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Grumpity Linden

A brief note on pricing changes, which ran long.

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6 minutes ago, CoffeeDujour said:

Land costs to region owners and, potentially, renters of land on private regions.

Mainland folk not so much.

True, but there was a decrease in mainland tier prices around the time I think that the premium free tier amount was changed from 512 to 1024 - and we got both of those benefits without any corresponding increase in premium rates at that time. 

My point was that if they are trying to balance out where the income comes from, if they lower one area (like land costs) it is reasonable that there will be an increase in a different area.

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5 minutes ago, Female Winslet said:

Well, the experience in Bellissaria seems to be showing the way. From that experience, we can learn that people like water access. So maybe some rivers, canals, lakes, and islands would be good. Most of that could be carved into existing space.

We can also learn that people want relief from ban lines and security orb abuse. So curb that in a similar way to how it was done there. It couldn't be identical but the same general idea of requiring a concrete time amount would work well.

It might be a good idea to do away with ban lines. If a person is banned from a place, that is one thing. But to say that only group members can inter a parcel, not a good idea. Especially if it is a large parcel. In some sims, it is hard to fly around, with out hitting a ban line. Do away with those, and flying would be easier. Don't want anybody flying over your land, then get an island.

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Even with the price increase, buying extra tier directly isn't economical. This is why people having multiple accounts is a thing.

 

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I just want to say to everyone here, "Thank you for pushing about the groups!" I have been reading this feed all day long, back and forth as the day passes. So many great and amazing view points were spoken here. And yes! The Lindens did listen about how important these group fees are for us! A lot of my non premium friends were highly upset, yet I was given more groups than I would ever use. Sitting at 45 groups for my premium! That's still crazy. Specially when back in the day when I first started in 2007, that was a fraction we were given. 

Hopefully Lindens will listen even further to our needs and we will only progress into the future. Just wanted again to say a big thank you to the minds that made the group changes happen. This is community, and I love how you all came together.  

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21 minutes ago, polysail said:

You realize, that L$ earned from the stipend can be cashed out, and then used to re-purchase premium right?  And that Premium didn't really cost 72$ USD / year all this time, because they've always been paying you 62$ USD back in L$ ( minus 3.5% transaction fee ) >  60$ USD of that back , for an 12$ annual membership fee.  And that the ACTUAL COST of the new Premium, when stipend is factored back in is still only 37$ per year.

That's 3.08 cents per month.... 

Yes I use my stipend to help me pay for my account. My point was that cost went up & stipend doesn't. At US$72 a year Stipend works out to be US$4.50 help each month to pay for account that is about 75% of cost over the year for people to use it in SL in paying for shopping etc or use to pay accounts IF they save it. After increase this will only cover 54%. For me this is not an increase of just US$27 but an increase of Approx AUD$40 for the account with also having to find an extra AUD$31 for the decrease in stipend bonus because it stays the same making this change an approx AUD$71 bill increase this yr with no benefits for a platform with increasing maintenance & performance issues. Whatever the %$ increase LL should add a = stipend cost of living increase too. 

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On 5/30/2019 at 4:48 AM, Sannita Cortes said:

Sorry, I was thinking of going premium and I would pay annually because like you it is the best deal. BUT VAT only then monthly because not annual and quaterly is not for new sign ups. For me VAT applies…. So I would pay annually my membership and VAT is only monthly possible - this process  I don't understand the reason for it because would be better to pay all in once.

 

I think what they are saying is that after June 24th, they will only have Basic, Monthly and Annually. They will discontinue Quarterly unless you are Quarterly now before the changes. 

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58 minutes ago, polysail said:

You realize, that L$ earned from the stipend can be cashed out, and then used to re-purchase premium right?  And that Premium didn't really cost 72$ USD / year all this time, because they've always been paying you 62$ USD back in L$ ( minus 3.5% transaction fee ) >  60$ USD of that back , for an actual real 12$ USD annual membership fee cost.  And that the actual cost of the new Premium, when the stipend refund is factored back in is still only 39$ USD per year..

You dont have to cash out to use your stipend to pay for premium or land. You simply sell ur L$ on the lindenx. 

Most people dont use the stipend to help pay for their renewals they spend that weekly injection as it comes in. 

Now that the price if premium has gone up i think more people will be trying hard to save up their stipend though, I being one of them. As it is I can keep 2 account on premium if im disciplined enough to follow through with my plan lol .. 

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2 minutes ago, ananoelle said:

You dont have to cash out to use your stipend to pay for premium or land. You simply sell ur L$ on the lindenx. 

But you will pay a 3.5% transaction fee to sell the L$.  You will not have the additional 5% 'process credit fee'.

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4 minutes ago, ananoelle said:

Most people dont use the stipend to help pay for their renewals they spend that weekly injection as it comes in.

While I don't save up all of my stipends, I still count the stipends against the Premium cost.  If I didn't spend the stipend, then instead I'd be spending more RL $ to buy L$.

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22 hours ago, Adam Spark said:

@Sweet ValentineWhat about those who buy linden dollars on a regular basis and work their tails off doing jobs in Second Life (providing a service that contributes to the community is as valuable as money if not more so) for the lindens that they in turn spend and give to those who do business?

Yes, there are freeloaders in Second Life. Not all basic account users are among them.

Without basic accounts, business owners wouldn't have an audience worth talking about. I'm tired of the notion that we don't have the right to as much of the basic experience as premium members. We pay for the service too, with our time, our talents, and yes our hard earned money.

again i said anyone making a profit ...anyone cashing out of sl should be paying a premium fee ...that is all the rest is fine

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On 5/30/2019 at 9:22 PM, ILIKEPIEPIEPIEPIEPIEPIEPIEPIEPI said:

 I have a Business and see no need for a prem account its a waste of money for land I will never use, 1200 Linden a month it's pointless to me when I upload 50k a month or more and I prefer the free membership because I don't get useless stuff that clog my inventory when I have my own sim

if u cash out money  or make enough to buy a sim ...spend tons on stuff in SL then its my opinion  that  you be premium...that simple

 

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On 5/30/2019 at 8:27 PM, River Abonwood said:

@Sweet Valentine I disagree!  I co-own a club, and I can assure you that I spend a ton of money buying things to improve and keep my place going.  Not to mention, paying the tier for the sim that we are on (because half of it is residential)!  To say that "free folk" don't add anything to SL is just crazy talk.  And guess what - we don't even make money.  We break even.  That's all we have ever asked of our place.

again...IF you make a profit and cash out of SL then you should pay premium ..you can disagree but  this is my opinion... yours doesnt change mine

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Just now, Sweet Valentine said:

if u cash out money  or make enough to buy a sim ...spend tons on stuff in SL then its my opinion  that  you be premium...that simple

 

If that is the case, then LL should lower premium, or have minor premium. A lot of people can't pay for premium. I know a guy that lives in Venezuela, and is basic. No payment on file. He is a scriptor. He is not on much, and he can't afford premium. I don't think he has a store.

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On 5/30/2019 at 8:03 PM, Selene Gregoire said:

What makes you say basics don't cover the costs of doing business in SL? Got anything to back that statement up with? 

I've owned and operated businesses in RL so I do know what it takes to run one and keep the doors open. I've also had a business in SL before and no one begrudged me being basic. I have to pay the same fees to LL for MP as premiums do, the same fees if I were to cash out, etc. And, unlike others, I do plan to have an inworld store again so I would be paying for the land even if it's indirectly. In the end LL still gets their cuts.

So what it boils down to for you is if someone is of low or fixed income they shouldn't be allowed to have an SL. That may not be what you are thinking but that is the end result. You know what that is called? Discrimination. Which is illegal in the US.

in rl u pay rent lights insurance business license fees ect ect...all overhead premium should be looked at the same way in again MY opinion...no one begrudges u anything im sure.....the world wants to many handouts these days ....again my opinion

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1 minute ago, Frankie Antonioni said:

If that is the case, then LL should lower premium, or have minor premium. A lot of people can't pay for premium. I know a guy that lives in Venezuela, and is basic. No payment on file. He is a scriptor. He is not on much, and he can't afford premium. I don't think he has a store.

if he had a business in rl he would be paying for his overhead.... if not his store would be shut down...its how a business works

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1 minute ago, Sweet Valentine said:

if he had a business in rl he would be paying for his overhead.... if not his store would be shut down...its how a business works

He doesn't have a store. People pay him to do scripting work. I don't think he has sold any L$ on the Lindex.

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Hey, I love the changes.  Thank you very much!  

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9 minutes ago, Sweet Valentine said:

if he had a business in rl he would be paying for his overhead.... if not his store would be shut down...its how a business works 

They already pay a fee, anyone who cashes out is charged a fee.  Anyone who makes a sale on the marketplace is charged a fee, for every sale.  These fees stack.  What exactly does adding 12USD monthly accomplish other than sating whatever weird vendetta you have against content creators?

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1 minute ago, Branduff Bisnovat said:

They already pay a fee, anyone who cashes out is charged a fee.  Anyone who makes a sale on the marketplace is charged a fee, for every sale.  These fees stack.  What exactly does adding 12USD monthly accomplish other than sating whatever weird vendetta you have against content creators?

Hey, why don't we create great big charity events to generate more currency conversion fees?  

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On 5/30/2019 at 4:49 AM, November Velde said:

Perhaps someone here can help me understand about locking in another year at the original price? The blog stated that between June and July, a person could get one more year. My problem is that my premium is not due until December 31st. Does this mean I'm SOL for being able to do this?

Actually I think what they are saying is that between June 3 and June 24 you can pre pay another year (if you have annual) and what it does is that time will add to your current time you have now. I might be wrong but that is how I am reading it. I've been reading it over n over. Because they didn't say only those that are due, they said everyone that has Premium accounts can pre-pay another year at the current rate. After June 24 it all goes to the new rate. So, if you pre-pay between June 3-24 then you will be ok and be in the current rate but if you wait till December then you will be paying the new rate. But paying now in June it will add more time to your current time with the old (current) rates. *Hope that makes sense*

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1 minute ago, Victorianna Writer said:

Actually I think what they are saying is that between June 3 and June 24 you can pre pay another year (if you have annual) and what it does is that time will add to your current time you have now. I might be wrong but that is how I am reading it. I've been reading it over n over. Because they didn't say only those that are due, they said everyone that has Premium accounts can pre-pay another year at the current rate. After June 24 it all goes to the new rate. So, if you pre-pay between June 3-24 then you will be ok and be in the current rate but if you wait till December then you will be paying the new rate. But paying now in June it will add more time to your current time with the old (current) rates. *Hope that makes sense*

That is how I understand it as well.  Linden labs is doing a pretty good job at trying to accommodate us.  

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Correct, I think so too. They are doing their best to make it fair for those of us that have been here forever already giving us a chance to get in on our regular rates before the new rates kick in. But from what I understand it's for all of us that are Premium members not just the ones that are due. I happen to be due this month, I was quarterly but changed it to annually before they bill me so that it is all set. I think I'm able to pre-pay another year between the 3rd to 24th because my payment comes out on the 2nd lol. (ofc, it figures) 🙄

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4 minutes ago, Victorianna Writer said:

Actually I think what they are saying is that between June 3 and June 24 you can pre pay another year (if you have annual) and what it does is that time will add to your current time you have now. I might be wrong but that is how I am reading it. I've been reading it over n over. Because they didn't say only those that are due, they said everyone that has Premium accounts can pre-pay another year at the current rate. After June 24 it all goes to the new rate. So, if you pre-pay between June 3-24 then you will be ok and be in the current rate but if you wait till December then you will be paying the new rate. But paying now in June it will add more time to your current time with the old (current) rates. *Hope that makes sense*

Per a post from Grumpity earlier, you don't have to be annual, but that would give you the best locked in savings.  

In any case, basically on the day you get ready to pre-pay, check your dashboard for your premium renewal date.  Whatever that day is, add a month/quarter/year to it, depending on what type of prepay you want to do.  Also remember that the quarterly option is only available if you are already on the quarterly plan. 

I have an alt that does not come up for renewal until April 2020.  When I do the prepay on June 3rd, it will be for a year and that will then extend the alt's renewal out to April 2021.

Whereas this account won't score quite as well since my renewal is June 28th.  So on when I do the renewal on June 3rd, it simply shifts the Jun 28 2019 renewal date to Jun 28 2020.

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53 minutes ago, ananoelle said:

You dont have to cash out to use your stipend to pay for premium or land. You simply sell ur L$ on the lindenx. 

Most people dont use the stipend to help pay for their renewals they spend that weekly injection as it comes in. 

Now that the price if premium has gone up i think more people will be trying hard to save up their stipend though, I being one of them. As it is I can keep 2 account on premium if im disciplined enough to follow through with my plan lol .. 

I use my stipend to help pay tier monthly.

 

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Posted (edited)
On 5/30/2019 at 7:02 PM, Spinach Soup said:

How new is new? One month or one week before June 3?

If I'm understanding this correctly, if I upgrade my basic account to premium on the annual cycle today or before June 24, I won't be able to do the prepay renewal for another year?

If you haven't gotten a solid answer/understanding yet:  If you paid for annual premium today at $72, then between June 3-24 you can go back to your dashboard and choose to pay for another year - at the current $72 rate.  That would then mean your next payment would not be due until May 31, 2021.

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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