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Frankie Antonioni

How LL can make more money, and sell abandoned land.

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Ok, so LL has said that they are going to raise premium, and other fees. But I think there is a better way. It would also help get rid of some of the abandoned land.  In the sim where my store is at, there is about 43,000 sq. meters of abandoned land. Even with the increase in the amount of land that premium members can own, there is still a lot of abandoned land around. So below are some solutions that LL can adopt.

LET VERIFIED BASIC ACCOUNTS OWN 512 SQ METERS OF LAND.

Ok, if a person has a basic, but verified account, then they can own 512 sq. meters of land. They will get no stipend, and no live support. The only way for them to deed the land to a group, is if they own the group. And only one parcel of land can be deeded to the group. If they are offline for 6 moths, or more, then they lose the land. So if the person is going to be offline for a long period of time, then they should sell the land. They also can't buy land on the auctions.Also can't buy land from LL.

LETS HAVE MINOR PREMIUM.

SO lets have minor premium. Minor premium would cost about $1.75 a month, or about $12.00 a year. They will be able to own 1024 sq. meters of land, but will get no stipend, or live support. They can deed the land to a group, and it wouldn't have to be a group that they own. They could even deed it to a rental. Unlike VB, there is no time limit for how long they can be offline. They could be offline for several years. As long as they pay minor premium, then they can keep the land.

Premium Members.

LL is talking about raising premium. If they are going to do that, then why not let premium members own 1536 sq. meters of land. If you guys are going to raise the price of premium, then how about letting people own more land. This will mean that more land gets sold, and less abandoned land.

LAND TRANSACTION FEES.

Now this might make some people mad. But I think there should be land transactions fees. When you sell a parcel of land, a percentage of the sales would go to LL. The fee would be smaller for larger parcels, than smaller parcels. Here is how it would look.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1/128 Region  25 Percent
 512 m2

 
1/64 Region
 1,024 m2

 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1/32 Region     20 Percent
 2,048 m2
 

1/16 Region
 4,096 m2
 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------
1/8 Region          15 Percent
 8,192 m2
 
 
 
1/4 Region
16,384 m2
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1/2 Region                  10 Percent
 32,768 m2


Entire Region
 65,536 m2
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you sell a 512 sq. meter parcel of land for 10,000 L$, then you would make 7,500 L$, and LL makes 2,500 L$. There would be no transaction fees on auctions, or on estates. With more people being able to own land, this will make land prices go up. The higher the price, the more LL makes.

Now you can sell land for 0L$. But you will have to sell it to a certain person. Say to a friend. You just couldn't put sell for 0 L$, and have no name entered into the field. Now, I have just mentioned land, but what about the L$ amount that premium members get each month.S

SHOULD MORE LINDENS BE GIVE OUT EACH WEEK?

Well if LL were to give out more L$ each week, that would make prices go up. Kind of like Germany after WW I. But there might be another way.

Let people be able to pay premium, and tier to LL, with L$.  Lets say 25,000 L$ a year. That is $100.00 a year. If LL is going to stick with the new $99.00 for premium, then let the premium members pay with L$. There would be no cash out. Premium members might have to pay more if they pay with L$. There is also an added bonus. Fewer L$ in circulation. Now the L$ has more buying power.

LL could increase the stipend to 500 L$ a week, but a lot of that would be going back to LL.

LETS HAVE TWO EVENTS.

Lets have two events, instead of one. One of the events is for spam. It is ok to spam the events for spam. There would be a 5 L$ fee for each spam. You can send up to 10 spams a day. Each time it would cost 5 L$. The posting in the spam events would stay up for 7 days. Spam Events would look like the regular events. I did a search today in events, for the word money. There were 5 listings, and 4 of those were from the same person. If you spam in the regular events, then you will be find 20 L$ for each spam.

I would like for some one at LL to look at what I posted.  Would LL make more money? If so, how much more would they make? I don't know how to set up a poll on here. But how many would go for the minor premium if it was offered? For those that are verified basic, how many of you be wiling to buy land? The land would be 512 sq. meters. How many basic members would like to try minor premium? The post that Grumpity Linden made is now 29, or more pages. So everybody might want to start posting here.

 

 

 

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The subject had been pretty much beaten to death by now i think. I will add this.I know plenty of people in SL who already pay their subscription with L$. They just sell L$ and have the usd added to their usd balance and Linden Lab takes the fee out of that balance.

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Abandoned land doesn't consume much in the way of resources.  

Land may be what Linden Labs has historically charged for, but it's the avatars and things on the land that drives up use of computational resources. 

 

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L$ don't cost LL anything. They generate them out of thin air.

When you pay L$ 10 to upload, you aren't giving LL money, you are removing 10L from the economy. 

L$ only have value when they are sold - to another resident. 

LL do not deal or trade in L$, only US$

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35 minutes ago, Erwin Solo said:

Abandoned land doesn't consume much in the way of resources.  

Land may be what Linden Labs has historically charged for, but it's the avatars and things on the land that drives up use of computational resources.

I'm not sure I agree, but we'd have to see numbers to resolve the issue.  Running a region, no matter what's on it, requires dedicating a portion of a server core.  As I recall, four regions run on a core, and four cores per server CPU, so 16 regions per server blade.  While it's possible that the server farm charges LL on the basis of power consumption or something, I think it's more likely they simply get charged a flat fee per server per month...which means that every region costs them the same, regardless of the actual computational load.

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Just now, Lindal Kidd said:

  Running a region, no matter what's on it, requires dedicating a portion of a server core. 

Yeah, you can't run half a region, and while an empty plot will not be consuming certain parts of the regions overall load, regions aren't in anyway balanced by land area.

Some **** over in the corner with a 512 running an afk breedable bot fueled temp rezzed disco party can more than make up for everything else.

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8 minutes ago, Lindal Kidd said:

 Running a region, no matter what's on it, requires dedicating a portion of a server core.  ...

Nope.  Everything is virtualized nowadays.  Search the web for virtual machine. 

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Posted (edited)

Yeah, yeah, I know LL has told us that SL is "moving to the cloud".  I don't think it's happened yet, though.  And even if they do, neither of us knows how the company(s) that LL will use will bill them for resources.  In any case, there's silicon and copper SOMEwhere underpinning everything.

Edited by Lindal Kidd

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5 minutes ago, CoffeeDujour said:

... Some **** over in the corner with a 512 running an afk breedable bot fueled temp rezzed disco party can more than make up for everything else.

True.  So, the perception that abandoned land is something to be given to free accounts without impact is erroneous. 

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14 hours ago, CoffeeDujour said:

L$ don't cost LL anything. They generate them out of thin air.

When you pay L$ 10 to upload, you aren't giving LL money, you are removing 10L from the economy. 

L$ only have value when they are sold - to another resident. 

LL do not deal or trade in L$, only US$

That's a truth with modifications. LL can generate L$ out of thin air yes, but they also have to pass the new game money on to users and they aren't giving much of it it away for free.

 

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, Lindal Kidd said:

I'm not sure I agree, but we'd have to see numbers to resolve the issue.  Running a region, no matter what's on it, requires dedicating a portion of a server core.  As I recall, four regions run on a core, and four cores per server CPU, so 16 regions per server blade.  While it's possible that the server farm charges LL on the basis of power consumption or something, I think it's more likely they simply get charged a flat fee per server per month...which means that every region costs them the same, regardless of the actual computational load.

They do not pay a fixed hosting fee per region/server core, we know that. LL has several times mentioned that badnwidth is a significant expense for them and of course an empty region doesn't take up much bandwidth.

On OpenSIm you can easily run a hundred empty region on a fairly modest home computer. LL could have done something similar with SL if they really wanted to but they haven't. They haven't even bothered to take down those Gaeta I regions they never got around to sell or use and there are also several other ways they could have cut down on the server cores without changing the software and without anybody noticing. I can't imagine they've overlooked the possible savings there so the reason they haven't done anything about it must be that it's not important enough to them.

Edited by ChinRey
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LL has their own data center and their own servers in it. The reason they're trying to move the simulators to the cloud is because the data center is now too out of date to support newer hardware, and going to the cloud is cheaper than building a new data center. This is from a talk given by the Linden in charge of the data center. I suspect their Sansar experience caused them to underestimate the difficulty of moving to the cloud. SL would be way more complex ... for a start, the code is old and Sansar doesn't have region crossings. The Linden also mentioned some hardware that wouldn't work right if put in separate racks, indicating very tight timing constraints. They have to get away from that too.

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I want to focus on the one idea in the original post I really like:  Minor premium, though I'd make it "a la carte permium."

You pick the premium benefits.  Each has a cost.  Some are worth more so might cost more than others.  But different people have different priorities, so defined tiers don't work.

Like, I might buy a package of owning land (1024 sq m free and the right to buy more, with a tier fee cost for more of course) and one of higher group/offline IM limits.

Someone in another thread said they value easier access to crowded sims but don't care about owning land.  They could buy that instead.

Because there would be no stipend, each benefit would be quite cheap (don't underestimate how much the stipend made premium before the price increases such a good deal, though less with the increases), but buy more than 4 perks or so and you're paying more in real terms than premium, so you only do it if you only value a few of the perks enough to pay for them specifically.

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On 6/1/2019 at 4:06 AM, Frankie Antonioni said:

LL is talking about raising premium. If they are going to do that, then why not let premium members own 1536 sq. meters of land. If you guys are going to raise the price of premium, then how about letting people own more land. This will mean that more land gets sold, and less abandoned land.

i am not sure of your own experience of Premium ownership of mainland parcels.  In recent times LL doubled the tier allowance from 512m to 1024m. LL also increased the LI allowance for standard mainland regions from 15,000 to 22,500 - a 512m parcel LI is now 175 up from 117 - pro-rata'd increases for larger sized parcels.  LL also changed the way LI is calculated so that a 1 prim standard box now only counts as 0.5 LI when linked - effectively 2 box prims linked now equals 1 prim. And LL did also previously reduce the extra mainland tier schedule by approx. 20%. So for mainland owners (Premium) we did get a whole lot more for our money in terms of parcels prior to this latest price increase, which nobody said no too

within your other idea about basic accounts and mainland parcels. In effect this would mean that every player gets a free 512m "room". That would probably have an adverse effect on resident-owned rental businesses and also probably less interest /uptake in Premium membership from people at the lower parcel/home ownership end

 

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3 minutes ago, Mollymews said:

i am not sure of your own experience of Premium ownership of mainland parcels.  In recent times LL doubled the tier allowance from 512m to 1024m. LL also increased the LI allowance for standard mainland regions from 15,000 to 22,500 - a 512m parcel LI is now 175 up from 117 - pro-rata'd increases for larger sized parcels.  LL also changed the way LI is calculated so that a 1 prim standard box now only counts as 0.5 LI when linked - effectively 2 box prims linked now equals 1 prim. And LL did also previously reduce the extra mainland tier schedule by approx. 20%. So for mainland owners (Premium) we did get a whole lot more for our money in terms of parcels prior to this latest price increase, which nobody said no too

within your other idea about basic accounts and mainland parcels. In effect this would mean that every player gets a free 512m "room". That would probably have an adverse effect on resident-owned rental businesses and also probably less interest /uptake in Premium membership from people at the lower parcel/home ownership end

 

I'm not totally against a price increase. But to go from $72.00, or $99.00, is a bit much. That is more than 30%. I would suggest $75.00, or perhaps $78.00. Then later on increase it to $80.00.  Let's find other ways that LL can make more money. Such as a land transaction fee. Or a higher fee if you want to belong to more groups. Want more than 70 groups? Then you will have to pay $15.00 more. How about a higher fee if you want more picts in your profile? If you stop paying the higher, then you lose the picts at the bottom.

But lets have something else also. I have noticed that profiles say no payment info, or payment info used. Lets have these in our profile.

Basic, No Payment on File.

Basic, Payment info Used.

Premium.

If LL were to adopt my suggestion to have minor premium, then you would see "Minor Premium".

There used to be Payment on file. But that is gone.

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2 minutes ago, Frankie Antonioni said:

 

Lets have these in our profile.

Basic, No Payment on File.

Basic, Payment info Used.

Premium.

If LL were to adopt my suggestion to have minor premium, then you would see "Minor Premium".

i think that any kind of profile status labelling as Basic or Premium would be counter-productive to community building. I would not like to see us go down that path

about the pick-your-own-premium-benefits. Grumpity Linden said that LL have no plans at this time to do this, due to the cost of implementing it

i get that you are enthusiastic and have ideas that you want to share.  I like that you do this, as I like everyone who likes to think about what could or might be done.  Grumpity Linden has indicated that LL are currently working on  introducing a new level of Premium package. Something more, not less than the current Premium offering. Maybe you could think about what kind of benefits could be in that package, which is going to happen 'soon'. Benefits that would be worth paying more than $US99pa for

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To be able to make money you have to consume a product,

the island and the premium land are consumables, 

how to remunerate employees, equipment and expenses,

I would like the company to publish statistics, I would like to know,

how many users are premium, how much island there is currently online, how many employees,

and much more.

 

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29 minutes ago, Cakewithfruit said:

To be able to make money you have to consume a product,

the island and the premium land are consumables, 

how to remunerate employees, equipment and expenses,

I would like the company to publish statistics, I would like to know,

how many users are premium, how much island there is currently online, how many employees,

and much more.

 

Private company ... they don't have to give you anything.

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