Ok Sloomer! The Rise and Fall of Second Life Generations

[Cinos Field]

1 hour ago, Alazarin Mondrian said:

What, the old place at Baku? I was seriously underwhelmed by what looked like a trainwreck of poorly built memes populated by a closed clique who were so far up their assholes their were looking out at the world through their teeth. Yeah, they all thought they were oh-so-clever and avante-garde because they could write a sim-crasher script. I managed to get myself banned from Baku in and amongst some of my early-day shenanigans.

Baku was, at least for a time, W-hat's home, which would be Something Awful rather than 4chan, and I always found the builds amazing for the time. They even participated in some Relay for Life sessions with entire video game themed builds.

4chan was more centered around Woodbury University, and their thing was more about sim crashers and such.

Edited November 29, 2019 by Cinos Field

[Garnet Psaltery]

1 hour ago, Alazarin Mondrian said:

What, the old place at Baku? I was seriously underwhelmed by what looked like a trainwreck of poorly built memes populated by a closed clique who were so far up their assholes their were looking out at the world through their teeth. Yeah, they all thought they were oh-so-clever and avante-garde because they could write a sim-crasher script. I managed to get myself banned from Baku in and amongst some of my early-day shenanigans.

Well, that was unfortunate for you.  I can't really remember the builds except that I know some of them made me laugh.  The members were very welcoming to me and I got into some interesting conversations with them - and was not banned.  Perhaps it was a matter of approach.

[Garnet Psaltery]

28 minutes ago, Cinos Field said:

Baku was, at least for a time, W-hat's home, which would be Something Awful rather than 4chan, and I always found the builds amazing for the time. They even participated in some Relay for Life sessions with entire video game themed builds.

4chan was more centered around Woodbury University, and their thing was more about sim crashers and such.

There, I could have been confused between the groups.  I had other reasons to approach Woodbury U, and I don't recall any interesting conversations there.

[Lindal Kidd]

2 hours ago, carolinestravels said:

I have an ALT in each generation!
My first one is from 2007

Do they have intergenerational squabbles?

[Mollymews]

this has been a pretty interesting read.  Thanks Scylla for starting this off

i always find it interesting how people personally relate to epoch-like scenarios. I don't have a personal take to relate in the RL-like parrelel, as I am not able to easily identify a framed reference within which to place myself in this definitive sense

I do have a thought tho about Second Life from the pov of the rise and fall and maybe rise again of civilisations

i think our inworld, as a civilisation, could be measured in 4 stages so far to date. +/- a year or two from the years listed. Just sticking with the broad idea that 4 SL years approximates an epoch

Stage 1) 2003 to 2007 - from scarcity to abundance
Stage 2) 2007 to 2011 - from abundance to complacency
Stage 3) 2011 to 2015 - from complacency to apathy
Stage 4) 2015 to today - from apathy to dependency

we are at the dependency stage I think. Examples of dependency are Belli Linden Homes, and the dependency today of most residents on a relatively few other residents to provide/make stuff for them (mesh)

the 5th stage is: 5) from dependency to bondage

the more dependent we are on a few to provide for the many then the sense of bondage increases. Bondage felt by the few providers to make stuff for the many. And the bondage felt by many of the many - the sameness effect of what is provided by the few. Which sameness is something that you Scylla have touched on in previous posts.

the 6th stage is: 6) from bondage to scarcity

scarcity because the few providers get even fewer relative to the many population. There is a scarcity of providers making scarce new stuff

which can lead from 6) to the alternate 1) scarcity to doom. The end of the cvilisation. Lots of startups / new worlds go down the alternate 1) path. Scarcity of users, scarcity of stuff, scarcity of things to do. Doom  

or it can be that the cycle for Second Life repeats: 1) from scarcity to abundance

which requires a whole new tribe of creatives to invade the civilisation. Who that tribe is I dunno exactly

it may end up being many of the people already here. The people (like myself maybe) who haven't yet exhausted the sameness. Exhausted in the sense that I (and others like me) am not yet motivated enough to make my/our own meshes. But if the sameness caused by the scarcity of providers happens, then I will start making my own stuff again most likely Which if lots of others do similarly then it leads again to abundance

Edited November 29, 2019 by Mollymews
epoch

[Da5id Weatherwax]

If we're in SL at all, we all fall into one age category.....  "Old enough to know better, young enough to do it anyway"

[Lindal Kidd]

A couple of points here...

First:  As someone who spends time hanging out on Social Island and greeting the newest of newbies, I can report that the kinds of people who are entering SL are no different than the kinds of people we saw back in late 2007.  (I can't report on the situation earlier than that, I wasn't there!)  We still get:

• The gamers.  "What's the point of this game?"
• The instant hookup crowd.  "A/S/L?"  Although nobody seems to actually use that rude abbreviation, it's true.
• The Homework Assignment.  "My teacher sent us all here.  How can I find my class?"  (These are rarer these days)
• The Get Rich in SL crowd.  "How do I make money on here?"  These too are much less common than they were in 2007.
• The Sense of Wonder people.  These are the rare newcomers who are fascinated by everything, bright-eyed and eager to learn.  They are the rare people who "get" SL almost at once, and will probably be around to write the history of SL's next ten years.

As always, the first two categories make up the majority of the newcomers.  It's interesting that despite drawing from the same kinds of people initially, we can make distinctions based on what people experience, and become, afterwards.

Second:  At the risk of getting into an argument with Love, I have to take issue with his view that "Boomers" are defined as people who are unable to accept change.  The younger generation has always had this view of their elders; that they are old fuddy-duddies who are stuck somewhere back in the last century.  I am myself a member of the Baby Boomer generation...and I often was exasperated by my parents, who seemed unable to understand, let alone embrace, things that came along later in their lives, like cell phones and personal computers.  But consider this:  The Boomers have experienced (and in many cases, caused to happen) more change in the last half of the 20th century and the first decades of the 21st than in any comparable period of human history.  The rate of change has been accelerating.  My father's life spanned the time between when men first flew and the time men landed on the moon, which is an incredible amount of change.  My own life saw us go from room-sized computers that required specialists to operate them to computers many times as powerful that were pocket-sized and could talk to you.  We went from two channels of black and white TV to TVs that spanned the wall of your room and could access hundreds of channels and decades of content on demand (and STILL nothing worth watching!)  We went from identifying the DNA molecule to modifying it.  From gas station roadmaps that you could never get folded back together to talking GPS systems.

I have been a part of, and eagerly embraced most of, the changes throughout my lifetime.  I, and the generation I'm a part of, has now grown old(er).  Like all generations before us, we have (we hope!) developed some maturity and wisdom and the perspective of our years.  It is galling beyond belief to have some pimply-faced teenager mock us with a sneering "OK Boomer" simply because we disagree on some point or other.  The younger generation always knows it all...until they become the older generation, and find out that they didn't.

[FairreLilette]

23 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Although she's a couple of decades younger than me, and belongs to a different generation, I'll admit that I laughed aloud, and found myself muttering "You go, girl!" when I first watched New Zealand MP Chlöe Swarbrick respond to a gibe in Parliament about her age with "Ok Boomer." Like many Gen Xers, I have ambivalent feelings about the Boomers, my parent's generation. I'm entirely happy to acknowledge the many astonishing things they accomplished, and I admire the politically-engaged activism they brought to bear against the establishment in the 60s and 70s -- feminism, civil rights, and the anti-war movement in particular. My ambivalence derives from wondering how they managed to lose themselves so thoroughly on their way to middle age in the 80s and 90s.

 

Some of the boomers turned to Yuppies.  But, I don't know if they lost themselves completely in the 80's and 90's, not in music anyways and not the music I listen too.   Here's just one song from Tears For Fears.  You could also look up the famous "London Calling" by The Clash.  Though Famous Last Words and London Calling could have been more in response to "the cold war".  Music today is dead.  The singers might be good but it sounds like they threw on the cheapest backing track and it (the music) has no passion whatsoever.   And, don't ever forget Jackson Browne...he never forgot.  You could read the lyrics to "Lives in the Balance" by Jackson Browne.   And, Jackson Browne has mostly done charity concerts here in Southern California.  He never lost anything, Scylla.  And, there are more I could list.  I think you are for the most part wrong about the Boomers losing themselves....perhaps just not following it enough.   And, you even missed Nirvana...talk about passion in the 90's.  It's there!   And though Nirvana are not "boomers"...the music of the 80's and 90's is far from the narcissistic drival put out as music today.  

"Famous Last Words" by Tears for Fears

After the wash
Before the fire
I will decay
Melt in your arms
As the day hits the night
We will sit by candlelight
We will laugh
We will sing
When the saints go marching in
A for a heart
B for a brain
Insects and grass
Are all that remain
When the light from above
Burns a hole straight through our love
We will laugh
We will sing
When the saints go marching in
And we will carry war no more
All our love and all our of pain
Will be but a tune
The Sun and the Moon
The wind and the rain
Hand in hand we'll do and die
Listening to the band that made us cry
We'll have nothing to lose
We'll have nothing to gain
Just to stay this real life situation
For one last refrain
As the day hits the night
We will sit by candlelight
We will laugh
We will sing
When the saints go marching in
And we will carry war no more

Edited November 29, 2019 by FairreLilette

[Alyona Su]

22 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Although she's a couple of decades younger than me, and belongs to a different generation, I'll admit that I laughed aloud, and found myself muttering "You go, girl!" when I first watched New Zealand MP Chlöe Swarbrick respond to a gibe in Parliament about her age with "Ok Boomer." Like many Gen Xers [...]

Yes, that's the 'it' term these days and it's intended as a demeaning quip. LOL Though I would have split your list differently:

Quote

1) SLoldbies -- Time Range: 23 June, 2003 (the public opening of Second Life) to [...]

I would say SLolbies stop and switch to SLoomers in the Summer of 2006 for this reason:

Those before the (possibly fake because of spin) news of the Anshe Chung making millionaire status in SL where here before anyone knew about SL at all. Once that news broke, it was a genuine gold-rush with a massive influx of new accounts. These people would be the SLoomers to me.

Quote

2) SLoomers -- [Summer, 2006]

I would say this group goes from the "Millionaire News" to the introduction of Sculpts. People wanted mesh and Linden Lab was dead-set against it, so they created Sculpty as a placation effort.

Which would bring a new title, I don't know as I'm not as creative as you. Perhaps SLulptors?

Then I would definitely pick up your list from there on, albeit, renumbered from here. Unless one wanted to create one called "SLcrimers" - when the TV show CSI featured SL in a two-part episode and another massive wave of new users slogged into SL. LOL

Quote

 

4) Meshers -- [...]

5) Altberghers -- [...]

6) Benters -- [...]

 

But all in all, a fun exercise in quips.

👍

[Lindal Kidd]

@Alyona Su, did sculpties really come about because LL was against mesh?  That's an idea that I hadn't heard before!  Please expand on it, if you have more information.

[Alyona Su]

21 minutes ago, Lindal Kidd said:

@Alyona Su, did sculpties really come about because LL was against mesh?  That's an idea that I hadn't heard before!  Please expand on it, if you have more information.

People were asking for the ability to upload mesh even since I first signed-up (in early 2006). There was not official statement to the effect because you know how Linden Lab (for the right reasons of course) always communicates in an ambiguous way, but in their communications it was very clear they did not want that at all (possibly because they could foresee the issues with it now, not with head and body, but the very-badly super-high poly-counts and such). Though one also should remember that back then the average PC or Mac could not possibly handle what we are seeing today.

So I'm not so sure they were against mesh for any reason other than that, really. The grid was already very laggy, imagine what mesh would have done; imagine today's grid on a $500 PC from 2006!

So, one of the Lindens (I forget exactly who) created the Scultpy system to allow experienced 3D modelers to be able to, at least, create a facsimile. If Linden Lab ever intended (even at a future date) to introduce mesh abilities in SL at the time, they never would have done the sculpt thing. When Sculpts arrived, everyone was ecstatic!

Edited November 29, 2019 by Alyona Su

[Lindal Kidd]

5 minutes ago, Alyona Su said:

 When Sculpts arrived, everyone was ecstatic!

I certainly was.  Even though I never learned how to actually make them, and always realized they were a kludge, I sure was happy to have them!

[Alyona Su]

5 minutes ago, Lindal Kidd said:

I certainly was.  Even though I never learned how to actually make them, and always realized they were a kludge, I sure was happy to have them!

My absolute favorite car and boat are both Sculpts. And they rez fast and look awesome. Just as with mesh, Sculpts built by a qualified modeler is just as awesome as mesh. Which is why I roll my eyes anytime anyone proclaims sculpts as something to be hated. I can point to a lot of mesh that deserve the same sentiment. LOL

Edited November 29, 2019 by Alyona Su

[Cinos Field]

The SL "boom" didn't quite happen in 2006 when joining became free though, I'd say it was closer to 2007. Initially the people who joined with free basic accounts were similar to the older ones, just... cheaper. All the media attention bloomed as a *result* of the free accounts.

The boom times would be around when the GossipGirl last name was introduced which was late 2007... so SLoomers would start a little before that.

Edited November 29, 2019 by Cinos Field

[Akane Nacht]

1) pre-mesh designers 
2) mesh designers 
3) people who just buy stuff and goof around 

[Janet Voxel]

8 minutes ago, Akane Nacht said:

1) pre-mesh designers 
2) mesh designers 
3) people who just buy stuff and goof around 

I think this is the most accurate description.

[FairreLilette]

Speaking as a person who may be considered a "Benter".  Well, I do think avatar creation is a valid art form and that SL photography is also a valid art form...I just never could quite get as good as many avatar's I've admired nor seem to create what I really wanted out of a human avatar.  Turning to a Dinkie now since 9/6/2019, we have so little to choose from...I still can't hardly believe there isn't even one tights fatpack for Dinkie's...and there are enough Dinkie's to generate a nice side income.  So, with so little material items for Dinkies, I'm learning to be a little less "vain" maybe.  But as for me, I want mesh clothing rather than prim skirts, and I want more detail in the shoes, etc.  I don't know how to create those yet nor have the time to learn right now. 

The main difference I find as a Benter is that I would like to enjoy more of the modern mesh items and high polygon items as opposed to those who may be older SLer's and have mostly prim builds as clubs.   I want to see more of the prettier stuff.  I am a visual person.   Now, how do we all get it to rez?... because when I pay...I can rez it fine.   See photo below, mostly mesh items for one of my clubs...rezzes in a jiffy for me...though I am the renter of the land.   I don't really like the old prim builds as much but I have no answers how to get it (the mesh stuff) all to rez for everyone.

Edited November 29, 2019 by FairreLilette

[FairreLilette]

2 hours ago, Akane Nacht said:

1) pre-mesh designers 
2) mesh designers 
3) people who just buy stuff and goof around 

Yeah, I agree.

_____________________

However, being a lower complexity avatar now as a Dinkie...it's not even the accessories that may cause lag because I can rez all the Tinies which are Dinkies, Tinies and Titchies plus others I don't know all the names...and even tinies can have complexity over 100k at times from the accessories...and I rez it all fine now as a low complexity avatar.  

But, what I want to say is...so I am in a low complexity avatar now as a Dinkie and can rez tons now...so maybe it wasn't the hair, maybe it wasn't the accessories that seem to be the problem with rezzing...it may just be the human mesh avatar itself, and it could be because of the hands and the feet.  Maybe it's time to consider at least upgrading some of the human mesh avatar bodies to have NO detachable feet nor hands.  The hands and feet should be meshed into one body unit and it may be better.  Something to think about.  

edit to add:  Dinkies are a one unit avatar...although you can add a different head and tail...but still all rezzes great.  So, it got me to thinking about what's up with you "biggies" as we "tinies" call you.  What if it is the detachable hands and feet that are causing problems?  Maybe detachable hands and feet have seen their day.  Just presenting this as something to think about.

Edited November 29, 2019 by FairreLilette

[Vanity Fair]

23 hours ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

There's a ton of really old accounts still around. I recently reconnected with people from 2003-2006 in SL. 

 

No one really "leaves".

I am constantly amazed by how many older avatars I encounter at clubs, stores and events which have a legacy name (first name and last name). There are still a lot of SLoldbies out there on the grid! My record oldest avatar spotted in-world was a 15-year-old avatar I met while dancing at Muddy's Music Café.

Edited November 29, 2019 by Vanity Fair

[Cristiano Midnight]

On 11/28/2019 at 11:04 AM, Scylla Rhiadra said:

1) SLoldbies -- Time Range: 23 June, 2003 (the public opening of Second Life) to 14 March, 2008, the day that Philip Rosedale stepped down as LL CEO.

Virtual life for SLoldbies must have been wild and exciting. Many of the most important features -- the Linden dollar, direct teleports, and Windlight were, for instance, introduced. The creators and coders of this generation lay the groundwork for literally everything that followed. My own sense of the SLoldbies is that they are, as a species, relatively open-minded. And they tend, I think, to subscribe to what now feels like an older version of digital libertarianism. They aren't 4Chan or Something Awful (most of them) -- but that's the culture from which they come. I really value and like SLoldbies: I find them sceptical, but always helpful.  

 

 

I just wanted to point out that there is a group even older than June 2003, from the closed alpha and beta, and a surprising amount are still active. SLoldbies would extend back into 2002.

[Amanda Crisp]

I won’t comment Much despite the fact that the title of my “Generational Cohort” bugs me. 🙂

Personally, I have never worried overmuch about what “era” a Resident is from. I’m more concerned about whether a given individual is the sort who treats other Residents as PEOPLE or not.

I’m an SLOldie taking my Original into account, and in each generational cohort I can come up with broad examples of people who either treat others with respect or others who approach SL from a more self-centered approach.

Its their choice of course; but I prefer to hang out with that “treats you like a person and not an NPC for my amusement” group 🙂

But yeah; the SLOldies as a cohort are kinda distinctive 🙂

Edited November 30, 2019 by AmandaKeen

[cheesecurd]

9 hours ago, FairreLilette said:

Music today is dead

This right here is the mark of a complete idiot.

i won’t even attempt to be nice about it, if you have this mindset about music then you do not know how to appreciate music

”oh it was so much better in the good old days! Music these days is terrible!”

The opinion of you and a billion other forty year olds with room temperature IQ.

[FairreLilette]

2 hours ago, cheesecurd said:

This right here is the mark of a complete idiot.

i won’t even attempt to be nice about it, if you have this mindset about music then you do not know how to appreciate music

”oh it was so much better in the good old days! Music these days is terrible!”

The opinion of you and a billion other forty year olds with room temperature IQ.

My IQ happens to be the temperature of the hottest day in Palm Springs ever.

As far as music appreciation...if you really understood music you would know music does not have an age.  It is timeless.  I have recordings of music from the 15th Century.  

I've given today's music enough listens.

The last musicians I loved their work were The Black Keys, just about all of Jack White's endeavors and Jet.  

Much of today's music is geared towards selling cosmetics to young girls.  Many young musicians of today won't listen to today's music either.  Maybe you should talk with them as to why.  

Edited November 30, 2019 by FairreLilette

[cheesecurd]

1 minute ago, FairreLilette said:

Much of today's music is geared towards selling cosmetics to young girls

Yeah if you literally only listen to top 100 kinda stuff.

Which has always been the case since the dawn of what one could consider the modern concept of pop music. It’s just that you liked a different era of pop music.

There is a massive amount of music out there in every genre and a lot of it is absolutely amazing from what one could consider a “musical quality” and creative standpoint. In the end music is music and if someone enjoys it then they enjoy it, wether it’s a modern opera or whatever today’s top hit song is, it’s good to someone and they like it and that’s what makes that music good.

I swear to god if I hear “Dance Monkey” on the radio one more time I’m going to blow my brains out in traffic, I personally do not like that song. But clearly a lot of people do enjoy it considering how popular it is, and I’m not going to write it off as bad music or artistically worthless or low quality just because I don’t like it.

The idea of that blanket statement “current music is bad/sucks/whatever” is the hallmark of someone who has a taste in music but does not understand that just because they do not like all music, doesn’t mean what they don’t like is intrinsically bad.

“Music today is dead” is one of those statements. You just don’t like today’s music. That does not mean it’s anywhere near dead. Not ever single song, album or artist out there in the last 20 years is out there as a major label backed “hit maker of the month”.

If I could swear on this forum and leave this off with a short worded blatant insult I would, let this sentence fill in for that.

[FairreLilette]

46 minutes ago, cheesecurd said:

Yeah if you literally only listen to top 100 kinda stuff.

Which has always been the case since the dawn of what one could consider the modern concept of pop music. It’s just that you liked a different era of pop music.

There is a massive amount of music out there in every genre and a lot of it is absolutely amazing from what one could consider a “musical quality” and creative standpoint. In the end music is music and if someone enjoys it then they enjoy it, wether it’s a modern opera or whatever today’s top hit song is, it’s good to someone and they like it and that’s what makes that music good.

I swear to god if I hear “Dance Monkey” on the radio one more time I’m going to blow my brains out in traffic, I personally do not like that song. But clearly a lot of people do enjoy it considering how popular it is, and I’m not going to write it off as bad music or artistically worthless or low quality just because I don’t like it.

The idea of that blanket statement “current music is bad/sucks/whatever” is the hallmark of someone who has a taste in music but does not understand that just because they do not like all music, doesn’t mean what they don’t like is intrinsically bad.

“Music today is dead” is one of those statements. You just don’t like today’s music. That does not mean it’s anywhere near dead. Not ever single song, album or artist out there in the last 20 years is out there as a major label backed “hit maker of the month”.

 

For the most part it is dead though as it's lifeless...here is the top song on the Billboard right now...this music here is awful.  This is what I mean when I wrote the backing tracks sound so cheap...but I could add... it's like the record companies don't even care.  There is no passion in the music in this top Billboard song of this week.  Jack White was the greatest musician in the 21st Century.  I have given today's music enough tries.  There are great young musicians struggling today because of free internet downloading.  The Black Keys had to go Germany just to try to get a bit of a start.  The Black Keys are not lifeless.  But, the sad truth is much of today's music is geared towards young girls to sell cosmetics or beauty products.   And, that is really the truth.   Oh, I don't consider myself the "pop music" type.  I did not listen to pop music....if you Madonna or something?  I don't know what you mean by "pop" music.  I was listening to progressive music at the time of Madonna in my headphones.  I grew up listening to music in the headphones which is a completely different musical experience.  I love all kinds of music...but generally not pop.  There is some pop I've liked over the years...but it's not much.  

 

Edited November 30, 2019 by FairreLilette