Last names nearly here - and more. Yay!

[Nalates Urriah]

Doing month by month certainly makes that possible. So, you could pay for a single month and get the last name. Canceling a week in won't get you a refund. You will have membership for the month. Then you will drop to basic. Can't imagine them taking the name away...

[LittleMe Jewell]

1 hour ago, Bree Giffen said:

Is it possible to start a premium account with a last name and drop to basic right away? Not that I'm planning anything. I have my last names.

Nalates is correct.  Grumpity or someone even stated somewhere that you would not lose your new name if you dropped Premium

[Mollymews]

1 hour ago, Alyona Su said:

It also depends on how you read it: If you change your name, you can keep your first name (because that is 100% elective) - but must choose a last name (as part of the name change process). In that case you are changing "one" name. Perhaps @Grumpity Linden can clarify this, I'd love to be told by an official that my perception is wrong, but until then, this is what I'm sticking with. So I'll either be vindicated or pleasantly wronged, because I'd love to be able to change only my first name, but I'm not going to lend to hope that will be an option.

This is the benefit of pessimism; I will get either exactly what I expect or I will be very pleasantly surprised. You optimists? LOL You either get what you expected or heartache.

this is how I perceive it as well.  A Linden has said that legacy last names like Su will not be reused, so will not be on the available last names list. Not on the list means that you can't pick Su

an inability to do this leaves us in the same kinda spot as BobJenkins Resident.  I am hoping that Linden will think about all this and work out a way where these individualised wants are catered to

as you say it would be useful I think that anyone with a legacy name can just change their first name if they want. Bob4563 Su would probably be happy to able to do this also

i think BobJenkins.Resident and Bob4563.Su are the two individualised wants that it seems the current Linden thinking doesn't cater for. There may be a third or fourth want but I can't think of what they might be. May be somebody else can.  If Linden could find a way to help BobJenkins and Bob4532.Su then that would be good

[Vanity Fair]

20 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

And yet...

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.lockwoodpublishing.avakinlife

Just one of many. Also take note of the install and review demographic size of that one app (50,000,000+ install) that has no less capitalised on a market LL could have done with ease.

Avakin Life is *incredibly* popular amongst the tween/teen community. Here is my writeup on the blog:
https://ryanschultz.com/2018/06/30/avakin-life-a-brief-introduction/

One of things I hate about Avakin Life is that clothing textures are VERY poor (at least on my ancient iPad 2, which I still use).

I would be interested in hearing about other mobile-compatible virtual worlds, though.

Edited November 24, 2019 by Vanity Fair

[Drayke Newall]

4 hours ago, Vanity Fair said:

Avakin Life is *incredibly* popular amongst the tween/teen community. Here is my writeup on the blog:
https://ryanschultz.com/2018/06/30/avakin-life-a-brief-introduction/

One of things I hate about Avakin Life is that clothing textures are VERY poor (at least on my ancient iPad 2, which I still use).

I would be interested in hearing about other mobile-compatible virtual worlds, though.

That popularity amongst those communities is why I mentioned it in this thread and having something as a separate yet linked instance to the main grid that is small enough for an on the go system/use. Without those demographics being showcased SL or a form of SL it hinders the growth of SL as the years go by due to it really only being the older generation that comes here. SL is more like a meme to the younger generations now thought of as a xxx game or something where weird people hang out which is not the stereotype SL needs if it wants to garner newer users. Not to mention the learning curve.

I also think a lot of people here forget that the teen grid existed in parallel with the main 'adult grid' and it would be interesting to wonder what the subscriber base of the teen grid would be if it was updated to a separate mobile experience rather than removed completely. It was a great way for teens to get into the SL mentality in an effort to 'graduate' to the main grid, however when that grid was removed articles in game or teen blogs etc. became more and more about the Adult nature of SL rather than how cool it is to play it as a teen.

That said, with the requirement of having to use a 3rd party program to mesh due to LL not updating their prim in world building system to mesh ( a mistake), the chances of any form of interest like it had for teens or newer generations is nil - that was its defining difference as a virtual world, building in it. It is also why a new SL should have been made years ago with a better engine as well as a more common script language. For example simple building controls can be made to work very efficiently on a mobile https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tdcp.threedc and by adding these for a mobile experience it would also improve the SL UI as well into a more user friendly one without a steep learning curve.

As far as other virtual worlds go, Avakin Life is the big one that has the most similarities to SL, most popular, etc. There are others however out there that offer a more niche or simpler virtual worlds (obviously none offering custom texture etc like SL) but still very popular. e.g. Club Cooee, Woozworld, IMVU (of course), Habbo etc.

It comes down to how one would define a virtual world I suppose as some seem to think SL is a virtual world and Habbo isn't even though the same principles of a virtual world are there just done differently.

Edited November 24, 2019 by Drayke Newall

[AyelaNewLife]

I miss Club Penguin

[Caerolle Llewellyn]

9 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

That popularity amongst those communities is why I mentioned it in this thread and having something as a separate yet linked instance to the main grid that is small enough for an on the go system/use. Without those demographics being showcased SL or a form of SL it hinders the growth of SL as the years go by due to it really only being the older generation that comes here. SL is more like a meme to the younger generations now thought of as a xxx game or something where weird people hang out which is not the stereotype SL needs if it wants to garner newer users. Not to mention the learning curve.

I also think a lot of people here forget that the teen grid existed in parallel with the main 'adult grid' and it would be interesting to wonder what the subscriber base of the teen grid would be if it was updated to a separate mobile experience rather than removed completely. It was a great way for teens to get into the SL mentality in an effort to 'graduate' to the main grid, however when that grid was removed articles in game or teen blogs etc. became more and more about the Adult nature of SL rather than how cool it is to play it as a teen.

That said, with the requirement of having to use a 3rd party program to mesh due to LL not updating their prim in world building system to mesh ( a mistake), the chances of any form of interest like it had for teens or newer generations is nil - that was its defining difference as a virtual world, building in it. It is also why a new SL should have been made years ago with a better engine as well as a more common script language. For example simple building controls can be made to work very efficiently on a mobile https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tdcp.threedc and by adding these for a mobile experience it would also improve the SL UI as well into a more user friendly one without a steep learning curve.

As far as other virtual worlds go, Avakin Life is the big one that has the most similarities to SL, most popular, etc. There are others however out there that offer a more niche or simpler virtual worlds (obviously none offering custom texture etc like SL) but still very popular. e.g. Club Cooee, Woozworld, IMVU (of course), Habbo etc.

It comes down to how one would define a virtual world I suppose as some seem to think SL is a virtual world and Habbo isn't even though the same principles of a virtual world are there just done differently.

Wow, not that I know anything about the technical difficulties or whether teens/young adults would even be interested in SL, but this seems like an awesome idea to me. The screen shot in the blog post @Vanity Fair linked to reminds me so much of SL, it looks like a way better version of Lumiya (which i found perfectly serviceable for a lot of things). But I guess the technical difficulties and of course it being dependent on LL make it pretty much impossible.

[ThorinII]

12 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

the chances of any form of interest like it had for teens or newer generations is nil

Good.

I really wish Linden Lab had kept the Teen Grid for those kids. In my opinion, Teenager absolutely don't belong into SL at all. Not on the main grid, and not on the Beta Grid.

To be honest, until the Teen Grid was closed down (biggest mistake by LL right after getting rid of Lastnames), I would stumble over minors at least once a month - and AR them via the category "Minors on the Main Grid". I mean, when they're so stupid and openly admit a couple times that they're minors in Real Life, then it's their own fault when they got the banhammer. 😈

ETA: The youngest kid I ever AR'ed was only 13, and spent her nights as an escort. She didn't even understand why my friends and I even AR'd her. For her, it was "just a game".

Edited November 24, 2019 by ThorinII

[Qie Niangao]

On 11/22/2019 at 9:11 PM, Drayke Newall said:

As it stands now you need to spend monthly $338 to obtain a homestead (cost of a full region and the homestead not including the $498 set-up fee). Place the premium price for the highest tier at $140 per month the price of the homestead and $31 (or higher) for the additional premium bonus' and you are not having any impact on profit but increasing them as more people have access to a Homestead (and spend more $L in the marketplace to furnish the sim). More people will also look into or sign up to a premium subscription and it would retain them in the subscription model as you would loose the access to the homestead (as you do with mainland parcels now).

Simply put, homesteads locked behind the need to buy a full sim is disadvantageous for Lab profit wise as if they were available without a full sim they would sell far more sims than they do now as generally most people don't want a full sim and certainly don't want to have to pay for a full region just to get one.

This is from an ancient corner of this thread -- sorry to be so far behind -- but this bit of arithmetic is pretty compelling. Nonetheless, I might quibble with the part I highlighted in bold. It may be that the Lab is convinced that Homesteads are money-losers if sold individually rather than as part of a larger Estate, following from the premise that Estates supply some first-line support to Homestead renters that the Lab would otherwise need to have staff to supply to Premium-Plus-Plus Homesteads. I have no idea if this support-cost argument has any grounding in reality but it's a case I'd try to make if I were an Estate owner with a lot of full-Homestead tenants.

21 hours ago, Garnet Psaltery said:

Pussycat, stop this ageist talk immediately. 

OK boomer

(Just kidding, of course. Trying on the term myself, to see how it feels.)

[Alyona Su]

20 hours ago, Bree Giffen said:

Is it possible to start a premium account with a last name and drop to basic right away? Not that I'm planning anything. I have my last names.

Yes - AFTER the Name Change feature is implemented and available - and you are creating a new account. If you mean this existing account, you will have to pay to change your name and even then, only after you have upgraded to the Premium tier.

[Drayke Newall]

7 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

This is from an ancient corner of this thread -- sorry to be so far behind -- but this bit of arithmetic is pretty compelling. Nonetheless, I might quibble with the part I highlighted in bold. It may be that the Lab is convinced that Homesteads are money-losers if sold individually rather than as part of a larger Estate, following from the premise that Estates supply some first-line support to Homestead renters that the Lab would otherwise need to have staff to supply to Premium-Plus-Plus Homesteads. I have no idea if this support-cost argument has any grounding in reality but it's a case I'd try to make if I were an Estate owner with a lot of full-Homestead tenants.

With their older prim limit maybe, but even back then I know many a sim owner that offered RP sims, hangout sims etc. that all would still be in second life with their sims if they had access to the homestead without the need of a full region.

We also all know that mainland is generally a dead loss as far as subscription goes. Whilst yes people do use mainland as part of the subscription, the support needed in terms of LL would be far higher than a top tier homestead premium plan as you don't have those pesky neighbours, builds, etc. and any griefer you can deal with yourself directly through the region setting ban lists instead of LL dealing with AR's. Only a roll-back service would be needed by LL support and rarely at that. Additionally with LL land auctions being generally defunct, mainland pricing is now higher in some cases than the setup fee of a homestead for less land.

I think also if they had made the change to homesteads being available without a full region it would have also potentially meant a greater uptake of the old now not available openspace regions, but that's a different topic.

Edited November 25, 2019 by Drayke Newall

[Maryanne Solo]

Users may "select a last name from a list" 😖 AND pay for the privilege 😫
Well that's just absolutely useless. 😿

I was thinking last name of my choice, not a name from a list. 👎

Lucky I made my avi animated .gif the way I did. 🙄 
 

Edited November 25, 2019 by Maryanne Solo

[Resi Pfeffer]

On 11/22/2019 at 7:01 PM, ThorinII said:

To be honest I absolutely couldn't care less about a mobile client for SL. I mean, what use is a mobile client anyway?

I use it, when i need to login in a situation where i dont have access to my pc or laptop. Such as: Being at work, being on a train, being at a friends house, and so on.
To do what? Nearly everything im doing using my computer, such as: teleporting, chatting, watching profiles, accessing the iventory, attach and detach items, switching to 3D mode to walk or fly anywhere i want, interacting with inworld items by sitting or touching... Actually, there is not a lot one cant do, using Lumiya.

Quote

You can't see a thing, because those 5" screens of average smartphones are way too small for anything more than some text - which makes that whole concept moot. And using such a client on a tablet?

Of course its far from being pleasant using the phone to move my avatar in SL... But it works. And maybe better than you might think. In my early days my computer had less fps than my phone now, whats around 10-20 fps, depending on where you are. 
What about accessing hompepages not optimized for mobile devices on your phone? Thats also awful, and its accepted nonetheless, because people just zoom in to hit buttons or links. Having a difficult way to access something is better than none at all.

Quote

From my point of view, even the 15" screen of my laptop is rather small for such a rich virtual world like SL.

Im with you. If i could, i would order a 5K USD computer, hooking it up to a 8K display to get the best out of SL. If i could...

Quote

In my opinion, LL shouldn't even waste one working hour on developing a mobile client, at all.

Around 10 friends out of my friendlist, what has a head count of around 90, are using mobile clients, most of them Lumiya, or textviewers for those who use iOS. And thats just the ones who told me about. Thats not a really bad rate, i would say.

If you want a real hint, where a vast amount of money was and still is burned for only a few online users at all... 
Ahhh, i wont name it, but its also developed by Linden Labs somehow, it was and still is a more or less a walking simulator, and sometimes standup comedians (who are not even known outside the US territory) perform their jokes on this platform.
Great, isnt it?

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

I wonder how quickly no one will care about being able to have an LL last name for their avatar. My hunch is pretty fast.

[Lyssa Greymoon]

5 minutes ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

I wonder how quickly no one will care about being able to have an LL last name for their avatar. My hunch is pretty fast.

I'm betting it'll be about the time pricing is announced.

[ItHadToComeToThis]

On 11/24/2019 at 12:13 AM, Mollymews said:

this is how I perceive it as well.  A Linden has said that legacy last names like Su will not be reused, so will not be on the available last names list. Not on the list means that you can't pick Su

an inability to do this leaves us in the same kinda spot as BobJenkins Resident.  I am hoping that Linden will think about all this and work out a way where these individualised wants are catered to

as you say it would be useful I think that anyone with a legacy name can just change their first name if they want. Bob4563 Su would probably be happy to able to do this also

i think BobJenkins.Resident and Bob4563.Su are the two individualised wants that it seems the current Linden thinking doesn't cater for. There may be a third or fourth want but I can't think of what they might be. May be somebody else can.  If Linden could find a way to help BobJenkins and Bob4532.Su then that would be good

They can just change their first name. It’s not just a whole name change, I asked this at one of the inworld group meetings. You can also revert back to previously used / original name if you so do wish

[Caerolle Llewellyn]

5 hours ago, Resi Pfeffer said:

I use it, when i need to login in a situation where i dont have access to my pc or laptop. Such as: Being at work, being on a train, being at a friends house, and so on.
To do what? Nearly everything im doing using my computer, such as: teleporting, chatting, watching profiles, accessing the iventory, attach and detach items, switching to 3D mode to walk or fly anywhere i want, interacting with inworld items by sitting or touching... Actually, there is not a lot one cant do, using Lumiya.

Of course its far from being pleasant using the phone to move my avatar in SL... But it works. And maybe better than you might think. In my early days my computer had less fps than my phone now, whats around 10-20 fps, depending on where you are. 
What about accessing hompepages not optimized for mobile devices on your phone? Thats also awful, and its accepted nonetheless, because people just zoom in to hit buttons or links. Having a difficult way to access something is better than none at all.

Im with you. If i could, i would order a 5K USD computer, hooking it up to a 8K display to get the best out of SL. If i could...

Around 10 friends out of my friendlist, what has a head count of around 90, are using mobile clients, most of them Lumiya, or textviewers for those who use iOS. And thats just the ones who told me about. Thats not a really bad rate, i would say.

If you want a real hint, where a vast amount of money was and still is burned for only a few online users at all... 
Ahhh, i wont name it, but its also developed by Linden Labs somehow, it was and still is a more or less a walking simulator, and sometimes standup comedians (who are not even known outside the US territory) perform their jokes on this platform.
Great, isnt it?

I too know several people who use Lumiya on their phones for most of their SL experience. As you say, having a massive computer and monitor is best, but some of these people are disabled, and either cannot afford a nice computer, or cannot sit in front of one for extended periods, or both. Sure, they miss out on a lot, but these people are mostly in SL for the social interactions (for some of them, this is about all the social interaction they have), and having a phone client means a lot to them.

When I was a Host, and when I did a lot of communication for my clan, I used Lumiya a lot at work (I cannot even get onto the SL website on my work computer, much less inworld). Unfortunately, it seems Lumiya is no longer supported, and of course it is not available on iOS. This is totally different from the topic of making a mobile client that has nice graphics and is good enough to interest young people, but having something basic like Lumiya for Android and iOS doesn't seem like it would take that many resources, and it keeps a certain segment of SL residents engaged.

Oh, and funny you mention websites not having mobile versions: SL doesn't, and if I have to log into SL on my phone, it is a nightmare. That and the horrible Search engine inworld just blow my mind, considering LL is supposed to be a cutting-edge tech company, and is totally an online experience. ~

[AyelaNewLife]

This is my average third party experience of Lumiya:

Quote

[11:14] Resident is offline.
[11:14] Resident is online.
[11:14] Resident is offline.
[11:15] Resident is online.
[11:15] Resident is offline.
[11:16] Resident is online.
[11:16] Resident is offline.
[11:16] Resident is online.
[11:17] Resident is offline.
[11:17] Resident is online.
[11:17] Resident is offline.
[11:18] Resident is online.
[11:18] Resident is offline.
[11:19] Resident is online.
[11:19] Resident is offline.
[11:20] Resident is online.
[11:20] Resident is offline.
[11:20] Resident is online.
[11:21] Resident is offline.
[11:21] Resident is online.
[11:22] Resident is offline.
[11:22] Resident is online.
[11:22] Resident is offline.
[11:23] Resident is online.
[11:23] Resident is offline.
[11:23] Resident is online.
[11:24] Resident is offline.
[11:24] Resident is online.
[11:25] Resident is offline.
[11:25] Resident is online.
[11:26] Resident is offline.

 

[missyrideout]

5 hours ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

I wonder how quickly no one will care about being able to have an LL last name for their avatar. My hunch is pretty fast.

lol. Right. As soon as I have one, I will cease to care.  So many people in the thread who have last names can't possibly see the appeal for those of us who don't? hi larious 

[Caerolle Llewellyn]

43 minutes ago, missyrideout said:

lol. Right. As soon as I have one, I will cease to care.  So many people in the thread who have last names can't possibly see the appeal for those of us who don't? hi larious 

I have a last name, and I can see the appeal.

Really, my last name no longer fits me at all, and I would like a new one. I picked the one I have a very long time ago, and it worked with what I thought I wanted to be in SL (sorta fae), but I left that all behind long ago. What I would really love, and what isn't going to happen, is being able to pick a custom new last name. I even settle for being able to have a display name that is used everywhere except for my account, but that isn't happening either. So I guess I will see what new names are on offer, and how much it costs, and go from there.

[missyrideout]

And I can see it being a big deal to couples, if the process makes it easy to have matching names. My partner has an old name but I know he would happily change to something new, We have been cautiously looking forward to that since they were announced. 

[Alyona Su]

7 hours ago, ItHadToComeToThis said:

They can just change their first name. It’s not just a whole name change, I asked this at one of the inworld group meetings. You can also revert back to previously used / original name if you so do wish

If you are correct then I'll be pleasantly surprised. If I can change only my first name that's what I'd like to do that, though I'll not hold my breath and continue presuming we won't be able to do that until I see that we can, or someone from @Linden Lab officially states that that is the plan, at least. I still haven't decided regarding my alt, though.

[Lyssa Greymoon]

2 hours ago, missyrideout said:

lol. Right. As soon as I have one, I will cease to care.  So many people in the thread who have last names can't possibly see the appeal for those of us who don't? hi larious 

I think anyone who has ever used a display name can see the appeal. There’s also the point that the costs makes a display name good enough.

[Kimmi Zehetbauer]

8 hours ago, Caerolle Llewellyn said:

I too know several people who use Lumiya on their phones for most of their SL experience. As you say, having a massive computer and monitor is best, but some of these people are disabled, and either cannot afford a nice computer, or cannot sit in front of one for extended periods, or both. Sure, they miss out on a lot, but these people are mostly in SL for the social interactions (for some of them, this is about all the social interaction they have), and having a phone client means a lot to them.

When I was a Host, and when I did a lot of communication for my clan, I used Lumiya a lot at work (I cannot even get onto the SL website on my work computer, much less inworld). Unfortunately, it seems Lumiya is no longer supported, and of course it is not available on iOS. This is totally different from the topic of making a mobile client that has nice graphics and is good enough to interest young people, but having something basic like Lumiya for Android and iOS doesn't seem like it would take that many resources, and it keeps a certain segment of SL residents engaged.

Oh, and funny you mention websites not having mobile versions: SL doesn't, and if I have to log into SL on my phone, it is a nightmare. That and the horrible Search engine inworld just blow my mind, considering LL is supposed to be a cutting-edge tech company, and is totally an online experience. ~

Although SL is best on the computer, for those who can't as you mentioned, the Lab should put it's resources on a decent mobile client instead of Sansar. They could make a client optimized for tablets since those are cheap nowadays and good for someone who needs to rest in bed a lot due to ailments. I don't want to see that replace the computer version of the virtual world.

[Pixie Kobichenko]

12 hours ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

I wonder how quickly no one will care about being able to have an LL last name for their avatar. My hunch is pretty fast.

And that is my question- if we're going to be able to change our first names for a fee, why will we be relegated to a list to pick a last name from?  I've been using a display first & last name different from my legacy first name and last name for a while now and I really like it.

  I don't mean it to be snarky at all I just don't understand why if we can change our first names why they won't allow us since we're paying a fee anyways why we can't change our last name to whatever we want as well.