Interpreting Maturity Rating Guidelines

[HerculesHeavens]

Hello everyone,

I want to discuss some gray areas that seem to exist in the guidelines for the maturity ratings. This is not just another one of those topics though. It is rather specific in nature and focuses on defining each individual example of a gray area I set forth. It also explains a little bit about myself and some problems that these guidelines are causing me that i'm having trouble sorting out. I'm frustrated and I have moved several times spending hundreds of thousands of lindens on mainland running into one problem after another. I feel that I'm close to a resolution but there are some things that still bother me. These things have to do with interpreting maturity rating guidelines.

Please make sure your posts have references to Linden labs official guidelines if your trying to interpret what is allowed and what is not. Please don't just spout off your views and opinions without doing some research. This is not really meant to be a debate even though it might turn into that because of the lack of clarity in Linden Labs guidelines... However it's my hope that we can actually come out of this conversation with some sort of resolution to my concerns that is backed up with linden references for peace of mind. So here we go. Below I will post some of the most confusing gray areas I have ran into when trying to determining what is allowed in moderate mainland.

 

Gray Area Examples:

1) A nude drawing of a woman posing with her back facing the viewer but with her arms tied up. For this example this image is located inside someones private home, on a moderate sim, behind visual barriers, with no public access, & avatar visibility disabled. This is clearly a bondage related image. However there is no exposed genitalia and there is no other person in the image interacting with her. This is a gray area to me because what is posted on the official wiki seems to contradict both sides of the argument. Would simply adding rope to the image make it "sexually explicit"? The wiki says that nude images of women posing is not considered adult and can reside in moderate regions rather than adult. Would this be okay as long as there is no sexual interaction between two individuals with their genitalia taking place? I think this really means that simply saying adult content is allowed as long as its not publicly promoted cant really apply to all situations because there are other official guidelines that exist posted by linden lab... I really wish it was that simple to know what is okay and what is not okay. Someone once said that just behaving like you would in RL in public and what you do in your own home in private is a good example to follow. But... is it really that easy? My references are below...

My reference is located under "Is simple nudity without sex Adult?" on this page:

http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Adult_Content_FAQ

 

2) A room full of bondage furniture with whips, canes, & chains hanging from the wall. For this example this room is located inside someones private home, on a moderate sim, behind visual barriers, with no public access, & avatar visibility disabled. The official wiki states that "The maturity ratings distinguish between publicly-promoted adult content, required to be on Adult regions, and non-public adult content, such as private homes with a sex bed, that can be located on Moderate land." Why am I confused? Because it says "such as". That could be interpreted as any furniture is allowed as long as it's not publicly promoted. My references are below...

My reference is located under "What does advertises or publicly promotes mean?" on this page:

http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Adult_Content_FAQ

 

3) But there is more... The last example all of a sudden becomes another gray area automatically. Why? Because almost every single person in the moderate mainland has some sort of sex furniture located outside. The reference goes on to explain the "Behind closed doors" rule and seems like that too can also be interpreted in different ways because it lists examples of what "behind closed doors" means without actually saying that you must follow all three examples of behind closed doors at once. Can you just pick one example that it gives and just turn off visibility? And before you say anything the section above that says "These restrictions apply regardless of whether the parcel has hidden avatars" is in another section referring to the topic of publicly promoted or not... so really even that can be interpreted in different ways. My references are below...

My reference is located under ""What does behind closed doors mean?" on this page:

http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Adult_Content_FAQ

 

My feelings on all this:

The truth is moderate mainland is utterly confusing when trying to determine what is allowed and what is not. Achieving this goal feels impossible. I cant seem to rest assured that my moderate land investment was a safe investment.... and I spent allot of money on it so I could live near the blake sea and have a broad range of activities in private and in peace without having to worry about living next to a brothel or look outside and see porn all over the place. I'm bothered by the lack of clarity and I worry that some of my hard work will be returned because of gray areas in the official maturity guidelines... I cant relax and enjoy my second life with all this uncertainty. But I am trying very hard to follow the rules and have peace of mind. Maybe some of you can help put my mind at ease so that I can relax and enjoy my second life.

Edited September 4, 2019 by HerculesHeavens
Any edits were to fix minor typos that I missed before posting.

[Chic Aeon]

59 minutes ago, HerculesHeavens said:

The last example all of a sudden becomes another gray area automatically. Why? Because almost every single person in the moderate mainland has some sort of sex furniture located outside.

Just two comments as I am not really interested in your plight,  but your statement above is completely false. I have lived in MANY MANY MANY places on mainland that were moderate (never in general or adult) and I have never found any adult outside furniture. So I believe your point of view is just that -- a point of view.  You might truthfully say "all of my current near neighbors have sex furniture outside" and that might be a viable argument, but saying "almost every single person" is just making assumptions that you cannot back up. 

 

Second: there is no point at all referencing the wiki as the wikis haven't been kept up well or often in a decade. If you want to reference your ideas you need to reference the TOS or one of the "rules" pages attached to them.   

 

I wish you lucky on your quest. 

[HerculesHeavens]

Umm give me a little bit to write my reply to this. I'm pretty sure my references are accurate... I need to figure out how to quote someone too. This is my first time posting on the forms.

Edited September 4, 2019 by HerculesHeavens
Made a mistake.

[HerculesHeavens]

18 hours ago, Chic Aeon said:

Just two comments as I am not really interested in your plight,  but your statement above is completely false. I have lived in MANY MANY MANY places on mainland that were moderate (never in general or adult) and I have never found any adult outside furniture. So I believe your point of view is just that -- a point of view.  You might truthfully say "all of my current near neighbors have sex furniture outside" and that might be a viable argument, but saying "almost every single person" is just making assumptions that you cannot back up. 

 

Second: there is no point at all referencing the wiki as the wikis haven't been kept up well or often in a decade. If you want to reference your ideas you need to reference the TOS or one of the "rules" pages attached to them.   

 

I wish you lucky on your quest. 

These are steps I took to obtain what I believe is legitimate information referenced directly from the official terms and conditions that is subject to the TOS and says so at the top of the page. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I don't see how It can be though because this is a contract we all agree to when we join second life...

Step #1: I went to the official terms and conditions right here: https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/second-life-terms-and-conditions

Step #2: I then scrolled down to "#7 RELATED POLICIES" and clicked on "Second Life Maturity Ratings" referenced by the official terms and conditions.

Step #3: I then read the page referenced buy the official terms and conditions posted by Jeremy Linden.

Step#4: I then found at the bottom of the Adult section on that page referenced directly from the official terms and conditions a link that says "For more information on what qualifies as adult content, see Adult Content FAQ"

Step #5: I then clicked on that link and it took me directly to this page "http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Adult_Content_FAQ"

Step #6: I then verified that it says "Official Linden Lab Information" at the top of the page and claims that content on that page is subject to the "Terms of Service". IF you click on that link then it brings you right back to the Official terms and conditions page. This is all in direct reference to the terms and conditions so I have no idea how you came up with such a wild and bazaar "point of view"....

 

I want you to know that I am not trying to be rude or upset you in anyway. But I believe your claim is inaccurate and it's not backed up by any references at all like mine are. I'm not posting on this form to start an argument or get involved in some off topic discussion. I am a confused resident of second life who is trying to accurately interpret official information referenced from the terms and conditions. Please be polite and make sure your information is accurate and provide references if you wish to to truly help me.

 

Secondly: I sail to the blake sea a few times a week and own land near there. I sail right by hundreds of homes right along the coast and see loads of adult furniture outside in moderate land such as beach towels, daybeds, hot tubs, swimming pools, and loads of other things that have adult animations in them and say adult when you select them. So it is not just near me it is all over the two continents of hundreds and hundreds of sims I sail through. Maybe I should have said it is extremely common rather than almost every single person. That would have been more appropriate I think. Almost every other house I see dose have adult furniture outside their home. It could also be more common along the coast on peoples beaches. Either way it is happening on a massive scale. That really cant be debated.... you must not get out much or something.

 

Now with all that out of the way... This is part of the reason i'm confused. Is it allowed because it is not publicly advertised? I am seeking information on what is truly allowed and what is not. I'm not trying to debate the legitimacy of the official terms and conditions but rather im trying to understand it. This is not a plight.... It is a discussion im trying to start with experts on the topic. Please provide references for any wildly bizarre claims in the future so you don't confuse me even more. I would appreciate it. Thank you.

Edited September 4, 2019 by HerculesHeavens
Added the word "to" in a sentence that was mistakenly left out.

[Alwin Alcott]

in general you can say that adult content is allowed in moderate places if you do everything reasonable to prevent others get confornted with it.

disable public access
disable visibility of avatars on your parcel
no open public porn , in your house is allowed
set your furniture to owner or group only

and
use your brains ...

[HerculesHeavens]

46 minutes ago, Alwin Alcott said:

in general you can say that adult content is allowed in moderate places if you do everything reasonable to prevent others get confornted with it.

disable public access
disable visibility of avatars on your parcel
no open public porn , in your house is allowed
set your furniture to owner or group only

and
use your brains ...

Thank you for your reply. I think you are mostly right. At least I hope so anyways. I wouldn't post porn anywhere though personally even if it was out of view on moderate land. But things like simple nudity is clearly okay according to any official information I can find posted on the TOS or links referenced from the TOS.

My reference is located under "Is simple nudity without sex Adult?" on this page:

 http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:Adult_Content_FAQ

Things just start getting confusing when we start talking about simple bondage nudity of just a female not doing anything sexually explicit. Would bondage nudity really be considered sexually explicit if there is no sexual interaction between two individuals with their genitalia taking place? Would simply adding rope to the image make it "sexually explicit" if shes tied up?

Edited September 4, 2019 by HerculesHeavens
Added "if shes tied up?" at the end.

[Alwin Alcott]

don't drag nudity in it, has nothing to do with adult content. Nudity is allowed everywhere, even on general regions, unless the owner restricts it.
It's pretty clear, sexual activity has to be "behind closed doors" the actions i described are closing that door.

Not every erotic expression is adult, here comes the "use the brains" in action.
Not every kink expression is adult.
 

1 hour ago, HerculesHeavens said:

Things just start getting confusing when we start talking about simple bondage nudity of just a female not doing anything sexually explicit.

It's not confusing the answer is in your quote already : "not doing anything sexually explicit" = moderate or even general.

One addition: a region or landowner can restrict everything that's allowed by the rating of their land. General/Moderate/Adult landowners can forbid nudity, or any other sexual /appearance limits , even when it's not forbidden in the LL explanations .... and so on.

[Alyona Su]

There are three contracts we all agree to in order to use Second Life: TOS, TAC, CS. I recommend you read them and they are (amazingly) written in plain English and easy to understand:

• Linden Lab Terms of Service: https://www.lindenlab.com/tos
• Second Life Terms and Conditions: https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/second-life-terms-and-conditions
• Community Standards: https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/community-standards

The question of virtual land and their ratings and what can be done is made much clearer here than in any F.A.Q.; this is in Terms and Conditions:

• 4. CONDUCT OF USERS OF SECOND LIFE
• (v) Violate our Second Life Mainland Policies, each of which is incorporated into this Second Life Policy;
• (vi) Violate our Maturity Content Guidelines. A region designated General is not allowed to advertise or make available content or activity that is sexually explicit, violent, or depicts nudity;

In other words: whatever happens *privately* stays private. It's similar with U.S. Copyright law: you can freely give anything away to family or personal friends (yes, it's in the law.) However, you cannot give it away to strangers (why a web link is illegal: anyone with access can take it.) So it's the same with the ratings on mainland. (And this is why Sex beds in your private home on G-RATED land IS ALLOWED as long as you make a good-faith effort to keep it private. Though just as in RL, people can invade your home and when they do: it's on them, not you. The suggested method of doing this is to turn off Avatar Visability on the parcel. This does not mean your sex-couch must be inside your mesh mansion, it can still be out in the open on the front porch.

Also, most newer sex-furniture and vehicles and other things now have security built into them, so just by setting them to Group-Only (often the default) is enough to have made a "good faith effort" to not "make available".

LL knows this; they aren't stupid.

 

Edited September 4, 2019 by Alyona Su

[HerculesHeavens]

7 hours ago, Alyona Su said:

There are three contracts we all agree to in order to use Second Life: TOS, TAC, CS. I recommend you read them and they are (amazingly) written in plain English and easy to understand:

• Linden Lab Terms of Service: https://www.lindenlab.com/tos
• Second Life Terms and Conditions: https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/second-life-terms-and-conditions
• Community Standards: https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/community-standards

The question of virtual land and their ratings and what can be done is made much clearer here than in any F.A.Q.; this is in Terms and Conditions:

• 4. CONDUCT OF USERS OF SECOND LIFE
• (v) Violate our Second Life Mainland Policies, each of which is incorporated into this Second Life Policy;
• (vi) Violate our Maturity Content Guidelines. A region designated General is not allowed to advertise or make available content or activity that is sexually explicit, violent, or depicts nudity;

In other words: whatever happens *privately* stays private. It's similar with U.S. Copyright law: you can freely give anything away to family or personal friends (yes, it's in the law.) However, you cannot give it away to strangers (why a web link is illegal: anyone with access can take it.) So it's the same with the ratings on mainland. (And this is why Sex beds in your private home on G-RATED land IS ALLOWED as long as you make a good-faith effort to keep it private. Though just as in RL, people can invade your home and when they do: it's on them, not you. The suggested method of doing this is to turn off Avatar Visability on the parcel. This does not mean your sex-couch must be inside your mesh mansion, it can still be out in the open on the front porch.

Also, most newer sex-furniture and vehicles and other things now have security built into them, so just by setting them to Group-Only (often the default) is enough to have made a "good faith effort" to not "make available".

LL knows this; they aren't stupid.

 

Thank you for your reply this is excellent information. I like the way you explained the good faith effort too. I think I'm starting to have a better understanding now. So basically Linden Lab is trusting us to make a good faith effort. That would explain why I see so much adult furniture outside along the coast.

Edited September 4, 2019 by HerculesHeavens
Added a little to the ending.

[Alyona Su]

10 minutes ago, HerculesHeavens said:

Thank you for your reply this is excellent information. I like the way you explained the good faith effort too. I think I'm starting to have a better understanding now. So basically Linden Lab is trusting us to make a good faith effort. That would explain why I see so much adult furniture outside along the coast.

The good-faith effort is the key, here. If you are *trying* to follow the rules, Linden Lab understands the best you can do it try. They aren't stupid. Okay, sometimes it may seem that they are, but not generally so. LOL

[HerculesHeavens]

3 hours ago, Alyona Su said:

The good-faith effort is the key, here. If you are *trying* to follow the rules, Linden Lab understands the best you can do it try. They aren't stupid. Okay, sometimes it may seem that they are, but not generally so. LOL

Right thank you for your reply. But I don't understand why they say "Sexually-oriented objects such as "sex beds" or poseballs may not be located or sold in General regions" when we check the ratings at the top of the viewer when the window opens or here at my reference link. It makes things so confusing. I personally couldn't rezz a sex bed in a general region without feeling it is wrong after seeing this information. I'm not trying to argue though. Its just pretty plain English that seems to contradict other information... Very confusing... Even if the date on it is old we are still confronted with it and I don't see anywhere that says its obsolete information. In my opinion (keyword there) Sex beds don't belong in General rated regions where minors are allowed... This is a very shocking discovery when you apply "The good-faith effort" to the equation. This is not me disagreeing with your post. I have an opened mind right now because i'm trying to understand. I'm just shocked and I cant help but reply to this.

My reference is located in the General section at this link:

 

Edited September 5, 2019 by HerculesHeavens
Added a little bit more to the end.

[Alyona Su]

17 hours ago, HerculesHeavens said:

"Sexually-oriented objects such as "sex beds" or poseballs may not be located or sold in General regions"

If this comes from the "Knowledge base" - which is just an F.A.Q. then so what?

The Terms and Conditions trump any FAQ and the TAC makes it pretty clear. Most importantly, never take anyone else's words for what the TOS, TAC, or CS say, read them yourself. Additionally, do not read into them, read them word-for-word as written, never try to "interpret" basic, simple language. Because the end, in a court of law, each word will be taken by definition, word for word; nothing is supposed to be "interpreted".

Edited September 5, 2019 by Alyona Su

[HerculesHeavens]

8 hours ago, Alyona Su said:

If this comes from the "Knowledge base" - which is just an F.A.Q. then so what?

The Terms and Conditions trump any FAQ and the TAC makes it pretty clear. Most importantly, never take anyone else's words for what the TOS, TAC, or CS say, read them yourself. Additionally, do not read into them, read them word-for-word as written, never try to "interpret" basic, simple language. Because the end, in a court of law, each word will be taken by definition, word for word; nothing is supposed to be "interpreted".

Some of you are clearly not reading the same information you provide in your posts nor the information I'm referring to. The link I gave is listed in the TAC under "#7 Related Policies". Click "Second Life Maturity Ratings" and it will lead you directly to the link I provided. I don't know how to be anymore clear than that... I thought people would be following along better but apparently not. IT also clearly states that "The following related policies are incorporated by reference in and made part of this Second Life Policy, and provide additional terms, conditions and guidelines regarding Second Life." That means we should follow them. All of these policies listed under #7 in the TAC have links. The link I posted is not just FAQ's like you said. It is incorporated by reference and made part of the legal policies. This is what happens when you don't do your research before posting. Someone is going to call you out. That link gives a clear English description of the guidelines for General rated regions and thus says "Sexually-oriented objects such as "sex beds" or poseballs may not be located or sold in General regions".

And for anyone who is just looking to take this thread even further off topic which is very annoying... because this has nothing to do with what I originally opened it to talk about... and tries to pick at this again... I will also point out that linden labs legal official content guidelines it speaks of on the page I posted leads you straight back to the link I provided and is also subject to linden labs legal content guidelines. Everything I have posted all ties together in a circle leading back to one another. We have all agreed to follow these things.

Secondly your comment of "nothing is supposed to be interpreted" cant apply to gray areas such as when linden lab uses the term "such as sex beds in moderate regions". Clearly they are leaving this opened so that it may also apply to other objects that are not just sex beds that have adult content in them. It means there is possibly other objects that could be considered acceptable in moderate regions to put it simply. This thread was supposed to be about discussing those other objects and the gray areas I listed at the beginning of the thread. They are left open and it is impossible for them to list every single item literally that could fall under these guidelines. As someone has mentioned before in the past this is leaving it up to us to "use our brains"... I pointed this out originally when I opened this thread.

Now... Lets get back to the topic of this thread and lets try to stop arguing over other subjects. Lets try to stay on topic here and not post false information on this thread that could put minors at risk. We don't want to mislead others into possibly thinking that its okay to have sex beds in General regions. Sex beds in general regions is not a gray area. It's extremely clear that they are not allowed under any circumstances. If someone wants to have a sex bed inside their home they should be on moderate land at the least. We cant just take one part out of what were reading and go by that. We have to follow the entire encompassing official Terms of Service, Terms and Conditions, Community Standards, and Content Guidelines set forth by linden lab and all of its related policies that linden lab incorporated into them by reference.

I will now post these so that anyone can fact check me below:

https://www.lindenlab.com/tos

https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/second-life-terms-and-conditions

https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/community-standards

And you may have missed this one:

https://www.lindenlab.com/legal/content-guidelines

This link below here is listed in the Terms and conditions under "#7 Related Policies". Click "Second Life Maturity Ratings" it will lead you directly to the link below. Also The content Guidelines will lead you to this link too. Information on this link below is meant to be a guide for the community to follow. Why dose everyone try to argue about this? This is all subject to the agreements we accept when we joined second life. IT dose not matter how old it is. It is still referred to and used as a guide in the current official legal links I posted above.  End of...

Note: If someone is reading this way after I posted it please fact check all this before taking what I said literally. You may be reading this a long time after it was posted. Linden lab can change its legal information at anytime they wish.

Edited September 6, 2019 by HerculesHeavens
Added a period to the end of a sentence and an extra note to the end of the post.

[Alwin Alcott]

in short:
you can have adult furniture for private use at moderate regions in your home, and you can have adult furniture for private use outdoor at moderate region when you use the provided privacy tools, as limited land access, blocked visibility, limited use (group of owner only) using these settings is the meaning for the often used term "behind closed doors".

A while ago this also was discussed about the Bellisseria regions: these are moderate, ánd do not have the possibility to lock the privacy settings as the other "free"mainland. Using the available privacy tools and use your common sense is enough to be safe.

You can NOT run a public and open adult business at moderate rated regions.

General rating : No
Moderate rating: No/Yes, BUT
Adult rating: Yes

addition as said earlier in the thread : every landowner/region owner can be more restrictive in the ratings.
For example, a adult region can have the policy to run on general rules... ( a general region can néver have adult policies)
 

[HerculesHeavens]

1 hour ago, Alwin Alcott said:

in short:
you can have adult furniture for private use at moderate regions in your home, and you can have adult furniture for private use outdoor at moderate region when you use the provided privacy tools, as limited land access, blocked visibility, limited use (group of owner only) using these settings is the meaning for the often used term "behind closed doors".

A while ago this also was discussed about the Bellisseria regions: these are moderate, ánd do not have the possibility to lock the privacy settings as the other "free"mainland. Using the available privacy tools and use your common sense is enough to be safe.

You can NOT run a public and open adult business at moderate rated regions.

General rating : No
Moderate rating: No/Yes, BUT
Adult rating: Yes

addition as said earlier in the thread : every landowner/region owner can be more restrictive in the ratings.
For example, a adult region can have the policy to run on general rules... ( a general region can néver have adult policies)
 

This is good information. I was not aware of the Bellisseria regions limitations. Can you provide a link to that discussion your speaking of? I would be interested in reading it.

Edited September 6, 2019 by HerculesHeavens

[Alyona Su]

14 hours ago, HerculesHeavens said:

All of these policies listed under #7 in the TAC have links. The link I posted is not just FAQ's like you said

The incorporated policies to not specify further anything regarding conduct based on region maturity rating. The F.A.Q. is there for example and even in those example the it states the same thing: "make available". You can take the paranoid approach if you want, there's nothing wrong with that. In the 13+ years I've been in SL I have been told by others that I will be Abuse-Reported countless times. Most of those may have been idle threats, I couldn't't care any less, though I know and understand the all the terms and conditions and have never, even once, received a notice about any kind of warning, caution, or anything other than marketing from Linden Lab, and yet I have owned land on the old Teen continent and had adult furniture out, on the porch, in the open on my G-rated parcel. But also with avatars hidden, sound restricted to parcel and security set tp group-only and no security orb or ban lines.

My RL job requires me to read "licenses" and "terms of service" all the time. One thing I have learned is that you must take them precisely as stated, you cannot inject alternate or "expanded"meanings into them or could find yourself in a court of law. Fortunately, the Linden Lab terms aren't about licensing from them, but that's really the only difference.

Go figure.

Edited September 6, 2019 by Alyona Su

[Hunny Bunny]

 

OMG is that a sex chair, I must investigate!

[Pussycat Catnap]

On 9/4/2019 at 12:54 AM, Alwin Alcott said:

don't drag nudity in it, has nothing to do with adult content. Nudity is allowed everywhere, even on general regions, unless the owner restricts it.

 

Actually nudity is NOT allowed on G sims. Otherwise you're correct there.

Almost every skin and mesh body shop in SL is in violation of the TOS, just nobody wants to report them...