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Grumpity Linden

A brief note on pricing changes, which ran long.

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Posted (edited)

I am wondering the justification for such a massive 40% increase in Premium membership. If you want more people to get premium it seems counter-intuitive to restrict basic AND raise the price both.  Are they raising the prices because of events, and experiences and all that nonsense? Most people I know don't bother with that crap and only have a premium for the Linden Home, perhaps there should be a basic paid membership tier that is at a cheaper price point, but cuts out all the social frill, and other "features" that most people have no real use for and only allows for the Linden Homes and the weekly stipend? 

It makes me even more concerned about what Super Premium might entail if they feel fluff is worth a 40% increase, and since we are on the topic of inflation and prices and fees going up across the board since that is 'natural'. That 300L Stipend should go up too, perhaps to 500L reflective of the modern economy, vis a vis - cost of living increases. 300L was fine back in the early 2000s, but not in 2019 especially when you factor in creators raising prices to compensate for the increased fees they must pay. 

Yet, we all know that won't happen, they'll speak of the 'natural" increase of prices, only when it benefits them and conveniently forget it on issues that benefit the customer. 

Edited by AtriaLightmare
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2 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

I wonder this too, although I haven't read all 42 pages of this thread so maybe it's revealed somewhere. The concern is, suppose I re-up my Premium accounts now to forestall the rate hike for another year, and suppose it turns out that the new Super Premium offer includes for free all the grid-scope Experiences I can eat so of course I must have it -- but what will become of my one-year grace period for the old rate when I want to upgrade to Super Premium?

If Super Premium is expensive enough, though, I suppose that US$ 99 - 72 = $27 savings will be beneath notice -- and if so I wouldn't be upgrading anyway.

As far as I understand what I'm reading the only people that benefit from paying LL the $72  for old price this year is any accounts due between 3rd & 24th June this yr. For me my account is due after so will get hit with the $99.

Since I'm not from USA that means my SL bill will cost me almost double now because I use the stipend to help pay my tier & without a 37.5% increase to stipend to match the account increase this means I will have to choose where my money will go. I pay almost $1.50 of my currency for every US$1, that is before any country banking conversion fees or LL fees getting money into SL & then also the extra to convert the L$ back into US$ so LL can take it when it is due has been added on top the amount needed to pay the final bill. 

This increase of US$27 will cost me approx $71 extra from my pocket before any extra for fees from anywhere has been added & there is no extra benefits to offset the cost. At moment I'm wondering do I sell or abandon land I live on & pay LL premium account  to live on the free 1024sq mainland or go to free account & invest my money into SL directly & live under a bridge.

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Louisea Tigerpaw said:

As far as I understand what I'm reading the only people that benefit from paying LL the $72  for old price this year is any accounts due between 3rd & 24th June this yr. For me my account is due after so will get hit with the $99.

 

No, you can pre-pay between 3rd and 24th June to get an additional year to what is remaining at 72USD

Eg, one of mine is due in October 2019, so I'll pre-pay a year in those 3 weeks, to make my next due date October 2020

Edited by FreyasFashions
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3 hours ago, Cain Maven said:

So I guess speaking up does matter sometimes. The Lab has decided not to cut the group count for Basic memberships after all :)

 

I'm glad to hear that, but they still need to rethink some of these other account changes. There are so many good ideas being shared in forums... hope you're still listening LL! Personally, I'll be rethinking whether I want to keep my premium membership.

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Posted (edited)

NOTE I DO NOT HAVE MY CONTACTS IN YET WHY I AM USING CAPS SORRY ,,,, 

 THE REAL ISSUES IS THAT LINDEN LABS HAVE NOT ARE NOT GIVING US TOTAL INFORMATION ABOUT THE EXACT CHANGES . THIS HAS CAUSE A LOT OF UNNECESSARY  UPSET AND STRESS

              I still have a LOT OF QUESTIONS and in fairness TO EVERYONE IN SECOND LIFE  just giving out bits and pieces is really not fair ,,,, second life is income to some/ a stress relief to others/ a venue to create a way to deal with diseases and disability so many things for so many  and the cost must be figured into OUR  THE RESIDENTS  BUDGETS  BECAUSE WITHOUT IS BASIC / PREMIUM ANYONE WHO SPENDS MONEY IN SECOND LIFE   WITHOUT US  YOU GUYS  IN LINDEN LABS  WOULD HAVE NO JOB/ NO LINDEN LABS... WELL MAYBE YOU WOULD IF SANSAR EVER REALLY  TOOK OFF  …so throwing out information without all the exacts is a very unfair and stress creating  behavior all of which on many levels have a negative impact on the residents no matter how pretty you wrap the package .  its like having a baby if you know the steps of development and  timing then one can prepare for the pain of labor and birth ,,, When information is withheld the person company withholding information becomes less credible  in EVERYONE'S  EYES,,,,,,,  and that is the main reason the forums  were blowing up ,,,,, if there had be an announcement say January and you guys said ok every one  we have to make a lot of changes and this is the deal and put it all out on the table everything good bad and ugly WITH NOTHING HIDDEN ALL INFORMATION  EVERYTHING  ,,,THEN WE WOULD HAVE HAD TIME TO ADJUST OUR BUDGETS AND TIME /  THE  TIME NEEDED  TO MAKE DECISIONS ON WHAT IS RIGHT FOR EACH ONE OF US IN OUR OWN REAL LIFE   ,,,, you see for the real life will always come first even the creators who livelihoods  come from earning a living from second life   as well as the   builders the merchants  all will be blessed with better opportunities  down the  road   ,,,sneaky never ever pays and I am very disappointed in the way linden labs  has  handled   all of the situations  and giving out information  in timely manner  .  NO ONE WANTS TO RENEW THE MEMBERSHIP THIS MONTH AND THEN IN JULY AUGUST GET TOLD O BTW WE JUST ADDED A SUPER LEVEL BUT YOU NOW HAVE TO PAY THIS MUCH MORE WHEN THIS COULD HAVE ALL BEEN  ALL PRESENTED IN TOTAL CLARITY AND HONESTY ,,,,, the  old joke of sending the parent huge bad news in order to  let them not be mad at bad grades   that never works ,,,,   work out everything ,,,, have it ALL ready ,,,, give the residents time to voice and then what changes can be made make them but this the way it has been handled ,,,, sorry but a lot of us has lost trust ,,,, its really not about the money but how you withheld the true truth ,, 

 I ASKED ABOUT HOW TO HANDLE MY MEMBERSHIP SINCE I AM QUARTELY AND IF IDO THE YEAR HOW DO THAT CALCULATE THE OVERAGE THIS IS THE  REPLY I GOT

 

 

Hello roseelvira Resident,

Thank you for your response, and thank you for your patience. We apologize for any confusion, let me clarify my response for you.

 

Details on extending your current membership at the existing rates are unfortunately not publicly available yet. I truly wish that I could say more, but I can only advise patience until the details are released.

 

To quote the blog post, there will be "the introduction of an all-new membership level for those who want to get the absolute most out of their Second Life", and there will be an option for existing monthly members to upgrade their membership to an annual membership during the July 3rd-23rd dates.

 

 

Hello roseelvira Resident,

 

Thank you for your response, and thank you for your patience.

 

You, and all existing Premium members, will have an option to lock in your current rates for one more billing cycle starting on this upcoming Monday, June 3rd, and running through Sunday, June 23rd. The Premium Membership price changes will be going live on Monday, June 24th.

 

More details on how to extend, or upgrade your Premium membership will become available soon. We kindly ask for your patience until the full details are publicly available, and once they are we will be more than happy to help with any further questions regarding that process.

 

Please let us know if you need any further assistance after these details are released.

 

Best Wishes,

SO  WE ARE SUPPOSE TO DECIDE IN JUNE THE NEXT FEW WEEK ON WHAT HOW WE ARE PAYING LOCK IN/// NOTE THEY DID USE  THE WORD  LOCK IN  AND THEN  IN JULY WE GET T HE  REAL TRUTH ,,,,,,,, VERY VERY VERY UPSET ,,,,,

Edited by roseelvira
ADDED INFORMATION

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Holy cow! I'm so happy it's not going to change!! Yayyy!! The groups honestly help alot of creators get their word out about them.releasing new clothing! I know alot of creators who do it that way & the use for events and more that require group space!!! And I got a quick question.... 

Let's say lindens wanted to have three levels of premium membership okay? And they wanted the perks to be different... On gifts, group space, offlines ims and more! So here is a rough estimate of what they could do... Is this optional @Grumpity Linden could their be more than just one premium membership? I know some who don't want the homes and I know some who do so it's still a win win situation! & If you did have a lower premium for just more group space, lindens and etc I think people would still go for that one too and if they wanted more than what they got I would think they would upgrade... 

* NOTE * to everyone reading I'm not saying LINDENS would keep it the way I have put down.. this is JUST an example of what they could do!! With three premium memberships I'm NOT SAYING IT WILL HAPPEN.

 

My Examples: 

Premium lvl 1:

* PRICING: Monthly: / Annually: 

* Weekly Ls: 100 - 150$L ?

* No linden home ( because most people just want the cash )

* Get in events faster like always..

* 50 groups?

* A starter goodie bag or something nice.. even something special from a linden I have no idea lol

 

Premium lvl 2:

* PRICING?

Monthly: / Annually:

* Weekly Ls: 300 - 450?

* Linden home 351 prims

* Get in events faster

* group space 55 - 60?

* Premium goodie bags? / gifts from lindens

 

Premium 3:

* PRICING? Monthly: / Annually:

* Weekly Ls: 550 - 600+ whatever they wanna choose it to be

* Better linden home than premium 2 or be able to have more than 1024sq of mainland! ( Not a joke ) 351prims + more prims don't know how many more... But more prims....

* Get in events faster like the other two..

* Group space: you can keep at 70 or make it 75...

* Better premium gifts / goodie bags or even an outfit ( for every body possibly even the classics ) made by the LINDENS that you WONT BE ABLE TO find in a store or can buy for real money! It is only for premium lvl 3. & If they want to after a couple years they can retire it and give it to the other premiums or just let it be retired! I'm sure the LINDENS can be creative too ;) hehe

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So now  in more stress and worry mode ,,,,,, if you lock in .....and then how much to lock out and get the most likely better values  ,,,,there is something just not right ,,,,,now i know why people stayed basic ,,,,,,,the sandbox dressing and harassment does not seem as bad  as all this uncertainty.

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Right now premium accounts get;

  • Weekly L$300 stipend*
  • L$1000 sign-up bonus** for first-time Premium Account subscribers
  • Priority entry when regions are full of avatars
  • Linden Home or 1024m² tier allotment for use towards a parcel on the Mainland
  • Expanded live-chat customer support
  • Premium virtual gifts
  • Exclusive access to Premium areas and experiences
  • Increased cap on missed IMs
  • Increased group membership limits
  • Voice Morphing

The only things that I find attractive is the increased group membership limits and only because SL groups aren't using sub-groups or even have the option to add more roles!!
Please LL give us more roles, they're kind of important if you have a roleplaying region with 100 tenants!

The expanded live-chat customer support is nice but I remember the days when we had chat support 24/7 and asking for help regularly resulted in an actual Linden coming over to fix the problem.

I bet we can think of quite a few new and perhaps even better benefits that would make the premium account more appealing.

I feel another blog post coming up.

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, roseelvira said:

So now  in more stress and worry mode ,,,,,, if you lock in .....and then how much to lock out and get the most likely better values  ,,,,there is something just not right ,,,,,now i know why people stayed basic ,,,,,,,the sandbox dressing and harassment does not seem as bad  as all this uncertainty.

I don't quite understand what you are saying is uncertain. LL have said:

Quote

Premium prices are going up on June 24.  Starting June 3 and until June 24,  Premium accounts have 3 weeks to pre-pay an additional cycle of premium at the old rates.  Best deal is, of course, prepaying for annual regardless of your current level. We hope you can take advantage of it. If you’re paying quarterly today, you can continue as quarterly. We will no longer offer it to new premium signups.  With the new prices, VAT will be charged on monthly and quarterly but not annual (of course only in the countries where VAT applies).

It says you can continue as quarterly if that's what you have now (until renewal date I assume). Then it will be the new rate of $99. If you were to chose to go for the annual payment, and do that 3-24 June you'll get the old rate of $72 (not $99)...I think.

As for the new higher tier coming in, no-on is under any obligation to chose that. If you do want to  you'll have an option to just upgrade to the new level. I expect the new level with include perks relating to homsteads or land or something, I doubt very much they'll take away the perks that exist at the current premium level, so you won't be losing anything.

Edited by Evangeline Arcadia

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14 hours ago, Grumpity Linden said:

3am, actually ;)

Surely that is a perfectly normal time for people in SL to still be  up ;)

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21 hours ago, Grumpity Linden said:

We have approximately 90,000 basic members with 36 or more groups.  We have approximately 10,000 premium subscribers with 55 or more groups.  This is not a 1:1 change.  Does that help with the confusion? 

How many premium accounts are there in total?

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the reply i got from support trying to get the real information

Details on extending your current membership at the existing rates are unfortunately not publicly available yet. I truly wish that I could say more, but I can only advise patience until the details are released.

 

To quote the blog post, there will be "the introduction of an all-new membership level for those who want to get the absolute most out of their Second Life", and there will be an option for existing monthly members to upgrade their membership to an annual membership during the July 3rd-23rd dates.

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So why not put the absolute most  upgrade  package  availability  in with this months having to chose lock in ,,,,,, i feel like a am dealing with a bad mortage company......

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18 minutes ago, Jo Yardley said:

Right now premium accounts get;

  • Weekly L$300 stipend*
  • L$1000 sign-up bonus** for first-time Premium Account subscribers
  • Priority entry when regions are full of avatars
  • Linden Home or 1024m² tier allotment for use towards a parcel on the Mainland
  • Expanded live-chat customer support
  • Premium virtual gifts
  • Exclusive access to Premium areas and experiences
  • Increased cap on missed IMs
  • Increased group membership limits
  • Voice Morphing

The only things that I find attractive is the increased group membership limits and only because SL groups aren't using sub-groups or even have the option to add more roles!!
Please LL give us more roles, they're kind of important if you have a roleplaying region with 100 tenants!

The expanded live-chat customer support is nice but I remember the days when we had chat support 24/7 and asking for help regularly resulted in an actual Linden coming over to fix the problem.

I bet we can think of quite a few new and perhaps even better benefits that would make the premium account more appealing.

I feel another blog post coming up.

We do need more roles indeed.. but even more benefits would be better for premium if they actually did it.. honestly some people don't want the house they offer.. or land because they want private land.. I know some people who would just be happy with extra linden & more group space for say... Me... I am always at my brother's sim, or backdrop city or somewhere else for pictures I have really no use for a home it'd be nice to just log in at and that's it but I would never use it LOL

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6 hours ago, Digit Gears said:

So, with the group limit thing being out of the question now, I do still wonder if there's a way to help ease the system if it's as taxing as they claim.

I still like my idea of letting groups have a optional auto boot system they can configure ranging from having it autokick after 1 year since last log on all the way up to 10 years since last log on.

And perhaps could have it be toggled on automatically maybe at like 5 years for any new groups made

https://jira.secondlife.com/secure/Dashboard.jspa

 

File a feature request.

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21 minutes ago, roseelvira said:

So why not put the absolute most  upgrade  package  availability  in with this months having to chose lock in ,,,,,, i feel like a am dealing with a bad mortage company......

Because it's not ready?

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1 hour ago, FreyasFashions said:

No, you can pre-pay between 3rd and 24th June to get an additional year to what is remaining at 72USD

Eg, one of mine is due in October 2019, so I'll pre-pay a year in those 3 weeks, to make my next due date October 2020

I have already paid annually in April 2019, and my next payment due was April 2020. Now, I pay 72US before June 24 and can use SL as a premium member until April 2021.

Isn't that correct?

Of course it sucks for those whose budget don't allow them to spend 72US out of the blue in 3 weeks.

Unless the new Super premium is an increase in Land, LI and Linden (dollars) I will not bother to pay to be Super premium. The three L's is what matter for me. Experiences, pah. Groups? Nice, but I'm full. Can't stomach one more. Voice morphing when I don't use voice? Missed IMs? No creator, no problem. Gifts? Hahhhaaa you must be joking. They have too high LI to be used, ever. Besides, I can get better. I haven't picked up a single premium gift.

So can I continue with the premium Lite or will they scrap it and have only premium Super? I don't bother thinking about it, it's a looong time until 2021.

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Everyone who owns land in SL has to be a premium member, so there are at least 60.000 people paying LL these fees, which is a nice pile of dosh.
However if you own land quite a few of the perks automatically lose its shine.
I got regions and homesteads, I don't need a home, mainland space, access to premium areas, etc.
And with having to pay hundreds of RL dollars towards tier every month, L$300 a week isn't something to write home about.
But I've been raised to never look a gift horse in the mouth so... wait... oops, too late ;)

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3 minutes ago, Jo Yardley said:

Everyone who owns land in SL has to be a premium member, so there are at least 60.000 people paying LL these fees, which is a nice pile of dosh.
However if you own land quite a few of the perks automatically lose its shine.
I got regions and homesteads, I don't need a home, mainland space, access to premium areas, etc.
And with having to pay hundreds of RL dollars towards tier every month, L$300 a week isn't something to write home about.
But I've been raised to never look a gift horse in the mouth so... wait... oops, too late ;)

Private region owners don’t have to be Premium. 

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4 minutes ago, Marianne Little said:

I have already paid annually in April 2019, and my next payment due was April 2020. Now, I pay 72US before June 24 and can use SL as a premium member until April 2021.

Isn't that correct?

Of course it sucks for those whose budget don't allow them to spend 72US out of the blue in 3 weeks.

 

Yup. I have another account who renewed in March, so that due date is *currently* March 2020, but I'll pre-pay at 72USD until March 2021.

 

And yeah, cut me off drastically for plans I HAD for the money this month - I'd have expected a little more notice, but I guess some is better than none

 

- Personally the land allowance, increased offlines (since they can't fix the "items sent from object - goes *poof*, but sent from avatar, all ok" bug), number of groups (yes, I'm maxed out at 60) and access to Live Chat make Premium worthwhile to me

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Jo Yardley said:

And with having to pay hundreds of RL dollars towards tier every month, L$300 a week isn't something to write home about.

Maybe not, but it has almost covered the cost of Premium up until this price increase.

A year of Premium was $72, while 53 weeks of L$300 is L$15900 or $63, +$7 (1024sqm) free tier, and the other perks.

Edited by Wulfie Reanimator
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1 hour ago, Luna Bliss said:

I don't understand why someone's account would be locked or frozen at all...why wouldn't they just be downgraded to basic automatically?
 

You might own land, either on your own or as part of a group with others.

If LL downgrade your account, all the tier that comes with it (and any extra you have purchased) suddenly vanishes and chaos ensues. How bad depends on how much land you have, how money you paid for the land, if your tier is group deeded, and so on.

So LL lock your account and give you a significant grace period to return your account to good standing (as in, pay your bill up to date). 

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4 minutes ago, Pamela Galli said:

Private region owners don’t have to be Premium. 

True if you don't buy on the mainland but you really do need that chat support as a landowner, in my experience anyway.
 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, AtriaLightmare said:

.... cuts out all the social frill, and other "features" that most people have no real use for...

 

If you read all of the comments carefully, in all of the threads about the changes, you will see that there is no single feature that MOST Premiums agree is worth it or not.  Many, many people only want a Linden Home.  Many, many others only care about increased groups and having some priority with getting into events.   In other words, there are NO "features" that "most" people have no real use for.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, roseelvira said:

 

 I ASKED ABOUT HOW TO HANDLE MY MEMBERSHIP SINCE I AM QUARTELY AND IF IDO THE YEAR HOW DO THAT CALCULATE THE OVERAGE THIS IS THE  REPLY I GOT

 

Here is how it will work.  Sometime from June 3-24, go to your Dashboard Account Summary page (https://secondlife.com/my/account) and note the 'Next billing renewal date' at the top.  When you do the "pre-pay", which will be done via the bottom section of the "Premium Membership" page (https://secondlife.com/my/account/membership.php), you will choose a pre-pay level.  Since you are currently quarterly, you can choose to pre-pay quarterly or annually (maybe even monthly, though that doesn't help a lot financially).  Whatever renewal date you noted on your Account Summary page - add the pre-pay time to that and that is when you will be billed next. 

i.e. You are quarterly and your Renewal billing date is July 15th, 2019.  If you choose to pre-pay a quarter, then it will immediately charge you the 'current quarterly' rate and your next billing date would shift to Oct 15th, 2019.  If you choose to lock in an annual payment then your next renewal date would be July 15th, 2020.  However, also note that if you choose to lock in annual, it will shift you to the annual billing cycle and you would then, at some point, have to change that if you didn't want annual - and you "might" not have the option to go back to quarterly.

 

 

 

48 minutes ago, Jo Yardley said:

How many premium accounts are there in total?

Rough guesstimate from various sources is approx. 60,000.  I truly do not remember where that figure was first mentioned, but it was sometime in the previous year.  

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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I'm not too worried about how the proposed new premium will impact my decision whether to pay the pre-paid on my premium accounts now. Really that's a no brainer - I'd be throwing away my own money by not taking advantage of the offer. The Lab has already said for those who want to upgrade to the super duper they will be able to upgrade with credit for what remains of their current account. So why worry? I'm just tired of hearing the rumor of a super premium and not getting any details. That's a hard pill to swallow for someone like me who has little patience in waiting to know what will be. I honestly, wouldn't have such a hard time waiting for it to be implemented. I just want to know what it is NOW.. lol .. but that is my shortcoming. I need more patience as having a clue drives me nuts if I can't find the answer.

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