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When did you last see a Bellessarian home available?


Nika Talaj
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Since this is a public forum, and we are able to say pretty much whatever we want:

If you can be anything, be kind.

And what my dear late mother used to say to me:

If you don't have something nice to say about something (or someone), don't say anything at all. I've been biting my tongue a lot. 

 

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1 minute ago, Sylvia Tamalyn said:

The issue is not "GOH players". The issue is just one (or maybe a few) who take it to such extremes that they shut almost everyone else out of every single new release. Grabbing it all for the sake of grabbing it all, if you will.

I have to admit that I was extremely disappointed with my chalet location and figured that it probably wouldn't be possible to get a "nice" one because there were so relatively few spots that are desirable to me, and a slew of people who are much better and getting the "nice" spots than I am.  So I gave up on chalets.

It never occurred to me that it might be just 1 or 2 individuals grabbing a vast majority of the most desirable spaces.

If that is really happening, then I can see why people would feel frustrated/upset.

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4 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Actually they do if they are AR'd and the items are definitely extending beyond the home parcel borders.  Abnor has specifically said to AR such things and they are definitely not allowed.

Now, they typically will allow someone to extend something like a driveway from their parcel over a small amount of public land to meet up with a road.  But that is someone covering a tiny bit of public grass versus someone putting a dock way outside their property onto the public area.

I have AR'd the extended docks, since I'm a kayaker. They have not been removed. Maybe they get put back in again.

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7 minutes ago, Marisa Starbrook said:

and LL never removes them.

LL are reactive. If no one reports a thing nothing will happen to it.

Although they aren't always consistent in terms of outcome (especially for places that are not Bellessaria.)

Just now, Teresa Firelight said:

I have to admit that I was extremely disappointed with my chalet location and figured that it probably wouldn't be possible to get a "nice" one

The Chalet build is more uniform than previous areas. Most houses are perfectly serviceable, a few are exceptional which may or may not be a positive.

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45 minutes ago, Trinity1776 said:

Chloe, I will grant you that no one deserves our unkindness or assumption of their motivations, and I'm sorry if I came across that way.

So, I'll focus more on the actions and not what's behind them.

The people that are doing this are impacting everyone else who participates. The Linden Homes system was not set up for certain individuals to become a "middleman" or land baron dispensing choice properties as they see fit. I see no issue with giving people a certain amount of leeway...but if/when new regions are dominated by certain individuals, I *personally* think that's an abuse of the system.

I totally get it - just wanted to put a little of why some are drawn into linden homes :) 

 

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8 minutes ago, Marisa Starbrook said:

I have AR'd the extended docks, since I'm a kayaker. They have not been removed. Maybe they get put back in again.

For things like that, I usually submit an AR every day or two.  Sometimes LL misses one or it drops to the bottom of the pile.  If LL really is removing an item and the person is continually putting it back, LL will remove their ability to even have a Linden Home.

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1 hour ago, Milk Pixelmaid said:

Linden Lab doesn't make it easy for people to try a variety of random locations, in fact, they limit it to just 5 per 24 hours. So, the reason people have alts is to increase their tries, plain and simple. This is on Linden Lab, if you hate the game... don't hate the players. If everyone had an abundance of rolls, I doubt there would be so many alts.

I took at look at your in-world profile and noticed that your account is not premium so I presume your Linden Home is on another account/s?  It just seems interesting to me that you have a lot to say about premium and how it works yet aren't paying for it on Milk's account as she's been No Payment Info On File since 2009! 

 

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1 hour ago, Milk Pixelmaid said:

Why does anchoring prims bother you? As long as the anchoring is done in a way where no prims are on public land, what is the problem? What covenant does that break?

I had the same reaction at first so I thought about it to see if I could figure out the issue.

What I see... is that this is leaving one of the homes as empty in order to clutter up the other.

First, no one actually needs more prims - if you do you're not being efficient. But that's a skill issue not something for an AR.

The really problem would be that it causes what appear to be vacant lots. Ghost towning.

 

This is actually happening in RL in the cities of San Francisco, London, and Manhattan. The ultra rich will go in and buy up a whole block just so they don't have any 'peasants' around them... and that is why a few blocks away in many of these cities, there are now camps of people living in tents... The issue of course has LOT more layers than that.. but blocks of land with empty houses is not a community.

 

In downtrodden cities, like Detroit, the same effect has resulted by people leaving. But that's a different looking result as then the block has no one on it.

This issue is what we are now seeing in the old linden homes - and that will solve out when those zones get closed. It's also present in a lot of mainland, and that will always be an issue due to a lack of zoning rules having led to flight...

...

Creating intentional vacant lots, what the wealthy are doing in RL, that's not a good look for the one part of SL that is vibrant. That people have now managed to emulate this effect in SL is not something to be encouraged...

Edited by Pussycat Catnap
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3 minutes ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

I had the same reaction at first so I thought about it to see if I could figure out the issue.

What I see... is that this is leaving one of the homes as empty in order to clutter up the other.

First, no one actually needs more prims - if you do you're not being efficient. But that's a skill issue not something for an AR.

The really problem would be that it causes what appear to be vacant lots. Ghost towning.

 

This is actually happening in RL in the cities of San Francisco, London, and Manhattan. The ultra rich will go in and buy up a whole block just so they don't have any 'peasants' around them... and that is why a few blocks away in many of these cities, there are now camps of people living in tents... The issue of course has LOT more layers than that.. but blocks of land with empty houses is not a community.

 

In downtrodden cities, like Detroit, the same effect has resulted by people leaving. But that's a different looking result as then the block has no one on it.

This issue is what we are now seeing in the old linden homes - and that will solve out when those zones get closed. It's also present in a lot of mainland, and that will always be an issue due to a lack of zoning rules having led to flight...

...

Creating intentional vacant lots, what the wealthy are doing in RL, that's not a good look for the one part of SL that is vibrant. That people have now managed to emulate this effect in SL is not something to be encouraged...

Interesting pov, however LL has never said you have to decorate a home. I see many empty homes.

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1 hour ago, Milk Pixelmaid said:

Linden Lab doesn't make it easy for people to try a variety of random locations, in fact, they limit it to just 5 per 24 hours. So, the reason people have alts is to increase their tries, plain and simple. This is on Linden Lab, if you hate the game... don't hate the players. If everyone had an abundance of rolls, I doubt there would be so many alts.

Actually, the number of rolls available to an account really has nothing to do with a single player using 15 or more alts to hold that many properties at one time.  

That is what frustrates folks here.  The person or persons are truly grabbing and holding a dozen or more properties at the same time within a single region.  Based upon observing the properties, they are then typically held for anywhere from a few hours up to a few days before being slowly released to grab others.

If it really was 'grab & immediately release' then folks would not be as upset.

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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17 minutes ago, Milk Pixelmaid said:

Interesting pov, however LL has never said you have to decorate a home. I see many empty homes.

I think the difference there is that a person hasn't purposefully made one spot empty, they've just not filled in the spot they have. But yeah, that is also a major 'first-world social issue' - that people get and pay for things they don't use.

 

But my reasoning above was just a theory, I can't speak for the rules LLs makes.

Edited by Pussycat Catnap
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Anchoring prims in one Linden Home to place content in another should be explicitly forbidden in the covenant. @Patch Linden

The goal is community, not encouraging people to play GoH for adjacent houses on the same region and then find ways around the intentional block on transferring / pooling ownership.

This is what deeding land to a group is for, and that has been disabled.

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I don't see why LL has to find ways to be more restrictive. If residents show that they like living close by, or sharing resources, I would think that LL might consider letting people set up groups on a region, instead of finding even more ways to take it away. We will have to see what type of management LL wants to be. In a way this is also resident feedback, and the residents feel like it's more of a community when they can be near their friends & family.

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17 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Anchoring prims in one Linden Home to place content in another should be explicitly forbidden in the covenant. @Patch Linden

The goal is community, not encouraging people to play GoH for adjacent houses on the same region and then find ways around the intentional block on transferring / pooling ownership.

This is what deeding land to a group is for, and that has been disabled.

Thank you

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18 minutes ago, Milk Pixelmaid said:

I don't see why LL has to find ways to be more restrictive. If residents show that they like living close by, or sharing resources, I would think that LL might consider letting people set up groups on a region, instead of finding even more ways to take it away. We will have to see what type of management LL wants to be. In a way this is also resident feedback, and the residents feel like it's more of a community when they can be near their friends & family.

The mechanics of sharing land via deeding to a group would undermine the entire premise of Linden Homes.

It would encourage GoH/botting to claim homes that can then be squatted and traded or sold. It would guarantee no one would every roll a lucky home ever again and that if people wished to live with their friends the only way to do so would be via a black market buy in.

It would be like Horizons, only instead of paying tens-of-thousands-of-L$ via normal mechanics for that gold star plot of land, you're paying it to some skeezy srs sl biznessman under the table.

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15 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

The mechanics of sharing land via deeding to a group would undermine the entire premise of Linden Homes.

It would encourage GoH/botting to claim homes that can then be squatted and traded or sold.

 

 

 

Right now if I get a Linden Home, my alt can use it, but has limits on what she can do. Right down to even things like using the radio or setting the About Land details. She can't even adjust the windlight. This is because you cannot deed the land to a group.

Deeded land is essentially "owned" by everyone in the group. There are ways to have total control and the only thing you can't do with deeded land is give it to a member - you have to sell it to them. It's very common on mainland to sell a plot to yourself for $0L in order to get it out of the group when you have some reason to do so (like maybe put it in another group, or sell it to a friend instead of yourself). This is the one sole thing that would still not be possible.

But all I need to do is charge people to be in and then to stay in my land group... I could probably set up a bot to take weekly payments, and if it didn't see a payment from 'Somebody Resident" that week, boot them from the group.

Now, I've just managed to become a land baron... and since I'm grabbing up a hundred Bellisseria plots a day, I've got a massive estate. And I can charge all these fools just enough to give me 10% over the costs of my 10,000 premium accounts... :)

- doing it this way, I never have to set out rental boxes, so I can escape the notice of the Lindens and Moles and the ban on commercial activity... until somebody reports me and all 10,000 of my tenants are suddenly evicted and LLs loses all that monthly premium... so... if I get away with it just long enough, they will feel pressure not to stop me...

- If that sounds silly... start talking to some of the land barons who hold massive chunks of Zindra and elsewhere... and are basically holding a tier bill that makes the above sound cheap. And then all the tricks they've used to offset it.

 

Thankfully, unlike with mainland and Horizons... LLs stopped "me" before the doors even opened on Bellisseria... so they will never face that moment when they have to decide about losing a customer that pays for half the servers like they would if they ever cleaned up mainland...

- THIS is very likely a big part of WHY you cannot deed your Linden Home to a group.

 

 

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Keep in mind one cannot deed the land of a linden home to a group. You can set it to your land group, for your alts of friends to use it, but those sqm do not count.

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46 minutes ago, Elena Core said:

Keep in mind one cannot deed the land of a linden home to a group. You can set it to your land group, for your alts of friends to use it, but those sqm do not count.

Thanks.

Edited my post to note that. I'd implied it but not stated it, forgetting it might not be known by everyone.

 

This whole issue reminds me of the debates I have with a nephew over his favorite political 'ism'. He's always "the world would be better if we just put this 'ism' in place instead of the corrupt government we have. And I keep telling to read some actual history not the junk in the chat rooms... "if your ism was in place, what happens when a power hungry set of folks take it over?" "But that won't happen because the people who like my ism are pure of heart and won't abuse the system..." /faceplant.

Thus... we have rules like no deeding land to your group because, despite how wonderful it would be. We know it only takes one homie to exploit that thing to make a mess of all our toys.

A bit like the issues we're now seeing in the 'game of homes' problem... Most of us are 'pure of heart' and follow our 'ism' as intended', so we get rolled by the homies that just see a loop with a hole in it.

 

Edited by Pussycat Catnap
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