Why are so many HUDs so large?

[Jim Crisp]

Now, I may need multiple HUDs on my screen. Many of them are much larger than they need to be. Why? Don't the creators understand that it's a plus if a HUD is only as large as it needs to be? And why don't more HUDs have the ability to be minimized?

[Mollymews]

i am with you Frank.  Unnecessarily oversized HUDs are a pita

can HUD makers please accept that your garment is not the only thing I am wearing. I like to coordinate my outfits and while I am appreciative of texture change HUDs that you (creator) provide to me, I do much prefer being able to put all the respective HUDs on at the same time, to make my life a bit easier

as Frank suggests, at least a minimize button would be good

[missyrideout]

Living with 1440p and higher monitors, as I imagine many designers do, its probably easy to forget that many of us aren't there. Clean and minimal huds that can also be resized and retain functionality are always welcome, agreed. That said, upgrading your monitor is a pure joy. Such a key part of how we see this world. 

Edited December 6, 2019 by missyrideout

[Orwar]

56 minutes ago, frankjwilson said:

Don't the creators understand that it's a plus if a HUD is only as large as it needs to be? And why don't more HUDs have the ability to be minimized?

   And what's with creators making HUDs that use separate textures for each and every button (especially colouring HUDs for apparel and such), all of course in much higher resolution than necessary, rather than just making a single texture with all of the components in it? HUD texture memory over-usage happens much too often. Or creators who still, in this day and age, use unpacking scripts that include the script itself, or require you to wear a bag which will break your AO and then copies the pose itself into your inventory when there are free scripts that with one click unpacks everything except the script itself, and works whether you wear the box on your HUD, avatar or rez it?!

   // Rant

[Janet Voxel]

Funny story: When Genus heads were in beta, they were asking for feed back. One of the main complaints that first week was “the hud is too small! Make it bigger.” Now it has a large hud and a small hud that comes with the head.

A lot of people can’t see a smaller hud.

[LittleMe Jewell]

1 hour ago, frankjwilson said:

Now, I may need multiple HUDs on my screen. Many of them are much larger than they need to be. Why? Don't the creators understand that it's a plus if a HUD is only as large as it needs to be? And why don't more HUDs have the ability to be minimized?

Because so many of us are old and can't read itsy bitsy teeny tiny writing.    

There are a couple of creators that now include 2 HUDs - one large and one small. 

I can't say as I've ever needed more than one HUD open at a time though.

[Orwar]

3 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Because so many of us are old and can't read itsy bitsy teeny tiny writing.

   I take it we shouldn't become pen pals then ... Those squares are 5 mm (roughly 5 squares per inch, for those across the pond!). The x-height is 1.5 mm, and it's written with a mechanical pencil with a 0.3 mm gauge.

   ... But think of all the paper I save!

[Janet Voxel]

Also, the way a hud is usually made is a prim for the background/base, then an additional prim for each button. Each button then has a script and a texture. You can see, that can get out of control very easily. And that’s just a basic hud, without fancy bells and whistles. There’s probably a lot of alpha textures involved too.

Until someone comes up with a hud that does something different/a more efficient way, it’s probably best to just get rid of them if you’re not using them....immediately.

[Orwar]

1 minute ago, janetosilio said:

Until someone comes up with a hud that does something different/a more efficient way

   There is a better way.

   Instead of putting the button's texture on the button itself, meaning it has to be a separate face with a separate texture, you make a HUD with just -one- texture, which in it has all the buttons painted on it. Then, when you put the HUD together, you just put invisible prims on top of each button, with a script connecting it to the HUD itself and carrying out whichever command you want it to do (i.e. 'Apply <insert UUID> to <insert item, and which face if applicable>).

   That way, a HUD only needs one single texture (unless it has several pages). The amount of scripts, well, you'll need one for each button regardless - but they're usually fairly short, and it might be good practice (and manners) to put together your outfit, select the colours, apply your alphas, and so forth, and then detach any HUDs before actually heading out to crowded places (which may be slightly off-topic, but it can't be repeated enough apparently, judging by how people are running around with enough script memory on them to accommodate the Skynet).

   More often than not, poor optimization in SL is largely due to ignorance or laziness of the creator, rather than 'SL is too limited'. Like, how do some of the really popular creators in SL get away with meshed lemon slices with 2,000 triangles in them, each, individually? No wonder people are having lag problems when there's junk like that strewn across the grid. I sit quite cozily on 180 FPS in my skybox, with all settings cranked to 11 - because I'm picky with what goes in there.

[Alyona Su]

MystiTool had it right: One prim, click for menu.

[Fritigern Gothly]

34 minutes ago, janetosilio said:

Also, the way a hud is usually made is a prim for the background/base, then an additional prim for each button. Each button then has a script and a texture. You can see, that can get out of control very easily. And that’s just a basic hud, without fancy bells and whistles. There’s probably a lot of alpha textures involved too.

Until someone comes up with a hud that does something different/a more efficient way, it’s probably best to just get rid of them if you’re not using them....immediately.

Rejoyce. for we now have llDetectedLinkNumber and llDetectedLinkName

Now, you can name all the prims that make up the buttons, then place something like BUTTON_NAME=llDetectedLinkName(llDetectedLinkNumber(0)); inside the touch event and follow this up with if(BUTTON_NAME == "Button 1") llSay(CHANNEL, "some command to change texture in the listening object"); and you will find that you no longer need one or more scripts in each button.

Edited December 6, 2019 by Fritigern Gothly

[BelindaN]

Stupid question from me.

So I put on a saved outfit and use all the huds to get where I want with it. Because I usually save the huds with the outfit.

Then I detach the huds. Does this reduce my impact?

If I detach the huds and re-save the outfit does that make a difference?

[Orwar]

17 minutes ago, BelindaN said:

Stupid question from me.

So I put on a saved outfit and use all the huds to get where I want with it. Because I usually save the huds with the outfit.

Then I detach the huds. Does this reduce my impact?

If I detach the huds and re-save the outfit does that make a difference?

   It reduces your lag, and potentially the response time of scripts around you. When sailing, for example, people are generally told to remove all things scripted, as the vehicles' scripts plus a bunch of avatar scripts can cause all sorts of problems. Having a receiver script in your hair when clubbing probably won't be a huge thing though (as the script basically just says 'Hi, I'm X - if you run a script aimed at X, I will react to it). Resizing scripts and such can be more intense however.

   I don't generally care to remove all my scripts when out and about, unless I'm going to an event or a club, in which case I will create a copy of the items in my outfit that I want to remove the scripts from, and put them in a folder for that particular outfit. Neph's event-going getup contains no scripts aside from her body and head, using the Firestorm AO, and has a complexity of less than 25,000.

[Ardy Lay]

There are options.  Do it with one texture on one primitive with one script.

vector llDetectedTouchBinormal( integer index );

integer llDetectedTouchFace( integer index );

vector llDetectedTouchNormal( integer index );

vector llDetectedTouchPos( integer index );

vector llDetectedTouchST( integer index );

vector llDetectedTouchUV( integer index );

[Fritigern Gothly]

44 minutes ago, Ardy Lay said:

There are options.  Do it with one texture on one primitive with one script.

Yes., but my example is just a simple one, based on a HUD with prims for buttons. Same as the example that I was responding to.

[Maitimo]

1 hour ago, Orwar said:

   I don't generally care to remove all my scripts when out and about, unless I'm going to an event or a club, in which case I will create a copy of the items in my outfit that I want to remove the scripts from, and put them in a folder for that particular outfit. Neph's event-going getup contains no scripts aside from her body and head, using the Firestorm AO, and has a complexity of less than 25,000.

Yep, I usually take off ALL my huds before leaving home and I also use Firestorm's built-in AO. Where possible, I make copies of my hair, clothing and shoes in my favourite colours and delete the scripts form those too. Unfortunately most hair and clothing these days is no-mod and has no option to delete scripts, which is annoying. 

Speaking of Firestorm's AO, is it possible to add animations to it for things like bento wings and tails? If so, how?

[Claireschen Hesten]

If the HUD is for customising something worn like clothes/shoes/jewellery or for a head/body and only worn when needed bigger is better if it means i'm clearly able to see what the colour options are or what part of the item can customised. i have HUDs for things where it's so small i click something and hope it's going to change the area i want changed 

[CaerolleClaudel]

I just wish all the things in SL could behave like windows on a computer. I get so frustrated clicking on things expecting them to come to the front, and they don't, so I have to Edit-move them, or minimize something else (or a lot of something elses). It's especially bad when trying to take photos and I have like 10 things 'open.'

[Orwar]

8 hours ago, Matty Luminos said:

Speaking of Firestorm's AO, is it possible to add animations to it for things like bento wings and tails? If so, how?

   Hm ... No idea, but that's an interesting question ... Goes off to dig around in the Firestorm wikis.

[Janet Voxel]

13 hours ago, Orwar said:

   There is a better way.

   Instead of putting the button's texture on the button itself, meaning it has to be a separate face with a separate texture, you make a HUD with just -one- texture, which in it has all the buttons painted on it. Then, when you put the HUD together, you just put invisible prims on top of each button, with a script connecting it to the HUD itself and carrying out whichever command you want it to do (i.e. 'Apply <insert UUID> to <insert item, and which face if applicable>).

   That way, a HUD only needs one single texture (unless it has several pages). The amount of scripts, well, you'll need one for each button regardless - but they're usually fairly short, and it might be good practice (and manners) to put together your outfit, select the colours, apply your alphas, and so forth, and then detach any HUDs before actually heading out to crowded places (which may be slightly off-topic, but it can't be repeated enough apparently, judging by how people are running around with enough script memory on them to accommodate the Skynet).

   More often than not, poor optimization in SL is largely due to ignorance or laziness of the creator, rather than 'SL is too limited'. Like, how do some of the really popular creators in SL get away with meshed lemon slices with 2,000 triangles in them, each, individually? No wonder people are having lag problems when there's junk like that strewn across the grid. I sit quite cozily on 180 FPS in my skybox, with all settings cranked to 11 - because I'm picky with what goes in there.

Interesting, so lets say I know zero about scripting like most people do. Where would I be able to get a script like that? What would it be called?

[Cinos Field]

11 hours ago, Matty Luminos said:

Yep, I usually take off ALL my huds before leaving home and I also use Firestorm's built-in AO. Where possible, I make copies of my hair, clothing and shoes in my favourite colours and delete the scripts form those too. Unfortunately most hair and clothing these days is no-mod and has no option to delete scripts, which is annoying.

Yep. It's a bit of an aside for this topic, but I actually stopped buying clothes that are no mod and offer no way to delete the scripts. Why? Well, I got this pair of panties. Three scripts in this tiny scrap of fabric. And because it's part of a lingerie set - including bra, garter and panties - that's a total of nine scripts that I won't actually be using after I decide on a color. Beyond the pale!

[Mollymews]

my Happy HUD Life 😼

Lucky for me I have a 2560 x 1440 screen. Typically I have between 12 and 20 texture HUDs for an outfit. This outfit has 17 different texture HUDs

 

 

[Nova Convair]

Many creators have not so much clue of creating.
More creators have no clue of SL.
Nearly no creator has a clue of scripting.

What you expect? You get what you see now.

It's not hard to make a script taylored for a specific hud - but only for an experienced scripter.

It's surely possible to make a customizable script system for hud development. Big documentation is needed which nobody reads but IM the creator instead. So if there is really none on the market I do not wonder about that. 😎

[Nalates Urriah]

17 hours ago, janetosilio said:

Also, the way a hud is usually made is a prim for the background/base, then an additional prim for each button. Each button then has a script and a texture. You can see, that can get out of control very easily. And that’s just a basic hud, without fancy bells and whistles. There’s probably a lot of alpha textures involved too.

Until someone comes up with a hud that does something different/a more efficient way, it’s probably best to just get rid of them if you’re not using them....immediately.

Orwar is right. But it should be other ways. 

Long ago Kelly Linden developed HTML HUDs. Those are still available but require one know how to write HTML into the script. Thus upping the learning curve. PITA.

Also, there is the LlDetectedTouchPos function that will allow use of a single prim. Paint your buttons on the texture and use LlDetectedTouchPos to tell if they clicked within the area that is the button. I made a script to help me get the button's location/area when building a script. I used to try and sell it. The downside is lots of buttons makes for a complex script.

Regardless of how many buttons or pages of menu one has in the HUD a single texture can be used with LlOffsetTexture. The texture can devote a strip in the texture to buttons and divide the rest in to the pages of menu. The HUD can be made of a mesh plain with 8 faces and have a Land Impact of 0.5. So, 2 mesh plains can make 1LI and 16 faces. Then one 1024 texture  and some fancy offsetting and you can have a very complex HUD for almost no LI.

The thing is the multiple textures and numerous prims make for an easy to build and script HUD. Since it is generally seldom worn or used, there is minimal need for efficiency or economy. When I made my helicopter paint and wheels HUDs I considered they would be only occasionally used. How often does one change the wheels on their SL heli? 

Putting effort into a HUD that is very seldom used and affects only the user is a waste of time. One can easily build a complex HUD from textures and prims and that is what people do.

The part that is DUMB is using a 1024 texture for buttons or a HUD that is not even 512x512 on the screen. A solid color button without a texture works and can change color easily. A 64x64 texture for a button with text works. But, many builders in SL are clueless when it comes to HUDs... or just clueless...

[Bree Giffen]

I haven't made a hud in a while but one issue I recall is that huds are prims like everything else in SL. Try taking one of your huds and rezzing it on the ground. It's small.

Making a hud smaller means working with small prims. Like being a jeweller in SL. It's difficult because you run into the constraint on dimensions of prims. You have to design the HUD in-world and then shrink it down to fit into the HUD view.