I went into the Developer / Rendering menu and turned off "Object-object occlusion".  I'm not sure what negative impacts that might have, but I haven't really noticed any yet.  However, I did have much, much fewer of the "no rez" occurrences yesterday.  The viewer was logged in from roughly 3:00 pm to 11:00 pm, though I was AFK off and on during that time.  I mention the length of my login because it "seems" like the 'no rez' happens more frequently the longer that I am logged on.

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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5 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

When I read threads like this, I think "that's never happened to me". I should stop thinking that, because now it just happened. I rezzed a PrimPossible bed - no copy of course. I was changing textures in the menu, and the first 2 went fine, then - poof. Copy PrimPossible cost so much, it is like cutting virtual stripes off my back.

I followed the advice in that link. Logged off and in again. took off shadows and all that.

I am not upset. I know every time I rez no copy items, it can be the last time. So I was prepared for that some day the inventory, or SL could do a trick on me.

Does the items usually come back after some days?

 

If it's gone due to a server side issue then no, you won't likely get it back.

On the other hand: https://wiki.firestormviewer.org/fs_missing_inventory

Be sure to read through that webpage at least once before you begin.

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6 hours ago, Profaitchikenz Haiku said:

Before pressing the nuke button to wipe out cache, have you used the area search to see if it went to 0,0,0 or up to 4000 metres for some reason? Also, have you tried turning ALM off?

ALM is advanced lightning? I did that, I even took away the athmospheric shaders. And I can not live in SL without area search. The first I am using. So many things that go sshhhh far away, or on the roof.

The good thing is that I don't like how that bed looked. And it was only PG , so not that expensive, I could have lost more important things.

I finished the room with another bed, and maybe the no copy bed comes back in a few days. Or maybe not.

 

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Sometimes it's better not to know much. I've had stuff vanish. Sometimes its sticking out of the side of a building, and sometimes in a basement I don't have.

Oh I just shrug it off.....and sooner or later hey presto it appears in lost and found!

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On 1/4/2020 at 7:44 PM, Marianne Little said:

When I read threads like this, I think "that's never happened to me". I should stop thinking that, because now it just happened. I rezzed a PrimPossible bed - no copy of course. I was changing textures in the menu, and the first 2 went fine, then - poof. Copy PrimPossible cost so much, it is like cutting virtual stripes off my back.

I followed the advice in that link. Logged off and in again. took off shadows and all that.

I am not upset. I know every time I rez no copy items, it can be the last time. So I was prepared for that some day the inventory, or SL could do a trick on me.

Does the items usually come back after some days?

 

If you just messaged me, I'd help you recover it no matter what. I'm an expert in inventory recovery and I will help teach you how you can recover everything you have ever lost in second life. Not just my objects but everything. I'll message you inworld.

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