Selene Gregoire Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) Aw shoot. New page. Edited July 19, 2019 by Selene Gregoire 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 1 minute ago, Shhoan said: Hi, I have a little doubt, and I think a large majority also has it, the famous day August 1, 2019, will all users lose the accumulated lindens we have in our accounts? No. The introduction of Tilia has absolutely NO bearing on your L$. Tilia is only responsible for the management of USD amounts, either in your Second Life account, or transferred outside of Second Life to an external entity such as PayPal. None of this impacts upon your L$ account, or your ability to buy and spend L$ in-world or through the MP. However, if you DO have a USD balance (NOT L$ balance) in your SL account, you will be required to agree to the Tilia terms of service in order to log in to your account. If you do not have a USD balance on 1 August, or subsequently, this affects you in no way whatsoever. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoiraKathleen Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, yiniii said: good afternoon, I have several questions unresolved, review the terms of Tilia conditions and these questions are the ones I have 1-Tilia affects people with payment information, or all second life users? 2-we have to provide all our personal data to Tilia or only those who are from EE. UU ? 3-the fee for an inactive account will be paid in lindens 4-If I have some amount of linden in my account, are the terms of Tilia automatically activated? 5-Tilia is going to remove linden from my account? 6- Tilia can withdraw money from credit cards, debit cards, or paypal? 7- the inactive account rates of how much is the minimum and the maximum fine? 8-On August 1, 2019 will I lose the linden I have in my accumulated account? 9- the deadline to recover an inactive account is 6 months if they do not eliminate it? 10-Will there remain debts and complaints for not paying an inactive account? I have some users with the same doubts that I am urgent to know the answer many of these users are already leaving to enter second life and thinking about quitting playing second life My understanding is that the Tilia TOS and ID requirements affects people who sell their lindens, resulting in a US dollar balance, and then transfer those US dollars out of Second Life to either a PayPal or Skrill account. It is when the US dollars are to be transferred out that the ID requirements would come into play. If you do not have a US dollar balance, you do not need to worry about the inactivity fee. If you do have a US dollar balance, in order to remain active (no inactivity fee) all you need to do is to log into your web dashboard and view your Account page at least once every 12 months. If all you do is to use Paypal, Skrill or a credit card to either purchase linden dollars or to pay tier, the new Tilia terms and inactivity fees should not affect you at all. You will not lose any linden dollars. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThorinII Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 @yiniii, @Shhoan: The answer is NO to all your questions. But best listen to the explanations given by @Grumpity Linden and @Patch Linden during the Town Hall meeting: On 7/17/2019 at 7:26 PM, Whirly Fizzle said: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 9 minutes ago, yiniii said: good afternoon, I have several questions unresolved, review the terms of Tilia conditions and these questions are the ones I have 1-Tilia affects people with payment information, or all second life users? Tilia affects ONLY residents who 1) have USD balances in their Second Life accounts, on or after 1 August, OR who 2) transfer funds in USD outside of Second Life. For residents to whom neither applies, this has no impact upon you at all. 2-we have to provide all our personal data to Tilia or only those who are from EE. UU ? You will need to provide identification to Tilia ONLY if you transfer USDs out of Second Life into an external entity such as PayPal. US citizens will be asked to provide their Social Security Numbers; non-US citizens will be asked to provide a government-issued ID, such as a passport. For the specifics relating to particular countries or blocs, contact Customer Service. 3-the fee for an inactive account will be paid in lindens No. The fee for an inactive TILIA account will be paid in USD, for an amount not yet determined, but not exceeding US$ 3.00 per month, and never more than the amount of USD in your account. In other words, you will not be billed for more than you already have. It does not affect L$ at all. 4-If I have some amount of linden in my account, are the terms of Tilia automatically activated? No. Tilia has nothing to do with L$. See the answer to 1), above. 5-Tilia is going to remove linden from my account? No. Tilia has nothing to do with L$. Your L$ balance will remain intact. 6- Tilia can withdraw money from credit cards, debit cards, or paypal? No. Tilia will never withdraw money from your credit cards, debit cards, or PayPal. It is ONLY for transferring money OUT of Second Life. 7- the inactive account rates of how much is the minimum and the maximum fine? See 3) above. The specific amount has not yet been announced, but it will be no more than US$ 3.00 per month, and never more than the amount of USD you actually have in your account. 8-On August 1, 2019 will I lose the linden I have in my accumulated account? No. See 1) and 4) above. Tilia has nothing to do with your L$. Your L$ balance will remain intact. 9- the deadline to recover an inactive account is 6 months if they do not eliminate it? It's not clear what you mean by this. An inactive Tilia account can be reactivated at any time merely by checking your USD balance within it. 10-Will there remain debts and complaints for not paying an inactive account? Again, see 7) and 3) above. You will NEVER be fined more than the total amount of US$ you have. You will not accumulate debt or "complaints" by remaining inactive. I have some users with the same doubts that I am urgent to know the answer many of these users are already leaving to enter second life and thinking about quitting playing second life That is of course up to you, but these changes DO NOT AFFECT MOST PEOPLE IN SL AT ALL. They impact a little upon those with USD balances in their accounts, and somewhat more upon those who transfer funds OUT of Second Life. For the vast majority of people in Second Life, nothing will change at all. For Linden Lab's own FAQ, read the opening post of this thread: https://community.secondlife.com/forums/topic/439435-official-tilia-qa-forum-thread-related-questions-only/ You can access a summary of the Linden Lab's "Town Hall" on this subject here: https://modemworld.me/2019/07/13/tilia-inc-and-second-life-town-hall-summary/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 OMG, we're all so helpful. @Linden Lab, can you please make the "Official" Tilia thread a sticky at the top of this forum, so that people can find it, and we don't have to scroll through pages to get the link? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rociomorena19 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Hi, I have several questions about what I could do with Tilia? Here I leave the questions. 1. Do people who buy lindens to the second life affect you in some of the tilia standards? 2. Do people who have a payment method, such as a credit card or PayPal, have a tilia policy? 3. When I am Spanish, does tilia policy affect me? 4. If I am not a premium, does the tilia policy affect me if I do not participate for 12 months? 5. What would happen if I did not enter for 12 months the rules of tilia that would put a fine and what would be in euros? 6. Will the accumulated lindens be removed on accepting the terms on August 1, 2019? 7. If I work in second life and I do not export the money to RL, does the tilia policy affect me? 8. August 1, 2019, at what time will the rules on tilia come into effect? 9. There is a part that says that if we denounce you, we have to pay for our lawyer and Tilia's, is that true? 10. Because I am Spanish, do I have to comply with that regulation of the United States? 11. If I do not accept the terms, would they permanently eliminate or ban my account? I have read the terms and I have many doubts that my family and friends want to leave Second Life and withdraw the money they invested these years. It is urgent to respond. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 We're all doomed. Someone has been spreading misinformation in the SL Spanish community. Why are WE still having to answer these questions? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoiraKathleen Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 @rociomorena19 Your questions are very similar to questions just asked by another resident. If you scroll up just 2 posts above your questions, you will see the answers to those similar questions, and that might be good to read to see if those answer your questions as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 12 minutes ago, rociomorena19 said: Hi, I have several questions about what I could do with Tilia? Here I leave the questions. 1. Do people who buy lindens to the second life affect you in some of the tilia standards? NO. 2. Do people who have a payment method, such as a credit card or PayPal, have a tilia policy? NO. Not unless they are transferring money OUT of Second Life. 3. When I am Spanish, does tilia policy affect me? YES. Tilia will impact ANYONE who has a USD balance, or transfers money OUT of Second Life. 4. If I am not a premium, does the tilia policy affect me if I do not participate for 12 months? Tilia applies to ALL Second Life residents who have a USD balance, or transfer money out of Second Life. The inactivity fee applies only to those who have USD balances that they do not access or at least check on for longer than 12 months. Premium members do not need to to do this: their accounts are always considered "active." Again, this is ONLY about USD balances: it has nothing to do with your L$ balances or other aspects of your account. 5. What would happen if I did not enter for 12 months the rules of tilia that would put a fine and what would be in euros? See my answer above. This ONLY applies to your USD balance (if you have one). The fine will be no more than $3 USD a month, and will never exceed your USD balance. 6. Will the accumulated lindens be removed on accepting the terms on August 1, 2019? I am not sure what you mean. Tilia will not impact upon your L$ at all. 7. If I work in second life and I do not export the money to RL, does the tilia policy affect me? You will need to accept the Tilia Terms of Service IF you have a USD balance. 8. August 1, 2019, at what time will the rules on tilia come into effect? I have no idea. Presumably at 12:00am SLT. 9. There is a part that says that if we denounce you, we have to pay for our lawyer and Tilia's, is that true? I'm not sure what you mean by this. There is a mechanism for disputes: check the Tilia Terms of Service. 10. Because I am Spanish, do I have to comply with that regulation of the United States? YES. Because Linden Lab is an American company. 11. If I do not accept the terms, would they permanently eliminate or ban my account? NO. But if have a USD balance as of August 1, or thereafter, you will not be able to log in without agreeing to the TOS. I have read the terms and I have many doubts that my family and friends want to leave Second Life and withdraw the money they invested these years. It is urgent to respond. To repeat what I said above, to the previous poster: these changes DO NOT AFFECT MOST PEOPLE IN SL AT ALL. They impact a little upon those with USD balances in their accounts, and somewhat more upon those who transfer funds OUT of Second Life. For the vast majority of people in Second Life, nothing will change at all. For Linden Lab's own FAQ, read the opening post of this thread: https://community.secondlife.com/forums/topic/439435-official-tilia-qa-forum-thread-related-questions-only/ You can access a summary of the Linden Lab's "Town Hall" on this subject here: https://modemworld.me/2019/07/13/tilia-inc-and-second-life-town-hall-summary/ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rociomorena19 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 thanks @ScyllaRhiadra but I am free to ask questions, and to solve the doubts not for you to hesitate and say that because you have to keep answering those questions nobody obliges you are free to answer but thank you very much for answering 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Gregoire Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 46 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said: We're all doomed. Someone has been spreading misinformation in the SL Spanish community. Why are WE still having to answer these questions? Well... we don't have to answer them. We don't even have to point them to the correct post in that closed thread that some brilliant person so intelligently closed. We could be meanpoopie heads and let LL deal with the backlash/aftermath of their own making. They are, after all, the ones that started this whole mess. Again. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Gregoire Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 1 hour ago, ThorinII said: @yiniii, @Shhoan: The answer is NO to all your questions. But best listen to the explanations given by @Grumpity Linden and @Patch Linden during the Town Hall meeting: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said: Well... we don't have to answer them. We don't even have to point them to the correct post in that closed thread that some brilliant person so intelligently closed. We could be meanpoopie heads and let LL deal with the backlash/aftermath of their own making. They are, after all, the ones that started this whole mess. Again. I am completely and utterly mystified by the absence of any movement from LL on this. The blog post announcing Tilia hasn't been updated since before the Town Hall, and (get this!) STILL SAYS THAT ALL SL RESIDENTS WILL NEED TO AGREE TO THE TILIA TOS!!!! The FAQ to which the blog post links has not been changed at all since it was first posted. The "Official" Tilia Forum thread has been locked, with the result that we can't bump it up, and is currently slowing sinking to the bottom of the second page of this forum. AND it's a disorganized mess. NO official transcript of the Town Hall has yet appeared, that I have seen. The only comprehensive and well-organized account of what this is all about is Inara's (my god, she deserves a lifetime service award) And, clearly, no one has thought to reach out at all to SL's international community. Seriously, WTF? Even I could write up a comprehensive, simple, and brief communication in a couple of hours or less (and all for the low low price of a Linden Home houseboat!), but they haven't been able to take the time to even update their own official blog announcement???? I despair. Edited July 19, 2019 by Scylla Rhiadra 3 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwin Alcott Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 1 minute ago, Scylla Rhiadra said: I am completely and utterly mystified by the absence of any movement from LL on this. seeing the things happening last weeks i think LL is very busy .. but with what?.. Am i worried?... yes. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Just now, Alwin Alcott said: seeing the things happening last weeks i think LL is very busy .. but with what?.. Am i worried?... yes. The LEA announcement, as "minor" as it seems, has me a little worried too, precisely because it is such a minor thing. I think the Sansar debacle is coming home to roost, perhaps. Fingers crossed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 1 hour ago, rociomorena19 said: thanks @ScyllaRhiadra but I am free to ask questions, and to solve the doubts not for you to hesitate and say that because you have to keep answering those questions nobody obliges you are free to answer but thank you very much for answering Hi Rocio, The frustration I was expressing was not directed at you, but at Linden Lab, who are very clearly not doing an adequate job of informing their residents -- particularly their non-native English speaking residents -- about what all this means. I wish you well, and hope that I was able to answer your questions. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Pancake Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 The Lab getting all SL's ducks in a line after 16 years of 'near enough' is indeed an ill wind. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onyx Kelberry Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Just a few weeks ago LL doubled the processing fee for cashing out from 2.5% to 5%. Are we going to have pay fee's to LL and to Tilia now ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionalein Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 I would not be surprised by now if we all had to agree to Tilia TOS despite what the townhall said... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qie Niangao Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 35 minutes ago, onyx Kelberry said: Just a few weeks ago LL doubled the processing fee for cashing out from 2.5% to 5%. Are we going to have pay fee's to LL and to Tilia now ? You have a last name. You've been here a while. You know better than this, asking a transparent FUD-promoting "question" just to be able to say you, too, piled on even now, at this late date. You made up an excuse to troll with a pretend scenario nobody could be idiot enough to take seriously. It's not cool. It's not amusing. The residents here are trying their best to answer what appear to be real questions from people who are still, despite everything, somehow confused. Nobody has patience for this. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onyx Kelberry Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Not at all its a concern. Otherwise I wouldn't have asked. I thought this thread was for people who had concerns and questions. If that rubs you the wrong way, all you had to do was ignore. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam Mode Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 4 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said: 10-Will there remain debts and complaints for not paying an inactive account? Again, see 7) and 3) above. You will NEVER be fined more than the total amount of US$ you have. You will not accumulate debt or "complaints" by remaining inactive. If you are in arrears paying your land tier (think full regions that maybe allowed to coast for a while due to illness, or credit card info snafus), Tilia isn't a get out of debt card. For inactivity fees max is balance but if you owe a past due debt -you owe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chic Aeon Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 2 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said: I despair. Someone on this forum -- a couple of months ago -- when I commented on "broken promises" made by Linden Lab (in that case it was Ebbe) commented that they doubted he would ever make a promise "like that". Well officials in The Lab have broken at least two promises in the last week. Whether we call them "promises" or not, it really doesn't matter; they clearly tell us things (sometimes repeatedly) that don't come to pass. I suspect we will muddle through the Tilia debacle (that is the HANDLING of the Tilia announcement and the subsequent TOS acceptance which BETTER be just for the USD holders in the crowd and not another broken promise) but I foresee another shoe dropping in the not too distant future. MORE difficult news isn't likely to come right away though so we will get a breather. It may be three months, it may be after the "super duper premium" is unveiled -- this giving us (possibly) something good to remember before said shoe hits the floor. My hunch is that it will concern cashing out to Paypal once again -- and not in a rah rah sis boom ba kind of way. I would be happy to be wrong :D. The LEA announcement was expected for some months now; once the AIRS sims disappeared. Whether my comments here "helped" finalize that decision, I know not. I seriously doubt that I have enough influence to tip the balance, but my continuous questions (some still unanswered) didn't help stabilize the situation. No regrets. I wouldn't change a word. And I think @Inara Pey's post on the closure and history of LEA was very fair and correct. And in THIS case, I know more than she does on the subject LOL. I don't see the closure connected to our current atmosphere at all. And it was a very good run and certainly a very important part of my personal SL journey. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qie Niangao Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 16 minutes ago, onyx Kelberry said: Not at all its a concern. Otherwise I wouldn't have asked. I thought this thread was for people who had concerns and questions. If that rubs you the wrong way, all you had to do was ignore. How can it possibly be a concern? What could you have read or heard to make you think of such a thing? Is somebody actually suggesting this to you in a way that makes you think they're serious? If so, please ask them to go back on their meds. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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