A brief note on pricing changes, which ran long.

[Jessicatje Artful]

On 5/31/2019 at 12:14 PM, Froukje Hoorenbeek said:

Whenever I contact support, I get copied and pasted from the textbook. When someone sells an empty box on the MP with my brand on it, you do nothing, no matter how many times that empty box is flagged by your customers. They have to come to me for support over this empty box they bought from you. It should not be our job to police your MP. In fact, a lot of work we merchants do, like replacing lost inventory and such, is not our job, but yours. 

5% of all cash outs is also 5% of all copybotted or otherwise stolen content. How about some more protection for the higher prize I have to pay? I would not mind paying more at all if I got something back for it. Like more protection of my work, against copybotters, grievers, trolls etc.

SL’s content creators are your greatest asset. This anonymous workforce has been giving you the content that kept you the biggest platform in virtual reality for 16 years. For free. How about you give us some perks as well?  

amen froukje ! i can not agree more with you, they dont do anything about the copybot stuff or the empty boxes, here is an idea for LL, you already have designers that create mesh and have to agree with some rules and answer questions the first time they upload mesh, Now what if you adjust the MP like this : any designer that wants to upload something has to verify they are the designer ? and ofcourse another option for gacha... just a little idea

[Fox Wijaya]

58 minutes ago, Sylvia Tamalyn said:

My understanding was that you can pre-pay at your current level (annual, for example), or you can move UP to annual. I haven't seen anything indicating you can move down to a more frequent payment plan like monthly and be allowed to pre-pay at the "old" rate, too. Interesting question!

i see  hear another thing thats not right... my friend that is quarterly till jun 18, but upgraded this week to annualy, is now showing annually with renewing date june 18 ...and can pay upfront till june 18 2020 .... ehm no... i don't think so... hope that is a system limitation and will repair itself after that date.. not going to push that button now.

[Linden Lab]

Hello all,

UPDATE: The limited-time opportunity for existing Premium members to lock in their current rates for one more billing cycle, including extending an existing monthly to use the current full year rate by upgrading now to annual is now available on the premium page. Simply renew before June 24th to extend your current Membership at the same low rate. For example, monthly members will be billed at the lower rate for one more monthly billing cycle, while annual members may renew (or monthly users may upgrade to annual) early to add one more year to your existing Membership at the current lower rate. If you have any trouble accessing the website, please note that it may be due to an increase in traffic and that the option will be available until the end of the day on June 24th.

We mentioned that we would update when it was live - and now it is!

 

[LittleMe Jewell]

22 hours ago, Coolnet Ordinary said:

Can you still buy the premium before the 24th for the low-cost rate of the 72 dollars a year?  Like, if I want to buy it on the 10th will it be available?

So after looking at the page with an alt that is not currently Premium, you can definitely upgrade right now at the current rate.  And since the new rate doesn't take effect until June 24th, you'll be able to do the upgrade on the 10th also.

The additional year option is not available on that checkout page (the one you get to via Upgrade), but I'd bet that one or two days later, it will be an option on the regular Premium Membership page just like it is for all existing Premiums.  So it you wanted, you could become Premium and likely pay for 2 years at the current rate, but you'd have to do it in two steps.

 

 

2 hours ago, Sylvia Tamalyn said:

My understanding was that you can pre-pay at your current level (annual, for example), or you can move UP to annual. I haven't seen anything indicating you can move down to a more frequent payment plan like monthly and be allowed to pre-pay at the "old" rate, too. Interesting question!

Makes sense.  I was not interested in only prepaying a month, but was curious as to what the options were.  

Since they are allowing quarterly billing folks to stay with the quarterly plan, I wonder if they can opt for just a quarterly prepay (along with the option to go annual) or if they only get an annual option.

Edited June 3, 2019 by LittleMe Jewell

[Garnet Psaltery]

5 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

The additional year option is not available on that checkout page (the one you get to via Upgrade), but I'd bet that one or two days later, it will be an option on the regular Premium Membership page just like it is for all existing Premiums.  So it you wanted, you could become Premium and likely pay for 2 years at the current rate, but you'd have to do it in two steps.

Yes indeed.  I upgraded 2 alts on 2nd June (yesterday) then added a year for each on 3rd (today). 

[Selene Gregoire]

2 hours ago, T0ranny Artful said:

any designer that wants to upload something has to verify they are the designer ?

How are new designers going to be able to verify if they haven't "designed" anything yet? Are you going to make them submit examples of their work? Who is going to take time out of their busy work schedule to be judge, jury and executioner of those decisions? Sounds like a lot of extra unnecessary hoops to jump through just be able to upload a snapshot or texture.

[Chad Marbach]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 5/30/2019 at 5:23 AM, Fox Wijaya said:

but more serious .. i think "grandfathering" the quarterly subscription isn't a good idea, also the raise in combination with the re addition of VAT will hit some residents quite hard.
Changes are understandble, and however i'm mostly one that pulls the brakes, i can't deal with changes too well, these new ones won't cost the average resident more than a cup of coffee.  I'm no creator or store owner, but think they might have some ideas about the 5% ..  🤯

Actually, when I had decided to go premium it was the quarterly subscription which I decided was best.  It seemed (and still does) the best compromise in price and payment rate with getting a Premium account as is. (I live off a very fixed monthly based income that is not very high (you know, like most Americans, below the poverty level by quite an amount).  I am glad they are allowing me to continue with my quarterly payments even though they are raised like the rest, but I have studied my budgets (monthly, quarterly, and annually) and have found I can handle the higher price and also that quarterly works out best for me. 

[Polymath Snuggler]

If you have a fixed income, wouldn't the lowest price overall price be the most appealing?

 

I live on a pretty near fixed income at the moment and I have always opted for annual.

Quarterly brings the annual cost to 131.95 $ USD as opposed to 99 # USD ~

Which when taking in to account stipend, is 70.95$ USD  compared to 39$ USD

Edited June 4, 2019 by polysail

[Mollymews]

34 minutes ago, polysail said:

If you have a fixed income, wouldn't the lowest price overall price be the most appealing?

yes that's true

however I just add something about what it means practically to be on a fixed low income. Not that you mean this in what you said, I just raise it as a further discussion point

the main struggle that people on fixed low incomes have, is getting the larger amount altogether at one time, to take advantage of discounted deals. A thing that fixed low income people sometimes get told is to go without and save up.  In this case a person told this will go without for at least 10 and a half months  until they can save the initial lump sum.  Given how few joy opportunities people on fixed low incomes do get then being told to go without for 10 and half months or so can be a little bit unthinking when we have been fortunate in our own lives to not be in this same situation

i have in my own past been on a low income and it is really difficult to manage, even to save a dollar here and there.  In my current situation today, having to go without while I save $100 to spend on joy is 2 weeks, which is a long way shorter than 10 months plus

i just add on another thing

i don't understand why LL is dropping the quarterlies for new accounts. It may simply be that the LL decision makers have never been on a fixed low income. Or maybe they once were a long time ago, and have forgotten how difficult it can be for people in this situation to put larger sums of money together at one time

i would ask LL to have another think about this. There are quite a few people who are on low fixed incomes, pensions, disability, etc. I think for many of these people (new or potential upgraders) the dropping of the quarterly package will comparatively increase their SL joy costs rather than reduce them. They will go to monthly rather than annually, because of the length of time needed to save up the initial annual fee amount  

[Polymath Snuggler]

6 minutes ago, Mollymews said:

yes that's true

however I just add something about what it means practically to be on a fixed low income. Not that you mean this in what you said, I just raise it as a further discussion point

the main struggle that people on fixed low incomes have, is getting the larger amount altogether at one time, to take advantage of discounted deals. A thing that fixed low income people sometimes get told is to go without and save up.  In this case a person told this will go without for at least 10 and a half months  until they can save the initial lump sum.  Given how few joy opportunities people on fixed low incomes do get then being told to go without for 10 and half months or so can be a little bit unthinking when we have been fortunate in our own lives to not be in this same situation

i have in my own past been on a low income and it is really difficult to manage, even to save a dollar here and there.  In my current situation today, having to go without while I save $100 to spend on joy is 2 weeks, which is a long way shorter than 10 months plus

i just add on another thing

i don't understand why LL is dropping the quarterlies for new accounts. It may simply be that the LL decision makers have never been on a fixed low income. Or maybe they once were a long time ago, and have forgotten how difficult it can be for people in this situation to put larger sums of money together at one time

i would ask LL to have another think about this. There are quite a few people who are on low fixed incomes, pensions, disability, etc. I think for many of these people (new or potential upgraders) the dropping of the quarterly package will comparatively increase their SL joy costs rather than reduce them. They will go to monthly rather than annually, because of the length of time needed to save up the initial annual fee amount  

I've been rolling my stipend refund + SL income back into my premium for 4 years.  When I do get extra money, I've made sure to keep an extra annual billing cycle worth of premium on my account, as I've been deathly afraid of getting locked out since I wouldn't be able to just "pay off my debt" without using L$ to do so.   So it's been literally the 12$ / yr annual fee that I've been citing on this thread, and it will remain so until 2021,  I never have been on a non-annual premium plan.

I may not be the best example due to the fact that my net SL income is positive, but that's how I've always managed this.

[Fox Wijaya]

2 hours ago, polysail said:

If you have a fixed income, wouldn't the lowest price overall price be the most appealing?

yes of course, but with a big BUT ... if your on a tight budget, you'r not able to miss 72 (or 99) from your monthly income,  you spend the little you have left after daily cost on special things like clothes of for few times a month some nicer food or even a movie.

[Callie Cline]

On 5/30/2019 at 1:34 AM, Grumpity Linden said:

We're open to suggestions, quite seriously.  One project currently in progress is an update to Events.  Hopefully by making events more useable, some of the group functionality can be absorbed there.  

hi grumpity! 

this thread has exploded so it's hard to know if you have commented or answered on some of the posts i've written asking about the double hike in cash out fees. i am many of my colleagues who are content creators who do business in SL would like to ask you to please reconsider this enormous increase coming with such a short notice. the costs of doing business are high as it is, and the short notice leaves no time to adjust. not to mention that just a few years ago it was 1 dollar then 10, then 25 then a huge hike to 250, now it will be doubled to 500 (per 10k, your numbers) it seems really off and the way it's been done seems and feels aggressive and so many creators have some really great views on why this is a really hard pill to swallow. 

since i said more in my other posts, i'll close this now and share one suggestion i've made for years then i'll go see if you answered somewhere else!

thank you for being open to listen and for suggestions. 

here is my number one suggestion i think would help you all soooo much. and it is what kept me in sl. 

1. make the learning curve easier. (bring back live help) if it were not for live help i'd never have been able to figure out sl.
the number one response i've gotten from people i show and have invited is "it's way too hard." and with little dumb games online that are easy, though sl may be appealing, it is a steep learning curve. helping new people in that way who log on and never come back are potential dollars lost. just this alone would increase the user base and then in turn revenue. i still get im's from new people who can't do much, and it takes a lot of time to help them which i try to do but if there was a place to send them (like when i send them to a CSR for our cats) it helps them SO much and they become sooooo loyal!

i still remember Dotedote Edison who was the person who i'd get every night when i logged in who showed me how to shop, rez, put on clothing, buy lindens, and so much more. not sure how you all try to retain customers now but to me SL is basically is a social and glorified chat room with amazing bells and whistles. relationships are key. 

 

sincerely, 

callie cline

 

p.s. i am happy to offer any other ideas if you all want to contact me, and i'd be happy to share ideas i think would help sl grow, make more money while being generous to their loyal user base, including creators. 

[Callie Cline]

7 hours ago, Linden Lab said:

Hello all,

UPDATE: The limited-time opportunity for existing Premium members to lock in their current rates for one more billing cycle, including extending an existing monthly to use the current full year rate by upgrading now to annual is now available on the premium page. Simply renew before June 24th to extend your current Membership at the same low rate. For example, monthly members will be billed at the lower rate for one more monthly billing cycle, while annual members may renew (or monthly users may upgrade to annual) early to add one more year to your existing Membership at the current lower rate. If you have any trouble accessing the website, please note that it may be due to an increase in traffic and that the option will be available until the end of the day on June 24th.

We mentioned that we would update when it was live - and now it is!

 

this is great i will pass this on to our community! thanks! (KittyCatS! owners)

Edited June 4, 2019 by Callie Cline
added community name

[Callie Cline]

5 hours ago, Selene Gregoire said:

How are new designers going to be able to verify if they haven't "designed" anything yet? Are you going to make them submit examples of their work? Who is going to take time out of their busy work schedule to be judge, jury and executioner of those decisions? Sounds like a lot of extra unnecessary hoops to jump through just be able to upload a snapshot or texture.

my understanding is she said "the" designer" (on the marketplace) of said product. not a new designer.  the context is someone uploading an empty box with an established designers logo on it. so she's asking for verification of identity, not if one can design or not. (which is subjective anyway) hope that clarifies. 

[Ivory Bouscario]

So just to be clear... if you are currently premium, and say it renews in September, and you pay the additional year now, does it add a year starting from now or does it add the year on AFTER when your current cycle ends in September? Also, is there going to be any increase in the weekly allotment of Lindens we get? I always thought it was pretty fair and almost evened out. Never really needed my free house because I have land. But now it seems that may not be the case much longer.

[Polymath Snuggler]

4 minutes ago, Ivory Bouscario said:

So just to be clear... if you are currently premium, and say it renews in September, and you pay the additional year now, does it add a year starting from now or does it add the year on AFTER when your current cycle ends in September? Also, is there going to be any increase in the weekly allotment of Lindens we get? I always thought it was pretty fair and almost evened out. Never really needed my free house because I have land. But now it seems that may not be the case much longer.

If you already had a paid premium plan ~ and you buy more again now, it winds up looking like this : 

As you can see it moved my billing date forward one year from when it was expected to be due.

Edited June 4, 2019 by polysail

[Fox Wijaya]

somehow.. somewhere... deep in my thoughts there's a little voice telling me, nót to prepay and take the 30 dollars more spending for granted when i have to renew.
We'r giving LL a sh*tload of cash, but that will run out faster than we pay it. We all know about that moneydrain in VR, is it really wise?.....
How about that new premium.. will that be worth it, or a new way to get more money when the bucket gets empty ... i start thinking LL should play a bit more open and show their plans longer than just a few weeks, with realistic timepaths. Don't mention planned features as comming soon when it, mostly, means more than  "soon" and shows to be a year or longer.

[Mollymews]

50 minutes ago, Fox Wijaya said:

somehow.. somewhere... deep in my thoughts there's a little voice telling me, nót to prepay and take the 30 dollars more spending for granted when i have to renew.
We'r giving LL a sh*tload of cash, but that will run out faster than we pay it.

yes there is always some risk involved in paying a forward subscription fee of any kind

the other day I was reading some SL forums archived chat from Charter Members and some other people who were SL residents also at the time who couldn't bring themselves to take up the charter offer at the time. Didn't and then regretted it ever since

same when LL offered the grandfathered regions buy down. Some did, some didn't. Some who didn't have since regretted it

at both those times, residents also worried that LL might be in trouble and may be needed a signal from us its customers (cash infusion being the best kinda signal ) that we residents still wanted to be in the game

this may be the case now too also. Whether it is or not, it is tho valid for all of us to think about it a bit.  Then make our own decision. It may be that I will regret giving more money than I had anticipated at this time to LL. It may turn out to be ok as well also.  For me I go with it will turn out ok, if only because I want it too

 

 

Edited June 4, 2019 by Mollymews
is

[Ethan Paslong]

@Linden Lab @Grumpity Linden

i see something strange on my accountpage...  i am on quarterly billing now, but will upp to yearly on june 18 ( is still in the old payment levels)
however..... here the screenshots what i get now :

Possibly this is a bug/glitch in the system, not using the actual info or......if this is the case i think you should mention that it's not possible to upgrade in the grace period to extend longer.

[Vick Forcella]

So we have till June 24th to lock in the correct premium fee.

However {coming is)" the introduction of an all-new membership level for those who want to get the absolute most out of their Second Life".

This gives the risk of locking in the premium fee and next comes another option and we have to pay again?

[Qie Niangao]

20 minutes ago, Vick Forcella said:

This gives the risk of locking in the premium fee and next comes another option and we have to pay again?

Yeah. I just re-upped my Premium accounts on the assumption that it would benefit any account even if it upgrades to whatever the new "super Premium" plan turns out to be. That's only an assumption, but one that seems almost as safe as assuming we'll get no details about the new plan until long after June 24th when the current-rate reenlistment period closes.

So far, the whole "super Premium" plan has been shrouded in mystery and the vague language of a Marketing department that wants to keep all its options open. (And every time I try to ask about the sole feature I actually want, grid-scope Experiences, it's as if the technical and business sides of the Lab work for different companies on different continents planets.)

[mikka Luik]

@Ethan PaslongOdd, seeing something different (also a quarterly here) and get the extension offer.

 

[Kyrah Abattoir]

5 hours ago, Fox Wijaya said:

yes of course, but with a big BUT ... if your on a tight budget, you'r not able to miss 72 (or 99) from your monthly income,  you spend the little you have left after daily cost on special things like clothes of for few times a month some nicer food or even a movie.

I don't want to sound like a jerk but...

That's called planning... If you plan ahead you're not "missing" those 72 (or 99) because you've had a whole year to put it aside little by little.

[Da5id Weatherwax]

10 minutes ago, Kyrah Abattoir said:

I don't want to sound like a jerk but...

That's called planning... If you plan ahead you're not "missing" those 72 (or 99) because you've had a whole year to put it aside little by little.

You're not sounding like a jerk, but rather like somebody who has either never lived it or last had to so far in the past that the memory is not too clear any more. If one was already on an annual plan when one's circumstances changed and resources became more limited then yes, there is a year to put by the next payment and all will likely be well. Starting out from a point of limited resources though, the only option, other than not going premium at all, is to "pay as you go" on a monthly basis - which consumes the funds you'd otherwise be putting aside for the next years payment. The up-front cost forms a barrier to entry even if, once that's paid, it would be perfectly feasible to fund the renewals.

[Kyrah Abattoir]

Yeah but the reason companies offer discounts on longer engagement is because it's more cash upfront for them and also because it makes their pocketbook a lot more predictable.