Last names nearly here - and more. Yay!

[Adam Spark]

10 minutes ago, ThorinII said:

To be honest I absolutely couldn't care less about a mobile client for SL. I mean, what use is a mobile client anyway? You can't see a thing, because those 5" screens of average smartphones are way too small for anything more than some text - which makes that whole concept moot. And using such a client on a tablet? From my point of view, even the 15" screen of my laptop is rather small for such a rich virtual world like SL. In my opinion, LL shouldn't even waste one working hour on developing a mobile client, at all. 👿

 

I'm with you. In my opinion SL is usable on 17 inch monitors at a minimum. Now, a mobile client is useful for merely connecting with people when you cannot otherwise log in. But for doing anything else, I don't get it. I tried Lumiya. I can use it, but having the functions on different pages or tabs is a PITA on a good day.

A mobile Marketplace app, on the other hand, I would be all about that.

[Paul Hexem]

I like how they compare the marketplace to other virtual stores.

"We put a fraction of the effort into our store as they do, and we happily sell thousands of unregulated, stolen products! You're lucky we don't charge as much as they do!"

[Selene Gregoire]

4 minutes ago, Gadget Portal said:

I like how they compare the marketplace to other virtual stores.

"We put a fraction of the effort into our store as they do, and we happily sell thousands of unregulated, stolen products! You're lucky we don't charge as much as they do!"

Seems they forgot they bought XStreetSL and developed the MP from it rather than coding their own from scratch. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Alyona Su]

12 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said:

Seems they forgot they bought XStreetSL and developed the MP from it rather than coding their own from scratch. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

They also purchased On-Rez and then killed off the superior of the two, so it all makes sense now.

[Cindy Evanier]

45 minutes ago, ThorinII said:

And using such a client on a tablet?

 I get what you mean right until the only choice I had was lumyia on my tablet when my hard drive had a catastrophic fart and I was almost imprisioned for stalking the computer man for a month  😇  

[Kitteh Whiskers]

11 hours ago, Grumpity Linden said:

You do not lose your name when you cancel premium.  The one time name change fee gives you this new name for good. Unless you decide to change it again. Which you could - no limit on name changes. 

So, we'd pay for Premium +  whatever fee LL wants to charge us?

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

1 hour ago, Gadget Portal said:

 

"We put a fraction of the effort into our store as they do, and we happily sell thousands of unregulated, stolen products! You're lucky we don't charge as much as they do!"

That is epic.

 

 

[Mollymews]

9 hours ago, Carina Asbrink said:

And why limit the name change to premium members? You could have taken x dollar for a name change from anyone who wants it

yes I do wonder why a basic account couldn't just buy a name change if they wanted without having to buy anything else. Unless things change then it seems a basic account will have to buy at least a one month premium and then pay for the name change on top of this.  Which seems a little bit gougy to me

altho when the idea is that getting a person onto Premium may mean that some people may continue to renew the premium fee thereafter.  Then while understandable from a purely revenue generating pov, it still seems a little bit off to me from a relational perspective

[Adam Spark]

*deleted*

Edited November 22, 2019 by Adam Spark
Cant remove, read and responded too fast haha

[Adam Spark]

1 hour ago, Katt Dragoone said:

So, we'd pay for Premium +  whatever fee LL wants to charge us?

Yes, its a premium feature thats not even free to Premium members. Go figure.

[LittleMe Jewell]

19 hours ago, Mollymews said:

i will wait and see how much it costs then decide if it will be worth it to me. I can't think of any name I would jump at changing to at the moment. If I could change from Mollymews Resident to Molly Mews then I would most likely, just because

am not sure this is going to be possible tho, as even if Mews was a selectable last name then from what Linden have said previously then I can't choose Molly as a first name for Mews as MollyMews is already being used by a existing user, who happens to be me.  I am hoping that Linden will find a way to make this possible. If not then oh! well, maybe one day somehow

 

Actually, if Mews came up on the list, you could try to get Molly Mews because "Molly Mews" is different from "Mollymews Resident".

[Kitteh Whiskers]

47 minutes ago, Adam Spark said:

Yes, its a premium feature thats not even free to Premium members. Go figure.

Greedy Greedy Greedy. In that case, forget it

[Mollymews]

8 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Actually, if Mews came up on the list, you could try to get Molly Mews because "Molly Mews" is different from "Mollymews Resident".

i am going off a previous conversation where A Linden ( I can't remember which one now) said that any combination of new names that resolves to 'mollymews' would be disallowed. So if Mews was a last name and I tried to enter Molly as a first name then it will tell me that Molly Mews has already been taken

and if I am honest I would be a little bit miffed if this was possible to do and somebody else snaffled it before me.  As I think would BobJenkins Resident or EmilyShort Resident who would I think like there to be a way they could name change to Bob Jenkins and Emily Short. The system recognising that BobJenkins Resident would probably want to do this, and allow BobJenkins Resident to do this if he wanted

it could be a way for Linden to also add last names to the available list.  When BobJenkins Resident name changes to Bob Jenkins then (after a Linden review) Jenkins is added to the list when/if not already. Same with Short when Emily does it

[Kimmi Zehetbauer]

5 hours ago, ThorinII said:

To be honest I absolutely couldn't care less about a mobile client for SL. I mean, what use is a mobile client anyway? You can't see a thing, because those 5" screens of average smartphones are way too small for anything more than some text - which makes that whole concept moot. And using such a client on a tablet? From my point of view, even the 15" screen of my laptop is rather small for such a rich virtual world like SL. In my opinion, LL shouldn't even waste one working hour on developing a mobile client, at all. 👿

 

  Hide contents

Actually, I'm even currently saving up for a really big (like, 32"!) monitor for my desktop computer (the monitor I'm using right now only has 24").

😈

 

I agree. SL is meant for the bigger screen, not the tiny ones on a phone. Heck, I don't even own a smart phone --- just a flip one.

But the funny thing is when my man DJs from our bar into a SL club, he'll mention that and we'll see a few patrons pull up their mobiles looking for the app.  He then says "You play this on the big computers, not the phone."

Edited November 22, 2019 by Kimmi Zehetbauer
Fixed formating due to fat finger syndrome.

[Adam Spark]

50 minutes ago, Katt Dragoone said:

Greedy Greedy Greedy. In that case, forget it

Greedy? No, I happily pay for what makes sense to me. I've even made paypal donations to creators of free stuff (Adblock browser plugin for one). I approve of the MP increases. I hope to see that go further, quite frankly.

Paying for premium features makes zero sense to me quite frankly.

[Drayke Newall]

9 hours ago, bigmoe Whitfield said:

Let's nix that one in the butt right now.  LL does not have the resources to spin up millions of free homesteads,  those cost LL money to host on a physical machine, even after they do end up moving the simulator code to aws, it still will cost them money and trying to eat the $$$ this will cause LL to have to throw out will not be a good financial standpoint to whom their investors and board people maybe.   But wishful thinking never hurts

As Selene Gregoire said, not really as it would be built into the premium price which this tier would be the most expensive. You do not attract people to a subscription model of offering equal worth to the cost of the tier. You have to offer something extra as a bonus that would offer something to draw them to it.

As it stands now you need to spend monthly $338 to obtain a homestead (cost of a full region and the homestead not including the $498 set-up fee). Place the premium price for the highest tier at $140 per month the price of the homestead and $31 (or higher) for the additional premium bonus' and you are not having any impact on profit but increasing them as more people have access to a Homestead (and spend more $L in the marketplace to furnish the sim). More people will also look into or sign up to a premium subscription and it would retain them in the subscription model as you would loose the access to the homestead (as you do with mainland parcels now).

Simply put, homesteads locked behind the need to buy a full sim is disadvantageous for Lab profit wise as if they were available without a full sim they would sell far more sims than they do now as generally most people don't want a full sim and certainly don't want to have to pay for a full region just to get one.

6 hours ago, Mollymews said:

altho when the idea is that getting a person onto Premium may mean that some people may continue to renew the premium fee thereafter.  Then while understandable from a purely revenue generating pov, it still seems a little bit off to me from a relational perspective

If LL think they will attract people to stay on premium solely because of people wanting a last name they must be living in some far off fairy land, especially if you have to pay for that name change on top of premium. All that will happen is a sharp increase in premium at the start and once people have their precious last name will cancel premium.

Premium has offered very little to the average user from the get go with only the Linden Home being the real selling point. This has however, never been enough to draw the majority of people to premium as evident from them never being able to remove their reliance on Land for profit.

4 hours ago, Kimmi Zehetbauer said:

I agree. SL is meant for the bigger screen, not the tiny ones on a phone. Heck, I don't even own a smart phone --- just a flip one.

But the funny thing is when my man DJs from our bar into a SL club, he'll mention that and we'll see a few patrons pull up their mobiles looking for the app.  He then says "You play this on the big computers, not the phone."

I think it is certainly something LL should look into. Especially now that we are seeing fold phones come out where they become a tablet from a phone.

Edited November 23, 2019 by Drayke Newall

[Pussycat Catnap]

16 hours ago, Resi Pfeffer said:

Like what? Can we expect having a mobile client for Android and iOS anytime soon? Maybe in 2023, when this weird internet things are not "Neuland" anymore?

Mobile gaming is popular in Asia... but not because people like it... rather the situations there kinda dictate it. You spend almost all your waking hours either at work or on a subway... Get on a train in Seoul or Tokyo and lots of folks might be playing some mobile game.

Outside of Asia people really dislike mobile gaming.

Though if I was developing SL for users in Latin America or Africa where broadband is often better than in Europe or America but no one has desktops then sure... I'd go for mobile.

But mobile MMOs have been very limited to date due to the limitations of the devices. A mobile version of SL is not going to be what you want it to be...

I know there have been mobile clients before - usually working as a connection to a virtual machine somewhere and it is that machine that then logs into SL... that's a model that has issues at scale...

 

[Kimmi Zehetbauer]

37 minutes ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

Mobile gaming is popular in Asia... but not because people like it... rather the situations there kinda dictate it. You spend almost all your waking hours either at work or on a subway... Get on a train in Seoul or Tokyo and lots of folks might be playing some mobile game.

Outside of Asia people really dislike mobile gaming.

Recently a train game my man use to play on the desktop went to a mobile only. He was bummed and can no longer play it.

[Adam Spark]

10 hours ago, bigmoe Whitfield said:

Let's nix that one in the butt right now.  LL does not have the resources to spin up millions of free homesteads,  those cost LL money to host on a physical machine, even after they do end up moving the simulator code to aws, it still will cost them money and trying to eat the $$$ this will cause LL to have to throw out will not be a good financial standpoint to whom their investors and board people maybe.   But wishful thinking never hurts

Millions of free homesteads?

They might have to spin up that many if they gave them to every current user of SL including basic, maybe (thats a stretch in my opinion). But we're talking high tier premium here.

[Skylar Littlepaws]

On 11/21/2019 at 1:58 PM, Reyetta Claven said:

The only highlights of that post were the last name contest and the new linden homes themes tbh. The rest is just crap. Doubling the marketplace commission, adding a new premium tier that no one asked for (I'm calling it now: they'll try to remove features from, or add extra fees/restrictions to free and/or classic premium to make Premium Plus seem better. They'll consider taking it back when there's a huge outcry from the users.), making name changes premium-only AND charging an additional fee on top of that... Is LL having that much of a problem keeping the lights on? Oof.

So, people did ask for premium tiers awhile back when the prices for the Premiums were going up.  I even offered the idea of doing a premium tier.  

[Raevyn Addams]

5 hours ago, Mollymews said:

The system recognising that BobJenkins Resident would probably want to do this, and allow BobJenkins Resident to do this if he wanted

it could be a way for Linden to also add last names to the available list.  When BobJenkins Resident name changes to Bob Jenkins then (after a Linden review) Jenkins is added to the list when/if not already. Same with Short when Emily does it

I like this a lot. Possible? Probably not. There's a lot of names out there (or words in general) that are fine by some and offensive by others and trying to police the options would be more headache inducing than having a list of preset names that are (again, generally) semi-guaranteed not to offend, upset or belittle - an important aspect when dealing across multiple countries and cultures.

As for the rest:

At the risk of sounding like a yes-man I'm actually okay with the announcement. Yes to last names. Yes to Super Duper Premium Plus. Yes to fees. Why?

Last names is something a lot of people have wanted a long time. Premium Plus is just another option that LL doesn't actually -need- to introduce. They could stay as they are and have people curse them for lack of initiative and stagnation. As for fees Linden Lab is a business that has to walk a fine line between profit and customer satisfaction like any business does.

Don't want last names? Don't get one. Don't want Premium Plus? Don't get it. The fees may be harder to avoid but people still pay for coffee or pay TV or that expensive pair of jeans or whatever it is that gives them enjoyment in their everyday real lives, and if they don't like it they vote with their feet. Don't like what SL is doing? Find another alternative, or make it yourself if you think you can do better.

When all is said and done Second Life is a luxury, not a necessity - and before I'm reminded at how many people use SL to fill a need in their lives it's been said many times before. I for one happen to be one of those people and while I am happy here to whatever degree I will continue to pay. When the day comes that I'm not or I can't afford it then I'll have to walk away. There are enough struggles in the real world to contend with.

As the old adage says you can't please everyone all the time, though I applaud LL for trying. As well as for taking the time to listen to our concerns both for and against and for bothering to engage with us at all instead of lording behind a wall of administrative silence like they could and many others do.

THANK YOU Linden Lab (and thanks too @Jagix Linden for taking the time to put together that picture and trying to inject some levity at the start of this thread). 👍

❤️

[Kathlen Onyx]

We heard you loud and clear. Soon it will be possible to change the name of a Second Life account. This is one of our Residents’ most requested features and we’re working furiously to make it available by the end of January.  Name Changes will be exclusively for Premium members at an additional fee. Changing one or both of your First and Last Name will be available as a single transaction. Last Names will be picked from a list, which you can help us curate.

What’s a last name you would choose for yourself? We’ll soon hold a contest seeking your contributions to the pool of last name options. From all of the suggestions, we’ll pick five, and those five lucky Residents will be able to change their names completely free of charge! You will not need to be Premium to participate or to win. The contest will run December 16 through January 15th, and participation details will be announced shortly. 

 

Am I reading this right? You have to pay to change it but you have to pick a last name from their list? Not sure how that is an enhancement.

[Drayke Newall]

29 minutes ago, RaeLeeH said:

Last names is something a lot of people have wanted a long time. Premium Plus is just another option that LL doesn't actually -need- to introduce. They could stay as they are and have people curse them for lack of initiative and stagnation. As for fees Linden Lab is a business that has to walk a fine line between profit and customer satisfaction like any business does.

But you seem to be missing the point. I don't think there would be any person that has an issue with a tiered premium model if done right. The re-introduction of Last names is just another bonus, the necessity of tiered Premium is another thing entirely.

You say that LL don't need to introduce additional tiers to premium, whereas LL themselves have stated they need to as with their profits tied to Land rental in SL and the dwindling uptake on Land it is negatively impacting on not only their profits but also the user, user retention, user spending and everything else. That is the sole reason they are introducing a Premium tiered subscription model, to ensure you can still have a Second Life to go to irrespective on whether others find an alternative.

13 minutes ago, KateaSL said:

Am I reading this right? You have to pay to change it but you have to pick a last name from their list? Not sure how that is an enhancement.

Yes correct. You pay for the subscription at full price and then pay an additional once off payment on top of your subscription to change your name. Last names are preselected by Linden Lab and you choose one of those last names from a drop down list as it was pre 2009 (albeit back then last names were free).

Edited November 23, 2019 by Drayke Newall
spelling is fun

[Adam Spark]

2 hours ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

Mobile gaming is popular in Asia... but not because people like it... rather the situations there kinda dictate it. You spend almost all your waking hours either at work or on a subway... Get on a train in Seoul or Tokyo and lots of folks might be playing some mobile game.

Outside of Asia people really dislike mobile gaming.

Though if I was developing SL for users in Latin America or Africa where broadband is often better than in Europe or America but no one has desktops then sure... I'd go for mobile.

But mobile MMOs have been very limited to date due to the limitations of the devices. A mobile version of SL is not going to be what you want it to be...

I know there have been mobile clients before - usually working as a connection to a virtual machine somewhere and it is that machine that then logs into SL... that's a model that has issues at scale...

 

The biggest difference is that Second Life is not a game and that mobile gaming is a completely different category from virtual worlds. Its like comparing sports with music.

[Drayke Newall]

3 minutes ago, Adam Spark said:

The biggest difference is that Second Life is not a game and that mobile gaming is a completely different category from virtual worlds. Its like comparing sports with music.

And yet you can play music whilst playing sports, just the same as you can play a game in SL.