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Official Tilia Q&A Forum Thread (Related Questions Only)

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There have been a lot of questions about our recent Tilia announcement , so we've created this thread as a way for Residents to formally submit their questions. Below we've summarized our existing responses pulled from another community-created thread so that they are better surfaced. As we respond to more of your questions, we will add those to this top forum post - so please review the answers in this post, to see if your question(s) have already been addressed. You may also want to bookmark or follow this thread for updates.

Please use this space to ask your questions specific to the announcement and we'll continue to review and respond where we can. For general comments that are not in the form of questions, we recommend that you continue to use the other forum thread, so that the focus of this thread stays on direct questions and answers. Off topic commentary may be removed or moved from this thread.

We'll also be holding a Tilia Town Hall event inworld in Second Life on Friday, July 12 at 1 p.m. (SLT/Pacific). For those who can't make the live event, we'll make available a video and transcript soon thereafter.

Here are the questions and answers:

Is this an extra fee on top of the recently changed credit processing fee?
No. The credit processing fees remain unchanged for you as a Resident. You will not be charged anything extra for a credit processing fee by Tilia. The only other fee which may apply is an inactivity fee. This fee would only apply to those accounts with USD balances which have not accessed their Tilia account in any way (for example, to check balance) or had any credit processing transactions over a period of 12 months or more.
 

How long will it take to process my credit request? Is it going to take longer than usual with Tilia?
We anticipate that the usual time to process credit, currently two to three business days, will not change for most Second Life Residents once your identification documentation has been verified.
 

How is this change compliant with GDPR? 
Tilia is fully compliant with GDPR. For more information, please see the link to our Privacy Policy where it reads:

OTHER INFORMATION
See our online Privacy Policy to learn more about information collected through our website and how we use and disclose it. That Privacy Policy should be regarded as part of this Privacy Notice.

 

Can you clarify the relationship between Tilia and Linden Lab? 
Tilia Inc. is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Linden Lab. 
 

Can you clarify whether there are ID requirements and fees for basic Linden Dollar purchases?
These changes apply to USD credit processing and do not have any impact on the routine purchasing of Linden Dollars. Only Second Life Residents who Process Credit of their USD balance to their payment method (e.g. PayPal)  are impacted by the ID verification requirements (which are necessary for compliance with U.S. laws and regulations).  The inactivity fee applies only to those accounts with USD balances which have not accessed their Tilia account in any way or had any credit processing transactions over a period of 12 months or more.
 

Will Residents outside the U.S. still need to provide verification or ID for credit processing transactions? 
Yes, anyone who processes credit will need to present a government-issued ID. 
 

I am not a US citizen, I do not drive & have no passport! We also do not have an official photo ID in the UK so how on earth will I qualify?
For non-U.S. citizens without a driver’s license or passport, we will need an equivalent government-issued ID to verify your identity for credit processing. If this is an issue, please contact our customer support team or continue to check our FAQ for additional guidance after Aug. 1. 
 

Will you expect me to scan my ID? Will you expect me to send a photocopied version over via snail mail? 
Yes, you would need to scan your ID for Tilia to verify after Aug. 1. We do not expect anyone to use “snail mail” for verification.

 

 


 

If I’m only using Linden Dollars, does this impact me at all?
No. If you are only using Linden Dollars, and do not have a USD balance, the ID requirements and the inactivity fee has no impact on your ability to continue using Second Life. For example, it doesn’t impact or change your ability to pay for Land Tier or other activities with Linden Dollars.
 

Does this inactivity fee apply to the Lindens I have stored in my account?
No. This fee would only apply to those accounts with USD balances which have not accessed their Tilia account in any way (for example, to check balance) or had any credit processing transactions over a period of 12 months or more.


Will this impact our Premium stipend? (No more L$300 per month? Will we get a token or is this on top of the L$300?) 
This will have no impact on the Premium stipend. 
 

I do have a cash balance, but I am not an SL content creator. I upload money, which goes towards my Premium payments. So does that mean it will affect me too? 
This should not affect you if you are only using your money for Premium payments. For those who are carrying a USD balance to pay Premium, you would need to be active on that account at least once in12 months to avoid the inactivity fee. Thus, paying your annual Premium qualifies as activity.
 

Will our information be stored in plain text?  
No!  We treat the security of any personally identifiable information with the utmost care.  Your information is encrypted and locked down to only be accessible by specific people who have a business need to access your information. Our practices are compliant with applicable U.S. regulations and laws. 
 

Will EVERYONE who uses Second Life have to agree to the new Tilia TOS and Privacy Policy - or just those who use credit processing in USD? *the answer to this question was edited on July 12 to reflect the most up to date information*
Only those who have a USD wallet need to consent to Tilia’s ToS. If you have a USD wallet, these will be presented to you when you log in to your SL account on the web.

I have already provided my personal info to Linden Lab in the past. Do I need to provide it again? Many of us have already provided such ID information for verification, are we exempt from having to provide it again because the information is already on record?
In general, most Residents will not need to resubmit the information if it has been previously provided. However, there may be some instances where Tilia may need to collect and verify the documentation again. 
 

Do I REALLY need to provide my social security number? I just want to enjoy Second Life and I’m not comfortable sharing that information.
The verification requirement applies only to Second Life Residents who process credit of their USD balance to their payment method (e.g. PayPal). The ID verification requirement is necessary for compliance with U.S. money transmitter laws and regulations, such as the USA PATRIOT Act and the Prepaid Access Rule. For those Residents who are not U.S. persons, they will need to provide a government issued ID. 
 

Can Tilia transfer our funds directly to our bank accounts/direct deposit? 
No, Tilia cannot transfer directly to bank accounts at this time.
 

Will Residents need to use Tilia to buy Linden Dollars?
No, Residents can continue to use the payment method on file to buy Linden Dollars. In this case, since there is no Tilia involvement there is no need to provide ID or SSN.

 


 

I’m still confused about whether or not I need to provide my social security number! Can you clarify WHO needs to provide this information? What specific laws and regulations are requiring this change?
The verification requirement applies only to Second Life Residents who process credit of their USD balance to their payment method (e.g. PayPal). The ID verification requirement is necessary for compliance with U.S. money transmitter laws and regulations, such as the USA PATRIOT Act and the Prepaid Access Rule. For those Residents who are not U.S. persons, they will need to provide a government-issued ID. 

 

I never buy Linden Dollars, but I’ve saved them from my stipend to use for purchases. Will I need to verify my ID to continue shopping or paying Land Tier in Second Life?
No. If you are only using Linden Dollars, and do not have a USD balance, the ID requirements and the inactivity fee has no impact on your ability to continue using Second Life. For example, it doesn’t impact or change your ability to pay for Land Tier or shopping with Linden Dollars.

 

What if I have “zero” USD balance - will I still get an inactivity fee that causes me to owe money if there is nothing in my account?
No.  The inactivity fee will not take your balance below zero. 
 

Where do we manage our Tilia account? Will it be a different dashboard than what we currently have on Secondlife.com?
You will continue to manage your account through the Secondlife.com dashboard.  It will be clearly marked which services are provided by Tilia.  
 

If I change my Second Life password, does the info associated with the Tilia account also change at the same time - or do I need to manage that account separately?
Yes, the info associated with both the Tilia and Second Life accounts will be changed at the same time if you change your password. You do not need to manage your accounts separately.


Can we start the verification process now, and if so how can we do that, or do those who need to submit further documents have to all wait until August 2nd?
We’re working on making that process available to you in advance so you can process credit with as little disruption as possible.  We do not have a date when this will happen but will announce once it’s available. We will make the step-by-step instructions for the Tilia ID verification process public as soon as we can. 


Will there be greater limits on how much we are allowed to process credit? If not now, is that a possibility on the table in the next few years?
Yes, it is possible that process credit limits will be reviewed in the future. However, there are no changes at this time. 
 

What happens to the money if an SL user with a USD balance on Tilia dies? 
The process is unchanged from what it is today. To see our current policy, visit the wiki article.

 

Does this change impact Second Life Residents outside the US? For example, will non-US users who want to process credits still be subject to verifying their ID? How will this affect people who are resident in the US but not citizens?
Yes, citizens of countries other than the US will still be subject to these requirements.  Those who do not have a social security number will need to submit a copy of their passport.

For non-U.S. citizens without a driver’s license or passport, we will need an equivalent government-issued ID to verify your identity for credit processing. For more specifics on what types of IDs might be acceptable if you do not have a government ID, you will need to work with our customer support team or continue to check our FAQ for additional guidance after Aug. 1. 

 

Will Tilia in the future be able to work with banks directly (instead of Paypal)?
We do not have such a service available at this time but are working towards making it available in the future. 

 


 

Will you make an additional charge to my credit card on file if there is inactivity on my Tilia account?
The inactivity fee is only applicable if you have an inactive USD balance and it will only be taken from that balance. It will never result in a new credit card charge.
 
Does this change impact both Premium and Non-Premium accounts? Will Premium members continue to get expedited assistance with Tilia like we do for SL?
The service levels for support will not change.  Premium account holders will continue to enjoy the same level of service they do today.

My bank, credit card company or Paypal has already verified my identity. Why do I need to do this again with Tilia? 
As a money services business, Tilia is required to comply with the various state and federal laws regarding money transmission, which require us to collect and verify this information regardless of whether you have provided this information to other financial institutions, such as your credit card company or PayPal.


What exactly is done with the information used in the verification process? Is it provided to the US government for compliance? Even if you are an outside resident? 

The information collected and verified will be stored in our encrypted database in compliance with all applicable data protection regulations. The information will not be provided to the US government unless we are compelled to do so through a legal process (such as subpoena or search warrant). 

How will be notified if we need to verify our ID? 

Residents who need to verify their ID will be prompted to do so when they first attempt to process USD credits. Residents should see an eform pop-up when they first attempt to process credit. The eform will guide them through the process of submitting identification information. If Tilia has already completed the verification, then the transaction will be processed with no delay. 

We are also setting up a process by which you can submit this info in advance so your payouts are not delayed, as well as a way to see whether or not you're approved for payouts already.

What is a process credit?

If you have a U.S. Dollar (USD) balance in your Tilia Account, you may request that some or all of your USD balance be credited to your PayPal or Skrill account.

How do we know that our information is safe with Tilia? 

We treat the security of any personally identifiable information with the utmost care.  Your information is encrypted and secured, so it is only accessible by those who have a need to access your information. Our practices are compliant with applicable regulations and laws.

What constitutes a need to access my personal information?

Tilia’s team must have access to certain personal information as part of the legally-required verification process.

Will my data be used for data mining purposes?

Tilia is not associated with data mining in any way, and your data will not be used for this purpose or sold to third parties. Tilia is a subsidiary of Linden Lab, and exists to strengthen our processes and better protect your data while allowing Second Life’s commercial backbone to thrive. 

Can any government access this information - when, how and why? 

No. This information will not be provided to any government unless we are compelled to do so through a legal process (such as subpoena or search warrant).  


We are continuing to review and monitor this forum thread and will respond with more answers as we can. Please note that we may not be able to respond immediately to all questions and that your patience is appreciated. 

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Will there be a way to opt out if we are never going to cash out, just buy Ls from time to time? Most residents don't need this "feature" and if it is true that L purchases are not made via Tilia then why in the world do we need a Tilia account just to purchase Ls?

Seriously, this should be an opt in deal, not shoved down the throats of people who are never going to use Tilia to cash out.

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How will this affect people who are resident in the US but not Citizens ?

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  1. Can we start the verification process now, and if so how can we do that, or do those who need to submit further documents have to all wait until August 2nd?
  2. Will any of these changes to a company providing service to multiple virtual platforms potentially impact the $L exchange rate?
  3. Can you guarantee us that Tilia will not be raising fees, or are there plans to potentially increase fees in say, a year, two years, three?
  4. Will there be greater limits on how much we are allowed to cash out? If not now, is that a possibility on the table in the next few years?
  5. In order to increase the amount we are allowed to cash out will any additional steps or requirements be added once we're Tilia members?
  6. If we are premium members in SL does our premium expanded support extend to our Tilia accounts in the event of an issue on the Tilia end of the cash out system?
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24 minutes ago, Linden Lab said:

Can Tilia transfer our funds directly to our bank accounts/direct deposit? 

No, Tilia cannot transfer directly to bank accounts at this time.

Will Tilia be able in the future to work with the banks directly, or cash out to credit/debit cards, instead of Paypal? Because as was mentioned on another thread, being in the EU and using the Paypal is really a pain.

I am keeping my fingers crossed this Tilia change might actually turn out great for us non-US citizens if LL decides later to give us more cashout alternatives.

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For my circle of friends who ask, it seems to me like it is fair to state that if you cash out money from Second Life then this conversation is relevant to them, but if all they do is inject money into Second Life and never cash out, then we can simply proceed as usual with no great need for us to participate in the conversation; is that a fair assessment? Thanks very much Linden Lab 🤗

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Posted (edited)

1. Can you give a logical reason why EVERY Second Life citizen is being given a mandatory Tilia account -- that many do not want and most will never use -- rather than setting up an OPT IN system for the very small percentage of those that will be cashing out their US balance?

 

2. Will we be able to change our SL password once we have the mandatory Tilia account --- making it so the name and password no longer match. Most people in tech make VERY SURE that no two passwords EVER match. I am one of them. 

   Edit:  Official answer is NO the passwords stay the same.   

Thank you. 

Edited by Chic Aeon
spelling adding answer to question 2
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Posted (edited)

1. Can this be something that's only presented to those who initiate exchanging L$ for $, rather than forcing it upon all residents?

2. Is LL able to guarantee residents that this is in no way a 'data collection' procedure for the purpose of selling on to third parties, as per Facebook?

Edited by AnyaJurelle
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7. Will Tilia be offering additional services or tiers of membership at extra cost? For example, paying a monthly fee or higher percentage for faster processing time, a one time fee to increase cash out limit, etc.

8. Will there be any benefit for the end users? Faster processing on cash out, more security, anything?

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1 hour ago, Linden Lab said:

I have already provided my personal info to Linden Lab in the past. Do I need to provide it again? Many of us have already provided such ID information for verification, are we exempt from having to provide it again because the information is already on record?

In general, most Residents will not need to resubmit the information if it has been previously provided. However, there may be some instances where Tilia may need to collect and verify the documentation again.

Will we be informed by email of our status in this regard so that we know if we need to resubmit ID or not?  And if so, when could we expect such an email?

 

Also, in the previous thread, I submitted some questions which haven't yet been answered. To avoid them being missed I'm posting them again here:

  1. Will we be able to submit ID information before August 1 so we won't have a delay cashing out while waiting for it to be processed?
  2. How will we submit this information (is there a specific ticket option or a separate web page or email address)?
  3. What are the specific submission requirements for ID (size, file format, etc.)?
  4. For a non-US citizen, is a single piece of government ID that also shows our address sufficient or is something else required, and if so, what?
  5. If we do have to wait until August 1 to submit ID, how long will it take to process?

 

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Please refresh and review the original post to see the newest updates. There are still a lot of questions we are working on getting answers for, and will update again when we have more responses.

QUICK REMINDER: For the sake of keeping this thread clean and easier to read,  please use this space to ask your questions specific to the announcement . Off topic commentary may be removed or moved from this thread. We will also try to use the comments merely to update when there are new questions and answers added to the main post. Thank you.

 

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Posted (edited)

i'm a bit confused about this still. after reading some of the FAQ's (
https://community.secondlife.com/forums/topic/439384-tilia-takes-over/page/7/?tab=comments#comment-1929793 )

i am confused still about the Tilia Terms thingy.

Quote

If I’m only using Linden Dollars, does this impact me at all?

No. If you are only using Linden Dollars, and do not have a USD balance, the ID requirements and the inactivity fee has no impact on your ability to continue using Second Life. For example, it doesn’t impact or change your ability to pay for Land Tier or other activities with Linden Dollars.

 

 

this is me. so i will never use this Tilia thing, nor will it apply to me by any means, but

Quote

 

Will EVERYONE who uses Second Life have to agree to the new Tilia TOS and Privacy Policy - or just those who use credit processing to cash out USD?

Beginning Aug. 1, all Second Life Residents will be asked to agree to the new Tilia terms of service and privacy policy upon logging in.

 

why do i need to still accept Tilia's terms, even though i will never use it, not will this ever apply to me at all ? is this basically saying that we're being forced to accept something even though it is not applicable, in order to keep using SL at all ? because if so, i can see people leaving as a result of this, and this would hurt SL in the long run.

also,

by being forced to accept these new terms means an automatically created Tilia account for each SL member.

1. how do we know, that we will not be charged any fees after 12 months of inactivity, especially since, like myself, i won't ever use this, meaning my Tilia account will be inactive for that duration ?

2. i don't think being forced to accept terms for something that some of us will ever use, and then also being forced to accept this new Tilia account creation is right. this Tilia account should be applicable to anyone who does process credits, as you mention in the blog post, and not to others who will have nothing to do with this since we only buy lindens or pay land tiers so why force everyone and more importantly, do we have an option to opt out of Tilia ?

Edited by ShibariKate
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9. If our transactions have already been going through Tilia for a while with no changes for the users... what's changed now? Why do we now need to accept a new TOS? What exactly is changing to create the need to make this switch come August 1st?

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@Linden Lab 

Will our land fees still be automatically deducted from our USD balances? 

I ask because you say that when we exchange Lindens to USD they go into some "Value Wallet" thing with your alt Tilia to be used between multiple platforms... So does this mean that the lab will deduct the land fees from our Tilia accounts? Or is Tilia used -purely- for cash out purposes as it has been for quite some time now?

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Posted (edited)

1. My first question is: you talk several places about an "inactivity fee", but nowhere do you specify exactly how much that fee will be. Do you already know what that fee will be, or not? And will you be charged a different free if you are a U.S. versus non-U.S. resident. Thank you.

2. My second question comes from this thread's FAQ: 

---

Does this change impact Second Life Residents outside the US? For example, will non-US users who want to process credits still be subject to verifying their ID? How will this affect people who are resident in the US but not citizens?
Yes, citizens of countries other than the US will still be subject to these requirements.  Those who do not have a social security number will need to submit a copy of their passport.

For non-U.S. citizens without a driver’s license or passport, we will need an equivalent government-issued ID to verify your identity for credit processing. For more specifics on what types of IDs might be acceptable if you do not have a government ID, you will need to work with our customer support team or continue to check our FAQ for additional guidance after Aug. 1. 

---

As a Canadian citizen, we are protected by the federal Office of the Privacy Commissioner of Canada, who has posted some information on supplying a Social Insurance Number (SIN, the Canadian equivalent of the SSN): https://www.priv.gc.ca/en/privacy-topics/identity-and-privacy/social-insurance-numbers/protecting-your-social-insurance-number/. It very clearly states, "Your SIN is not a piece of identification." However, it also states that there is no law preventing private-sector organizations from asking for your SIN for other purposes such as identification. However, they warn that your SIN can be used to steal your identity. Along with other personal information, someone unscrupulous may be able to use your SIN to:

  • apply for a credit card or open a bank account,
  • rent vehicles, equipment, or accommodation in your name, leaving you responsible for the bills.

My questions are: will a Canadian SIN be considered the equivalent of a U.S. social security number? And what other Canadian forms of identification (besides our passport) will be acceptable to Linden Lab if we do not wish to provide our SIN for privacy and security reasons? Thank you.

 

Edited by Vanity Fair
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So, saying I choose to not log into SL for more than 12 months, I am charged an inactivity fee from my card on file even though I do not sell anything in SL? 

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Correct me if I am wrong @Linden Lab.

I believe this only concerns those who cash out, and we can only continue to use Second Life if we agree that should we use Tilia in any way, we will play by the rules.

Nothing is being forced on us. There is plenty in the Second Life TOS that has nothing to do with certain users. We just have to pledge not to break it, and agree that we have no recourse for being sanctioned should we do so.

My only question, due to lack of understanding how all this works...

If Tilia is wholly owned by LL, what was LL previously not doing that creating a separate entity (versus just playing by the rules as Linden Lab) corrects?

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Quote

what is we remove our credit cards on file ?

Would then we be charged a fee if say we go 12 months inactive? 

it says we all have to agree to this Tilia on August 1st, I don't know what I would be agreeing to ? Does that mean I would then have to give my SS# and photo ID ? or just sign I agree with whatever  is required, if I don't agree then do I loose all I have put into SL and vanish? This does not make me happy at all , 

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  So exchanged linen dollars via Lindex  will show up in our SL account page as usual and tier taken out of that balance shown in our SL web backend?   Users will never log into Tilia unless they want to cash out?  Or will we need to log into Tilia if we are converting linden dollars to US dollars in order to pay Linden Lab fees like tier and premium membership?

 

image.thumb.png.87d85466b46161c52177167df6294622.png

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Why is it that you don't handle EU and European Economic Area citizens through your UK Tilia subsidiary when the GDPR regulation states you must do so?

GDPR is a regulation meaning no implementation is required in national law for a regulation, as it is of direct application. 

The legal rules it creates are, depending on its subjects, directly applicable to any entity on the territory of the European Union and European Economic Area. Any citizen will be able to refer to the GDPR provisions after May 25th 2018, and its provisions will be directly enforceable by any court.

This implies that any EU and European Economic Area citizen who is a customer of Linden Labs and its subsidiaries have the right to take the Tilia UK subsidiary to court in Europe for failure to implement the GDRP.  The same right can be extended to general consumer protection, banking and financials sector regulations and tax regulations. 

While you have a US requirement to do IRS reporting on US citizens and US registered businesses, there is absolutely no point in reporting transactions for non US citizens or companies to the IRS where in many cases these might risk IRS tax withholding. This can completely be avoided - at least for European Union and European Economic Area entities by establishing a relation between these and your UK subsidiary, and not your US registered company as you have set forth in this communication. Then the UK subsidiary would have to do their tax reporting in accordance with EU regulations to the member state for the entity in question (person or business). 

The "disadvantage" perhaps from your perspective is that the UK company would have to be in full compliance with all EU regulations. The upside is that you will avoid the often significant noise your terms creates with European Union and European Economic Area customers, and consumers in particular. Being in compliance would easier persuade these you are a company that can be trusted with their business.  

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Posted (edited)

I have two alt accounts both have less than $2.00 USD balances. They held premium accounts at one time but are now downgraded to basic. With balances so small it does not make sense to buy Lindens and then transfer to my main account. My question is -- Will there be a way to transfer those balances to my main's USD balance? If not, is there a way to just relinquish the proceeds as I will NOT be trying to recover those funds through purchasing lindens?

Edited by Blush Bravin
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Posted (edited)

1. This verification process, what exactly is done with the information? Is it provided to the US government for compliance? Even if you are an outside resident? 

2. Can I request to look at this data to verify its contents and accuracy? 

3. Is my sl profile associated with the verification information or just my payment information?

4. What if I just wanted to verify my identity with the payment information but wanted my sl profile private? 

5. Why is this even needed if many of us already have a verified PayPal account? I do many online transactions using PayPal without having to send paperwork to verify my identity because PayPal has already verified me. For many that's the point, so they don't have to have to give the information again and avoid this mess of emailing and scanning documents over the internet to a bunch of random corporations. 

6. If I no longer use sl, or decide to revoke your usage of my data, can I do this?  

Edited by Uneven
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Hello everyone,

We are still looking into answers for many of your questions. While we had hoped to add another batch today, it looks like we will have to wait until tomorrow to give you more answers. 

Talk to you then - and we will update the main post here as well as let you know through comments. 

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