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3 hours ago, Raspberry Crystal said:

I guess people have got into a groove with how they do things in second life, and it remains to be seen how Patch & Co decide to interpret the covenant.

It does seem to be a genuine surprise to some that continuity in landscaping is important to others.

That second line. Exactly what I've seen in my years in SL, and found very few willing to go along with it. (Aside from one instance where several friends and I rented a mainland region and worked together on the landscaping and holidays, and a few specifically themed estates.) 

It's one of the things I love about Belli, and I suspect will be the most difficult to enforce and/or explain for the exact reason you said: people have gotten used to doing things certain ways, especially on mainland. As much as I've always hated the "green block - snow block - ninja block - neon club block" aspect of mainland, I personally would support a time limit on seasonal decor. I think it would go a long way towards appeasing us continuity folks, knowing it's temporary. 

Also, as Sylvia mentioned, derender is not an option on all viewers so that is not a one-size-fits-all solution.

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A time limit seems a reasonable compromise. Part of a December in real life suburbia in the UK and I presume the USA and much of the rest of the western world is for families to decorate their homes with the gaudy decoration of fake snow covered roofs with inflatable Santa's stuck in the chimneys etc. It would seem thoroughly out of theme to prevent those in Bellisseria expressing themselves as they would in areas like those Bellisseria is based on.

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The problem may be in the policing of said compromise. What happens to those items returned by people that for whatever reason weren't able to pick up all their objects still rezzed after that period? What about the potential headaches sure to come by those who lost gacha or no copy items? On top of that trying to police what people rez now, as well as trying to ensure people stay in their parcel boundary lines, seems like added work when they're already busy. As others have said not all countries experience snow at Christmas and not everyone celebrates Christmas. LL encourages residents to celebrate what and how they like within the ToS but I'd be very surprised if allowances were made for one holiday. Where would the allowances end? 

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Can’t wait for an official update about the snow, or any terrain prim covering the entire parcel that is out of theme for the region. The problem isn’t Christmas or any holiday decorations, the problem is people trying to make snow on lush green grass, and that is awkward and unsightly. Oh, can we talk about these ridiculous color/brick shells too??

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Saying that no snow is the same as no Christmas is pretty disingenuous. Loads of places all over the world don't get snow in December and still manage to celebrate Christmas. We very rarely have snow during Christmas where I live in RL. In SL I'm excited to make a beachy Christmas landscape with Christmas lights in palm trees.

Honestly, limiting snow to a light dusting or patchy drifts seems pretty reasonable. 

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24 minutes ago, Sehra Kauffman said:

Saying that no snow is the same as no Christmas is pretty disingenuous. Loads of places all over the world don't get snow in December and still manage to celebrate Christmas. We very rarely have snow during Christmas where I live in RL. In SL I'm excited to make a beachy Christmas landscape with Christmas lights in palm trees.

Honestly, limiting snow to a light dusting or patchy drifts seems pretty reasonable. 

That isn't what I said. I said: the rationale for no snow would also mean no Christmas decorations. (Emphasis added.) Snow is my decoration. I saw some houses tricked out for Halloween that were completely crazy and made the houses look different. I just don't think it's going to hurt anyone to look at artificial snow in an artificial world for a few weeks, just like I had to look at things that gross me out or terrify me for a month. 

I really can't even believe this is such a major discussion :(

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There are PLENTY of places all over the world that celebrate Christmas without snow.   

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I would hate to be one of those responsible for making this policy.  What we are really talking about are seasonal changes...and since the infrastructure of Belli doesn't change for the seasons, we decorate as we see fit...in summer we put out swimming pools; in autumn trees with changing leaves; in winter a bit of snow and/or icicles,maybe a few bare trees, and in spring, flowers and plants. There surely can be no rules against decorating for the various holidays of the year if you choose to do that.

The covenant currently does not disallow prims covering the entire ground of a parcel...perhaps it should. It does state "Linden Homes should be kept presentable and in-theme to their unique areas."

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28 minutes ago, HoneyBear Lilliehook said:

That isn't what I said. I said: the rationale for no snow would also mean no Christmas decorations. (Emphasis added.) 

Not sure I follow. Can you explain how? 

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ok i do not know if this will work but   and ll would have to do it ,,and i do not know about coder thinggy and script thinggy but ,,, if in beli  make the sky look wintery and have a light snow falling from the sky   so it looks like the first snow   and one can make a small mesh for a little snow here and there build up ,,, so like when you walk out side and it is just starting to snow  the sky has that look and the flakes slowly fall ,,,,,, i do not know if ll could do the make it snow thing but that could be a win win for everyone ,,, looks nice and the decorations would pop without being out of theme ,,,,  once again  a few days of snowing skys would be nice ,,, don't know how they could do it but what a sweet surprise . 

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Something that people from colder climates know and people in warmer places may not understand is that snow is NOT a decoration - it is weather or environment, a fact of nature or whatever you want to call it but it is most definitely not just a decoration.

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10 minutes ago, Flower Caerndow said:

Something that people from colder climates know and people in warmer places may not understand is that snow is NOT a decoration - it is weather or environment, a fact of nature or whatever you want to call it but it is most definitely not just a decoration.

You got that right !!! If they ever had to shovel a looonnnggg  driveway ,,, or road or path  ,,, grew up on farm  so shoveling to the barn the chicken yard the feed barns  etc ,,,,   

Edited by roseelvira
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24 minutes ago, roseelvira said:

lite-dusting.jpg.9b61cf1a9ca310ef9a360651ae437871.jpg    A LIGHT DUSTING OF SNOW 

And in the part of Texas I live in when we get that much snow everything stops. We have a holiday. Kids stay home from school. And if it should happen to be around Christmas we all give a prayer of thanks! 

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3 hours ago, HoneyBear Lilliehook said:

That isn't what I said. I said: the rationale for no snow would also mean no Christmas decorations. (Emphasis added.) Snow is my decoration.

I understand  what you meant. Snow is a part of the christmas decoration as the types of snow in sl  that were sold and  last year there was some new items that were wow and looked soooo real.  I think the snow could still be use but do the transparent thing to make it lite like a dusting or overnight frost ,,, and yes frost up here in the north looks like it snowed over night ,,, there is a solution to this that will be a win win  just all stay calm.... I know if i had kept my hb i would have wanted it to have snow around it ,,,ice in the water   maybe a few penguins on a glacier ,,, JUST JOKING ,,,,    psss a few small ice cubes ,,, wink  lolol

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2 hours ago, Blush Bravin said:

And in the part of Texas I live in when we get that much snow everything stops. We have a holiday. Kids stay home from school. And if it should happen to be around Christmas we all give a prayer of thanks! 

lol....sounds like north Texas, except for 2011 when we got 11" and the world stood still for a week.

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There are people who are going to feel strongly on either side of this debate. To me, snow isn't a decoration... it's a weather event that is a pain in the you-know-what. To some, it's an essential part of celebrating Hanachristmakwanzica or whatever. 

I'm afraid that there are going to be issues with things like this now and forever, and it's going to force LL into making the covenant even more detailed - and maybe it should be. I think it already says something about weather systems, but not specifically about ground coverings, except the theme part. I'm an old Scroogy-Grinchy fuddy-dud that doesn't really like any holidays, religious or otherwise but others should be able to celebrate however they want as long as it doesn't impede other's enjoyment. 

The question is going to be what impedes the enjoyment of others because it's going to be different for each of us. I don't want to see snow, but I don't always get what I want. I'd be okay if it was allowed, but limited to, say, December 15 through January 1. I'm flexible, though, and I think ultimately that's what we're all going to have to be.

Compromise makes a community, or something like that. 

LL has already had to rethink things like security orbs and ban lines, etc., and things are going to keep cropping up that weren't part of the original thought process as we move through the seasons, and themes, and... yeah, elections because if someone covers their parcel with the other guy's posters, etc., my head will explode, and then I'll cover my parcel with my guy's posters, and then it'll be all out war and so, yeah, these are things that probably weren't considered when Bellisseria was on the drawing board and are going to have to be dealt with as they come up.

How freaking awesome is it that they, especially Patch, is reading this and listening to us and putting thought into it and taking our wants into consideration, though?

That's pretty flippin' sweet!

So before we tear each other apart, let's wait to hear what Patch and crew come up with maybe?

tenor.gif.12e8bebc47fe160b0b9525f9a848272e.gif

 

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Though I think we all love that wintry, Christmas feeling that we get from the old Bing Crosby song, "I'm dreaming of a white Christmas." Don't forget, he also sang the Christmas song, "Mele Kalikimaka".

Mele Kalikimaka is the thing to say on a bright Hawaiian Christmas day
That's the island greeting that we send to you
From the land where palm trees sway
Here we know that Christmas will be green and bright
The sun will shine by day and all the stars at night
Mele Kalikimaka is Hawaii's way to say Merry Christmas to you

People celebrate their Winter holiday accustomed to their climate and beliefs.  While we're having winter in North American, friends of ours across the globe in places like New Zealand are in the midst of their summer months.

I love the snowy look, but only for the month of December.  Then the snow can just go away, all away.  I have lived all over the United States, in various climates.  I love to look at snow, but I detest living in it.

I love the climate that Bellisseria offers and I think the residents should abide by the climate set up here by the moles.  I'm in full agreement that snow is not a Christmas/Winter decoration, but an element of weather in certain regions.  Southern California has winter, but they don't have snow in L.A.  And I have seen so many beautifully decorated places in RL and in SL with and without the snow frosted decorations. I think if you want a dusting of snow, then use a Christmas tree that is frosted, or wreaths.  But the snow prims on the roofs and grounds, is not the same as the set up people used for Halloween. Fall occurs all over the world and majority of places experience the fall of the leaves and leaf piles from it, they don't all experience snow though.  I'm fully on board with whatever @Patch Linden and his team decide for the Bellisseria community.

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Snow only comes in winter, but winter is a different time of year depending on whether you live north or south of the equator.  Additionally, it only comes if you are far enough north or far enough south.  The southern parts of the world see snow when us USA folks are sweating our tushies off and when we get it, they are sweating their tushies off.  Many people never see snow.

 

19 hours ago, TessaPaige Jupiter said:

There are two camps, those that want snow and those that don't. Perhaps, as I stated before allow people to celebrate the holidays for a small window of time like 3 weeks. A couple of weeks leading up to the holidays and the week after.

Because of what I said above, Christmas and snow only go together in the northern portion of the world.  The rest of the world only somewhat associates the two together because of many holiday movies.

 

 

14 hours ago, HoneyBear Lilliehook said:

It's not like we're putting up pink and purple snow and that it's going to stay forever.

Now there's an idea -- it will go with the neon pink trees that I've seen - that do appear to be staying forever.  

 

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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All the fake snow decorated houses at Xmas look tacky to me and I wonder at the expense people spend on making their otherwise mundane residences look like snowy grottos covered in fairy lights and inflatable santa's but I can't deny the creativity makes me smile. Snow is of course a weather condition and in the UK it is rare to get it at Xmas, but it is definitely a thing for suburban houses, like those in Bellisseria, to go wild with the decorations, including fake snow blankets as well as the inflatable santas, the trees and all the lights.

SAM_8767.JPG

I am a bit astonished this sort of glorious kitsch is not a feature of christmas all over?

Asking the Lindens to start policing taste and trying to make Bellisseria unlike the reality of where we live in real life would be a step in the wrong direction and a waste of their time when they should be focused on expanding the continent. The existing rules are sufficient, and in our realities snow blankets in gardens are a thing from mid November to mid January. No reason for them to create additional work for themselves with new regulations to enforce, I am sure they have enough to do as it is. I can't see Linden Grinches being a role anyone there would want to take on, any more than Council enforcement officers in real life would want to.

Edited by Aethelwine
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6 hours ago, Aethelwine said:

Asking the Lindens to start policing taste and trying to make Bellisseria unlike the reality of where we live in real life would be a step in the wrong direction and a waste of their time when they should be focused on expanding the continent. The existing rules are sufficient, and in our realities snow blankets in gardens are a thing from mid November to mid January. No reason for them to create additional work for themselves with new regulations to enforce, I am sure they have enough to do as it is. I can't see Linden Grinches being a role anyone there would want to take on, any more than Council enforcement officers in real life would want to.

Arguments like this always tickle me. First, they're already policing things behind the scenes every time someone reports their neighbor for pink neon trees. They even have an entire department devoted to policing things - governance. 

As far as it being a waste of time, I feel confident that Patch making a call about snow drapery won't grind the entirety of the LDPW to a halt for even 10 seconds. Patch isn't out there terraforming and building houses or decorating regions. If the existing rules were sufficient, we wouldn't be having this conversation. These topics are going to come up again and again since Bellisseria is an entirely new type of project for LL, and they need to be thought about and discussed. They want the residents' input and opinions or Patch and the Moles wouldn't be here reading all these threads. Making a decision on something that has already shown itself to be a bit contentious will likely save them work in the long run since there will be an official decision that governance can fall back on as neighbors report each other for having blankets of glittery purple snow covering their parcels. 

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