The New LH Release Plan - Your Thoughts

[LittleMe Jewell]

If the current new regions are getting roughly 20 new homes, maybe 35-40 of the Camper/Trailer plots per region, with a bit less on some regions that get some large public areas?  Looking at the current blank regions that have been left in the middle of traditional home areas - western section, north-eastern area, maybe a few regions in that mountain area in the center of the pickle island -- that could give 25 regions, give or take a few.  Allowing for a smaller average than the actual 35-40 per region, to account for large public areas, we could still see around 750 of the Trailers/Campers, maybe even a bit more if that western mountain range is extended downwards a bit.  If they do it right and use all of the open regions in the middle of the completed areas, it is even slightly possible to get closer to 1000 -- and yeah, that is probably the far outside stretch on the estimate.

[Daniel Voyager]

The moles are working around SSPE153 regions heading down south. There are tons of new homes being built and some higher up (mountain/hill area). 

Snapshots taken today at 12.42pm SLT/PDT. 

Edited July 7, 2019 by Daniel Voyager

[Beth Macbain]

Also, I believe the entire process will get faster and faster as they get used to doing it more. I don't want them cloning any regions, but I do believe a sort of assembly line thingie is going to naturally fall into place and production will increase. 

The last thing they want is for a lot of people to lose interest quickly because they can't get in. Maybe they should have waited until they had 10,000 ready to go instead of 3,000? Perhaps... perhaps not. It's given them the freedom to catch bugs that can only be found by incompetent residents (i.e. ME) breaking things in ways they never imagined them to be broken. Much easier to get those fixed and out of the way with 3,000 homes then 10,000... or 30,000!

And to do it on a schedule that is comfortable for them, not the demands of 30,000 angry residents demanding action immediately. 

[Daniel Voyager]

2 minutes ago, Beth Macbain said:

Also, I believe the entire process will get faster and faster as they get used to doing it more. I don't want them cloning any regions, but I do believe a sort of assembly line thingie is going to naturally fall into place and production will increase. 

The last thing they want is for a lot of people to lose interest quickly because they can't get in. Maybe they should have waited until they had 10,000 ready to go instead of 3,000? Perhaps... perhaps not. It's given them the freedom to catch bugs that can only be found by incompetent residents (i.e. ME) breaking things in ways they never imagined them to be broken. Much easier to get those fixed and out of the way with 3,000 homes then 10,000... or 30,000!

And to do it on a schedule that is comfortable for them, not the demands of 30,000 angry residents demanding action immediately. 

I agree, it's good the Moles are adding new areas/content along the way.

1, 000 - 3, 000 new homes at a time sounds alright. There needs to be announcements when big batch releases happen along with advance notice. 

There are thousands of new homes coming later this year.

[Nika Talaj]

On 7/6/2019 at 8:50 AM, BJoyful said:

How would ppl get on this list?  What about the people who are busy or away on holidays or sick when the list is made?...How many more emails and updates are needed to tell every person your home is being built, your grass is growing, we put the scripts in your house, we planted some trees by your hedge. Do you want a space in the hedge for a garage?  Would you like pink flowers or yellow flowers?  We're putting a path behind your house, do you still want it or do you want a house with no path?  Your house is going to be ready in approximately 30 to 45 days, unless the people ahead of you in line are away, then it could be as long as 7 months.

As the system is, you can try anytime and possibly get a home anytime.  ... There will be enough made.  They will not stop until there is enough. 🙂 

BJoyful, I don't know why you and some others are so protective of the current system, which encourages people who may not really have that much time to waste it babysitting the Linden land page.  Try reading Aethelwine's post again, more calmly.  Where did she (or anyone) suggest progress emails on parcels?  What a textbook case of reductio ad absurdum you give here.  Why so defensive?

Frankly, I don't really see any reason why a list and the land page couldn't co-exist.  For example, the land page itself could have a choice to put your name on a list.  Depending on the length of the list and the land page demand, new houses would get reserved for distribution via either the list or the on-demand page.  Pretty simple mechanism, really.

But the land process is what it is.  I seriously doubt the Lindens intend to spend any time changing it; from their viewpoint, they build houses and can see how many unique typists have them.  They seem content.  Neither Aethelwine nor I are agitating for a list, merely pointing out that we think it might be a good idea.  No need to stomp so hard on other folks' opinions.

 

Edited July 7, 2019 by Nika Talaj

[Chic Aeon]

13 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

If the current new regions are getting roughly 20 new homes, maybe 35-40 of the Camper/Trailer plots per region, with a bit less on some regions that get some large public areas?  Looking at the current blank regions that have been left in the middle of traditional home areas - western section, north-eastern area, maybe a few regions in that mountain area in the center of the pickle island -- that could give 25 regions, give or take a few.  Allowing for a smaller average than the actual 35-40 per region, to account for large public areas, we could still see around 750 of the Trailers/Campers, maybe even a bit more if that western mountain range is extended downwards a bit.  If they do it right and use all of the open regions in the middle of the completed areas, it is even slightly possible to get closer to 1000 -- and yeah, that is probably the far outside stretch on the estimate.

But they aren't getting roughly 20 homes (that was my original estimate based on the first release). Many of the regions so far --and upcoming -- have more community area and FEWER plots, that was my point. 

 

When they originally had the campers out on SSP in March there were 26 (I counted :D). We don't KNOW of course how many trailers will be on the regions -- likely it will vary also.  There certainly could be  many trailers in the mountain ranges, but so far we haven't seen any work being done inworld aside from a bit of plot layout in SSP83 and SSP84.

 

They could put trailers in the southern regions too of course.  But whatever they DO, the more there are the more time it will take --- that was my point that I guess I didn't make all that clearly :D.     There is PLENTY of space -- it is the rate of building that is a problem and that is also inherent with the process.

 

So saying "everyone will get their home soon" really isn't a realistic comment -- to me anyway.  

 

While I think the trailers will get gobbled up, I don't think they are going to be as popular as plots that are 1024. Some folks will just take one to have "something". Others of course actually WANT a smaller space -- so that works well for them. 

[Daniel Voyager]

1 minute ago, Chic Aeon said:

But they aren't getting roughly 20 homes (that was my original estimate based on the first release). Many of the regions so far --and upcoming -- have more community area and FEWER plots, that was my point. 

 

When they originally had the campers out on SSP in March there were 26 (I counted :D). We don't KNOW of course how many trailers will be on the regions -- likely it will vary also.  There certainly could be  many trailers in the mountain ranges, but so far we haven't seen any work being done inworld aside from a bit of plot layout in SSP83 and SSP84.

 

They could put trailers in the southern regions too of course.  But whatever they DO, the more there are the more time it will take --- that was my point that I guess I didn't make all that clearly :D.     There is PLENTY of space -- it is the rate of building that is a problem and that is also inherent with the process.

 

So saying "everyone will get their home soon" really isn't a realistic comment -- to me anyway.  

 

While I think the trailers will get gobbled up, I don't think they are going to be as popular as plots that are 1024. Some folks will just take one to have "something". Others of course actually WANT a smaller space -- so that works well for them. 

It should say "everyone will get their home before the end of 2019".

Next month marks one year since the first SSP regions came online. It's incredible how big the continent is now compared with late last year. 

The land selection page needs to have a status check section for availability. The demand is big and simply refreshing the page all day wastes so much time. 

[Chic Aeon]

15 minutes ago, Daniel Voyager said:

It should say "everyone will get their home before the end of 2019".

Next month marks one year since the first SSP regions came online. It's incredible how big the continent is now compared with late last year. 

The land selection page needs to have a status check section for availability. The demand is big and simply refreshing the page all day wastes so much time. 

So you think there are only 5,000 or 6,000 or even 10,000 folks that want a new home? What about the people in the 512 homes that are apparently (official statement) going to disappear not long after the beginning of the year? (Personally I don't think that is a valid statement any longer but I haven't seen anything official to contradict it.). 

 

Even if the Moles are working faster, there are less than 4,000 plots now in a year. Abnor stated that it takes the Moles weeks to months to make the new styles so that has to be figured into the timeline also.  So at the "current rate" judging by the last year we would have about 6,000 homes by the end of the year.  If they get a lot faster, then more -- but still not the number needed (currently -- as I have stated I believe the demand will shift with the coming of Super Duper Premium).   

 

We will see how things are at the end of the year.  That will be the test :D. 

 

Edited July 7, 2019 by Chic Aeon
pasted in a screenshot that I didn't want -- bad, bad editor!

[LittleMe Jewell]

I can't see any way they'll have replaced all of the existing homes by year end unless they finished out the entire SSP area that we can see and then duplicated it multiple times, which we know they don't want to do.  

[Sparkle Bunny]

they will NEVER replace all the existing homes. there were too many of them in the first place. some current residents of the old homes won't be renewing their premium membership due to the price increase, some will go super-premium instead, some will just go back to mainland or rentals. some who currently have a new home will drift off for the same reasons. there might be a home for everyone who wants one by this time next year, but i doubt they'll ever be in a position to pick the theme without playing the auto-refresh game.

[Laurelrose Anthony]

I must have missed something.  What is "super duper premium"? 
 

[LittleMe Jewell]

58 minutes ago, Laurelrose Anthony said:

I must have missed something.  What is "super duper premium"? 
 

 

This statement:  

from this blog post:

 

Grumpity also commented in one of the threads about it.  I'll see if I can find that - or maybe someone else has it saved.

 

[BJoyful]

3 hours ago, usagihara said:

they will NEVER replace all the existing homes. there were too many of them in the first place. some current residents of the old homes won't be renewing their premium membership due to the price increase, some will go super-premium instead, some will just go back to mainland or rentals. some who currently have a new home will drift off for the same reasons. there might be a home for everyone who wants one by this time next year, but i doubt they'll ever be in a position to pick the theme without playing the auto-refresh game.

I don’t think you are including the new Premium accounts who have been added to the total which may or may not be currently housed in new or old Premium Homed and are simply living somewhere else in SL until there is enough homes , so the total of existing old LL homes of 38,000 may not even included in the total which LL are expecting to need homes for and therefore may not be enough.  LL may not be able to make enough in 2 or 3 years 🙂

[BJoyful]

6 hours ago, Nika Talaj said:

BJoyful, I don't know why you and some others are so protective of the current system, which encourages people who may not really have that much time to waste it babysitting the Linden land page.  Try reading Aethelwine's post again, more calmly.  Where did she (or anyone) suggest progress emails on parcels?  What a textbook case of reductio ad absurdum you give here.  Why so defensive?

Frankly, I don't really see any reason why a list and the land page couldn't co-exist.  For example, the land page itself could have a choice to put your name on a list.  Depending on the length of the list and the land page demand, new houses would get reserved for distribution via either the list or the on-demand page.  Pretty simple mechanism, really.

But the land process is what it is.  I seriously doubt the Lindens intend to spend any time changing it; from their viewpoint, they build houses and can see how many unique typists have them.  They seem content.  Neither Aethelwine nor I are agitating for a list, merely pointing out that we think it might be a good idea.  No need to stomp so hard on other folks' opinions.

 

How will people get on list and what about the ones who are away or sick when this list gets made?  What about brand new members who sign up or leave the list daily.  How will they be integrated into this list fairly? How will people be informed where they are in this list.  Will the people on this list need to claim the home that is getting made for them?  How long will they be allowed to have to decide?

 I don’t think I stomped and I certainly didn’t feel angry when I said it.  I simply imagined a possible way a list would work and I came to the conclusion that sitting on a list is meaningless when it moves at the same unpredictable rate but with an infinite number of extra delays and during that delay what will people be doing... suggesting waiting list for shore line only, no hedge, all hedge, trees, waiting list for campers only.. all needing information about what number they are is, every time that list changes, and so on and on and reply to why they are moving up the list so slowly   And how long will it take me to get to the top of the list... how is that less stressful than what is in place now which is anyone who clicks might get a home anytime... click when you wish as long as you wish.

IMO anyone can try at any time and get a home at any time, rather than waiting for goodness knows how long before than can try.

[Mollymews]

8 hours ago, Daniel Voyager said:

 

O.M.G !!

Bulldozer Mole has leveled the top of a mountain range to build houses on.  I hope that at the very least they obtained a Resource Consent for what can only be described by the self-appointed duly elected President of the Mountain Preservation Society, who is appalled !!,  as vandalism and total disregard for the natural environment, and would question vigorously the validity of the information provided to the Resource Consent Commissioner who may have authorised such appalling wantoness !!!

ps. that the President of the Mountain Preservation Society, who is and remains appalled !!!, also has a shop that sells mountain hiking and tramping equipment has nothing to with their appalledness ok

😸

[karynmaria]

58 minutes ago, BJoyful said:

How will people get on list and what about the ones who are away or sick when this list gets made?  What about brand new members who sign up or leave the list daily.  How will they be integrated into this list fairly? How will people be informed where they are in this list.  Will the people on this list need to claim the home that is getting made for them?  How long will they be allowed to have to decide?

 I don’t think I stomped and I certainly didn’t feel angry when I said it.  I simply imagined a possible way a list would work and I came to the conclusion that sitting on a list is meaningless when it moves at the same unpredictable rate but with an infinite number of extra delays and during that delay what will people be doing... suggesting waiting list for shore line only, no hedge, all hedge, trees, waiting list for campers only.. all needing information about what number they are is, every time that list changes, and so on and on and reply to why they are moving up the list so slowly   And how long will it take me to get to the top of the list... how is that less stressful than what is in place now which is anyone who clicks might get a home anytime... click when you wish as long as you wish.

IMO anyone can try at any time and get a home at any time, rather than waiting for goodness knows how long before than can try.

I could be wrong but I don't think they are looking for that detailed of a list.  From what I get from these people who would like a list is if the home isn't available you have an option of going on the list.  Then when let's say 20 houses are available the first 20 get told that they have let's say 24 hours to go get their home.  It seems quite simple, but it just opens up another big can of worms and just different complaints.  "I was sick, I didn't get the email, I was on vacation...........".

No matter how you look at it either way it is going to be stressful and someone is going to think it is unfair.  But really it is only stressful if you let it be...... JMO.

 

[Aethelwine]

On 7/6/2019 at 4:50 PM, BJoyful said:

I may be missing something really elementary here, but how is being on a list any different or more fair than what is presently in use?  

I am struggling to understand the sense of your question. The answer seems pretty clear in the post you quoted.

"Quite simply a list would be far better, it would avoid all the time and trouble and stress being caused for people using autorefreshing, spending hours of their time looking and with no guarantees. I fear in three four months there will still be people complaining they have spent days of their life refreshing the page and getting no where, whilst others seem lucky enough to swap and change houses for location."

Fairer, but nore importantly avoiding hours and hours of work refreshing the page without any guarantee of any success, reducing frustration and negative feeling.

On 7/6/2019 at 4:50 PM, BJoyful said:

 How would ppl get on this list?  What about the people who are busy or away on holidays or sick when the list is made?  What about the people who have 5 Premium Alts all trying to get a home all put on that list so they will get 6 chances for their Dream location?  Does each of them get a Home before the next person on the list?  Do we wait for that person with 5 Alts to find the Home they like best and Abandon 3 or 4 of them to the next person on the list?  Do the abandoned ones then become the first available and everyone else waits for the leftovers?  What if they put a 'you have 24 hours to respond to this available Home' and 35 ppl in a row are away when those Homes get ready?  Does someone then send an email to every person still waiting saying you are number 74 in line, and 35 days later you are still number 74 in line?  Will that give you any idea when you will get a home?  How many more emails and updates are needed to tell every person your home is being built, your grass is growing, we put the scripts in your house, we planted some trees by your hedge. Do you want a space in the hedge for a garage?  Would you like pink flowers or yellow flowers?  We're putting a path behind your house, do you still want it or do you want a house with no path?  Your house is going to be ready in approximately 30 to 45 days, unless the people ahead of you in line are away, then it could be as long as 7 months.

much of this I have already outlined.

How would people get on the list? - sign up through a webpage.

What about the people who are busy or away on holidays or sick when the list is made? - as suggested before the list would initially be advertised, open to enrollment for a few days maybe even a week and then randomised. After initial set up new signups to the list would simply tack on to the end.

Your Alts questions could be handled a number of ways... perhaps only allow one sign up to the list per email address, or perhaps the view could be taken that each alt has equal entitlement. Arguments could be made a number of different ways. I am open to suggestions.

With regard to issues around the time to accept a home, most people even on holiday or whilst traveling would have daily  access the website should they need to via their phone such that they can accept their home when it comes up. I don't see that being a big issue. So long as the process is clearly explained they will know what they have to do to claim there home. much easier and preferable to the current system that involves hours of work, auto refreshers and no guarantees.

I really don't understand what you are excited about with hedges and grass growing, and emails - you have completely lost me on that point. So I can't reply to that. if they are releasing 60 homes a week and you are 74th on the list you would know you are likely to get a home this week or early next week if there are none abandoned. You wouldn't get a precise time and date you would get a home, but a good indication.

On 7/6/2019 at 4:50 PM, BJoyful said:

As the system is, you can try anytime and possibly get a home anytime.  How badly a person wants a house will determine how much time and effort they spend trying to get one and a list will only throw an infinite number of extra variables into the time spent waiting.  Should the person who is trying obsessively and tearing their hair out stressing over an abandoned home be given priority over the person who is patient enough to simply try once or twice a day using auto-refresh at random times of the day as is convenient?  Is it fair to make that stressed out hairless person wait another day or wait their turn in on a list that moves at an equally unpredictable rate as knowing exactly what everyone knows now.  The homes are being made.  There will be enough made.  They will not stop until there is enough. 🙂

The whole point of a list is to take the stress and distress out of the allocation process, to remove the variables and luck and randomness from the current prcoess which may well have people three more months down the line without a home that have been looking daily for a home, but been unlucky looking at the wrong time, unavailable at the times of the big releases. the current system isn't especially fair, but more importantly it is just a bad system that could hardly have been designed better to be more frustrating and more likely to create a sour feeling towards the houses. In real life councils don't allocate housing by first come first through the door each morning. They do it with lists, they just work better in all senses where demand is greater than supply.

 

[Fionalein]

I would not be too surprised to find the Lab one day starting to throttle those autoupdaters... website calls and bandwidth come with a cost after all. If enough folks start using short span autoupdaters this becomes equivalent to a DDoS attack (well without the malignent intent).

Edited July 8, 2019 by Fionalein

[Aethelwine]

15 hours ago, Nika Talaj said:

Frankly, I don't really see any reason why a list and the land page couldn't co-exist.  For example, the land page itself could have a choice to put your name on a list.  Depending on the length of the list and the land page demand, new houses would get reserved for distribution via either the list or the on-demand page.  Pretty simple mechanism, really.

But the land process is what it is.  I seriously doubt the Lindens intend to spend any time changing it; from their viewpoint, they build houses and can see how many unique typists have them.  They seem content.  Neither Aethelwine nor I are agitating for a list, merely pointing out that we think it might be a good idea.  No need to stomp so hard on other folks' opinions.

Maybe they could use a list just for the big releases.

As you say all I am doing is floating an idea out there that seems to make sense to me, I have my houseboat from the first release. I just feel the pain of those expressing their discontent inworld and on the forums and offering supporting the idea raised before me that it could be done fairer, doing it the way homes are allocated in real life where demand is greater than supply.

[Love Zhaoying]

I’d support a “priority list”, which LL could charge more for. 

[Fionalein]

17 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I’d support a “priority list”, which LL could charge more for. 

Don't give them ideas - well it kinda happened already - you could bid for granted access to Linden Homes in charity auctions  

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Fionalein

[BJoyful]

A list of any sort will delay people getting homes when the homes are ready and simply prolong the process.  The problem is that ppl are stressing themselves out and seeing their name and number on a slow moving list which only moves slower and slower as the 24 hours delay is compounded won’t help.  If ppl are hammering an f5 key 24 hours a day perhaps they are the ones who need to go on a vacation from that and wait for 3 or 4 months until more people have had a random chance to get a home and relieve the pressure on themselves.  

Being on a list means nothing at all when ppl have no idea how long they will be on that list.  LL knows how many Premium members they have.  Call what LL has a “list”.  LL is making homes for those people.  There will be enough homes.  Ppl will all get a home somewhere in that process.  LL already has that “list”.  There will be less people every Monday Wednesday and Friday waiting.  Forcing everyone to wait an extra 24 hours while any person on that this finds out their number will only delay the process.  Ppl are not being forced to do anything.  They are choosing to to do what they are doing and choosing to complain about it.

Making a ‘list’ and telling everyone they are number 35,047 in line, (so they can just relax for a year) would be much more helpful than having ppl stressing that their number hasn’t moved.  😫 

People will get stressed if they are not getting what they want when they want it.  Each person can choose to take a chance and try or not.  There WILL be enough.  Everyone WILL get a home.  Everyone can do whatever they wish until they do and LL or being number 35,000 on that list won’t change that. 🙂 

Edited July 8, 2019 by BJoyful
Grammar

[Patch Linden]

I really don't see this list thing happening...

How would person #9,998,383,750,000 feel?

[tinatickles Cummings]

20 minutes ago, BJoyful said:

A list of any sort will delay people getting homes when the homes are ready and simply prolong the process.  The problem is that ppl are stressing themselves out and seeing their name and number on a slow moving list which only moves slower and slower as the 24 hours delay is compounded won’t help.  If ppl are hammering an f5 key 24 hours a day perhaps they are the ones who need to go on a vacation from that and wait for 3 or 4 months until more people have had a random chance to get a home and relieve the pressure on themselves.  

Being on a list means nothing at all when ppl have no idea how long they will be on that list.  LL knows how many Premium members they have.  Call what LL has a “list”.  LL is making homes for those people.  There will be enough homes.  Ppl will all get a home somewhere in that process.  LL already has that “list”.  There will be less people every Monday Wednesday and Friday waiting.  Forcing everyone to wait an extra 24 hours while any person on that this finds out their number will only delay the process.  Ppl are not being forced to do anything.  They are choosing to to do what they are doing and choosing to complain about it.

Making a ‘list’ and telling everyone they are number 35,047 in line, (so they can just relax for a year) would be much more helpful than having ppl stressing that their number hasn’t moved.  😫 

People will get stressed if they are not getting what they want when they want it.  Each person can choose to take a chance and try or not.  There WILL be enough.  Everyone WILL get a home.  Everyone can do whatever they wish until they do and LL or being number 35,000 on that list won’t change that. 🙂 

Those of you lobbying against a list do not understand the concept of planning.  If they had a list, and I find I am #6,752, I would set up shop in an older style home and not worry about it.  When my number got to #100 or so, I would abandon old home, and be ready to move, when I got the notice I had a place.  As it is now, I can't use an old home, and also have a chance at a new home, because you can't play the 'refresh the screen game' while still having your old home.  Waiting lists have been used by colleges, RL apartment and condos, etc. etc. quite effectively for decades.  They actually work and serve a purpose.  When going to a popular restaurant, do you make reservations, or just drive there each evening, hoping there's been a cancellation, and you'll be seated?  If you call and they say, "our first opening is a week from Tuesday" you say, great, I'll take it.  Now you know to go somewhere else between now and then.  And I understand they won't be able to give a date because their production process is more art than science.  But seeing where I am on a list would allow me to gauge reasonably when I might expect a home, and allow me to enjoy my full premium benefit while I wait.  Yes, I could just take an old home, and not worry about it for 3 months, but there is no reasonable expectation it will be a better situation in 3 months.  Many have done the math on these blogs, and it could be years before the supply is equal to the demand.  So I'm stuck hitting f5 as many times as I can squeeze in during my real life, and my second life, if I ever hope to have a new home.  It's a silly way of doing things.  A list would be much more professional.

[Love Zhaoying]

24 minutes ago, Patch Linden said:

I really don't see this list thing happening...

How would person #9,998,383,750,000 feel?

Could switch, what could go wrong?

*Edit* Aww, shrunken head Beetlejuice GIF won’t save.

Edited July 8, 2019 by Love Zhaoying