Leninah Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 @Luna Thank you for clarifying that and not judging me as ‘that bad’ …. your honour! I am most certainly criticizing LL and make no apologies for it. Two months after the new double prim homes were offered and they are still woefully under-supplied and there is no date whatsoever for when they may be available. That remains the fact however many diversions, rabbit holes and obsequious tirades this debate goes down. I can understand that it IS more difficult to put these together than maybe it should be. Even so its not beyond the realms of reasonable expectations for a target date to be provided is it? That at least would help us decide whether to wait or not? @Beth You shut up when YOU decide its time to stop speaking, not when ANYONE else tells you to. Too many people have fought and died for that right to give it up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ananoelle Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 @Leninah may I ask when you first knew about the new Linden homes? 2 months waiting is nothing compared to the 8 or so months some of us waited and watched as SSP transformed in Bellisseria. 27 minutes ago, Leninah said: I can understand that it IS more difficult to put these together than maybe it should be. Even so its not beyond the realms of reasonable expectations for a target date to be provided is it? That at least would help us decide whether to wait or not? Maybe if it were like the old LHs then yeah we would all be in a sardine can already. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leninah Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Hi Ananoelle, I heard about them from a friend who managed to get one. I think we’ve talked about quality and this falls into two camps. Those that believe it’s fine to wait endlessly for something with no idea when it may become available and be quite happy to pay for it meanwhile not having it as they wait indefinitely, so long as when it finally does arrive it is beautiful and pretty. The other camp doesn’t share that view completely, they think if we’re paying for it and its good enough as it is (not a sardine can btw they are lovely as they are) GIVE IT TO ME NOW or at least tell me when I can get it! My opinion is the former of these is a little soft on the provider. I do seem to be in the minority here though, but hey ho that doesn’t make my point of view invalid or deserving of ridicule 😊 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s2Pandora Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) The staggering release is a known marketing move that increases hype and therefor business/profit. They bring you in showing you "You COULD get this!", not you "will". Not yet, anyway. Many companies will say a product is "sold out" when it's actually not to increase hype for it. Something sold out fast must be really good, right? Well, limit the release and heck yeah it'll sell out fast. Couple this with the conveniently timed increase in price.. it's pretty obvious. They know these are doing well, and they are looking to increase their profits even more over it with so many new premium subscribers. The 16th B-Day celebration will bring even more in, and those late to the party get to pay even more. Edited June 18, 2019 by s2Pandora 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Wijaya Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 51 minutes ago, Leninah said: Two months after the new double prim homes were offered and they are still woefully under-supplied and there is no date whatsoever for when they may be available. double prim homes? what did i miss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leninah Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, Fox Wijaya said: double prim homes? what did i miss? Hi Fox, The new Linden Homes come with 351 prims because its 1,024 sqm of free tier. If you can get one, which is what this debate is about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ananoelle Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Leninah said: The other camp doesn’t share that view completely, they think if we’re paying for it and its good enough as it is (not a sardine can btw they are lovely as they are) GIVE IT TO ME NOW or at least tell me when I can get it! My opinion is the former of these is a little soft on the provider. I do seem to be in the minority here though, but hey ho that doesn’t make my point of view invalid or deserving of ridicule 😊 It's not ridicule everyone here has their own opinions and that's ok. I would however say this, your paying premium for a 1024sqm allotment which you can either buy mainland, allocate tier to group or claim a Linden home. There are still Linden homes avaliable, they just so happen to be the ones you don't want. That I'm sorry is totally your choice. LL are indeed providing you with what your premium membership entitles you to. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ananoelle Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 17 minutes ago, Fox Wijaya said: double prim homes? what did i miss? You missed breakfast 🍻😂 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ananoelle Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Leninah said: @Beth You shut up when YOU decide its time to stop speaking, not when ANYONE else tells you to. Too many people have fought and died for that right to give it up. One of these might work better on @Beth Macbain 😜 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiramanell Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 31 minutes ago, s2Pandora said: The staggering release is a known marketing move that increases hype and therefor business/profit. They bring you in showing you "You COULD get this!", not you "will". Not yet, anyway. Many companies will say a product is "sold out" when it's actually not to increase hype for it. Something sold out fast must be really good, right? Well, limit the release and heck yeah it'll sell out fast. Couple this with the conveniently timed increase in price.. it's pretty obvious. They know these are doing well, and they are looking to increase their profits even more over it with so many new premium subscribers. The 16th B-Day celebration will bring even more in, and those late to the party get to pay even more. There's some correlation between the renewed Premium perks, and prices going up, for sure. But it feels you're making them out to sound too sleazy. A more reasonable account of what might have happened, is like the following, imaginary board-room meeting: LINDEN A "Our income from land sales are down again. Maybe we really need to start focussing more on subscription based income again?" LINDEN B "Ok, let's increase Premium fees then. Peeps love a nice LL home." LINDEN C "Well, not those." LINDEN B "Why not?!" LINDEN C "Erm, because they're crap, maybe!?" LINDEN A "Very well, it's decided then: let's first work on making Premium more attractive. We'll hire some Moles, and we'll start building new homes." Edited June 18, 2019 by kiramanell 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Wijaya Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 30 minutes ago, Leninah said: Hi Fox, The new Linden Homes come with 351 prims because its 1,024 sqm of free tier. If you can get one, which is what this debate is about. it's not that i don't know, i'm around a bit longer, but using confusing descriptions makes the discussion excellent for a derail. The new Linden homes are nót double prim, or double anything, just placed on the new standard 1024 sqm parcels. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiramanell Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Leninah said: I am most certainly criticizing LL and make no apologies for it. Two months after the new double prim homes were offered and they are still woefully under-supplied and there is no date whatsoever for when they may be available. That remains the fact however many diversions, rabbit holes and obsequious tirades this debate goes down. I can understand that it IS more difficult to put these together than maybe it should be. Even so its not beyond the realms of reasonable expectations for a target date to be provided is it? That at least would help us decide whether to wait or not? LOL @ obsequious. I don't do 'obsequious', not for anyone. But let's make this concrete. What would YOU have them do differently? It has been suggested, for instance, they should have spent the last few years working on these, and then release 'em all at once. But, from a business perspective, that's unreasonable. They've introduced stuff in the past, that merely got a lukewarm reception. So, you can't just spent years on a massive building overhaul, solely based on the hope that ppl will like it (even, now that, with 20-20 hindsight, it's clear ppl do). You need early feedback (aka, you need to start selling the new homes in a staggered fashion, so you can abandon the project in time, should enthusiasm fizzle out for some reason). So, what else? Give Premium members the choice of getting 2 crappy, old homes? Why, 2 times 0 still equals 0. 😁 (Not to mention, the humongous re-programming task that would entail, for just a stop-gap measure, at best). So, hire more Moles then? I'm not even convinced that would really work, in the sense that Mole don't scale linearly: more Moles doesn't equate to an equally higher linear output. As with any urban planning design, ppl will need to communicate with each other, and coordinate the inception of the plan. It's human work, and you can't just have endless amounts of Moles working on their own little hill: inter-coordination will inevitably slow things down to a point where it just goes as fast as it goes. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emma Krokus Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Fox Wijaya said: but this exaclty has a work around, owning another Linden home not ..sadly. create a group, let a alt join, and donate the tier to the group as landowner. As soon the new homes come available, take out your donation and you can grab ..or try to grab, a new home. As soon you succeed, go to your old land, take up your stuff and move. ( if you don't get a new home... simply ad the donation back) If you want to sell he old land, do it for a price that goes fást .. or simply abandon it or the group will get troubles for not having enough land donated, but that will take a little time. Thank you for that work around, Fox. I was under the impression that you would be billed if you held more land than your present tier allowance for even one second within a billing period. I hadn't realised that there was a grace period between taking your tier from a group and donating it back. Emma Edited June 18, 2019 by Emma Krokus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvia Tamalyn Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Leninah said: Hi Fox, The new Linden Homes come with 351 prims because its 1,024 sqm of free tier. If you can get one, which is what this debate is about. As Fox noted, the new homes are not double prim homes. "Double prim" refers to parcels that have two times the normal allotment, such as the parcels in Bay City. The new Linden homes are regular parcels, with the normal 351 allowance for a 1024 sq m parcel. When one has a Premium membership, they get a land allowance of 1024 to use however. We all get this exact same benefit, whether or not we are using it on a new Linden home. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvia Tamalyn Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, Emma Krokus said: Thank you for that work around, Fox. I was under the impression that you would be billed if you held more land than your present tier allowance for even one second within a billing period. I hadn't realised that there was a grace period between taking back your tier from a group and donating it back. Emma If the land is owned in your name, then what you said is right, so you still have to be careful about land that you own as an individual. Group-owned land is a bit more flexible. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leninah Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 @Ananoelle The new Linden Home is advertised and offered as a tangible benefit of the current Premium membership we’re paying for, the Linden Homes, not just the tier, the homes. If you read the threads from Patch you can see its accepted by LL that these are late and they’re working hard to provide what they promised and are currently failing to deliver. So, no they are not providing what we are paying for currently, not to all of us anyway. The homes that are available are not the new ones they are the old ones limited to 512sqm and 175 prims so no it’s not a ‘choice’ that is being made available to me presently though I still have to pay for it. As I keep saying if we had an expectation of a date when this might be resolved that would be something to work with, but no, nothing other than ‘soon’. @Kiramanell What would I do? I’d give a date when given the limitations of my resources and the time to do it ‘properly’ all pretty and nice and beautiful, observing the laws of diminishing returns, I would expect (expect not guarantee even) be able to meet the generated demand is what I’d do. @Fox OK point taken let me re-phrase ‘double prim homes’ to ‘Linden homes that can accommodate twice as many prims as the current Linden homes because they come on 1024 sqm parcels which currently they do not’ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leninah Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 18 minutes ago, Sylvia Tamalyn said: As Fox noted, the new homes are not double prim homes. "Double prim" refers to parcels that have two times the normal allotment, such as the parcels in Bay City. The new Linden homes are regular parcels, with the normal 351 allowance for a 1024 sq m parcel. When one has a Premium membership, they get a land allowance of 1024 to use however. We all get this exact same benefit, whether or not we are using it on a new Linden home. @Sylvia Just another observation about the eagerness to equate the value of the tier allowance equally between using it on a Linden home and to buy land. If I go to buy land using that 1,024 sqm tier it’s going to be mainland. To be blunt, current available mainland sucks big time. It’s usually crowded, lags, is expensive to purchase (prices for smaller parcels rocketed when the allowance was increased) and the surroundings usually are pretty dire. Nothing at all like the current Linden homes, either old or new, or even in development new themed ones I’m sure. They are free to purchase, usually uncrowded, low lag, and in very pleasant surroundings. So that just isn’t a fair comparison to make. If you have a premium account taking the Linden home to use the free tier is a way better option … if you can that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberry Crystal Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 31 minutes ago, kiramanell said: Mole don't scale linearly @kiramanell Your point is well made, and makes an amusing image @Leninah Not sure if this was mentioned already, but your premium entitles you to an old Linden home + tier on a 512 (+48 ish if you group it) mainland plot. my perceived value difference is in the build and environment quality between old and new plots rather than area or prims. It is possible, but fairly challenging* to hold onto a mainland plot while trying for a new home. *You can't do that manoeuvre by phone for instance You sound annoyed, and I can understand why. The response of Moles et al to all this is to focus, as much as they can, on releasing more homes but without reducing the build quality. Stating a time-frame which turns out to be inaccurate could cause more problems than it solves. The informed guesswork on the forums here suggests 'this month' for a large release, and to my uninformed opinion, this would seem reasonable. The last release sold out in under half an hour though, and if you are not available around release time you could miss out again. If you use a browser extension which refreshes the land page, and sends an alarm for relevant keywords you could probably pick up a plot outside that time, but it would need a bit of thought. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberry Crystal Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 @Leninah (cross posted so responding to your last message) Mainland is unnecessarily horrible. The more time I spend in Bell the more I see that. This new build represents a change of culture, and that can't happen without some rough edges being torn on the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emma Krokus Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Leninah said: @Sylvia Just another observation about the eagerness to equate the value of the tier allowance equally between using it on a Linden home and to buy land. If I go to buy land using that 1,024 sqm tier it’s going to be mainland. To be blunt, current available mainland sucks big time. It’s usually crowded, lags, is expensive to purchase (prices for smaller parcels rocketed when the allowance was increased) and the surroundings usually are pretty dire. Nothing at all like the current Linden homes, either old or new, or even in development new themed ones I’m sure. They are free to purchase, usually uncrowded, low lag, and in very pleasant surroundings. So that just isn’t a fair comparison to make. If you have a premium account taking the Linden home to use the free tier is a way better option … if you can that is. About mainland - my personal experience: For the last year my friend and I have had a plot around 4,400 prims (not inworld right now, so cant be sure) tier free from the allowances of 4 premium accounts from LL direct and donated to a group. We both have shops there. It is not crowded - for the shops' sake it would be nice if it was! There is no lag. We bought the parcel at L$ 1 per sqm from LL. I know of two other people who more recently purchased parcels directly from LL. The land is on a fairly flat green piece of mainland directly by a Linden Road. One of my friends' parcel is a water front with - not entirely unimpeded - views, but its nice to be by the water. I have found more abandoned pieces of land near water front just flying around and believe it is still possible to ask LL to sell them to you directly. I do feel for me there is some extra value in having Mainland. There are less restrictions - e.g. you may have a shop, club, etc., you are more free to build what you want and where you want. Emma Edited June 18, 2019 by Emma Krokus 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leninah Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 @Raspberry Thanks for your ideas there I will look into those The big issue for me is the 175 prim limit in a single home. Are you saying that I could take a 512k linden home buy a 512k parcel of mainland, group them and have the 351 prim allowance available to use on the Linden home? If so, that is interesting because I didn’t think aggregating prim allowances worked across SIMs? I understand the fear in announcing any date, trust me I’m in the UK and we’ve seen that with BREXIT! However not having any date or idea is worse my opinion than being kept in the dark. Had our government said "ok we're leaving the EU we're gonna work on that not sure when and can't tell you when cause its a bit complicated" There would have been revolution here! I’d rather someone was open and honest and said “look we’re going for this much on this date we may not make it but if we don’t we’ll tell you the new target” That would be for me way better than having no clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberry Crystal Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 I don't think that's possible Leninah (adding prims to Linden home) but I am definitely not an expert! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Wijaya Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, Raspberry Crystal said: I don't think that's possible Leninah (adding prims to Linden home) but I am definitely not an expert! you are right one more expert point given...lol ONLY when you have two seperate parcels on one (1) region, you can use the LI from both on one, but.. doesn't work with Linden homes because you can own only one per account, and not deedable to group, so that won't work either. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ananoelle Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 @Leninah I'm trying to find Patches acceptance of being what you class as late since there has (not to my knowledge) never been a date given. Your date will always look like this 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leninah Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 1 minute ago, ananoelle said: @Leninah I'm trying to find Patches acceptance of being what you class as late since there has (not to my knowledge) never been a date given. Your date will always look like this LOL Love it !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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